Should there be a new calling to focus on the "Poor and Needy"?

[rpn]

It is part and parcel of discipleship.   It is supposed to be what HT/VTing are about, and compassionate service (though not just financially needy), even institute and other educational pursuits (did you know that RS has a reading curriculia available to teach those who cannot read, using the bible, for instance, and all the provident living that helps people climb so they are able to reach a hand down for those behind them on the ladder.

It is wholly about changed hearts.   Any ward mission or provident living leader will tell you that having someone named in charge doesn't do anything to change hearts.

[juliann]

19 minutes ago, cinepro said:

I think the leaders could probably give counsel that is clear enough for the members to rationally follow without going overboard.  Like when President Hinckley told the young women that "One modest pair of earrings is sufficient" and no one went overboard.

Point taken.

[Calm]

26 minutes ago, cinepro said:

Like I said, if you're in the camp of "the Church is doing enough", that's fine.  I'm open to that idea as well.

I'm just posting from my own experience.  Maybe my ward is the exception, but I get invited to volunteer at the soup kitchen once a year around Christmas.  I get asked to come help at "Mormon Helping Hands" once in the spring (and that's usually not anything to do with the "poor and needy"). 

But I get invited all the time to go to the Temple, do family history work, do my home teaching and clean the Church building.  No one has to google about whether or not LDS believe in Home/ Visiting Teaching because we have people whose callings it is to do nothing but track whether or not people are doing their visits and we hear about it every week in Church.

To put it another way, if the Church decided that "Caring for the Poor and Needy" was going to get just as much time, effort and money at the local level as "Redeem the Dead" and "Proclaim the Gospel", would they need to change anything, and if so, how would they do it?

I am not in the camp of the Church is doing enough.  I am in the camp of show some recognition of what the Church is actually doing before complaining it isn't doing much of anything.

If you have to wait around to get invited to help the poor and needy, maybe you should be looking elsewhere for the problem.

[The Nehor]

I don't think a calling would help much beyond the JustServe and Helping Hands programs. The latter is situational and the former is still being built but will hopefully provide lots of meaningful service opportunities.

The problem as I see it is that most of the time efforts to help the poor and the needy require two resources: people and money. With the latter the Church does not endorse specific charities other then its own though it also does not discourage them. With the former most people think of brute force situations like soup kitchens or painting or cleaning or other jobs that anyone minimally competent should be able to take care of but most solutions that benefit the poor and needy require more.

My personal passion lately has been abused and neglected kids and I volunteer a decent bit of time to help. To do what I do requires 30 hours of training to start and then a lot more as you go along. The church cannot really give someone a calling to do that. I know people who feel passionately about education in underfunded school districts who move heaven and earth to ensure that the poorest have textbooks and computers and functional schools. I know people who work in prison outreach programs helping ex-convicts get job training and find jobs (no easy task). I know some who help the elderly repair their homes or come up with solutions to help them survive on meager financial resources.

"Now, lest I be accused of proposing quixotic global social programs or of endorsing panhandling as a growth industry, I reassure you that my reverence for principles of industry, thrift, self-reliance, and ambition is as strong as that of any man or woman alive. We are always expected to help ourselves before we seek help from others. Furthermore, I don’t know exactly how each of you should fulfill your obligation to those who do not or cannot always help themselves. But I know that God knows, and He will help you and guide you in compassionate acts of discipleship if you are conscientiously wanting and praying and looking for ways to keep a commandment He has given us again and again."

I like there how Elder Holland says that he (and presumably the church) do not know how each of us should fulfill our obligation and a church program would, I fear, standardize too much how people view fulfilling our obligation. Most of it will not be done in a church organized way or by someone with a calling doling out assignments in the same way we keep our buildings clean.

So yes, I think I can do more and many members can too but I do not think a ward calling is the way to do it.

[juliann]

25 minutes ago, cinepro said:

 

I'm just posting from my own experience.  Maybe my ward is the exception, but I get invited to volunteer at the soup kitchen once a year around Christmas.  I get asked to come help at "Mormon Helping Hands" once in the spring (and that's usually not anything to do with the "poor and needy"). 

 

Again, have you ever had to organize service?  I did six weeks of tutoring for immigrants last summer. I don't think you have any idea the amount of contacts and work that was required to get that off the ground. We just happened to have a very determined immigrant who worked in the schools and could get names and locations.But the schools closed campuses in July. So she also had to secure library space. (That was fun. A pushy parent walked up to us and got huffy that her kid couldn't join us because she had a library card. Documents were required and it was through the school.)  She then bought the snacks and rewards. I was able to supply materials from my own stash.

