Engagement Before Mission

[rpn]

NO, but it isn't because "they stand no chance". It is because they need to experience this process that will change them, without having made promises that are premature until they've become what they will become.

[Alan]

I got engaged just before I went on my mission at the age of 18.

After 2 years service I returned home and we got married.

That was 32 years ago and still counting.

[Garden Girl]

I was engaged before my mission, as a 25-year-old convert. My fiancee served a mission during the same period I did. We were married a month after I returned. I consider it a unique situation, but it was right for us.

That's the key... it was right for you, so it worked. Keep in mind that going on a mission occurs at an age where neither party is truly mature... not emotionally, not intellectually... 19 year old boys aren't really ready except in a few instances. When the age was 21 for women it was a little more workable... but now at 19 they can be called. There's a whole lot of difference between a nineteen year old and someone 21.

Going on a mission, particularly a foreign mission, matures a person... opens them to people, places, and experiences that helps them grow as an individual and even changes them forever. The 19 year old boy isn't the 21 year old that comes home. Now the young women will be in the same situation.

So, IMO, it is best not to be engaged as the general rule... understanding that there are always a few exceptions... instead, a missionary should be able to focus on the experiences at hand and grow and develop without other influences or limitations...

GG

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

I was engaged before my mission, as a 25-year-old convert. My fiancee served a mission during the same period I did. We were married a month after I returned. I consider it a unique situation, but it was right for us.

Same happened in my Ward, a family picture was made with the other married brothers and sister. Two years later (after returning from thier missions) they married.

[jbarm]

When I was on my mission, I had a sister in my district who got engaged to another missionary in the MTC. Her fiance and she were in the same MTC branch but went to different missions (typical strategy back then to have sisters in a branch go to a different mission). We thought it rather odd and a real distraction, but oh well. Of course I had a lot of distractions with 8 sister missionaries and two elders (myself and my companion) in one district, but that is another story.

My wifes uncle went on his mission in the 1950's just after he got married. His wife eventually came out and served with him on his mission for the last 6 months or so. Now that would be interesting.

jb

[thatjimguy]

I think you missed the implications of my post.

Maybe I did. Explain that one again please.

At that age, personality and lifestyle habits are still developing. If one is side by side with someone, one can develop as well in response to the other's behaviours, etc.....both grow together so to speak; however, if one has very limited contact, it is possible that after two years those differences are significant, possible too significant to overcome.

This is just as true when people are together. You can hear about couples “growing apart” that live in the same house!

1) People can be committed to the wrong things or the wrong people,

2)and a trial of committment under those circumstances is just a waste of mental and emotional energy.

3) Two years apart for people who love each other is difficult under any circumstances, but unless both have confirmation that it is God's commandment that they be together, it's not a matter of obedience or faith in God to wait.

1) Just as much as anyone else…why the assumption that they two people would be lying to themselves about being engaged would be “right”?

2) Look at any talk about trials given by our leaders. Do they encourage giving up? Losing Faith?

3) When they pray for confirmation from the Holy Spirit about it, I would say it would be. If they pray about it, get the confirmation, then do NOT stay together, wouldn’t that be from a LACK of faith that they could have made it through the trial?

Any reason that engagements break up would be the same thing even if they stuck together. If one breaks the engagement during the mission, I would say that person very well have done the same thing if the mission did not exist. “The grass is always greener” is not a new thing.

1) Just because two people get engaged, doesn't mean that it's an eternal marriage,

2) and it certainly doesn't mean that the Holy Spirit was involved.

3) And, the elder made a committment to serve the Lord for two years, putting everything else second to that goal. Getting engaged on his mission meant he broke that committment to the Lord, and who would argue that that is ever a good thing?

1) No not yet.

2) I disagree, assuming that both parties are praying for guidance and legit. If the idea of being engaged before a mission is a bad idea, why then wouldn't the spirit just say “BAD IDEA! Danger! Danger! Will Robinson!”

3) No it does not! Is anyone less committed to the Lord when they are married? You may say it will cause a distraction to the commitment well so does homesickness. Out here at BYU-I I see girls who are very homesick and it distracts them just as much as if they miss their man. No difference. Break out the Kleenex and grab some chocolate...it's going to be awhile...

Where a commitment is a pledge and an obligation that needs to be constantly worked on and kept fresh, it would be difficult for the unmarried couple to maintain a parallel, concurrent commitment to both the mission (or both missions if both are on a mission) and their engagement for marriage.

Since when do we falter our faith due to difficulty?

NO, but it isn't because "they stand no chance". It is because they need to experience this process that will change them, without having made promises that are premature until they've become what they will become.

2) It seemed to work out for some here…I think what is happening is much like the idea of getting married after a couple only know each other for 3 months. Average people will say it will never work. And sure enough if it doesn't…it’s the talk of the town to say “I told you so…see!” However there has been a study that has evidence that the length of courtship has no bearing on the odds of divorce.

(http://commons.pacif...246&context=spp)

But the idea “short courtships never work” will always be a common statement because it makes sense. I sense the same things here. Everyone hears about the horror stories of the “dear john” letters and such and everyone remembers it because of the grief attached. Not as much is remembered about the ones that make it.

