Tithing Settlement is now Tithing Declaration

[SteveO]

7 minutes ago, Chum said:

You are becoming obnoxious. Would you kindly aim your compulsions elsewhere?

No problem.

 

 

 

 

what an absolute waste of time this board is

[SeekingUnderstanding]

11 minutes ago, SteveO said:

No problem.

 

 

 

 

what an absolute waste of time this board is

Imagine if you had stopped five pages ago, apologized for the misreading and moved on. I’d never trust you to remove a nail until you take care of that giant rod rammed into the back side of your brain 👍. 

[Rain]

1 hour ago, SteveO said:

https://youtu.be/-4EDhdAHrOg

 

Thought it was common knowledge 

I completely understood what video you were talking about.  The problem is that the video is showing both sides of the story and some people think it is only about their side of the story.  We all get you wanted to remove the nail.  We would all like to remove the nail for chum.  However removing the nail only takes care of half of the problem. 

Quote

Helping someone who's been stabbed is actually straightforward. Just follow these steps and you could save someone's life.

Three simple steps to help someone who's been stabbed:

1. Put pressure on the wound.
2. Call 999.
3. Keep pressure on the wound until an ambulance arrives.
4. What if there is an object in the wound?

If there is an object in the wound, don't remove it as this could make the bleeding a lot worse. Apply pressure around it.

Red Cross

  Sometimes we don't have the training to remove the nail.  Chum has been dealing with this for 30 years.  It's unlikely that anyone, but God, is going to be able to remove it, but we can sit here beside him and care for him and call God/999/911 while caring for the wound.

[SteveO]

8 minutes ago, Rain said:

I completely understood what video you were talking about.  The problem is that the video is showing both sides of the story and some people think it is only about their side of the story.  We all get you wanted to remove the nail.  We would all like to remove the nail for chum.  However removing the nail only takes care of half of the problem. 

  Sometimes we don't have the training to remove the nail.  Chum has been dealing with this for 30 years.  It's unlikely that anyone, but God, is going to be able to remove it, but we can sit here beside him and care for him and call God/999/911 while caring for the wound.

Appreciate this.  That’s a pretty good understanding of where I’m coming from.
 

1 hour ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

Imagine if you had stopped five pages ago, apologized for the misreading and moved on. I’d never trust you to remove a nail until you take care of that giant rod rammed into the back side of your brain 👍. 

You don’t have a nail problem…

 

There’s a stick up your *** though that I could help with.

😂😂😂

 

Alright I’m done.  I’m just trolling for the lolz at this point.  Nice slow couple days at work.  I’ll probably check back and see what you’re all complaining about in October during conference.  ✌🏽 

[SeekingUnderstanding]

23 minutes ago, SteveO said:

There’s a stick up your *** though that I could help with.

😂😂😂

I’m just glad you noticed. See you in October 😍

[Teancum]

On 8/11/2022 at 6:24 PM, filovirus said:

Do you really think the Church is missing out on your tithing?

Well of course it is missing out on it since I do not pay it. Your question really should be is it harming the church not to receive my tithing.  I would answer not likely.  Will it potentially harm the church when you have tens of thousands who used to tithe like I did but no longer do?  Long term perhaps.  Likely, at least on a local level, the time my wife and I used to give hurts the church more than the lack of our cash.

 

On 8/11/2022 at 6:24 PM, filovirus said:

 

From the sounds of it, the Church doesn't need your tithing, nor anyone's for the foreseeable future. I'm pretty sure they have enough to keep the lights running.

I would not argue against that. The alleged one true church has amassed a mighty amount of worldly wealth in many forms.

On 8/11/2022 at 6:24 PM, filovirus said:

 

But maybe from a different perspective, you may be missing out on spiritual blessings that God has in store for you because of not paying tithing.

I am not to worried.

[Teancum]

On 8/12/2022 at 4:49 PM, randy said:

....annnnd the Church will continue to keep plodding along and will continue to do just fine.

.....aaaaaaand did I say it woudn't?

[Bernard Gui]

On 8/11/2022 at 4:36 PM, JAHS said:

Perhaps. The Church is not just  a religion, it is also a corporation so it can operate effectively in this world.
I think the change is part of a softening of the names of certain actions that the church has instigated over recent years. 
 https://www.ldsliving.com/30-names-and-terms-that-are-no-longer-used-by-the-church/s/10868
 

Perhaps the word “settlement” better described what happened at the end of a year when many lived in an agrarian society.

