New Announcement on Youth and Primary Progression

[Avatar4321]

55 minutes ago, Traela said:

Yes, it would be nice if it were just as common for families to travel at least to see a girl receive her Personal Progress medallion, and even her Faith in God if she finished that (my daughter was the only one in years to finish hers).

 

Can’t control what others do but you can always start it with your family and see if it catches on

[tulip]

5 hours ago, Avatar4321 said:

What do you base that conclusion on?

The evidence is everywhere.   Gay marriage is the law of the land.   More than half the members support the LGBTQ agenda.  Do you live under a rock?

[Avatar4321]

28 minutes ago, tulip said:

The evidence is everywhere.   Gay marriage is the law of the land.   More than half the members support the LGBTQ agenda.  Do you live under a rock?

And that would make 11-year-olds not ready for the priesthood because?

[Avatar4321]

3 hours ago, tulip said:

The evidence is everywhere.   Gay marriage is the law of the land.   More than half the members support the LGBTQ agenda.  Do you live under a rock?

Btw if the evidence was everywhere shouldn’t you be able to provide it when asked?

 

Edited December 15, 2018 by Avatar4321

[Calm]

8 hours ago, SouthernMo said:

god is asking for obedience and promising nothing in return.

God promises everything in return.

[Calm]

9 hours ago, JLHPROF said:

Probably.  But is it accurate? 

 If every principle a member claims to have a firm testimony of is subject to change under a future administration and that member would discard their testimony I would say that testimony is meaningless.

Members once had testimonies of the blessings of many doctrinal principles.  Baptism for health.  Testimonies of plural marriage.  Testimonies that the ordinances and garments shouldn't be altered.  Testimonies of mother's blessings.  Testimonies that Adam is God.  And then they were told their testimony was no longer valid, so they dropped it.

Today we have testimonies of baptism by immersion. Testimonies of priesthood blessings.  Testimonies of tithing.  Until we get told otherwise.

Testimonies can be about how individual blessings can help us prepare for greater understanding and light, a testimony of a particular understanding or commandment t or revelation ( personal or general) doesn't require that we be locked into that behaviour for the rest of our lives, only that is what God requires of us in the here and now.  If I receive a personal revelation I should go to college, that does not require I never graduate and move on to other things.

I have a testimony of baptisms for health, mothers' blessings, plural marriage in some specific cases.  I don't need to practice something with exactness myself in order to have a testimony of it.  That would be highly problematic since I am female and many things I have a testimony I am a passive recipient or even observer of fully dependent on the actions of men.

Edited December 16, 2018 by Calm

[Avatar4321]

18 minutes ago, Calm said:

God promises everything in return.

Not sure how anyone can miss that

[Rain]

On 12/15/2018 at 10:21 AM, Traela said:

Yes, it would be nice if it were just as common for families to travel at least to see a girl receive her Personal Progress medallion, and even her Faith in God if she finished that (my daughter was the only one in years to finish hers).

 

Yes, that would be nice, but it doesn't quite do it since the same could be done with the boys' Faith in God and Eagles. I'm assuming the new programs will have the same problems.

On 12/15/2018 at 11:17 AM, Avatar4321 said:

Can’t control what others do but you can always start it with your family and see if it catches on

You are right that I can't change others only myself,  but I think it is ok to talk about, especially since it would be an absolute minimum to do it with my family 12 years from now.

To be honest we are not ones that feel comfortable traveling great distances  for ordinations anyway, except for the one ordaining. We, personally, think it places too much emphasis on the "honor". This traveling to every ordination was something my parents just started recently with retirement.

It was just something I had never thought about till I read the comments about getting all the boys' ordinations in and it will likely be emphasized to the girls just because the obviousness of it all being done in a short time frame.

Edited December 16, 2018 by Rain

[Avatar4321]

1 hour ago, Rain said:

Yes, that would be nice, but it doesn't quite do it since the same could be do with the boys' Faith in God and Eagles. I'm assuming the new programs will have the same problems.

You are right that I can't change others only myself,  but I think it is ok to talk about, especially since it would be an absolute minimum to do it with my family 12 years from now.

To be honest we are not ones that feel comfortable traveling great distances  for ordinations anyway, except for the one ordaining. We, personally, think it places too much emphasis on the "honor". This traveling to every ordination was something my parents just started recently with retirement.

It was just something I had never thought about till I read the comments about getting all the boys' ordinations in and it will likely be emphasized to the girls just because the obviousness of it all being done in a short time frame.

I never had my grandparents come for my ordinations so I didn’t think about it much either 

[Rain]

5 hours ago, Avatar4321 said:

I never had my grandparents come for my ordinations so I didn’t think about it much either 

I do wonder if this is more of a new things. Hard to say with my experience. My last grandparent died when I was 4 and I was the oldest in my immediate family. My husband said his grandparents came, but one lived next door and the other down the street - all in the same ward.

[ksfisher]

6 hours ago, Avatar4321 said:

I never had my grandparents come for my ordinations so I didn’t think about it much either 

To tell you the truth I don’t even remember my parents being there for my ordinations (my dad wasn’t a member in good standing).  