Yes, I would certainly say do not be cavalier about it, but if we cannot trust the Holy Spirit with something such as righteous eternal marriage, how can anyone trust the Holy Spirit for anything?

That's the key... it was right for you, so it worked.

That's the key... it was right for you, so it worked.

And what made it right for them? The confirmation of the Holy Spirit and the desire of righteous love. As long as they keep true to that, they’ll win. People are supposed to grow through trails as I keep hearing. As long as they have the faith in God that they are right for each other, they should prevail.

Edited March 17, 2013 by thatjimguy

[thatjimguy]

.....

[Duncan]

That's the key... it was right for you, so it worked. Keep in mind that going on a mission occurs at an age where neither party is truly mature... not emotionally, not intellectually... 19 year old boys aren't really ready except in a few instances. When the age was 21 for women it was a little more workable... but now at 19 they can be called. There's a whole lot of difference between a nineteen year old and someone 21.

Going on a mission, particularly a foreign mission, matures a person... opens them to people, places, and experiences that helps them grow as an individual and even changes them forever. The 19 year old boy isn't the 21 year old that comes home. Now the young women will be in the same situation.

So, IMO, it is best not to be engaged as the general rule... understanding that there are always a few exceptions... instead, a missionary should be able to focus on the experiences at hand and grow and develop without other influences or limitations...

GG

I agree. Even you aren't even done physically grown up yet, certaintly not at 19! In this mission they had 18 missionaries come out a couple of weeks ago and already two went home, which happens but one of them why he was ever sent out is strange to me but whatever. In our ward we got one fo them, nice enough fellow. I asked him to pray once and he said he hadn't ever really prayed before so I said well, you'll be praying a TON in the mission! or you should be!

Edited March 17, 2013 by Duncan

[webbles]

doesn't that kind of grind against the idea of eternal companion? How many of you feel the same as Canard78?

I feel the same as Canard78 and I don't see how it goes against the idea of an eternal companion. Once my wife and I were married, we became eternal companions and I plan to very much keep it that way. But before we were married, she was not my eternal companion. Any woman could have potentially become my eternal companion at that time.

[altersteve]

... righteous love.

That's redundant.

[CV75]

1) Since when do we falter our faith due to difficulty?

RE: 1) Many people do; that is the reality of our fallen and/or inexperienced condition. But that aside, if the full and ongoing demands of a two-year mission and the full and ongoing demands of an engagement to be married are to be met, they must be made sequentially and not concurrently. Of course there may be unique exceptions. But more likely, the “full and ongoing demands” are not fully understood by the parties involved, which is what fallen and inexperienced people often do (hence the counsel they receive from the Lord’s anointed).

Edited March 18, 2013 by CV75

[CV75]

Yes, I would certainly say do not be cavalier about it, but if we cannot trust the Holy Spirit with something such as righteous eternal marriage, how can anyone trust the Holy Spirit for anything?

We also have to have a humble trust in ourselves as well, which requires utmost personal honesty. Regarding personal revelation, the Holy Spirit reveals the right intelligence about the right subject at the right time and place to the properly prepared individual. Otherwise what we attribute to the Holy Spirit is actually something else, however noble our intention may be.

[Calm]

This is just as true when people are together.

If you mean that it happens when people are together just as it happens when they are apart...yes, that is true. If you are suggesting that it happens as often or is as likely when people are together as when they are apart, I would disagree.

When people are together they have the option to pay attention to the other in ways that are lacking when they are apart and thus they can modify their own behaviour so that their actions bring them closer together instead of drifting apart. Since a missionary is supposed to be focusing on the mission itself and not on his or her loved one, that is something s/he is specifically not able to do...adjust behaviour to meet the needs of the loved one or the relationship.

I am discussing here the practical side of a relationship, if a couple has had a spiritual witness about a relationship (not just one of the couple, but both) then that should certainly be taken into account in their decision whether or not to continue the relationship. I do believe that all things are possible with God.

[thatjimguy]

We also have to have a humble trust in ourselves as well, which requires utmost personal honesty. Regarding personal revelation, the Holy Spirit reveals the right intelligence about the right subject at the right time and place to the properly prepared individual. Otherwise what we attribute to the Holy Spirit is actually something else, however noble our intention may be.

The problem I have with that idea is that is an automatic setup for promptings that fail to be the fault of the prayeree, which goes back to my statement about how can you trust the Holy Spirit (or yourself) if you can feel something is right, and then be wrong.

[rpn]

"Stand no chance" is the language of the poll, not mine.

[Buzzard]

I'm glad it's not hard and fast or my circumstances might be different. My father put a ring on my mothers finger before he departed back in the 1950's. She absolutely waited for 2 1/2 years, the only date she went on was one with her brother.

Dad didn't even go right home after his mission, he went straight to Mom's parents house from the airport. The wedding was two months later. They were married 54 years, and of course in the gospel sense are and will be married for quite a while to come.

[CV75]

The problem I have with that idea is that is an automatic setup for promptings that fail to be the fault of the prayeree, which goes back to my statement about how can you trust the Holy Spirit (or yourself) if you can feel something is right, and then be wrong.

