Eat Meat Sparingly

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, Rivers said:

Supposedly there won't be any meat in the millennium. So I'm going to enjoy steak and cheeseburgers as much I can until that time. 

Or join me. One of the first orders of business I have is inventing plants that grow meat.

[janderich]

On 6/3/2016 at 3:39 AM, thesometimesaint said:

Do plants not deserve to live?

Perhaps after the resurrection our bodies will be able to directly convert sunlight into energy instead of having to use plants as intermediaries. Until such a time I'll be eating plants, and on rare occasions meat. Based on my interpretation of the word of the Lord, I see a hierarchy of living things. At the lower end are plants, then animals, then humans.

To do as little harm as possible to the earth and the higher intelligence on it, plants are our best option. Next, would be animals. Finally, if the plane I'm on crashes in the Andes mountains and half the people die on impact, and I'm starving to death, I may resort to cannibalism and feel justified in doing so.   

[rodheadlee]

On 6/2/2016 at 6:39 PM, Ahab said:

With some veggies and nuts on some occasions,  I hope. 

I love steamed veggies.

[thesometimesaint]

11 hours ago, The Nehor said:

When I was a child I pointed out to my father that if plants have spirits then killing or harming them was wrong.

He did not buy it and I still had to mow the lawn.

Me too.

[thesometimesaint]

20 hours ago, BlueDreams said:

Most animals raised in feed lots are eating mostly grains (corn, soy, wheat) not grass. solely grass fed animals that we use as meat are rare in the US.

I find it odd that people find being veg work. Maybe slightly more vegan. But honestly I don't think about it at all and I'm more likely to get a wider range of vitamins, minerals and protein in a meal with far less fat, added sugar, and cholesterol. For example Jeanne has a burger with onion tomato and pickles and I assume a bun. I'm planning to have a cucumber, carrots, red bell pepper with hummus. And a side of watermelon, another type of melon, raspberries and strawberries. In one meal there's little to no food prep minus cutting some fruit/veggies. I've gotten more than my allotted amount of fruits and veggies, and some legumes (that's about half the pyramid) and had my fair share of vitamin a, c, b-6, dietary fiber, magnesium, iron, protein, potassium.That burger is a source of iron, protein, b-12, and a little magnesium/b-6. But it also is a chunky source of saturated fat, cholesterol, carbs (with little fiber or umph), and sodium. Meat isn't a miracle food and the foods you're replacing it with often have more balance (or just more) of vitamins.

I went vegetarian when I was 13-14. This isn't all that hard when a young teen could pull it off. There's an adjustment period though...particularly if it's a drastic change. I recently took over someone's diet for a month or 2 and the adjustment was largely from the complex grains, lack of processed foods, and fiber (I flushed her out basically). But after that the adjustments were more pleasant: more energy, more stable moods, clearer/healthier skin, feeling "light," less digestive probs, and losing weight. The hardest part that I saw was if you don't know how to cook (I had to learn) and if you're unwilling to try new foods. Oh, and giving your body time to get past cravings, particularly if you eat a ton of sugar or meat. 

I know it's mostly in jest. But I also feel these are somewhat common misconceptions. So I'm writing more into it than is probably needed

One last thing not particularly to you. As a long-term veg I kinda find it funny when people mention the delectable meats like they're heaven. For one, most meats I can't remember what they taste like and meat is usually not that aesthetically appealing. It's like someone raving about escargot or fried crickets and showing your photos of fried snake and bat. For another my food is Delish!

 

with luv, 

bd 

We can get grass fed beef at my local grocery store. A bit more expensive, but the flavor is worth the occasional treat.

Meats can comfortably occupy about 1/4 of a dinner plate. About the size of  a deck of cards, 2-3 times per week safely meets the protein needs for a adult.

There is no "miracle" foods. A well balanced diet concentrating on a variety of foods, from a variety of sources will serve most people well. But as I said I don't have a problem with vegetarians.

Live long and prosper.

[RevTestament]

On 06/01/2016 at 11:04 AM, Mystery Meat said:

As an attorney, I spend my day dealing with nuance and subjectivity. Perhaps, few words are more subjective in the commandments of God, then the word sparingly when it comes to the consumption of meat. I would be curious to know how each of you treat this part of the Word of Wisdom. It has been on my mind as of late and I feel like a change is in order in my life.