Expecting people to do this as a calling would be a full time job and would get the church spread out into all kinds of situations it could not control. The legal liability alone would be horrific. Meanwhile, there are existing organizations begging for help. 

[Duncan]

So, I don't want to add to the Mormon leaks situation but the Church is kind of moving into this area already. I don't know about the US but this program has been rolled out in several Canadian Stakes and apparently developing countries. From what I heard this grew out of the PEF but people needed more than education. It isn't just a "poor and needy" but it's under the umbrella of Self Reliance. There are 4 areas that are going to be focused on, Education, Finances and I forget the other two. But a Couple will oversee this and it'll be run like  ARP (addictions recovery program) where you attend an area like education and they are meetings with discussion leaders and you can rotate through the different areas. Who goes to these I have no idea or how all that is determined. I saw the manual but apparently it's more 3rd world country examples and situations so i've heard they are updating it to a North American model. The manual is in my posession but I can't get to it as I am dying so if I make until tomorrow I can share more from the book

[Ahab]

Anything we can think of to try to help the poor and needy is something we can do and there is no need to wait for a calling to do it. 

And now that is all I have to say about that.

[Tacenda]

2 hours ago, Calm said:

Not really.  If someone is actually interested in serving, why wouldn't they go looking on LDS.org or ask someone in their ward who would be able to direct them to the right place about it and keep asking till they find that person.

Would you sit around and wait for someone from the American Cancer Society to come knocking at your door to invite you to volunteer or go look them up to see what was needed?

Why expect the Church to do things differently?  They publish articles, put out press releases from time to time and make whole websites to make it easier for people to serve and still we get people complaining they weren't told.

The drive to help must not be too strong if they won't even take the first step on their own and instead just fantasize about it.

And you do this over and over, applaud the ignorant complaints, even after being told where the information is..  I don't know what would satisfy you at this point.

Obviously this is a sore point for me, but I am so tired of people not being willing to do the effort to learn, but so willing to complain about their ignorance and blame it on others.  Grow up and be responsible for yourself.

I may be guilty of some of your comments about me, but not all of it. I do try, I've looked on LDS.org for service ideas and I love the JustServe website. I guess the idea that I'll never do what I use to think I would, like serving a mission with my husband, just brings it to the surface. We don't hold current recommends so we won't get this opportunity. But I know there are other ways out there. 

 

[PeterPear]

Steadying the Ark.

good luck

[Robert F. Smith]

5 hours ago, cinepro said:

........................................................................

What do you think?  What could the Church (and Church members) do to systematically make big improvements in "caring for the poor and needy"?

In parts of Utah, where the Mormon population is nearly everyone, the Church could transform itself into the sort of "machine" which you envision -- for systematic care for the poor and needy, including full application of education and training under the new Pathway program, in which non-members would be fully included (under current geographical ward boundaries).  "Teach a man to fish," and all that.

Elsewhere, the overarching problem is that secular and partisan political notions and structures interfere with effective implementation of such care.  Our current efforts as a puny church simply cannot make a big enough dent in the overall problem.  Our Pathway program is shifting into high gear worldwide, is very successful, and will prove to be a big leg up for members.  Our service missionaries attack the problems of poverty and drought in a variety of ways worldwide, and we cooperate with many other NGOs in doing so, but bad weather, war, and displacement of refugees dwarfs all of those efforts.  In order to get beyond those Sisyphean efforts, we need to look at socio-political transformation here at home, in the USA.

We could, for example, make Utah a shining example for the rest of America.  Perhaps we could begin by jettisoning partisan politics and our failed free-market capitalism in favor of the law of consecration.  But would that even be possible?  Perhaps with Mitt Romney at the helm in such an effort (as he did with the Utah Olympics), such reorganization would be possible.  Maybe . . .  and I don't even like Romney.

In any case, such socio-political transformation first calls for personal transformation in each of us.  The late Max Skousen attacked the problem in Los Angeles by having a bunch of stake presidents gather with him at a thrift store to purchase clothes that would make them all look somewhat homeless or down-and-out.  None of them had shaved that week.  Then they went out into poor neighborhoods and mingled with the street-people, ate at soup kitchens, stayed the night at the Union Rescue Mission, etc. (I'm trying to recall what they did now, and am having difficulty remembering; perhaps someone has a copy of the article describing it all, possibly in Dialogue).

Anything done would have to have the full blessing of the Brethren.

