Should Bishops turn the microphone off on "other" testimonies?

[Thinking]

In the thread about the 12 year-old beehive, juliann wrote...

On 6/15/2017 at 11:27 AM, juliann said:

Well.....actuallly.....

travelmonies

speshulmonies

thankamonies

lovemonies

medicalmonies

And our favorite....10 minute.sermonies!

Frankly, I think they are all out of place. F&T meeting shouldn't be a bully pulpit.

Many of us have sat through those agonizing testimonies.

• One minute before the bishopric member stands up that one ward member stands up and the Sunday School teachers immediately begin thinking of ways to shorten their lessons.
• Brother Repetition stands up and tells the same stories that he always tells as if he has never told them.

I have never personally witnessed a microphone being turned off on a testimony. I wonder if bishops receive any training on when it is necessary and how to approach the member.

[bluebell]

I think the only time that should happen is if someone starts testifying about God accepting sin (from the church's perspective), or that they look forward to living a life of sin (again, from the church's perspective) because they know that's what God hopes for them.

I think there's a difference between inappropriate testimonies and testimonies that glorify sin and deny teachings of the church.

[pogi]

If a testimony is perceived to support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teaching or practices are contrary or oppose those accepted by the church, then yes, they should be shut down.

[USU78]

17 minutes ago, Thinking said:

In the thread about the 12 year-old beehive, juliann wrote...

Many of us have sat through those agonizing testimonies.

• One minute before the bishopric member stands up that one ward member stands up and the Sunday School teachers immediately begin thinking of ways to shorten their lessons.
• Brother Repetition stands up and tells the same stories that he always tells as if he has never told them.

I have never personally witnessed a microphone being turned off on a testimony. I wonder if bishops receive any training on when it is necessary and how to approach the member.

I have. Many times.

[JLHPROF]

Personally, I'd be happy if they'd just get rid of F&T meeting.
They are beyond repetitive, most of the "testimonies" aren't testimonies, and so much content is inappropriate.

Or at least redesign the format.  Testimony meetings have always been part of the Church.  It seems like they lost their way some time ago.

[Duncan]

I've only seen it once and heard it about from my parents. This guy in our ward a few years went up during FT and talked about baptisms for celebrities and holocaust victims and wanted the church to stop doing it at which point the Bishopric member went up and told him it was taken care of and he sat down, awkward but I guess he felt fine. My parents told me about this time in the '70's this guy had to give a talk and then ended up talking about the evils of abortion, which i'm sure wasn't his assigned topic. Afterwards the Branch President said something that this isn't the place for political platforms and members hold various opinions but he gave a disclaimer. I'm on the phone with her now and this other guy gave a talk about his criticisms of other religions and the BP also gave a disclaimer afterwards and his wife told Mumsie that she knew the BP would say that to him and the congregation. I too like everyone else wish sometimes they would have turned off the mic.

[juliann]

12 minutes ago, Thinking said:

In the thread about the 12 year-old beehive, juliann wrote...

Many of us have sat through those agonizing testimonies.

• One minute before the bishopric member stands up that one ward member stands up and the Sunday School teachers immediately begin thinking of ways to shorten their lessons.
• Brother Repetition stands up and tells the same stories that he always tells as if he has never told them.

I have never personally witnessed a microphone being turned off on a testimony. I wonder if bishops receive any training on when it is necessary and how to approach the member.

Several decades ago, there was a very strange man who came in and went to the mic, can't remember what he said but he was a bit scary. He was escorted out. 

I forgot to add the bookimonies. I've heard testimonies of The Work and the Glory, Visions of Glory, various biographies....  The ones that bother me the most are the speshulmonies, though, as in, I'm so speshul even if you aren't. We had a teen die in a car crash and it probably wasn't a month before a speshul one was up there thanking God for saving their lives by telling them to turn right instead of left kind of stuff. With her parents in the audience. I've never recovered. I certainly do believe these things happen, but there is a time and a place and it might not be F&T meeting.

[bluebell]

I like testimonies where the person explains (briefly) why they believe what they are testifying of instead of just testifying of it. 

30 second testimonies where the person says they know the church is true, etc. and then sits down do nothing for me. 

[juliann]

Just now, bluebell said:

I like testimonies where the person explains (briefly) why they believe what they are testifying of instead of just testifying of it. 

30 second testimonies where the person says they know the church is true, etc. and then sits down do nothing for me. 

I agree. Where I draw the line is when it moves into "we need/should....." exhortations.  I'd like a rule that the first time you say we instead of I the mic goes dead.  The problem is the bishopric sets the stage by starting it off and they can be among the worst offenders when it comes to giving sermons. 

[JLHPROF]

26 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I like testimonies where the person explains (briefly) why they believe what they are testifying of instead of just testifying of it.