Note: this thread is not the place to discuss the Word of Wisdom as a commandment, the love of animals, or what science has to say about anything. If you can't stay on topic, you will be removed.

I have always interpreted this section to mean that we should eat meat sparingly except in times of famine we might have to eat quite a bit. I interpret sparingly to mean something like no more than one helping of meat per day. For some people eating less meat might be appropriate and that should be a prayerful determination based on available medical evidence and personal preference. I do not consider a non-meat diet to be particularly more healthful than a diet with some meat. I particularly like some meats such as Seafood, an occasional steak, and would miss them if I were not allowing myself to have them at least occasionally. I also believe there's potentially healthful things about Seafood.

Edited June 5, 2016 by RevTestament

[Ahab]

On 6/3/2016 at 10:31 PM, The Nehor said:

Or join me. One of the first orders of business I have is inventing plants that grow meat.

Beans/legumes are better and as close as you'll ever be able to get to animal flesh from a plant.  And yes you can consider that as a personal challenge to do any better than that.

[The Nehor]

16 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Beans/legumes are better and as close as you'll ever be able to get to animal flesh from a plant.  And yes you can consider that as a personal challenge to do any better than that.

Oh, I will beat legumes and beans. Couldn't do much worse.

Edited June 6, 2016 by The Nehor

[thesometimesaint]

36 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Beans/legumes are better and as close as you'll ever be able to get to animal flesh from a plant.  And yes you can consider that as a personal challenge to do any better than that.

SEE http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/amino-acid-profile-beans-4952.html

[Jeanne]

On 6/5/2016 at 8:42 AM, RevTestament said:

I have always interpreted thisg section to mean that we should eat meat sparingly except in times of famine we might have to eat quite a bit. I interpret sparingly to mean something like no more than one helping of meat per day. For some people eating less meat might be appropriate and that should be a prayerful determination based on available medical evidence and personal preference. I do not consider a non-meat diet to be particularly more healthful than a diet with some meat. I particularly like some meats such as Seafood, an occasional steak, and would miss them if I were not allowing myself to have them at least occasionally. I also believe there's potentially healthful things about Seafood.

I practically live on albacore tuna and halibut!  I mix everything in salad with lemon and then good to go.  I have a thing about green beans too..weird lady.

[Jeanne]

Embarrassed...what exactly is legumes?

[UtahTexan]

I. Eat. Meat.

Maybe it is because I am a Texan.  Maybe it is because I did not make it the top of the food chain just to eat vegetables.

Actually, it is because I load protein and try to stay away from carbs.

 

 

[Ahab]

29 minutes ago, CountryBoy said:

I. Eat. Meat.

Maybe it is because I am a Texan.  Maybe it is because I did not make it the top of the food chain just to eat vegetables.

Actually, it is because I load protein and try to stay away from carbs.

Good to stay away or at least minimize what are known as "simple" carbs, but "complex" carbs are the best kinds of food to be eaten... including whole grains and beans and fruits and starchy vegetables. 

http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/nutrition/carbs/simple-vs-complex-carbohydrates.html

Contrary to popular opinion, and surprisingly to some Texans, people are not carnivores, by nature, although we can eat pretty much anything we want to eat.  

I was born and raised in Texas and every time I go back to visit I'm amused by what I didn't realize when I lived and ate most of my meals there... it's pretty dang hard if not near impossible to get a decent salad at most restaurants that serve good bbq!... usually just the fixins they use for the burgers! 

 

[UtahTexan]

7 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Good to stay away or at least minimize what are known as "simple" carbs, but "complex" carbs are the best kinds of food to be eaten... including whole grains and beans and fruits and starchy vegetables. 

http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/nutrition/carbs/simple-vs-complex-carbohydrates.html

Contrary to popular opinion, and surprisingly to some Texans, people are not carnivores, by nature, although we can eat pretty much anything we want to eat.  

I was born and raised in Texas and every time I go back to visit I'm amused by what I didn't realize when I lived and ate most of my meals there... it's pretty dang hard if not near impossible to get a decent salad at most restaurants that serve good bbq!... usually just the fixins they use for the burgers! 

