How Quickly We Conform

[Fair Dinkum]

I’m surprised and yet not really with how fast believers in Mormonism adapt and change and drop words from their vocabulary once it’s been deemed forbidden  or add words and phrases that GAs promote 

for example the word Mormon has almost become a pejorative to use the word in polite conversation with believers any more   I’ve been chastised and corrected multiple time when referring to the church as the Mormon church  and yet prior to president Nelson’s declaration declaring the word  as assisting satan it was quite normal for believers to refer to the church as the Mormon church  

another example is covenant path. It’s a phrase that has recently become popular 

still another is ponderize it was popular then not so much after it was disclosed that the GA who promoted it was profiting from it

why do members so readily accept these words and phrases into their vernacular?  Seems very insular and bizarre  

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Fair Dinkum

[jkwilliams]

When I'm around church members, I try not to use the word "Mormon" because, as you say, they think I'm being rude or insulting. Around here in Ohio, there aren't very many Latter-day Saints, and most of the people I work with do not know that I have any connection to the church. On rare occasions it comes up, such as when someone says they heard I went to BYU. When the church comes up, if I say "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints," most of the time people either say, "I'm not familiar with that church," or "Oh, that's the Mormons, right?" Either way, it ends up with me using the word "Mormon," and everyone is clear about what religion I'm talking about. I personally don't think there's anything wrong with using the word, but I understand why it's on the outs with church members. I grew up Mormon and was Mormon for 40 years, so I don't see any reason to describe myself otherwise.

[Scott Lloyd]

On 8/18/2022 at 2:12 PM, Fair Dinkum said:

I’m surprised and yet not really with how fast believers in Mormonism adapt and change and drop words from their vocabulary once it’s been deemed forbidden  

for example the word Mormon has almost become a pejorative to use the word in polite conversation with believers any more   I’ve been chastised and corrected multiple time when referring to the church as the Mormon church  and yet prior to president Nelson’s declaration declaring the word  as assisting satan it was quite normal for believers to refer to the church as the Mormon church.

It’s not a matter of it being a pejorative. Rather, it’s a matter of conveying via personal conduct one’s own intent to heed what one deems to be inspired direction from a prophet of God. 
 

That said, I try not to be a jerk about it and will almost always let it pass without comment when I observe others not following it, especially those who aren’t members of the Church or who likely have only a casual acquaintance with it. But I do believe professing members ought to abide by it, just as they should heed any divine direction that comes through a prophet. 

Edited August 25, 2022 by Scott Lloyd

[pogi]

40 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I’m surprised and yet not really with how fast believers in Mormonism adapt and change and drop words from their vocabulary once it’s been deemed forbidden  

for example the word Mormon has almost become a pejorative to use the word in polite conversation with believers any more   I’ve been chastised and corrected multiple time when referring to the church as the Mormon church  and yet prior to president Nelson’s declaration declaring the word  as assisting satan it was quite normal for believers to refer to the church as the Mormon church  

another example is covenant path. It’s a phrase that has recently become popular 

still another is ponderize 

why do members so readily accept these words and phrases into their vernacular?  Seems very insular and bizarre  

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

Its called culture.  Language evolves in culture.  Most peoples language evolves with the culture.   

Words are often swept under the rug:

https://bestlifeonline.com/outdated-words/

Only to be replaced with new trendy words:

https://www.indiatoday.in/education-today/grammar-vocabulary/story/10-trending-english-words-of-2022-with-meaning-1970919-2022-07-06

Bunch of sheeple! 

Oh, wait, I can't use that word.  Too trendy for my individualism vibe I want to trend with. 

Edited August 18, 2022 by pogi

[The Nehor]

22 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

still another is ponderize it was popular then not so much after it was disclosed that the GA who promoted it was profiting from it

Ponderize died within a day. It was never popular. It is a cautionary tale.

23 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

I would suggest that an individualism that is focused on what words you use to describe things is a very superficial kind of individualism.

[bluebell]

13 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I’m surprised and yet not really with how fast believers in Mormonism adapt and change and drop words from their vocabulary once it’s been deemed forbidden  or add words and phrases that GAs promote 

for example the word Mormon has almost become a pejorative to use the word in polite conversation with believers any more   I’ve been chastised and corrected multiple time when referring to the church as the Mormon church  and yet prior to president Nelson’s declaration declaring the word  as assisting satan it was quite normal for believers to refer to the church as the Mormon church  

another example is covenant path. It’s a phrase that has recently become popular 

still another is ponderize 

why do members so readily accept these words and phrases into their vernacular?  Seems very insular and bizarre  

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

It would be weird if it wasn't happening.

We see it all the time in our culture.  How long ago was it when "woke" or "microaggression" or "snowflake" or "yeet" weren't used by anyone, and now they are popular phrases that you here all the time.  

In general, humans so readily accept new words and phrases into our vernacular because that's how language and culture work.  It's true for our culture at large and for church culture as well.

https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/504338/how-new-words-become-mainstream

As far as the usage of the name Mormon.  That's different from the other examples that you gave, and probably more akin to those words in our culture that were once socially acceptable to use (like the terms "retarded" or "disabled" or something similar) and then suddenly weren't. 

