Infallibility of Patriarchal Blessings

[MiserereNobis]

Hello LDS friends,

The issue of LDS leadership, particularly the apostles and prophet, being fallible has often come up on the board. It is usually in the context of a (perceived) mistake made. Some point to the mistake as evidence of leadership not being what they claim, while others point out that leadership is not infallible so mistakes are to be expected.

I was lately doing some quick reading about patriarchal blessings and the issue of fallibility crossed my mind. If I understand correctly, a patriarchal blessing is given once in a person's life, is transcribed verbatim, and the person is supposed to study the blessing for their (yes Scott, I'm using a plural pronoun to refer to a singular antecedent ) entire life to learn God's will for them. This sounds like the blessing is infallibility proclaiming what God wants, since, unless I'm mistaken, there is no option for a redo or a clarification or a disavowal or an explanation, as there is when leadership, including the prophet, makes pronouncements.

What if the patriarch is just speaking as a person and not as God's mouthpiece? Who would know? Does one get a testimony of the infallibility of one's blessing? Or of one's specific patriarch giving the blessing? Are there instances of a clearly wrong patriarchal blessing? Does anyone double-check that the patriarch is actually doing what they are supposed to be doing?

This, to me, is a much more interesting area of discussion than whether or not the prophet is infallible. This a situation where an individual is getting specific words from someone that is supposed to be speaking for God. This seems, if I'm understanding it correctly, like a personal revelation (if I'm using the LDS terms accurately) given to one person by another person.

If a patriarch is wrong, then we have people studying a man's fallible words for their entire life to figure out things about themselves and God. This seems highly problematic.

I also read that the person receiving the blessing is told which tribe of Israel they belong in. Is this also infallible or could the patriarch be mistaken? (and what is the exact reason for being told a specific tribe... does it make any difference?)

Thanks for your thoughts and discussion. And may you continue to have a merry Christmas season!

+ PAX +

[bluebell]

I don’t have time to address everything in the OP except to say that it is possible to get a second patriarchal blessing. 

[Calm]

Blessings are dependent on agency also.  Thus if a person was blessed to have a large family, but never got married, it would not be assumed to be a false prophecy.  And the chance for the blessing isn't lost, but something that could be fulfilled somehow in the next life, either because the person repented of the choices that led to the loss of the blessing or it wasn't their fault ( perhaps in a car accident leaving them comatose).

Edited December 31, 2019 by Calm

[Calm]

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/patriarchal-blessings?lang=eng

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/2017/04/young-adults/understanding-your-patriarchal-blessing?lang=eng

[Scott Lloyd]

12 minutes ago, Calm said:

Blessings are dependent on agency also.  Thus if a person was blessed to have a large family, but never got married, it would not be assumed to be a false prophecy.  And the chance for the blessing isn't lost, but something that could be fulfilled somehow in the next life.

Without presuming to speak for MiserereNobis, I would hazard a guess that he understands this already but that it still does not preclude the possibility that the patriarch simply gets it wrong and does not obviate whatever problems might result therefrom. 
 

I confess that I don’t have a ready answer. 

[InCognitus]

Patriarchal blessings are subject to interpretation, and a person's understanding of their own patriarchal blessing may change as time goes on.  It is often comparable to how we understand statements from prophets of God in scripture.  I've seen people make judgements about their personal blessings at an early stage of their life, but they haven't even begun to understand what their blessing might really mean.  And many of the promises and blessings that are given are contingent upon the faithfulness of the person receiving the blessing.

 A good example of what I mean by this is from what we would see as a primary example of patriarchal blessings found in the Bible with Jacob's blessing to his sons found in Genesis 49 and Moses' blessing in Deuteronomy 33.  It's informative to compare those two versions of the blessings.  Simeon and Levi are combined in the Genesis account (verses 5-7 of chapter 49), but Simeon is completely missing from the Deuteronomy 33 account.  Dan's role also diminishes (compare Gen 49:16-18 to Deut 33:22).  There are some other differences.   So what do we make of this?  I see our personal patriarchal blessings informing us in different ways in different stages of our lives, much like I see the differences in these accounts of patriarchal blessings in scripture.  And the choices we make have consequences that may cause us to lose some of the blessings.

