cdowis Posted November 4, 2018 Posted November 4, 2018 (edited) minute 1 As Micah Wilder approaches the stage, he enjoys the applause of the crowd. Having left Mormonism, he's a real rock star, rather than just another nobody. He's on the speaking tour to tell his amazing story of salvation from this evil cult. minute 17 At the end of his performance, the crowd roars with approval == he gave them what they wanted to hear He basks in their applause and cheers of approval. He is saved! He is saved,! Hallelujah, he is saved from the grasp of Satan himself Gives me chills. (youtube) Edited November 4, 2018 by cdowis
mfbukowski Posted November 4, 2018 Posted November 4, 2018 So this is sarcasm? and yes of course- link? I am kind of lost here- help me figure out what you are saying! 1
The Mean Farmer Posted November 4, 2018 Posted November 4, 2018 looks like a You Tube video with that title. I am not going to link it as I doubt it is worthy of it. (I haven't watched it) But looks like a young man went out to serve a LDS MIssion and returned back a Baptists, BAC, or other. His story of conversion is apparently applauded by the crowd he is preaching to.
bluebell Posted November 4, 2018 Posted November 4, 2018 6 minutes ago, The Mean Farmer said: looks like a You Tube video with that title. I am not going to link it as I doubt it is worthy of it. (I haven't watched it) But looks like a young man went out to serve a LDS MIssion and returned back a Baptists, BAC, or other. His story of conversion is apparently applauded by the crowd he is preaching to. That makes sense. It would be weird if they didn’t applaud his decision.
sunstoned Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 Quote I am having a hard time understanding the significance of this story. I am sure people convert to and from various religions, mormonism included, on a daily basis. 2
JLHPROF Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 Just another "all you need is Jesus" sermon which completely ignores what Jesus taught or expects beyond calling him Lord, Lord. 4
cdowis Posted November 5, 2018 Author Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) Links to antiMormon stuff is forbidden but you can do a simple search on the title. Forbidden Guideline == "Why I Left the Church or de-conversion stories" Edited November 5, 2018 by cdowis
cdowis Posted November 5, 2018 Author Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) 5 hours ago, mfbukowski said: So this is sarcasm? and yes of course- link? I am kind of lost here- help me figure out what you are saying! If I told you, I could technically be banned -- for the sixth time. Anyway, it is sufficient that the Christians in the crowd know I speak their language -- like Nephi and the Jews. It may be helpful to know that his credentials include "finding the real Jesus" on his mission in Florida, and leaving early after educating his his fellow missionaries. His mother is Lynn Wildman, the "BYU professor" who did a youtube video on the inner workings of the church. I assume that she considered herself in the inner circle. Edited November 5, 2018 by cdowis
mfbukowski Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 26 minutes ago, cdowis said: If I told you, I could technically be banned -- for the sixth time. Anyway, it is sufficient that the Christians in the crowd know I speak their language -- like Nephi and the Jews. It may be helpful to know that his credentials include "finding the real Jesus" on his mission in Florida, and leaving early after educating his his fellow missionaries. His mother is Lynn Wildman, the "BYU professor" who did a youtube video on the inner workings of the church. I assume that she considered herself in the inner circle. No thanks.
cdowis Posted November 5, 2018 Author Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) Let explain further. When you are an exMormon, there is alot of competition to get a hearing of your story == you got ex-bishops, an area authority, veil worker, apologists who have seen the light. Now you have a missionary who renounced his religion in the middle of his mission and an exBYU professor. It really takes alot nowdays to get any attention. It's a tough business to sell books, tapes, give speeches. You got to have a following. Edited November 5, 2018 by cdowis
Ouagadougou Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 I'm a little confused here, but if the LDS Church puts so much emphasis on sharing a testimony, doesn't that give every other group, religion or point of view just as much legitimacy in sharing their ideas and beliefs? Or, is it that a testimony only really matters when it testifies of the LDS faith and aligns with what LDS leadership wants? I can tell you from personal experience that I have heard many LDS testimonies that were shared to "get attention," IMO. If this person found Jesus on his mission, and he feels that way, then I think he can share that experience as he sees fit. 1
The Nehor Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) 49 minutes ago, Ouagadougou said: I'm a little confused here, but if the LDS Church puts so much emphasis on sharing a testimony, doesn't that give every other group, religion or point of view just as much legitimacy in sharing their ideas and beliefs? Or, is it that a testimony only really matters when it testifies of the LDS faith and aligns with what LDS leadership wants? I can tell you from personal experience that I have heard many LDS testimonies that were shared to "get attention," IMO. If this person found Jesus on his mission, and he feels that way, then I think he can share that experience as he sees fit. They have as much right to share them as anyone as long as it is done in appropriate venues. I am not sure how that conveys legitimacy. I do not pretend to be in some kind of neutral state where I have to treat all testimonies as equally valid in some quixotic quest for imaginary fairness. Edited November 5, 2018 by The Nehor 3
The Nehor Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 1 hour ago, cdowis said: Let explain further. When you are an exMormon, there is alot of competition to get a hearing of your story == you got ex-bishops, an area authority, veil worker, apologists who have seen the light. Now you have a missionary who renounced his religion in the middle of his mission and an exBYU professor. It really takes alot nowdays to get any attention. It's a tough business to sell books, tapes, give speeches. You got to have a following. A veil worker is a big deal to these people. Oh boy. This should be fun. See you suckers later. I have some money to make!