[Teancum]

On 8/11/2022 at 6:06 PM, bluebell said:

Is tithing down?

Well I guess almost nobody knows. Better said is I think it likely tithing is down.  Covid, slow growth, inflation, disaffected members who used to tithe but no longer do. Seems likely it is down.

On 8/11/2022 at 6:06 PM, bluebell said:

And if it is, how does this "change that doesn't actually change anything" (as ttribe put it) going to increase it?

A longer time period to meet with members, more time to talk about tithing, teach about tithing and convince people to pay tithing or train children more to do so.

[jkwilliams]

5 minutes ago, Teancum said:

Well I guess almost nobody knows. Better said is I think it likely tithing is down.  Covid, slow growth, inflation, disaffected members who used to tithe but no longer do. Seems likely it is down.

A longer time period to meet with members, more time to talk about tithing, teach about tithing and convince people to pay tithing or train children more to do so.

Well, on the one hand, the bishop isn't going to be so jammed for time in December; on the other, there will be enough eager people who will get their "declaration" over early so the bishop can spend extra time getting the stragglers to come in.

[Bernard Gui]

19 hours ago, jkwilliams said:

Well, on the one hand, the bishop isn't going to be so jammed for time in December; on the other, there will be enough eager people who will get their "declaration" over early so the bishop can spend extra time getting the stragglers to come in.

I never spent time “getting the stragglers to come in.”  Whoever signed up and showed up, that was it. It’s voluntary, after all.

Edited August 15, 2022 by Bernard Gui

[jkwilliams]

3 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

I never spent time “getting the stragglers to come in.”  Whoever signed up and showed up, that was it. It’s voluntary, after all.

I wish some of my bishops had been like you. I quit going to tithing settlement after I stopped paying tithing. Subsequently, three different bishops tried first to pressure my wife into getting me to come in, and when that failed, they approached my kids. 

[Tacenda]

I was always a faithful tithe payer up until my husband said no more in the last 4 years, long story but it was about his being told if he stayed in his father's business he would benefit at the end, until his parents decided to give it to the church, most of it. Anyway, I was the bill payer and would make sure to pay it before the bills like I was taught and also try to pay on gross and if I didn't, I'd pay on our tax refund. I enjoyed very much attending tithing settlement each year and loved taking my family and it being around Christmas time was special to me. And having one on one with the bishop and my family was nice. But I'm glad that the bishops will hopefully get to spend time with their families during the holidays now. Probably won't happen still, but one can hope.

[jkwilliams]

1 minute ago, Tacenda said:

I was always a faithful tithe payer up until my husband said no more in the last 4 years, long story but it was about his being told if he stayed in his father's business he would benefit at the end, until his parents decided to give it to the church, most of it. Anyway, I was the bill payer and would make sure to pay it before the bills like I was taught and also try to pay on gross and if I didn't, I'd pay on our tax refund. I enjoyed very much attending tithing settlement each year and loved taking my family and it being around Christmas time was special to me. And having one on one with the bishop and my family was nice. But I'm glad that the bishops will hopefully get to spend time with their families during the holidays now. Probably won't happen still, but one can hope.

It was always a formality with me, as I dutifully paid tithing with each paycheck. We also decided that our fast offerings would be 1% of our income. Anyway, the first year after I quit paying tithing, I let the bishop's pressure get to me, and I went with my wife to tithing settlement. I did not want to take our kids with us because I didn't want to affect my kids' beliefs about tithing. Needless to say, it was awkward. 

[Tacenda]

2 minutes ago, jkwilliams said:

It was always a formality with me, as I dutifully paid tithing with each paycheck. We also decided that our fast offerings would be 1% of our income. Anyway, the first year after I quit paying tithing, I let the bishop's pressure get to me, and I went with my wife to tithing settlement. I did not want to take our kids with us because I didn't want to affect my kids' beliefs about tithing. Needless to say, it was awkward. 