Edited December 31, 2019 by InCognitus

[PacMan]

It’s a blessing. Not a horoscope. And like any blessing, it’s not a ceiling but a baseline. If you miss a blessing, the atonement is big enough to make up for it in other ways. 

[Tacenda]

My husband's brother was told he was of another tribe than the rest of his family, so he thinks he was adopted in or something. 

Also, there are stories of people that have chosen different career paths because of their patriarchal blessings.

And also some that were changed, from the one they were given then the typed up one, they were mailed later on. 

 

 

[Hamba Tuhan]

2 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

This seems highly problematic.

It's no more problematic than any other instance of reading written scripture: the Gift of the Holy Ghost is given to inspire both understanding and interpretation.

Quote

Unless I'm mistaken, there is no option for a redo or a clarification or a disavowal or an explanation.

I'm very close to our stake patriarch. Patriarchs are specifically instructed to review the transcripts of blessings before they upload them and give them to recipients. They can edit the blessing and even add things that they are inspired to add but which were not included when the blessing was pronounced.

Quote

Does anyone double-check that the patriarch is actually doing what they are supposed to be doing?

Yes.

[Bernard Gui]

2 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

Hello LDS friends,

The issue of LDS leadership, particularly the apostles and prophet, being fallible has often come up on the board. It is usually in the context of a (perceived) mistake made. Some point to the mistake as evidence of leadership not being what they claim, while others point out that leadership is not infallible so mistakes are to be expected.

I was lately doing some quick reading about patriarchal blessings and the issue of fallibility crossed my mind. If I understand correctly, a patriarchal blessing is given once in a person's life, is transcribed verbatim, and the person is supposed to study the blessing for their (yes Scott, I'm using a plural pronoun to refer to a singular antecedent ) entire life to learn God's will for them. This sounds like the blessing is infallibility proclaiming what God wants, since, unless I'm mistaken, there is no option for a redo or a clarification or a disavowal or an explanation, as there is when leadership, including the prophet, makes pronouncements.

What if the patriarch is just speaking as a person and not as God's mouthpiece? Who would know? Does one get a testimony of the infallibility of one's blessing? Or of one's specific patriarch giving the blessing? Are there instances of a clearly wrong patriarchal blessing? Does anyone double-check that the patriarch is actually doing what they are supposed to be doing?

This, to me, is a much more interesting area of discussion than whether or not the prophet is infallible. This a situation where an individual is getting specific words from someone that is supposed to be speaking for God. This seems, if I'm understanding it correctly, like a personal revelation (if I'm using the LDS terms accurately) given to one person by another person.

If a patriarch is wrong, then we have people studying a man's fallible words for their entire life to figure out things about themselves and God. This seems highly problematic.

I also read that the person receiving the blessing is told which tribe of Israel they belong in. Is this also infallible or could the patriarch be mistaken? (and what is the exact reason for being told a specific tribe... does it make any difference?)

Thanks for your thoughts and discussion. And may you continue to have a merry Christmas season!

+ PAX +

Somehow we have to dislodge this zombie notion of infallibility that keeps coming back to life. We are human. We are fallible. Prophets are fallible. Patriarchs are fallible. Bishops are fallible. I am fallible. My recipe for Beef Wellington was fallible, well, in the way I constructed it, it was. Only the Godhead is infallible. 

That said, my blessing has been a guide in my life. I received it when I was 7, before I was baptized because I had a tiger mom who wanted the patriarch who blessed her to bless me. She got her way. Granted, it was to a young boy, but there are parts that have come to pass exactly as foretold. There are also parts that I interpreted for guidance when I had some important forks in the road. None of it is "false" nor was I mislead by following it. It was indeed a blessing. As to details of my blessing, as Brother Brigham said, "It is best that each man learn to mind his own business." If you are curious, go get one for yourself.