Gray Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 8 hours ago, JLHPROF said: Just another "all you need is Jesus" sermon which completely ignores what Jesus taught or expects beyond calling him Lord, Lord. Indeed. Jesus was all about works and commandments.
Ouagadougou Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, The Nehor said: They have as much right to share them as anyone as long as it is done in appropriate venues. I am not sure how that conveys legitimacy. I do not pretend to be in some kind of neutral state where I have to treat all testimonies as equally valid in some quixotic quest for imaginary fairness. A testimony is subjective to the individual and is based on his/her own personal experiences; therefore, I'm not sure any testimony can convey 100% legitimacy. I haven't watched the video, but if this missionary who shared his experience/testimony truly feels the way he does in his heart (like any other LDS member does about the church), then how is that not as valid as any LDS testimony (which is based on feelings and that person's understanding of "the spirit")? It's arrogant to suggest that only an LDS testimony is truly valid, IMO, especially when it is just as subjective as another religion's testimony and based on feelings and their interpretation of the spirit. You personally don't have to treat all testimonies as "equally valid," but neither does any other religion, because we all will have a particular bias. So, what you have is a fascinating event, IMO, in which everyone is right and validated in his/her own mind. Edited November 5, 2018 by Ouagadougou
CV75 Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 17 hours ago, cdowis said: minute 1 As Micah Wilder approaches the stage, he enjoys the applause of the crowd. Having left Mormonism, he's a real rock star, rather than just another nobody. He's on the speaking tour to tell his amazing story of salvation from this evil cult. minute 17 At the end of his performance, the crowd roars with approval == he gave them what they wanted to hear He basks in their applause and cheers of approval. He is saved! He is saved,! Hallelujah, he is saved from the grasp of Satan himself Gives me chills. (youtube) Happy Belated Halloween! I thought that might be what you were going for with this virtual bag on fire LOL I haven't seen the video of course, which I hope pulls someone's chain, after all it's for Halloween!
Doctrine 612 Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 My neighbor invited me to his church to hear a ex bishop, who was now the new mission leader type of the church. so before I went I did some back ground on the man. found out he was fired from his last church and he never served as a bishop but as a 2 counselor in a bishopric. I went and he had a bunch of books on sale and dumb argument against the church. Angel Moroni still being called an angel. After the meeting I confronted him and pointed out his fault in the arguments and told him I know he was lying about everything. He tried to argue back but then I friend stepped in and asked if he was ever a bishop. he said no but a councilor in a bishopric, i tlod the group that is not the same. The councilors are not set apart as bishops. then he cut me off and said that he served for one year, and it was very challenging. the people watching this exchange of words started to laugh. Because of one year. then he started to attack me saying I am trying to earn my way to heaven. then I gave my testimony of Gods Grace and atonement. last I heard the man stayed at the church for a few years, out stayed his welcome and was fired.
Tacenda Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 1 hour ago, CV75 said: Happy Belated Halloween! I thought that might be what you were going for with this virtual bag on fire LOL I haven't seen the video of course, which I hope pulls someone's chain, after all it's for Halloween! It sure pulled your chain, kind of makes you guys appear to be worried that this Wilder guy might be right, haha!