This change is often because someone who has been given cultural authority (doctors, scholars, social media influencers, popular bloggers...or for church culture, Prophets, apostles, and other leaders) makes it a point to get people to stop using a term because they believe it to be offensive in some way.

 

[Amulek]

12 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

why do members so readily accept these words and phrases into their vernacular?  Seems very insular and bizarre  

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

But isn't this just how language works? Various in-groups develop specific words or phrases that come in go over time - sometimes quickly, sometimes not.

For example, I remember seeing Tony Hawk land his first 900. It was rad...I mean, no, it was phat...no, it was lit!

Sometimes those words end up seeping into the wider culture (e.g., valley girl slang like 'gag me with a spoon,' Boston expressions like 'wicked,' or maybe even a little Yiddish here and there: 'Oy Vey!'), sometimes not.

I think religious terms tend to be more in-group specific and rarely have a much wider audience, nor are they regularly adopted by outsiders.

I mean, off the top of my head, the only thing I can think of that we can probably to lay claim to is "funeral potatoes."

You could probably say "sister wives" and people would know what you were talking about too, but I don't think we really popularized that one.

 

[Danzo]

39 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

for example the word Mormon has almost become a pejorative to use the word in polite conversation with believers any more

I use it all of the time.  Mainly when a read and share scriptures.  Nothing wrong with the word.   Nothing wrong with using the correct word for something.

 

39 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

another example is covenant path.

Nothing wrong with that word as well.  It is a good description.   Other words can (and are) used as well.  Iron Rod.  Plan of happiness. Plan of salvation.  

 

39 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

still another is ponderize it was popular then not so much after it was disclosed that the GA who promoted it was profiting from it

I have personally never heard the term used by any member of the church other than some GA who talked about it at conference a few years ago. 

 

39 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

why do members so readily accept these words and phrases into their vernacular?  Seems very insular and bizarre  

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned

I am not sure why you think using Mormon correctly, "covanent path" etc are problematic.

New words pop up all of the time in our culture and language.  the verb Google.  The who knows how many letters in the acronym lgbtq. . .    Gay marriage.  Any political scandal needs to add the suffix "Gate" after it for some reason. "Progressive" instead of liberal "lets go Brandon"  "Woke" "MAGA".  The preferred word to describe people from or descended from sub Sahara African natives has changed enough times that I am not quite sure what to say.  

All examples of word changes recently that have nothing to do with members of the church.

Language changes. 

Make peace with it.

Edited August 18, 2022 by Danzo

[Stormin' Mormon]

17 minutes ago, pogi said:

Its called culture.  Language evolves in culture.  Most peoples language evolves with the culture.   

Words are often swept under the rug:

https://bestlifeonline.com/outdated-words/

Only to be replaced with new trendy words:

https://www.indiatoday.in/education-today/grammar-vocabulary/story/10-trending-english-words-of-2022-with-meaning-1970919-2022-07-06

Bunch of sheeple! 

Oh, wait, I can't use that word.  Too trendy for my individualism vibe I want to trend with. 

Similar to what I was going to say. 

This apparent phenomena is no different than how any other community behaves.  It is, in fact, what was described in the original meaning of the word "meme."  Words and ideas come into vogue, people adopt them, new ideas come into vogue, the newer ideas are adopted and the old ones pass out of use. 

I am trying to be fair minded, but I can't see this as anything other than a giant nothingburger. 
 

[pogi]

41 minutes ago, Stormin' Mormon said:

a giant nothingburger. 

Case in point. 

That is actually a good example of how words can ebb and flow in popularity.  Nothingburger has been around for a long time, but is recently surging in popularity.  

How "borg" of you to use it.   

I have to say, the smug and derogatory nature of the OP is kind of off-putting.   

[The Nehor]

Also the Borg have evolved and are now only seeking out lost and emotionally bereft souls to voluntarily add to the collective. You holding on to out of date Borg stereotypes is offensive.

[MiserereNobis]

27 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Also the Borg have evolved and are now only seeking out lost and emotionally bereft souls to voluntarily add to the collective. You holding on to out of date Borg stereotypes is offensive.

Yeah, obviously he didn’t watch the second season of Picard. 

[MustardSeed]

I need to *unpack* this idea.  So members are cultlike in their use of language- let me do my best to not *gaslight* you here.  Indeed, Mormons like to receive *tender mercies* so they try to be obedient and also use words that make them feel a part of things.  
 

No different than society at large.  No cap. 

[bsjkki]

1 hour ago, MiserereNobis said:

Yeah, obviously he didn’t watch the second season of Picard. 

You just gave away a major plot point.  But, I didn’t love season one so was going to skip it anyway.

Edited August 18, 2022 by bsjkki

[MiserereNobis]

26 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

You just gave away a major plot point.  But, I didn’t love season one so was going to skip it anyway.

It’s better than the first season but still not great. Just above middling. Strange New Worlds, on the other hand, is fun!

