CA Steve Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 My wife's best friend has frequent conversations with dead people, and not your "Oh your dead grandma says "Hi" " type conversations but long involved conversations with specifics. She also believes she gets almost instant answers, from the HG, to any and all questions she might have. These questions can be anything from what to wear in the morning to if she should consult a lawyer about a legal matter, and church or job related big decisions. My wife believes her friend is very spiritual, me, I think she is a bit crazy. I wonder how others feel about this extensive involvement in her life and how also the Church might view it. I don't see a problem with her every days use of the HG to answer any and all questions, though I suspect it might not always be the HG telling her to wear the white blouse, but the dead people part I think might be moving into a bit of spiritualism and frowned upon.
longview Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 My wife's best friend has frequent conversations with dead people, and not your "Oh your dead grandma says "Hi" " type conversations but long involved conversations with specifics. She also believes she gets almost instant answers, from the HG, to any and all questions she might have. These questions can be anything from what to wear in the morning to if she should consult a lawyer about a legal matter, and church or job related big decisions. My wife believes her friend is very spiritual, me, I think she is a bit crazy. I wonder how others feel about this extensive involvement in her life and how also the Church might view it. I don't see a problem with her every days use of the HG to answer any and all questions, though I suspect it might not always be the HG telling her to wear the white blouse, but the dead people part I think might be moving into a bit of spiritualism and frowned upon.It does not fit the "Plan of Redemption" and runs counter to God's purpose for us to struggle and to overcome afflictions and to exercise our faith. Personally I believe she is one of those that have a heavy involvement with depraved spirits, both of wicked spirits of the departed and of Satan's Legions. Isaiah 8:19 ¶And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead? 20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them. 21 And they shall pass through it, hardly be stead and hungry: and it shall come to pass, that when they shall be hungry, they shall fret themselves, and curse their king and their God, and look upward. 22 And they shall look unto the earth; and behold trouble and darkness, dimness of anguish; and they shall be driven to darkness.
CA Steve Posted June 20, 2014 Author Posted June 20, 2014 Maybe, but given the conversations I have had with her and the conversations she relates having with dead people, if these are Satan's legions and or depraved people, the world has little to fear. Mostly it is just things like "so and sos dead mother wants you to give her daughter a hug and let her know her missing quilt is in the closet and that Aunt Irene is doing fine." If this is the best Satan can muster we can all take next Sunday off. I don't see any harm in what she does. it is mostly just a bit creepy. 2
strappinglad Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 Does she take requests? If so, have her ask some serious doctrinal questions like how many angels can fit on the head of a pin or where is Zarahemla.
ksfisher Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 The Holy Ghost is our guide in life, not our chauffeur.
CV75 Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I don't see any harm in what she does. it is mostly just a bit creepy.Does anyone else in her circle of family, friends and general influence expressed that he/she sees any harm; if so, what is it, and why do you not agree?
CA Steve Posted June 20, 2014 Author Posted June 20, 2014 Does anyone else in her circle of family, friends and general influence expressed that he/she sees any harm; if so, what is it, and why do you not agree?I have only briefly met her daughter and husband. I am not sure what their opinion is of all of this. And it has only been recently that I have become aware of the extent of what she thinks she experiences so I have not discussed it with anyone else beyond my wife. It may be that she has only recently felt comfortable enough with me to share. In all likelihood I would not mention it to anyone else since it seems a bit bizarre, and I would not want to cast her in a bad light with others. I think she is a good person, notwithstanding the fact she talks to dead people.
JLHPROF Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 My wife's best friend has frequent conversations with dead people, and not your "Oh your dead grandma says "Hi" " type conversations but long involved conversations with specifics. She also believes she gets almost instant answers, from the HG, to any and all questions she might have. These questions can be anything from what to wear in the morning to if she should consult a lawyer about a legal matter, and church or job related big decisions. My wife believes her friend is very spiritual, me, I think she is a bit crazy. I wonder how others feel about this extensive involvement in her life and how also the Church might view it. I don't see a problem with her every days use of the HG to answer any and all questions, though I suspect it might not always be the HG telling her to wear the white blouse, but the dead people part I think might be moving into a bit of spiritualism and frowned upon. I believe that we should and can all have a closer relationship with the HG and get more immediate and clear revelation. But what your wife's friend is describing sounds like delusions. I would be very concerned about the spirit delivering them. She may be spiritual but that doesn't make it God's spirit.
CV75 Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 I have only briefly met her daughter and husband. I am not sure what their opinion is of all of this. And it has only been recently that I have become aware of the extent of what she thinks she experiences so I have not discussed it with anyone else beyond my wife. It may be that she has only recently felt comfortable enough with me to share. In all likelihood I would not mention it to anyone else since it seems a bit bizarre, and I would not want to cast her in a bad light with others. I think she is a good person, notwithstanding the fact she talks to dead people.Since you're portraying it as moving into a bit of spiritualism, I think that's a red flag, but so is moving into a bit of mental illness or dementia. So hopefully her family is keeping an eye on it. Put her name on the prayer roll and see what happens! If it comes to the point of getting the attention of her bishop, he should be able to discern whether it is a gift or not (D 46:27).