[gopher]

2 hours ago, Duncan said:

So, I don't want to add to the Mormon leaks situation but the Church is kind of moving into this area already. I don't know about the US but this program has been rolled out in several Canadian Stakes and apparently developing countries. From what I heard this grew out of the PEF but people needed more than education. It isn't just a "poor and needy" but it's under the umbrella of Self Reliance. There are 4 areas that are going to be focused on, Education, Finances and I forget the other two. But a Couple will oversee this and it'll be run like  ARP (addictions recovery program) where you attend an area like education and they are meetings with discussion leaders and you can rotate through the different areas. Who goes to these I have no idea or how all that is determined. I saw the manual but apparently it's more 3rd world country examples and situations so i've heard they are updating it to a North American model. The manual is in my posession but I can't get to it as I am dying so if I make until tomorrow I can share more from the book

I think you are referring to this.  It's a series of 12 week training courses led by "facilitators" called from the wards.  The four courses I've seen are:

Personal finance
Starting and Growing My Business
Education for Better Work
Find a Better Job

Good luck not dying.  That would stink.

[Traela]

57 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

In parts of Utah, where the Mormon population is nearly everyone, the Church could transform itself into the sort of "machine" which you envision -- for systematic care for the poor and needy, including full application of education and training under the new Pathway program, in which non-members would be fully included (under current geographical ward boundaries).  "Teach a man to fish," and all that.

Elsewhere, the overarching problem is that secular and partisan political notions and structures interfere with effective implementation of such care.  Our current efforts as a puny church simply cannot make a big enough dent in the overall problem.  Our Pathway program is shifting into high gear worldwide, is very successful, and will prove to be a big leg up for members.  Our service missionaries attack the problems of poverty and drought in a variety of ways worldwide, and we cooperate with many other NGOs in doing so, but bad weather, war, and displacement of refugees dwarfs all of those efforts.  In order to get beyond those Sisyphean efforts, we need to look at socio-political transformation here at home, in the USA.

We could, for example, make Utah a shining example for the rest of America.  Perhaps we could begin by jettisoning partisan politics and our failed free-market capitalism in favor of the law of consecration.  But would that even be possible?  Perhaps with Mitt Romney at the helm in such an effort (as he did with the Utah Olympics), such reorganization would be possible.  Maybe . . .  and I don't even like Romney.

In any case, such socio-political transformation first calls for personal transformation in each of us.  The late Max Skousen attacked the problem in Los Angeles by having a bunch of stake presidents gather with him at a thrift store to purchase clothes that would make them all look somewhat homeless or down-and-out.  None of them had shaved that week.  Then they went out into poor neighborhoods and mingled with the street-people, ate at soup kitchens, stayed the night at the Union Rescue Mission, etc. (I'm trying to recall what they did now, and am having difficulty remembering; perhaps someone has a copy of the article describing it all, possibly in Dialogue).

Anything done would have to have the full blessing of the Brethren.

Sorry, couldn't get the link to work, but there's an article on Bloomberg.com entitled "How Utah Keeps the American Dream Alive".

The gist is, Utah is already a "shining example for the rest of America".  It has the highest upward mobility in the country, and the LDS church is a big part of the reason why.

 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Traela

[Duncan]

Just now, gopher said:

I think you are referring to this.  It's a series of 12 week training courses led by "facilitators" called from the wards.  The four courses I've seen are:

Personal finance
Starting and Growing My Business
Education for Better Work
Find a Better Job

Good luck not dying.  That would stink.

that' is it!!! thanks man!!!!

[Stargazer]

1 hour ago, Traela said:

Sorry, couldn't get the link to work, but there's an article on Bloomberg.com entitled "How Utah Keeps the American Dream Alive".

The gist is, Utah is already a "shining example for the rest of America".  It has the highest upward mobility in the country, and the LDS church is a big part of the reason why.

 

Interesting.

Have a look at the Prosperity Gospel thread for examples of how this is a bad thing.  According to some people, anyway.

[Robert F. Smith]

1 hour ago, Traela said:

Sorry, couldn't get the link to work, but there's an article on Bloomberg.com entitled "How Utah Keeps the American Dream Alive".

The gist is, Utah is already a "shining example for the rest of America".  It has the highest upward mobility in the country, and the LDS church is a big part of the reason why.

Yes, thanks for reminding us.  That the author is an outsider is evident from her use of the term "Utahans."