I distinctly remember when my husband quit paying, and his testimony had issues too, and the bishop's clerk trying to get us to go in, my kids were pretty much out of the house by then and my husband being quite a stinker and not returning calls. They gave up eventually. I'm sure the clerk was alarmed at how we turned out from years of being faithful tithe payers.

[jkwilliams]

Just now, Tacenda said:

I distinctly remember when my husband quit paying, and his testimony had issues too, and the bishop's clerk trying to get us to go in, my kids were pretty much out of the house by then and my husband being quite a stinker and not returning calls. They gave up eventually. I'm sure the clerk was alarmed at how we turned out from years of being faithful tithe payers.

So, it wasn't just me who got pressured to attend tithing settlement. 

[bluebell]

4 minutes ago, jkwilliams said:

So, it wasn't just me who got pressured to attend tithing settlement. 

I wonder if it mostly depends on whether or not the tithing status of a member has suddenly changed, and bishop wanting to have them in to discuss what brought on the change, more than the tithing itself?

[jkwilliams]

Just now, bluebell said:

I wonder if it mostly depends on whether or not the tithing status of a member has suddenly changed, and bishop wanting to have them in to discuss what brought on the change, more than the tithing itself?

That would make sense if it had only been the bishop when I quit paying tithing. It wasn't.

[bluebell]

3 minutes ago, jkwilliams said:

That would make sense if it had only been the bishop when I quit paying tithing. It wasn't.

Then probably an attempt to get you into the office to talk about your inactivity as well.  I can see this for someone who had been very active as an adult and then wasn't, even if the change was not super recent.

 

[jkwilliams]

Just now, bluebell said:

Then probably an attempt to get you into the office to talk about your inactivity as well.  I can see this for someone who had been very active as an adult and then wasn't, even if the change was not super recent.

 

Well, one of the bishops called a few months before that and said he wanted to meet with our whole family in our home. So, my wife, my kids, and I gathered in the living room to have the bishop berate me and try to guilt me into going to church. I told him I'd be happy to talk to him in private, but this wasn't something I was going to air out in front of my children. I didn't hear anything back from him until he started trying to get me to go to tithing settlement. Personally, I think that bishop was a jackass, and my family agrees with me. 

[blackstrap]

I generally just stop the bishop in the foyer and declare right then quietly. It saves us both time. 

[Macabus]

On 8/11/2022 at 3:20 PM, InCognitus said:

I've been audited by the IRS twice now, the first time was for my charitable contributions and business expenses (I had a lot of driving mileage at the time), and the second time was for my charitable contributions only.  This happened in the 2006-2008 period before we could pay tithing online.  In both cases I had to provide canceled checks from the bank to back up my charitable contributions.  The first audit resulted in a $500 refund to me because I had missed a child tax credit on my return.  You would think they would have learned something from the first audit, so I was really surprised by the second audit on charitable contributions two years later.  

I don't know what the IRS will require as proof for online payments now.  I hope I never need to find out.   But I'm pretty sure the piece of paper we print from the church (either signed or not signed) won't be sufficient.

You can download a official tax statement, including the Church EIN, to be used as documentation for a write-off. It includes line item donations along with a declaration that, "This statement contains a record of voluntary contributions to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints made by the named donor(s) during the year XXXX. The Church provided no goods or services in consideration, in whole or in part, for the contributions detailed below but only intangible religious benefits."

[ksfisher]

On 8/15/2022 at 6:19 PM, blackstrap said:

I generally just stop the bishop in the foyer and declare right then quietly. It saves us both time. 

I don't think this fulfills the purpose of this meeting.  It's more than just a check the box yes, no, or somewhere in between.  This is a time to counsel with the bishop.  For many members this may be the only time during the year that they meet with the bishop.  The opportunity to meet with the bishop should not be dismissed in an effort to save someone time.

[Senator]

49 minutes ago, ksfisher said:

I don't think this fulfills the purpose of this meeting.  It's more than just a check the box yes, no, or somewhere in between.  This is a time to counsel with the bishop.  For many members this may be the only time during the year that they meet with the bishop.  The opportunity to meet with the bishop should not be dismissed in an effort to save someone time.

Is there a requirement to meet with the bishop?

[ksfisher]

1 minute ago, Senator said:

Is there a requirement to meet with the bishop?

Same as it's always been.  Everything in the church in voluntary.