 

Maybe so...but I lost 90 ponds my way.  I am 56 and weight what I did in my 30s.  My last Doc visit said my bloodwork and health was that of someone 25 years my junior.

So, my way at least works for me.

Been a Texan my whole life......We eat meat.  especially those of us raised in the Country

[The Nehor]

49 minutes ago, CountryBoy said:

Maybe so...but I lost 90 ponds my way.

So you are the one responsible for the water shortage. GO FIND THOSE PONDS IMMEDIATELY!!!!

[UtahTexan]

1 minute ago, The Nehor said:

So you are the one responsible for the water shortage. GO FIND THOSE PONDS IMMEDIATELY!!!!

I a m awfill at typng

[BlueDreams]

1 hour ago, CountryBoy said:

Maybe it is because I am a Texan.  Maybe it is because I did not make it the top of the food chain just to eat vegetables.

That is literally word-for-word what my 17 yr old brother said to me the other day when I sent him halconero's video. Great minds....well actually probably just Texans (bro has grown up there since he was 4 or 5).

With luv,

BD

[BlueDreams]

duplicate

Edited June 6, 2016 by BlueDreams

[flameburns623]

The MOVE! Weight loss program at the VA hospital system tries to move obese vets away from simple carbs and red meats to smaller portions of fish and poultry, smaller portions of more nutrient-rich/fiber-dense carbohydrates, and larger portions of non-starchy veggies. 

The dietician at our local program insists that the research is pointing to consumption of large quantities of red meat as playing a significant role in both heart disease and cancers.

She pushes pretty hard to get vets to get to a place where 1/3rd to 1/2 of meals are purely vegetarian, with most of the meat-including meals using animal protein as a condiment rather than as a centerpiece of the meal. The advice is to have no more than one or two servings of animal protein, no greater than the size of a standard deck of cards, per day. 

They even offer a coojing class to help veteans transition to better habits. It IS POSSIBLE to create zesty, tasty meals using less animal protein and moving away from red meats. Adventists are particularly skilled at doing this. However, taste adjustments have to be made and cravings for one's former favorite foods will likely occur.

Lo-carb diets are acknowledged as also a good alternative, with South Beach dieting probably better than Atkins in this respect. Our particular VA dietician dislikes even discussing low carb diet options. She thinks they are expensive relative to other diet options and often faddish.

And she thinks the independent research doesn't support low-carb as being any more effective over longer-term than other diets.

A lot of the advice she gives seems to endorse the Word of Wisdom, broadly speaking. She probably is not LDS, nor seemingly religious in any way, btw. Just a relatively young woman who's been at her job maybe ten or fifteen years. And her advice comes straight out of a phonebook-sized manual they give us when we are enrolled into the weight loss programs at the VA.

I have thought, several times, that her emphatic insistence that current research encourages the limiting of meats generally, and red meat particularly, dovetails nicely with the WoW. 

[JAHS]

6 hours ago, Jeanne said:

Embarrassed...what exactly is legumes?

 alfalfa, clover, peas, beans, lentils, soybeans, peanuts

[thesometimesaint]

18 hours ago, Jeanne said:

Embarrassed...what exactly is legumes?

SEE https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legume

[RevTestament]

18 hours ago, Jeanne said:

I practically live on albacore tuna and halibut!  I mix everything in salad with lemon and then good to go.  I have a thing about green beans too..weird lady.

 

12 hours ago, flameburns623 said:

The MOVE! Weight loss program at the VA hospital system tries to move obese vets away from simple carbs and red meats to smaller portions of fish and poultry, smaller portions of more nutrient-rich/fiber-dense carbohydrates, and larger portions of non-starchy veggies. 

The dietician at our local program insists that the research is pointing to consumption of large quantities of red meat as playing a significant role in both heart disease and cancers.

She pushes pretty hard to get vets to get to a place where 1/3rd to 1/2 of meals are purely vegetarian, with most of the meat-including meals using animal protein as a condiment rather than as a centerpiece of the meal. The advice is to have no more than one or two servings of animal protein, no greater than the size of a standard deck of cards, per day. 