Later in my life I thought I would like to get one that was addressed to a more mature person, and I received permission from my stake president, but I did not follow through. 

Edited December 31, 2019 by Bernard Gui

[InCognitus]

2 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

Somehow we have to dislodge this zombie notion of infallibility that keeps coming back to life. We are human. We are fallible. Prophets are fallible. Patriarchs are fallible. Bishops are fallible. I am fallible. My recipe for Beef Wellington was fallible, well, in the way I constructed it, it was. Only the Godhead is infallible. 

Related to patriarchs and patriarchal blessings, Isaac (the staunch traditionalist) being fooled by Rebekah and Jacob in his blessing to Jacob and Esau comes to mind.  The Lord seemed totally fine with that, however.

[Scott Lloyd]

54 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

My husband's brother was told he was of another tribe than the rest of his family, so he thinks he was adopted in or something. 

Also, there are stories of people that have chosen different career paths because of their patriarchal blessings.

And also some that were changed, from the one they were given then the typed up one, they were mailed later on. 

 

 

The first paragraph can be answered with one of the links Calm provided, wherein it was explained that we all have multiple blood lines running through us and it is thus possible for a tribal lineage to be dominant in one family member different from that of other family members. It’s comparable to certain hereditary characteristics being dominant in one or more family members that are not dominant in others. 
 

The third paragraph of your post is answered by what Hamba said, that a patriarch can later edit and add to a blessing as he is inspired to do so. 

Edited December 31, 2019 by Scott Lloyd

[The Nehor]

The Stake President is to review patriarchal blessings with the patriarch on a regular basis in case the patriarch goes off the rails. On an odd note patriarch is also one of the few priesthood offices you lose if excommunicated and are then rebaptized and have your blessings restored. 

The blessing is not infallible. The church does not designate even the scriptures as infallible and the Book of Mormon authors admit there could be errors. We have no doctrine of infallibility outside of God and means just God, not our interpretations of what God is saying. We have the promise that the prophet of the Church will not lead us astray but even that is interpreted. I interpret it to mean that following him will lead no one to hell.

The blessing is meant to be interpreted by the one who receives it with the aid of the Holy Ghost. Without the Holy Ghost it is of very limited value and without righteousness it is unlikely to happen at all.

As to the designation of a tribe I have only a limited idea of what that means. One of the things we do in this life is join families. We are children of the Father by spirit birth, children of Christ through baptism, heirs (adopted or not) to Israel through baptism and often blood, and are assigned a tribe. Through the temple we also lock in our mortal families. There is some mystery tied up to this seemingly obsessive creation of family bonds. I am not sure what it is exactly. I know the value of many of them but I am pretty sure there is something tying them all together.

43 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

My husband's brother was told he was of another tribe than the rest of his family, so he thinks he was adopted in or something. 

Also, there are stories of people that have chosen different career paths because of their patriarchal blessings.

And also some that were changed, from the one they were given then the typed up one, they were mailed later on. 

 Patriarchs are supposed to edit the blessing for clarity and content as led by the Spirit. It is not a dirty secret. Many patriarchs have told me that they spend a lot of time in prayer revising blessings as needed.

Fun fact: My name is misspelled on my patriarchal blessing. I really need to get around to apostasizing over that.

[The Nehor]

4 minutes ago, InCognitus said:

Related to patriarchs and patriarchal blessings, Isaac (the staunch traditionalist) being fooled by Rebekah and Jacob in his blessing to Jacob and Esau comes to mind.  The Lord seemed totally fine with that, however.

The Priesthood has the power to both bind and loose. If that story is recorded accurately Isaac had the ability to revoke the blessing when he found out he had been tricked.

[Scott Lloyd]

4 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

The Stake President is to review patriarchal blessings with the patriarch on a regular basis in case the patriarch goes off the rails. On an odd note patriarch is also one of the few priesthood offices you lose if excommunicated and are then rebaptized and have your blessings restored. 