30 second testimonies where the person says they know the church is true, etc. and then sits down do nothing for me.

Agreed.
Bearing testimony is exactly that.
What do you know and how do you know it.

All other kinds of testimonies should be requested to stop.  Preferably by those in authority to do so.

[Scott Lloyd]

1 hour ago, Thinking said:

In the thread about the 12 year-old beehive, juliann wrote...

Many of us have sat through those agonizing testimonies.

• One minute before the bishopric member stands up that one ward member stands up and the Sunday School teachers immediately begin thinking of ways to shorten their lessons.
• Brother Repetition stands up and tells the same stories that he always tells as if he has never told them.

I have never personally witnessed a microphone being turned off on a testimony. I wonder if bishops receive any training on when it is necessary and how to approach the member.

I just posted on the other thread a message that applies to the OP here, so I'll repost it here: 

There is a big difference between tolerating a too-long travelogue and allowing the promulgation of false doctrine from the pulpit. The former is an annoyance at worst. The latter is an offense. 

Accordingly, there can be a difference in how one chooses to deal with such things and whether or not they call for emergency action. 

[Darren10]

My ADD kicks in during Fast and Testimony meetings so I say tutn thr microphone on for me and leave it off for everyone else.

[Darren10]

I used my like quotas (I think I get more tomorrow) so let me announce that I agree fully with bluebell's posts. Exactly what I thought.

[Rain]

1 hour ago, bluebell said:

I like testimonies where the person explains (briefly) why they believe what they are testifying of instead of just testifying of it. 

30 second testimonies where the person says they know the church is true, etc. and then sits down do nothing for me. 

I have very rarely heard testimony only testimonies. I hear them less than 1 time month. I have wondered if the strength of the Spirit would be any stronger if all testimonies were just testimonies. I have wanted to experience this just once to see the outcome. But then perhaps I would be disappointed if the Spirit just wasn't there as I imagine or if I would be forever longing for it after that if the Spirit was that strong. 

But I'm ok with the brief story. 

[bluebell]

2 minutes ago, Rain said:

I have very rarely heard testimony only testimonies. I hear them less than 1 time month. I have wondered if the strength of the Spirit would be any stronger if all testimonies were just testimonies. I have wanted to experience this just once to see the outcome. But then perhaps I would be disappointed if the Spirit just wasn't there as I imagine or if I would be forever longing for it after that if the Spirit was that strong. 

But I'm ok with the brief story. 

We have lots of them every sunday.  It takes the people longer to walk up to the stand than to share what they are going to say and they don't waste any words.  "I know this church is true.  I know that Jesus is the Christ.  I know that Joseph Smith is a prophet.  In the name of......Amen."  That's it.  Over and over and over again sometimes.  

They are so fast and so devoid of context that they are hard to listen to for very long.  And they become interchangeable with each other. No judgement on the people who bear their testimonies like that.  It takes real guts to get up there and I admire every person who does it.  Those kinds of testimonies just don't do anything for me personally.

[Calm]

I think people learn from those around them.  If that is the type of testimony they hear, that is the kind given.

In our ward, I rarely hear that from an adult.  We rarely have parents coming up with their children though occasionally older kids will come up with younger kids, but they don't prompt unless the child freezes.

Most in my ward are of the theme of how the Spirit has helped them through some troubling times, often with details but they tie it into how the Spirit works for them enough I don't see it as wandering off.

They tend to be a few minutes to five or six with some quiet between.

I think if we want to hear a certain type of testimony, we need to contribute by being an example several times a year of what we would love to hear from others.  It may catch on.

Edited June 17, 2017 by Calm

[Rain]

3 minutes ago, bluebell said:

We have lots of them every sunday.  It takes the people longer to walk up to the stand than to share what they are going to say and they don't waste any words.  "I know this church is true.  I know that Jesus is the Christ.  I know that Joseph Smith is a prophet.  In the name of......Amen."  That's it.  Over and over and over again sometimes.  

They are so fast and so devoid of context that they are hard to listen to for very long.  And they become interchangeable with each other. No judgement on the people who bear their testimonies like that.  It takes real guts to get up there and I admire every person who does it.  Those kinds of testimonies just don't do anything for me personally.

It is even more rare that I hear testimonies like that. The testimony only testimonies I hear are usually pretty unique. Of course, one of those people is my husband so I might be biased.He never says "I know" or "I believe". 

[Rain]

1 minute ago, Calm said:

I think people learn from those around them.  If that is the type of testimony they hear, that is the kind given.

In our ward, I rarely hear that from an adult.  We rarely have parents coming up with their children though occasionally older kids will come up with younger kids, but they don't prompt unless the child freezes.

Most in my ward are of the theme of how the Spirit has helped them through some troubling times, often with details but they tie it into how the Spirit works for them enough I don't see it as wandering off.