[bsjkki]

17 minutes ago, MiserereNobis said:

It’s better than the first season but still not great. Just above middling. Strange New Worlds, on the other hand, is fun!

I am enjoying that one! Even if it gets a bit silly sometimes.

[mfbukowski]

4 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

Individualism has been abandoned

And we are still so far from being a Zion culture. It's all my, me, and mine.

[mfbukowski]

I wonder how many of us hang out here to feel superior to others, while we are pretending to help them.

But there really are so many VERY confused folks ....

[Kenngo1969]

7 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

... reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

You will be assimilated.  Resistance is futile.

[carbon dioxide]

8 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I’m surprised and yet not really with how fast believers in Mormonism adapt and change and drop words from their vocabulary once it’s been deemed forbidden  or add words and phrases that GAs promote 

for example the word Mormon has almost become a pejorative to use the word in polite conversation with believers any more   I’ve been chastised and corrected multiple time when referring to the church as the Mormon church  and yet prior to president Nelson’s declaration declaring the word  as assisting satan it was quite normal for believers to refer to the church as the Mormon church  

another example is covenant path. It’s a phrase that has recently become popular 

still another is ponderize it was popular then not so much after it was disclosed that the GA who promoted it was profiting from it

why do members so readily accept these words and phrases into their vernacular?  Seems very insular and bizarre  

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

I use the same pronouns and words today as I have done all my life.  The word "mormon" is not offensive to me and I still use the word from time to time.  I accept what Pres. Nelson has said and I think he is correct but the reality is the word "mormon" has been used for so long its not realistic to expect it to go away.  Plus it easier to say "I am a Mormon" over "I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day saints." That is a lot of words to say and I prefer saying fewer words if it accomplishes the same point. 

[Kenngo1969]

While I understand, I think, the caution regarding not being too exclusivist or too "look-down-our-noses-at-others"-ish with regard to our use of language (and I do think that point has a certain amount of merit), on the other hand, perhaps, if we can be persuaded to speak like a Zion people, we will be one step (albeit a small step, but a step nonetheless) closer to being a Zion people.

You're welcome to join us if you like, Fair Dinkum.  

Edited August 19, 2022 by Kenngo1969

[Rain]

 

On 8/18/2022 at 1:31 PM, pogi said:

Its called culture.  Language evolves in culture.  Most peoples language evolves with the culture.   

Words are often swept under the rug:

https://bestlifeonline.com/outdated-words/

Only to be replaced with new trendy words:

https://www.indiatoday.in/education-today/grammar-vocabulary/story/10-trending-english-words-of-2022-with-meaning-1970919-2022-07-06

Bunch of sheeple! 

Oh, wait, I can't use that word.  Too trendy for my individualism vibe I want to trend with. 

Yes, I first heard "I absolutely love it" on youtube videos doing "DIY" (yep, there's another one) with dollar store items.  Then on thrift store DIY videos and now I'm starting to hear it in watercolor videos. I've heard it enough that it drives me a little crazy.  To be honest, "covenant path" is getting that way for me some as well.

Edited August 19, 2022 by Rain

[teddyaware]

8 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I’m surprised and yet not really with how fast believers in Mormonism adapt and change and drop words from their vocabulary once it’s been deemed forbidden  or add words and phrases that GAs promote 

for example the word Mormon has almost become a pejorative to use the word in polite conversation with believers any more   I’ve been chastised and corrected multiple time when referring to the church as the Mormon church  and yet prior to president Nelson’s declaration declaring the word  as assisting satan it was quite normal for believers to refer to the church as the Mormon church  

another example is covenant path. It’s a phrase that has recently become popular 

still another is ponderize it was popular then not so much after it was disclosed that the GA who promoted it was profiting from it

why do members so readily accept these words and phrases into their vernacular?  Seems very insular and bizarre  

reminds me of the Borg and a collective mind. Individualism has been abandoned 

Because they know the restored Church of Jesus Christ is true and that it’s being led by living prophets who are inspired of God to know what to emphasize and what not to emphasize, at any given point in time, on the way to the Second Coming of the Savior, something unbelievers will never be able to understand because the doings of God can only be discerned and comprehended by the Spirit of God. Enjoy being perplexed and incredulous as you kick against the pricks.

Edited August 19, 2022 by teddyaware

[Calm]

9 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

still another is ponderize it was popular then not so much…

Maybe for 15 minutes…I don’t remember it ever catching on. It was exposed within a day or two of the conference talk using it, iirc. (It looks like he gave it Sunday afternoon and the site was taken down that night)

Iirc, it was his son who was profiting from it, but he may have been too.  It was wrong either way.  He apologized.

Edited August 19, 2022 by Calm

[Calm]

Oh my gosh, lol.  The urban dictionary has entries from a day or two after conference for ponderize that are the opposite of its meaning as well as absurd ones and of course, vulgar ones.

This is my favorite:

Quote

The act of monetizing ones position in a church office.

This revelation from God is going to make me rich if I can find a way to ponderize it.