The blessing is not infallible. The church does not designate even the scriptures as infallible and the Book of Mormon authors admit there could be errors. We have no doctrine of infallibility outside of God and means just God, not our interpretations of what God is saying. We have the promise that the prophet of the Church will not lead us astray but even that is interpreted. I interpret it to mean that following him will lead no one to hell.

The blessing is meant to be interpreted by the one who receives it with the aid of the Holy Ghost. Without the Holy Ghost it is of very limited value and without righteousness it is unlikely to happen at all.

As to the designation of a tribe I have only a limited idea of what that means. One of the things we do in this life is join families. We are children of the Father by spirit birth, children of Christ through baptism, heirs (adopted or not) to Israel through baptism and often blood, and are assigned a tribe. Through the temple we also lock in our mortal families. There is some mystery tied up to this seemingly obsessive creation of family bonds. I am not sure what it is exactly. I know the value of many of them but I am pretty sure there is something tying them all together.

 Patriarchs are supposed to edit the blessing for clarity and content as led by the Spirit. It is not a dirty secret. Many patriarchs have told me that they spend a lot of time in prayer revising blessings as needed.

Fun fact: My name is misspelled on my patriarchal blessing. I really need to get around to apostasizing over that.

It’s not that we are “assigned a tribe,” as such. We already have the tribal lineage, through blood or adoption, and it is the role of the patriarch to declare that tribal lineage. 
 

[Scott Lloyd]

9 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

The Priesthood has the power to both bind and loose. If that story is recorded accurately Isaac had the ability to revoke the blessing when he found out he had been tricked.

From the fact that he chose not to, it can be inferred that he later gained divine light and understanding to the effect that Jacob should be the one to have the birthright. 

[The Nehor]

5 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

It’s not that we are “assigned a tribe,” as such. We already have the tribal lineage, through blood or adoption, and it is the role of the patriarch to declare that tribal lineage. 
 

Yeah, bad word choice.

However I am sure we can all agree that the most blessed lineage is that of the birthright son Reuben. I know I was confused when assigned to that tribe but my mother told me it is definitely the best because I am in it. It is a hard lineage to perpetuate and emulate the founder in. My father has made it even harder. He doesn’t have even one concubine!!!!!

(sigh)

[The Nehor]

2 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

From the fact that he chose not to, it can be inferred that he later gained divine light and understanding to the effect that Jacob should be the one to have the birthright. 

Yep.

[Robert F. Smith]

2 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

.................................

I was lately doing some quick reading about patriarchal blessings and the issue of fallibility crossed my mind. If I understand correctly, a patriarchal blessing is given once in a person's life, is transcribed verbatim, and the person is supposed to study the blessing for their ................... entire life to learn God's will for them. This sounds like the blessing is infallibility proclaiming what God wants, since, unless I'm mistaken, there is no option for a redo or a clarification or a disavowal or an explanation, as there is when leadership, including the prophet, makes pronouncements.

Such patriarchal blessings are not seen as different from those given, for example, in Genesis 49 or Deuteronomy 33.

2 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

.....................................

This, to me, is a much more interesting area of discussion than whether or not the prophet is infallible. This a situation where an individual is getting specific words from someone that is supposed to be speaking for God. This seems, if I'm understanding it correctly, like a personal revelation (if I'm using the LDS terms accurately) given to one person by another person.

If a patriarch is wrong, then we have people studying a man's fallible words for their entire life to figure out things about themselves and God. This seems highly problematic.

One prominent scholar who was also a stake patriarch, Professor Richard L. Bushman, was asked at a large meeting at the Claremont Colleges in Southern California (where he headed the Mormon Studies program) how he received patriarchal blessings.  The questioner was a non-Mormon student there.  Bushman replied that the blessings "just come."  He did not know how.  Later he would type up the transcript himself from the tape-recording.  During that transcribing, he said that he sometimes edited what he had said to reflect more accurately what he had received but could not quite state it well during the actual blessing.  He compared that to Joseph Smith editing his own revelations.  I was there and took notes.