[Robert F. Smith]

3 hours ago, PeterPear said:

Steadying the Ark.

good luck

How about D&C 58:26 For behold, it is not meet that I should command in all things; for he that is compelled in all things, the same is a slothful and not a wise servant; wherefore he receiveth no reward.
27 Verily I say, men should be anxiously engaged in a good cause, and do many things of their own free will, and bring to pass much righteousness;
28 For the power is in them, wherein they are agents unto themselves. And inasmuch as men do good they shall in nowise lose their reward.
29 But he that doeth not anything until he is commanded, and receiveth a commandment with doubtful heart, and keepeth it with slothfulness, the same is damned.

[Rain]

I basically have that calling. I am the stake JustServe.org specialist. Each of the wards in my stake are in the process of calling ward specialists. I will be training them next month. 

In my calling I talk with organizations within my stake that need volunteers. I talk with them about what kind of things they need volunteers to do and help them post these jobs to the website. 

One of my organizations just loves the Mormons because of all the helps she gets.  Another organization just out of my stake asked us to take her project of the website.  She had so many volunteers so quickly that she needed to catch up to them before having it on again. Another one made a video expressly thanking just serve volunteers and posted it to their website. 

As the specialist I train or stake to register for the site and encourage them to volunteer. We also go to other churches,  schools,  clubs etc so they can also learn how to volunteer.  It is the coolest thing to see members from 4 different religions volunteering together!

In my stake I also do a highlight of different projects and send them to each of the ward bulletins. I talk with the stake organizations about projects they could do. I give suggestions to those wanting to do things.  I even give suggestions to the missionaries in our stake.  

Our ward specialists will be directly working with the people in their wards. Bishops can invite them to ward council where the specialists can suggest things of service that can help organizations and people in the ward.  

I could talk forever about this. 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Rain

[Rain]

Now that I have briefly covered Just Serve let's go on to being well known for our service. 

I have found that people are usually very humble and quiet about their service.  Sometimes it is like pulling teeth to get people to share their stories so that they can inspire someone else.  They take the scripture to heart about not doing alms before men,  never realizing that sometimes they need to light a candle so others can glorify God. Far more service happens than you will ever know about. 

But service does get known and Mormons are known for their service.  Utah has Festival of Trees. I want to be very clear that there are many non members that volunteer for it and I do not want to lessen their contributions with what I say next.

Many states have Festival of Trees, but Utah's is the biggest. Not only that, but it is all volunteer and every penny goes to those children at Primary Children's Hospital, something very unusual. There are thousands of volunteers, over 700 decorated Christmas trees donated along with thousands of crafts, quilts, candy, cookies, cards, gingerbread houses etc. Several million each year from the sale of these items goes to the hospital. 

Now that is big, but where I am going with it is that there are reps from other Festivals from across the states that come to find out how they do it.  They are overwhelmed with it.  They don't get the volunteers Utah does.  Many of them need to reimburse the cost of decoated trees because they don't get enough donated.  

When the leaders of Utah's Festival are asked how they do it they respond that it is the people of Utah. No one says it is the Mormons, but the connection is still there.

But that is just one organization.  Things like this happen in many places if you are looking for them. 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Rain

[Rain]

Ok, now, can we do better? Yes!

It is interesting to me how vastly different stakes can be with this.  There is just a road that separates my stake from a second stake. I have seen first hand,  how much of an influence  stake presidents can have on how excited people are about service.  One SP jumped on this,  pulled all the bishops in, really worked together with them and the Just Serve specialist. The stake is on fire. The other SP isn't so excited about it. His bishops are not either.  Some of the wards actively criticize Just Serve. Leaders make a huge difference in how people in their stakes and wards view something.

To be fair there are some differences in the stakes. One has several gated communities with multi million dollar homes. The other has a huge variety of economic circumstances in his stake. It isn't just the SP that makes the attitudes towards service. 

Edited April 13, 2017 by Rain

[Rain]

So what has the church done?  Well, they put a lot of money into Just Serve so that we can help the poor and needy be helped from organizations who understand how to organize the these things and we train or people to use the site. 

It has things talked about in conference about refugees. When they first announced I was a stranger it actually caused the refugee organizations some trouble. Members swarmed to the phones to ask them what they could do and they spent all their time answering phones . The church actually asked our area to NOT call the organizations. To wait for projects on Just Serve instead and volunteer through the site so the organizations could be ready. 

One of the sweetest things for me came through those refugee projects put on the site.  There is a man in our ward who has offended just about every other HP in our ward.  They don't like to be around him. He found out one of these refugee organizations needed furniture. He donated a bunch of his furniture that he wanted to give away.  Now a lot of people can do that,  but he took it a step further. Next thing I know, he is MAKING more furniture to give to the see refugee apartments. What he makes is beautuful. He often makes and sells it to other people, but these things he making to give away, because originally the church said we should look after our refugee brothers and sisters.  He has shown love in a way that has been hiden to the others around him.

