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SteveO

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  1. They need to kill something for legitimate military service, or…?
  2. I don’t believe I ever said I personally believed it. I’m double vaxxed myself and have trust in the CDC and medical establishments. I said I understood why those who don’t, do. That’s been my entire contention during this conversation. My list of missteps and errors from the medical community and CDC are just that. And those are real missteps and errors people point to and legitimately use for their justification for nog trusting them. I don’t think in today’s world, that such margin of error is acceptable anymore.
  3. What do you think would’ve happened if Trump had won re election? I hate the hypotheticals, but I remember this from Harris last October: “If the public health professionals, if Dr. Fauci, if the doctors tell us we should take it, I’ll be the first in line to take it, absolutely," Harris said. "But if Donald Trump tells us we should take it, I’m not taking it," she said. I bet the polling would be different if we still had 45. My point is, there will always be the politics inserted where they shouldn’t. It’s the way the world operates. No escaping it. This isn’t some modern day anomaly either. Science has always been under assault from outside forces pushing an agenda. And I get the garbage being pushed. I mean, last night Tucker Carlson put out a tweet from some rap Queen about how the vaccines made her friend’s testicles swell up. It’s trash. And there’s tons of it. So I get that frustration. And I’ll amend my previous comments that I think journalists and politicians have done a massive disservice to the science and medical community. I think they all get lumped into a singular group. But all the more reason for a very small margin of error. All the more necessary, I think, for doctors to stay off YouTube, stay off the news networks, stay off media and putting out signed letters, stay away from protests wearing scrubs, etc. That needs to get tamped down and safeguarded. In the army, we used the phrase “quiet professionals”. Maybe that needs to be a motto introduced to the healthcare industry. Anyways, I really do have to be done. My wife is telling at me and my 2 year old son is fighting for my attention.
  4. https://www.npr.org/2021/05/13/996331692/poll-finds-public-health-has-a-trust-problem He won.
  5. Oh good, well, I agree with all of this. Have a nice night.
  6. This conversation started with you saying that the CDC and medical community have had an unassailable reputation and credibility during COVID. They don’t. You’ve admitted as much. It does not help their credibility. You want to argue whether it does or not? Have at it. But I’m not arguing percentages with you. Sounds like you have a good number of perfectly valid reasons for why people are hesitant. I hope you have understanding for their concerns and continue to work towards getting them vaccinated
  7. Well I’m glad we’ve moved from “conspiracy theories” to “yeah but Trump” to “yeah but they aren’t the primary reasons”. You think the CDC caving to political pressure in their policy making and COVID guidance reinforces or deters those concerns? Man, if only there was a trustworthy source to convince them otherwise…where oh where could they get that information?
  8. You think the CDC caving to political pressure in their policy making and COVID guidelines helps or hinders those efforts? Do you think it helps in your fight against misinformation? You think the CDC caving to political pressure in their policy making and COVID guidance helps or hinders those efforts? Do you think labeling people “enemies” helps or hinders your efforts? Have I brought up “mistakes” or “conspiracy theories” Pogi? You seem to not be able to decide which. I conceded the teachers union, the others…not so much. If they’re mistakes, and evidence of political pressure of which I expect science and medicine to weather, then I understand the hesitancy. How can you not? They are causing real harm and it is metastasizing at a rapid rate in America. If you think it would be more wise to take a less confrontational approach, I am fine with that and agree that is probably more helpful, but I think it is time that we stop making excuses for them. No more enabling. They are not our political allies, they are adversarial to the American cause of vaccination, regardless of what party you belong to. “Political allies”? Do you think this helps or hinders your efforts?
  9. Well, you’ve come a long way since a few posts ago, so I’ll concede there is no smoking gun on the teachers union. I think your problem is believing vaccine hesitancy is coming exclusively from the “right” and probably Trump supporters. For a lot of them, this is most certainly true. But I voted for the guy, and as I said, I’m vaxxed. I live in Fairfax, Virginia…I can tell you anecdotally, that vaccine hesitancy isn’t solely from the political right. You’d be very surprised. A lot of them…are African American co workers. Again, Trump was wrong, and I didn’t approve of the way he handled much of anything concerning the pandemic. Pretending, like some here, that these are crackpot conspiracies not worthy of consideration, just makes you dismissive of the fact—which anyone has been able to see—that the experts have stepped on rakes time after time since this mess began. I never attribute nefarious intentions to what can be more easily explained by human incompetence and mistakes, although there have definitely been some bad actors. But the fact remains that the error is still there. I work in the private sector. In semiconductors. I work in an environment where there is very little tolerance for error. I don’t understand people who want to give an “A” for effort to government agencies, all the while mistakes and bad policy continue to be made. There’s a price to pay for it. I’m saying you need to understand what that price is. It is the current hesitancy we are experiencing today. My initial statement, I believe, still stands. The scientific and medical community has done, in the near future, immense harm to its credibility with a significant portion of the population. Personally, I lack confidence with certain individuals, not on the community as a whole. But I understand why others would choose to believe otherwise.
  10. I’m glad you think so. It’s not been true in the real world though.
  11. I’m glad you see that the CDC was undermined by political forces. We’re on the same page. Would you be comfortable with the CDC considering suggestions from President Nelson about having in person Church meetings? How about “non essential” workplaces offering their suggestions for a return to work? Well I think it’s a little WTF myself. I don’t know how otherwise intelligent people read that statement and nod along. But to each their own. I said I was offering reasons for why people are vaccine hesitant. Not really, is the vaccine mandate based on science or federal worker unions? Based on the teachers union influencing the CDC, I’d say the latter. Base decisions off the science, not political influence…
  12. I’m glad you agree he was wrong They said it was spread by aerosols, and then backtracked a few days later. I never said it was nefarious, but it was a mistake. Dr Robert Redfield, head of the CDC, instructed his staff to change a series of safety recommendations for meat packing to suggestions, adding dozens of qualifiers such as “if feasible” and “not required”. He told orderlies that the edits came directly from Vice President Mike Pence’s chief of staff. A Freedom of Information Act request obtained AFT emails to the CDC. “Thank you again for Friday’s rich discussion about forthcoming CDC guidance and for your openness to the suggestions made by our president, Randi Weingarten, and the AFT,” AFT Senior Director for Health Issues Kelly Trautner wrote in one of the emails. “Older populations are whiter,” public health “expert” Dr. Harald Schmidt, of the University of Pennsylvania, told The New York Times in early December. “Society is structured in a way that enables them to live longer. Instead of giving additional health benefits to those who already had more of them, we can start to level the playing field a bit.” If that makes sense to you, fine, but understand it’s a WTF to people who are vaccine hesitant. How about now? I’m glad you agree it’s journalistic malpractice as I initially pointed out. It’s not like Journalists are responsible for informing the public or anything. Is the executive order based on science or nah? If we can ignore science based on the directives of political forces, what good is the science?
  13. And it’s a mystery why COVID has been politicized. These aren’t conspiracy theories.
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