Exiled Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 3 hours ago, Ouagadougou said: A testimony is subjective to the individual and is based on his/her own personal experiences; therefore, I'm not sure any testimony can convey 100% legitimacy. I haven't watched the video, but if this missionary who shared his experience/testimony truly feels the way he does in his heart (like any other LDS member does about the church), then how is that not as valid as any LDS testimony (which is based on feelings and that person's understanding of "the spirit")? It's arrogant to suggest that only an LDS testimony is truly valid, IMO, especially when it is just as subjective as another religion's testimony and based on feelings and their interpretation of the spirit. You personally don't have to treat all testimonies as "equally valid," but neither does any other religion, because we all will have a particular bias. So, what you have is a fascinating event, IMO, in which everyone is right and validated in his/her own mind. It's a function of what the group wants and each religion follows suit. For the LDS, their testimony is better because the LDS group leaders say so. This is why the recent responses where the Q12/FP person says that an answer to prayer that goes against the brethren (group) is a wrong answer, automatically. Knowing this, definitely stay away from listening to what the OP subject person has to say. It could be toxic as it goes against the group.
Storm Rider Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 11 minutes ago, Exiled said: It's a function of what the group wants and each religion follows suit. For the LDS, their testimony is better because the LDS group leaders say so. This is why the recent responses where the Q12/FP person says that an answer to prayer that goes against the brethren (group) is a wrong answer, automatically. Knowing this, definitely stay away from listening to what the OP subject person has to say. It could be toxic as it goes against the group. These little trite, inane responses or statements may work for the mindless, but it really grates for its sheer stupidity. I know it may be shocking to you, but my testimony is not, and never has been, built on another human. It remains built on an interaction between me and God. Simply because I believe in the restoration of the same church the Jesus Christ instituted when he was on earth does not equate to me losing my relationship with God. I may listen to their counsel, but as a disciple of Jesus Christ, I follow him. I believe that God leads other humans to belong to other churches and/or faiths. They have their own personal relationship with God. You may want to take a break from the trite summations of the members of the Church of Jesus Christ. You have lost touch with them and their beliefs. Your statements have more to say about you as an individual than anyone else. 1
Ouagadougou Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Storm Rider said: These little trite, inane responses or statements may work for the mindless, but it really grates for its sheer stupidity. I know it may be shocking to you, but my testimony is not, and never has been, built on another human. It remains built on an interaction between me and God. Simply because I believe in the restoration of the same church the Jesus Christ instituted when he was on earth does not equate to me losing my relationship with God. I may listen to their counsel, but as a disciple of Jesus Christ, I follow him. I believe that God leads other humans to belong to other churches and/or faiths. They have their own personal relationship with God. You may want to take a break from the trite summations of the members of the Church of Jesus Christ. You have lost touch with them and their beliefs. Your statements have more to say about you as an individual than anyone else. So God could have lead this missionary (about whom this post is talking about) to another church and/or faith? That is possible according to your point of view. Moreover, your statement that your testimony is "not built on another human being" contradicts the temple recommend question that confirms you must sustain the current President of the Church (who holds all the keys of the priesthood), along with sustaining the members of the First Presidency and Quorom of the Twelve Apostles and local leaders. You must built part of your belief system on these leaders, IMO, in order to fully sustain them. Also, why no mention of the OP's trite, inane, and sarcastic mockery of someone else's testimony just because it is of a different belief/religion? This arrogance, need for superiority, and "better-than-others" attitude actually drives a lot of people away from the church, IMO. 2
The Nehor Posted November 5, 2018 Posted November 5, 2018 6 hours ago, Ouagadougou said: A testimony is subjective to the individual and is based on his/her own personal experiences; therefore, I'm not sure any testimony can convey 100% legitimacy. I haven't watched the video, but if this missionary who shared his experience/testimony truly feels the way he does in his heart (like any other LDS member does about the church), then how is that not as valid as any LDS testimony (which is based on feelings and that person's understanding of "the spirit")? It's arrogant to suggest that only an LDS testimony is truly valid, IMO, especially when it is just as subjective as another religion's testimony and based on feelings and their interpretation of the spirit. You personally don't have to treat all testimonies as "equally valid," but neither does any other religion, because we all will have a particular bias. So, what you have is a fascinating event, IMO, in which everyone is right and validated in his/her own mind. Everyone being right assumes there is no underlying reality for people to be right or wrong about. I dismiss that assumption.
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