2 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

I also read that the person receiving the blessing is told which tribe of Israel they belong in. Is this also infallible or could the patriarch be mistaken? (and what is the exact reason for being told a specific tribe... does it make any difference?)...................

The lineage of one of the Twelve tribes is given.  Such lineages can be actual or by adoption.  Here in the USA, the lineage has typically been Ephraim, for Jewish converts usually Judah.  In Eastern Europe and Central Asia (former Soviet Union) a great many other tribes have been represented.  The Nephites and Lamanites were descended mainly from Manasseh, but some from Judah.  As to infallibility, no human can be infallible.

[Robert F. Smith]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

Blessings are dependent on agency also.  Thus if a person was blessed to have a large family, but never got married, it would not be assumed to be a false prophecy.  And the chance for the blessing isn't lost, but something that could be fulfilled somehow in the next life, either because the person repented of the choices that led to the loss of the blessing or it wasn't their fault ( perhaps in a car accident leaving them comatose).

My patriarch, the late Serge Lauper, told me that patriarchal blessings are conditional.  They are not fortune telling, he said.  Naturally, apostasy would short-circuit any blessing.

[Duncan]

Does it make any real difference what tribe one comes from? I know people that come from various tribes and as far as I can tell they don't live their lives any differently, everyone is to preach the gospel and build Zion

I struggle with my blessing, I call it a burden, it hasn't provided me any real direction or has ever really been much value in my life and certaintly most of it hasn't ever come to pass.  I am beyond agonizing over it. For example, I am told to become "acquainted" with the scriptures but to come to know their "true meaning"-To me to become acquainted with something is to have  a basic passing knowledge of something but hardly intimate or really knowing something, like you know someone but not much beyond their name and a few facts, but then how does that  square with supposedly knowing their true meaning,?it can't be both, if so why use the word "acquaint" and yet "true meaning"? it's like all over the place. I have been praying to know meanings and relevancy in my life and I get nothing, despite a promise that I would be given revelation in my life, so why promise something, then the person asks for it for it but then not be given it?  My brothers' blessing says he'll have  a family and be interested in family history. My brother is on the spectrum, he has zero interest in anybody, sexually speaking, he has never had a girlfriend, and doesn't seem to be interested in anyone and he doesn't care at all about family history, so if God wanted him to be or knew he would be then that failed, so what was supposed to happen I have no idea

Edited December 31, 2019 by Duncan

[Robert F. Smith]

9 minutes ago, Duncan said:

Does it make any real difference what tribe one comes from? I know people that come from various tribes and as far as I can tell they don't live their lives any differently, everyone is to preach the gospel and build Zion

That's tantamount to saying that the original Twelve Tribes of Israel were pointless, or that it would have been just as good to have thirteen or fifteen apostles rather than Twelve.  Perhaps in those and other cases, there is a special symbolic meaning to Twelve, just as there is to Seventy., etc.

9 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I struggle with my blessing, I call it a burden, it hasn't provided me any real direction or has ever really been much value in my life and certaintly most of it hasn't ever come to pass.  I am beyond agonizing over it. For example, I am told to become "acquainted" with the scriptures but to come to know their "true meaning"-To me to become acquainted with something is to have  a basic passing knowledge of something but hardly intimate or really knowing something, like you know someone but not much beyond their name and a few facts, but then how does that  square with supposedly knowing their true meaning,?it can't be both, if so why use the word "acquaint" and yet "true meaning"? it's like all over the place. I have been praying to know meanings and relevancy in my life and I get nothing, despite a promise that I would be given revelation in my life, so why promise something, then the person asks for it for it but then not be given it?  My brothers' blessing says he'll have  a family and be interested in family history. My brother is on the spectrum, he has zero interest in anybody, sexually speaking, he has never had a girlfriend, and doesn't seem to be interested in anyone and he doesn't care at all about family history, so if God wanted him to be or knew he would be then that failed, so what was supposed to happen I have no idea

Obsessing over the content of one's patriarchal blessing is probably not healthy.  One should just live his life according to right principles.  If in the course of life some content of a blessing is fulfilled, fine.  If not, don't worry about it.  Que sera, sera.  What will be will be.