They tend to be a few minutes to five or six with some quiet between.

I believe this to be true. In my last ward testimonies were very long. The content reminded me of Robert Smith books. I don't miss those testimonies, but I do miss the people. 

[SteveO]

I've mentioned before that there are a lot of members in my ward (young married student) that struggle with depression.  There are a few testimonies where I can't bear to even look at the person out of the sheer akwardness of it all--but I've found that it seems to be therapeutic for those who are struggling.  And as my wife has said, maybe struggling along with them and being a group of people who listen to their problems--might be one of the more Christian things we do during our 3 hour block.  It's not ideal, but we get through it fine.

[MormonVideoGame]

3 hours ago, pogi said:

If a testimony is perceived to support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teaching or practices are contrary or oppose those accepted by the church, then yes, they should be shut down.

No, that only helps the critics, especially if they are being recorded. Like I said in the other thread

"I think it was a bait. The counselor took the bait by shutting down the mic, and that simply doesn't look good in the eyes of most Americans. Now the video is going viral because of that" 

1 hour ago, Calm said:

I think if we want to hear a certain type of testimony, we need to contribute by being an example several times a year of what we would love to hear from others.  It may catch on.

Please 

Edited June 17, 2017 by MormonVideoGame

[gopher]

Sure, there are some uninspiring speakers, but all it takes is one new convert or recently activated member to bear sincere testimony to make F&T meetings worth it for me.

[Garden Girl]

5 hours ago, JLHPROF said:

Personally, I'd be happy if they'd just get rid of F&T meeting.
They are beyond repetitive, most of the "testimonies" aren't testimonies, and so much content is inappropriate.

Or at least redesign the format.  Testimony meetings have always been part of the Church.  It seems like they lost their way some time ago.

Fast Sunday is my favorite Sabbath, with its F&T meeting... Why?  Because our very wise bishop has given basic guidance in regard to testimonies, so our meetings are enjoyable, spiritual, and most importantly, Christ-centered... even so, the testimonies are personal, varied, humorous, poignant, sometimes bringing tears, sometimes chuckles, but always uplifting... 

I think the bishop sets the tone for not only the ward's F&T meetings... but activities in general...

GG

[Tacenda]

9 minutes ago, Garden Girl said:

Fast Sunday is my favorite Sabbath, with its F&T meeting... Why?  Because our very wise bishop has given basic guidance in regard to testimonies, so our meetings are enjoyable, spiritual, and most importantly, Christ-centered... even so, the testimonies are personal, varied, humorous, poignant, sometimes bringing tears, sometimes chuckles, but always uplifting... 

I think the bishop sets the tone for not only the ward's F&T meetings... but activities in general...

GG

Good for him!!  And for you and the ward family!!

[Meerkat]

I like the idea that context adds meaning to a testimony.  There's another aspect of testimony, and that is how it strengthens the person doing the testifying.  They may be petrified.  But they felt the urge to stand up and say what they know.  Lord, bless them for following that prompting.  I believe there's a blessing in that for them, and for us.  It also gives them a context for the next time they are encouraged to stand up.

I, for one, am very uncomfortable standing before a group and expressing myself.  I often stand to share my testimony with a deep feeling of gratitude for why I have one.  But when I reach for that thought, it has evaporated and I am left standing there telling what I know, but not remembering exactly why.  I love most all the testimonies.  I also love all the Sacrament meetings.  I am fed so much.  

One year we were visiting one of our children.  At ten after the hour, the spouse got up and walked out of Sacrament meeting with the children following.  I asked what had happened.  I was told "The Holy Ghost leaves the meeting at ten after the hour."  Actually, the only part I noticed that left was the in law.  The speaker had gone over time. but I was still feeling the Spirit.  I understand that we are impatient and don't want to go over time.  But what an opportunity to suffer long with kindness. Isn't that what we came here to learn? 

[mfbukowski]

8 hours ago, Thinking said:

In the thread about the 12 year-old beehive, juliann wrote...

Many of us have sat through those agonizing testimonies.

• One minute before the bishopric member stands up that one ward member stands up and the Sunday School teachers immediately begin thinking of ways to shorten their lessons.
• Brother Repetition stands up and tells the same stories that he always tells as if he has never told them.

I have never personally witnessed a microphone being turned off on a testimony. I wonder if bishops receive any training on when it is necessary and how to approach the member.

Nope

You don't turn off the microphone- that is for wusses.   And it doesn't make them sit down.

And it's very hard to do.  But when it gets inappropriate it gets inappropriate and suddenly you know you have to do something.

I usually get up and say "Thanks for your testimony it's time to wind up, thanks"  even if there is 40 minutes yet to go.

Once I said "Sorry, your political comments are inappropriate, please wind up right now"

You just do what you have to do.