They even offer a coojing class to help veteans transition to better habits. It IS POSSIBLE to create zesty, tasty meals using less animal protein and moving away from red meats. Adventists are particularly skilled at doing this. However, taste adjustments have to be made and cravings for one's former favorite foods will likely occur.

Lo-carb diets are acknowledged as also a good alternative, with South Beach dieting probably better than Atkins in this respect. Our particular VA dietician dislikes even discussing low carb diet options. She thinks they are expensive relative to other diet options and often faddish.

And she thinks the independent research doesn't support low-carb as being any more effective over longer-term than other diets.

A lot of the advice she gives seems to endorse the Word of Wisdom, broadly speaking. She probably is not LDS, nor seemingly religious in any way, btw. Just a relatively young woman who's been at her job maybe ten or fifteen years. And her advice comes straight out of a phonebook-sized manual they give us when we are enrolled into the weight loss programs at the VA.

I have thought, several times, that her emphatic insistence that current research encourages the limiting of meats generally, and red meat particularly, dovetails nicely with the WoW. 

Seafood with a lot of pink such as shrimp, lobster and salmon are rich in astaxanthin, one of the strongest antioxidants known. Cooked conservatively they are also low in fat except for the omega 3s. Both these things are considered healthful. I am of the personal opinion that the major issue Americans are having with weight is not the fat they eat, but the plethora of simple carbs high on the glycemic index. This constant stream of sugar laden carbs and lack of exercise doesn't allow the body to store sugar as glycogen so it gets stored as fat. I strive to eat the diet you two are proposing and believe it is in harmony with the word of wisdom.

[Jeanne]

1 hour ago, RevTestament said:

 

Seafood with a lot of pink such as shrimp, lobster and salmon are rich in astaxanthin, one of the strongest antioxidants known. Cooked conservatively they are also low in fat except for the omega 3s. Both these things are considered healthful. I am of the personal opinion that the major issue Americans are having with weight is not the fat they eat, but the plethora of simple carbs high on the glycemic index. This constant stream of sugar laden carbs and lack of exercise doesn't allow the body to store sugar as glycogen so it gets stored as fat. I strive to eat the diet you two are proposing and believe it is in harmony with the word of wisdom.

I love shrimp..so this is a plus.  lobster is good..but I make a mess out of it.. Does everybody remember salmon patties our mother's used to make?    I exercise a lot but all I do is get shorter.  I do love salt..my biggest flop! Thanks for this!!

[Ahab]

3 hours ago, Jeanne said:

I love shrimp..so this is a plus.  lobster is good..but I make a mess out of it.. Does everybody remember salmon patties our mother's used to make?    I exercise a lot but all I do is get shorter.  I do love salt..my biggest flop! Thanks for this!!

My Momma made what she called salmon croquets, about the size and shape of medium sized potatoes rather than patties.  And they were yum yum eat em up good! 

Salmon mixed with minced onions and celery and enough eggs to help them stay into shape then rolled around in corn meal and baked until the cornmeal was extra crispy.  

I ate them with ketchup when I was little, also using the ketchup for the tater tots she would usually serve along with them, but now I'd prefer to use my own tarter sauce and a lot of juice from some fresh lemons.  With some big piles of cole slaw and green beans on the side.

 

[Jeanne]

11 minutes ago, Ahab said:

My Momma made what she called salmon croquets, about the size and shape of medium sized potatoes rather than patties.  And they were yum yum eat em up good! 

Salmon mixed with minced onions and celery and enough eggs to help them stay into shape then rolled around in corn meal and baked until the cornmeal was extra crispy.  

I ate them with ketchup when I was little, also using the ketchup for the tater tots she would usually serve along with them, but now I'd prefer to use my own tarter sauce and a lot of juice from some fresh lemons.  With some big piles of cole slaw and green beans on the side.

 

Oh...that sounds so good..it does!  Loving onions and celery in everything and corn meal too!  And then....you had to go and put ketchup on it.  I love tarter and my lemon serves many purposes!  I am so sweet and sour.  When I was pregnant with my son..I sucked on limes and lemons the whole time..poor kid, he came out all puckered up.

Edited June 7, 2016 by Jeanne