[Duncan]

7 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

That's tantamount to saying that the original Twelve Tribes of Israel were pointless, or that it would have been just as good to have thirteen or fifteen apostles rather than Twelve.  Perhaps in those and other cases, there is a special symbolic meaning to Twelve, just as there is to Seventy., etc.

Obsessing over the content of one's patriarchal blessing is probably not healthy.  One should just live his life according to right principles.  If in the course of life some content of a blessing is fulfilled, fine.  If not, don't worry about it.  Que sera, sera.  What will be will be.

that's what I say, if having one or not having one come to mean the same thing then what value is having one? why not just teach the right principles and just forget the whole thing? in our stake our former patriarch went inactive and I know one couple, now inactive, got theirs from him and then later from the new patriarch and he said anyways, they were both different blessings so now what does that mean? would I get something entirely different from some other patriarch? further,  I know Pres. Monson said your blessing is a page from life's book of possibilities, well, how do you plan your life on a possibility? it's possible you might get run over by a car, it's possible you might get married but end in a murder suicide, it's possible your house could catch fire and you lose everything, how do you plan for a trillion things that might possibly happen?

[CV75]

11 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

Hello LDS friends,

The issue of LDS leadership, particularly the apostles and prophet, being fallible has often come up on the board. It is usually in the context of a (perceived) mistake made. Some point to the mistake as evidence of leadership not being what they claim, while others point out that leadership is not infallible so mistakes are to be expected.

I was lately doing some quick reading about patriarchal blessings and the issue of fallibility crossed my mind. If I understand correctly, a patriarchal blessing is given once in a person's life, is transcribed verbatim, and the person is supposed to study the blessing for their (yes Scott, I'm using a plural pronoun to refer to a singular antecedent ) entire life to learn God's will for them. This sounds like the blessing is infallibility proclaiming what God wants, since, unless I'm mistaken, there is no option for a redo or a clarification or a disavowal or an explanation, as there is when leadership, including the prophet, makes pronouncements.

What if the patriarch is just speaking as a person and not as God's mouthpiece? Who would know? Does one get a testimony of the infallibility of one's blessing? Or of one's specific patriarch giving the blessing? Are there instances of a clearly wrong patriarchal blessing? Does anyone double-check that the patriarch is actually doing what they are supposed to be doing?

This, to me, is a much more interesting area of discussion than whether or not the prophet is infallible. This a situation where an individual is getting specific words from someone that is supposed to be speaking for God. This seems, if I'm understanding it correctly, like a personal revelation (if I'm using the LDS terms accurately) given to one person by another person.

If a patriarch is wrong, then we have people studying a man's fallible words for their entire life to figure out things about themselves and God. This seems highly problematic.

I also read that the person receiving the blessing is told which tribe of Israel they belong in. Is this also infallible or could the patriarch be mistaken? (and what is the exact reason for being told a specific tribe... does it make any difference?)

Thanks for your thoughts and discussion. And may you continue to have a merry Christmas season!

+ PAX +

“…the person is supposed to study the blessing for their …entire life to learn God's will for them” because everyone involved is fallible but God, and we need to personally discover His will from the blessing, including the meaning and reason for our assignment to a tribe of Israel and course corrections that may still save save us even though we may have departed from any or all the instructions and promises in the original blessing. That is the important thing.

[CV75]

PS a patriarchal blessing is a form of scripture, and as such the faith, revelation, testimony we receive and act upon from the pronouncements (as with scripture) exalt us through God's grace, not the actual pronouncements.