The church asks us to work in canneries, cheese making plants, farms etc. Many know the food goes to those the bishop puts an order for the storehouse, but those are not the only poor and needy who benifit. 

I feel like I know a ton of things that the church does to help the poor and needy, yet the more I know, the more I find I have barely scratched the surface. 

If you really want to know what the church does as a group and how it inspires us as individuals go to the canneries, go to Just Serve, go find a food bank or refugee organization if Just Serve is not in your area and...just serve. You might find more members lurking behind the scenes than you knew about before.

Edited April 13, 2017 by Rain

[CV75]

16 hours ago, cinepro said:

What do you think?  What could the Church (and Church members) do to systematically make big improvements in "caring for the poor and needy"?

The Church piloted a self-reliance initiative outside the USA and is currently rolling it out in the USA. https://www.ldsphilanthropies.org/perpetual-education-fund/news-features/New-Self-Reliance-Services-Initiative-Ignites-Hope.html

It basically combines welfare and employment services into one "Self-Reliance" program: https://www.lds.org/topics/pef-self-reliance/manuals-and-videos/na?lang=eng&old=true

[Gray]

I think more could definitely be done. This is something that is starting to be more on the church's radar, but it still seems like it's on the back burner compared to work for the dead or reactivation. But, life in the church is already pretty programmed (or can be if you let it), and there are a lot of things taking up members' time and money as it is. I think to give equal time to philanthropy, we'd need to scale back on something we're already doing. Members do not have infinite reserves of time and money. 

 

[bluebell]

1 hour ago, CV75 said:

The Church piloted a self-reliance initiative outside the USA and is currently rolling it out in the USA. https://www.ldsphilanthropies.org/perpetual-education-fund/news-features/New-Self-Reliance-Services-Initiative-Ignites-Hope.html

It basically combines welfare and employment services into one "Self-Reliance" program: https://www.lds.org/topics/pef-self-reliance/manuals-and-videos/na?lang=eng&old=true

They are currently doing this in our stake.

[HappyJackWagon]

The church has some really good service programs and officially the Bishop has the specific calling to care for the poor and needy at the ward level and chairs the ward welfare committee (actually not sure if that's still an official thing). However, bishops are overwhelmed with responsibilities and can hardly be expected to spearhead service opportunities in the ward. So he hopefully delicates service needs and caring for the poor and needy to the Relief Society and Priesthood quorums. But they are also really busy so it's hard to step outside of the day-to-day requirements of the callings and get more involved in communities. So they likely need to delegate a little more. I would see nothing wrong with having a member or two from the RS and PH quorums assigned to identify and develop community service opportunities. There are some good service projects that go on in wards and stakes around the world but maybe not as many as could be done, simply because every active person in the church is super busy with other church, family, and personal responsibilities. Still, it could be more of a focus.

If that doesn't work, they could always cancel church on the 3rd Sundays and call it Service Sunday where everyone is encouraged to serve others outside of the immediate church community. But somehow I don't see that happening.  

[stemelbow]

1 minute ago, HappyJackWagon said:

The church has some really good service programs and officially the Bishop has the specific calling to care for the poor and needy at the ward level and chairs the ward welfare committee (actually not sure if that's still an official thing). However, bishops are overwhelmed with responsibilities and can hardly be expected to spearhead service opportunities in the ward. So he hopefully delicates service needs and caring for the poor and needy to the Relief Society and Priesthood quorums. But they are also really busy so it's hard to step outside of the day-to-day requirements of the callings and get more involved in communities. So they likely need to delegate a little more. I would see nothing wrong with having a member or two from the RS and PH quorums assigned to identify and develop community service opportunities. There are some good service projects that go on in wards and stakes around the world but maybe not as many as could be done, simply because every active person in the church is super busy with other church, family, and personal responsibilities. Still, it could be more of a focus.

If that doesn't work, they could always cancel church on the 3rd Sundays and call it Service Sunday where everyone is encouraged to serve others outside of the immediate church community. But somehow I don't see that happening.  

Cancelling Church one Sunday a month is an awesome idea.  We could use that day, organize a great service in the community project each month and do it as a ward.  I realize most would be opposed to that but if it came from the top, it could work.  I think most would find that that Sunday would produce more spiritual experiences than Church ever does.