Sometimes it really is OK to be wrong! The Lord can help us learn so much from mistakes that from His perspective are completely surmmountable, and from ours are completely unavoidable. This is why we are counseled to go with the best decision we can make with the light that we have. Of course no one wants to be wrong, but we are often not doing our part to be right.

And that can be OK too--mistakes comes in so many degrees of wrongness, most of which are not irreversible.

Someone who could have made a better choice about or between a mission and an engagement to be married can still, at some point along the line, have a marriage, or at least an attitude about his marriage, that is in line with the Lord's will. And therein lies the key to the joy of correction. And the joy in erring on the side of wise counsel when feeling the tug against one's confidence in self or the Spirit.

Fearing mistakes is a sign of not having faith in the desired course of action.

[Brenda]

I wanted a fourth option on the poll. Something like "Get engaged after the mission. If it's right, she'll still be there."

My opinion, for what it's worth: Don't tie her down while you are gone. It's not fair to her and she will never get those years back. I know how hard it is to say goodbye with no guarantees .... been there. But I ended up having a wonderful time at college and dated others while my boyfriend served his mission. I cannot tell you how I treasure that once-in-a-lifetime experience. And it worked out. We got married soon after he got home. And 37 years later -- no regrets.

[thesometimesaint]

It's not a good idea, and absence doesn't make the heart grow fonder. But some few can make it work out.

[The Nehor]

The difference between waiting and formal engagement is commitment. For something called eternal companionship, I would figure this kind of trial would be encouraged.We are so committed and obedient with things in this church, why is this so different? We are told that having the faith of Abraham or Job is a good thing for anything else. Why not this?

The faith we endorse is faith in Jesus Christ not faith that neither of us will alter our feelings for two years (something often out of pur control) or that things will work out. Having faith that things will work out how you want because you want them is faith unlikely to last long.

Commitment again is to God and the gospel, a safe commitment as God never changes and His promises are sure. Two mortals are presumptuous to assume the same of an agreement between them. Marriage is the closest we come to that but even in that case people can and do fail. Why take that responsibility if you do not have to? I would argue that most of those who want that kind of commitment are operating on fear of losing the other person, not faith.

[Damien the Leper]

I had a bishop who didn't serve a mission. He met his wife at 19 and after 6 days of knowing each other they were engaged. They have been married now for almost 36 years.

They got engaged after he had received his mission call. I think they made a good decision.

Edited March 23, 2013 by Valentinus

[ERMD]

B ad idea.

[Brenda]

I had a bishop who didn't serve a mission. He met his wife at 19 and after 6 days of knowing each other they were engaged. They have been married now for almost 36 years.

They got engaged after he had received his mission call. I think they made a good decision.

Except that, as he encourages his sons or the youth in his ward to serve a mission, he cannot say he did it himself. Example is pretty powerful.

[BlueDreams]

Hey all.

1) I know there is a hard and fast rule about not being married before going on a mission. But what about being engaged?

There's no technical rule against it

2) Also I would like to hear personal insights and opinions as to this.

I think it is one of the dumbest things anyone could do. The people who go are young puppies. 19....now often 18. They have never really had the opportunity to date and experience life outside of immediate supervision. Maybe it's my overt prejudice against 19 yr olds making life-long/eternal decisions on one's spouse. It's probably all those darn classes that I've gotten to see the rapid decrease in divorce statistics if someone would marry when they're just a little older (the marital "sweet spot" is between 22-26 statistically for highest likelihood of happiness and low levels of divorce). Maybe it's remember all too well how unprepared I was to make that decision before my own mission. Either way, I would be piping mad if someone did that to my daughter/son. I know it seems "romantic" and they're "in love." But it's unfair to make him/her not only wait but entirely unavailable for anybody for 2 yrs! I couldn't do it to the man I loved and he wouldn't do it to me.

All that said, I also put that for most it wouldn't work. But there is an exception to everything. I'm aware that it could work and be a great marriage come 2 years with a good happy relationships. I'm just saying the likelihood isn't big. And for most teens who are thinking of doing so, it would be stupid to assume it's a good idea.

Personally I don't mind people writing and pining for each other. But I don't think they should have the expectation that they be there in the end. I watched a number of missionaries break up during their time on a mission. It wasn't pretty. the vast majority of those relationships didn't last, plain and simple.

We talk so much about Eternal Marriage...what's 1 1/2 or two years compared to that?

They're not married yet. Their commitment is minimal and not bound by covenant but arbitrary human promise with no formal bind.

We speak so much of commitment it just seems backwards that some oppose this idea. I do not know the numbers of how many do or do not think it is a good idea (hence the poll, just for a glimpse) Are eternal companions replaceable?

They're not eternal companions yet. It's a moot point until they are.

With luv,

BD

[JLHPROF]

metformin azithromycin 250 mg price more information propecia buy acomplia online avodart methotrexate ectopic tadalafil cialis generic alli online

 

REPORTED.

What a stupid place to post spam.  Whoever pays you to do their marketing needs a refund.