[The Nehor]

On 12/15/2018 at 1:58 AM, tulip said:

 

They are trying to get the youth excited about the priesthood and temple work before they get caught in the LGBTQ propaganda.   The problem is an 11 year old isn't ready for the priesthood.   

Since you do not believe the Priesthood even exists it seems idiotic to comment on whether someone is or is not ready for it.

In other words this statement is par for the course for you.

[Calm]

2 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Since you do not believe the Priesthood even exists it seems idiotic to comment on whether someone is or is not ready for it.

In other words this statement is par for the course for you.

He says he is a member, maybe tulip is his favorite flower

http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/71382-new-announcement-on-youth-and-primary-progression/?do=findComment&comment=1209875981

 

Edited December 17, 2018 by Calm

[The Nehor]

2 hours ago, Calm said:

He says he is a member, maybe tulip is his favorite flower

http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/71382-new-announcement-on-youth-and-primary-progression/?do=findComment&comment=1209875981

 

Active and believing are sadly not synonyms but at least not a parrot which is a shame. Parrots are amusing.

[Scott Lloyd]

14 hours ago, Avatar4321 said:

I never had my grandparents come for my ordinations so I didn’t think about it much either 

Only two of my children's grandparents are still living, but we have never felt inclined to expect them to travel to attend our sons' ordinations. Seems a bit much.

[cherryTreez]

On 12/15/2018 at 10:21 AM, Traela said:

Yes, it would be nice if it were just as common for families to travel at least to see a girl receive her Personal Progress medallion, and even her Faith in God if she finished that (my daughter was the only one in years to finish hers).

 

My family has always traveled to see the personal progress be awarded. My sister drove 8 hours to be at mine. I know many families that make a point to be there. I guess I thought it was normal for family to be there.

[The Nehor]

Wow, sometimes we will do ordinances and such when more family happen to be around anyways but the idea of traveling for an ordination or Youth award or baby blessing is still foreign to my family.

[The Nehor]

Spent about three hours yesterday writing up a comprehensive ward transition plan covering hopefully everything to do with this change and the two hour block and the curriculum changes and how we are making it work locally and how it should impact every calling. Now just need Bishop to sign off and I can send it to the whole ward.

Exciting times.

[The Nehor]

The biggest calling headache I found with the change is 11 year old Scouting. Since all those who are 11 at the beginning of next year will become deacons and go to BSA the 11 year old program will cease to exist until boys start aging into it throughout the year. Then it dies permanently at the end of next year. So at least it is a temporary problem.

[bsjkki]

20 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

The biggest calling headache I found with the change is 11 year old Scouting. Since all those who are 11 at the beginning of next year will become deacons and go to BSA the 11 year old program will cease to exist until boys start aging into it throughout the year. Then it dies permanently at the end of next year. So at least it is a temporary problem.

I think the Stakes should provide a year long 11 year old scout program if needed. These boys are stuck in a program “hole” and it is hard to fix it on the ward level. We have no 11 year old scouts until October but I know of wards that will have one in January but we are also not allowed to have one boy participate with their leaders. 

[The Nehor]

12 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

I think the Stakes should provide a year long 11 year old scout program if needed. These boys are stuck in a program “hole” and it is hard to fix it on the ward level. We have no 11 year old scouts until October but I know of wards that will have one in January but we are also not allowed to have one boy participate with their leaders. 

Huh.......I kind of like this idea. I am going to suggest this to the Bishop. If he and the 11 year old scouting leader approves we could try talking with another ward or two in the Stake. Keep all the leaders and two deep takes care of itself on top of that. Maybe separate out more later in the year as the program fills if needed.

[HappyJackWagon]

I haven't read this thread so sorry if this has been covered.

Does anyone think it is possible that the church will take the same approach for baptismal age? All children turning 8 within the year can be baptized together. It would be efficient.

Or does the scriptural mandate about 8 being the age of accountability take that option off the table? Obviously there was nothing scriptural about ordination ages so that made it an easy policy change whereas a baptismal age change would require a scriptural/doctrinal change.

[Hamba Tuhan]

5 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Wow, sometimes we will do ordinances and such when more family happen to be around anyways but the idea of traveling for an ordination or Youth award or baby blessing is still foreign to my family.

Same. I think it may be a consequence of affluence in some families?

[bluebell]

52 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

I haven't read this thread so sorry if this has been covered.

Does anyone think it is possible that the church will take the same approach for baptismal age? All children turning 8 within the year can be baptized together. It would be efficient.

Or does the scriptural mandate about 8 being the age of accountability take that option off the table? Obviously there was nothing scriptural about ordination ages so that made it an easy policy change whereas a baptismal age change would require a scriptural/doctrinal change.

I think the scriptural mandate takes that off the table.  I also think that logistically it would be really difficult for some stakes to baptize every kid in the stake who was going to be eight in January of that year.  It could be more than 100 kids in some places.  

[The Nehor]

4 hours ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

Same. I think it may be a consequence of affluence in some families?

My family is affluent. My parents could fly wherever they like to attend these events and do for things like births and pay for their children to come on family vacations. It probably is tied somewhat to wealth but not exclusively.