Ahab Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 My wife's best friend has frequent conversations with dead people, and not your "Oh your dead grandma says "Hi" " type conversations but long involved conversations with specifics. She also believes she gets almost instant answers, from the HG, to any and all questions she might have. These questions can be anything from what to wear in the morning to if she should consult a lawyer about a legal matter, and church or job related big decisions. My wife believes her friend is very spiritual, me, I think she is a bit crazy.I wonder how others feel about this extensive involvement in her life and how also the Church might view it.I don't see a problem with her every days use of the HG to answer any and all questions, though I suspect it might not always be the HG telling her to wear the white blouse, but the dead people part I think might be moving into a bit of spiritualism and frowned upon.I wouldn't fret too much about it. She's not going to see or hear anything from a dead person that she couldn't also see or hear from a living person, and sometimes I have trouble telling the difference either way. Dead people are really alive, ya know. 1
Calm Posted June 20, 2014 Posted June 20, 2014 What is the fruit of her conversations? Is the quilt found? Are good things done for other people? 1
Kenngo1969 Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 The Holy Ghost is our guide in life, not our chauffeur.That's "sig-line" worthy. Do you mind?
Tiki Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 While speaking at the funeral of Elder Thomas Williams, President Brigham Young spoke of the spirit world as follows: “How frequently the question arises in the minds of the people—’I wish I knew where I was going!’ Can you find out? Well, you will go into the spirit world, where Brother Thomas now is. He has now entered upon a higher state of being, that is, his spirit has, than when in this body. ‘Why cannot I see him? Why cannot I converse with his spirit? I wish I could see my husband or my father and converse with him!’ It is not reasonable that you should, it is not right that you should; perhaps you would miss the very object of your pursuit if you had this privilege, and there would be the same trial of faith to exercise you, not so severe a path of affliction for you to walk in, not so great a battle to fight, nor so great a victory to win, and you would miss the very object you are in pursuit of. It is right just as it is, that this veil should be closed down; that we do not see God, that we do not see angels, that we do not converse with them except through strict obedience to his requirements, and faith in Jesus Christ (DNSW, 28 July 1874, 1).https://www.lds.org/manual/teachings-brigham-young/chapter-38?lang=eng
juliann Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 Sounds like she might be a follower of Visions of Glory nonsense. 2
Guest Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 Sounds like she might be a follower of Visions of Glory nonsense.When was growing up and I was reminded at my mother's funeral...it is the "glory-land".
CA Steve Posted June 21, 2014 Author Posted June 21, 2014 Sounds like she might be a follower of Visions of Glory nonsense.Winner! This is exactly right. In fact now that you mention it, I remember her talking about the book a while back and me cautioning her about it. I have not read the book, just some of the reviews on Amazon and I think a FAIR review on it, if I remember correctly.
ERayR Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 The Holy Ghost is our guide in life, not our chauffeur. Some people go by limousine and some of us just stumble through the rocks.
The Nehor Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 Sounds like a sad woman who desperately wants attention. If she wasn't LDS she could be a medium as it sounds like her communications are equally banal. It is all sweetness and light and frippery. I already know my dead relatives love me. If they show up I want information on what the other side is like or in-depth understanding of myself from an objective viewpoint to aid me on the road to perfection. Someone feeling kind of sad and needing a hug is not the kind of thing we need angels for.
Zakuska Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) It sounds to me like she may be suffers from Schizophrenia, you know like the nobel prize winner guy depicted in the movie "a beautiful mind". He saw, spoke to, and lived a whole alternate life with all kinds of people who werent really there. Edited June 21, 2014 by Zakuska
Blah Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) My initial reaction is that she's not being honest. But I don't know her, so that's probably not really fair. My second thought was that these kinds of things do happen. Specifically, I remember an anecdote Truman Madsen related about Wilford Woodruff (a man he called "a spiritual amphibian") in which President Woodruff tells a man "I haven't spoken to your father since he died," and seemed genuinely troubled and/or disappointed about it. My third thought is, "Most people aren't President Woodruff." If she is regularly communicating with spirits, I have doubts that they're benign. If she's not, then she needs a new hobby. (And even if she is, she still needs a new hobby.) And if she's mentally ill, she needs help, and soon. Edited June 21, 2014 by Blah
mfbukowski Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) Is God a dead person? How smug we are! What precisely is the difference, and how could anyone know the difference? Edited June 21, 2014 by mfbukowski
rameumptom Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 We are not to be commanded in all things nor to be a slothful servant. The HG does not need to guide us in what to wear on a daily basis. That said, it is possible to speak with dead people. OTOH, it is also possible that those dead people are really demons in disguise, seeking to deceive and gain control over the woman's decision making. Spend a few years giving her good advice, and then with her full trust you can convince her to do other things, as well.
CA Steve Posted June 21, 2014 Author Posted June 21, 2014 A few observations and thoughts. In my view this person is neither dishonest, mentally ill or deceived by evil spirits. After my wife, whom I consider a saint (she has to be to put up with me for so many years) this is one of the nicest most sincere well adjusted people I have ever met. She is not vocal about what she thinks she hears and sees, nor is she out trying to convince others about it. I had known her for quite sometime before I figured out the extent of what she thinks she experiences. I do not see any ulterior motive or even a begin attention seeking drive, I even think she fully understands that this is a bit "waka doodle" to use her own term. I do agree that there might be minor signs of some sort of instability here but, at this point that is all there is. Now my mother, throughout her life, has related similar experiences, though on a much more infrequent basis and usually occurring during a temple session. I expect that such experiences are not unusual for others also, especially in the temple. Why should we accept similar experiences from some because they happen in the temple and not from others because they are more frequent and not necessarily inside the temple? By the way, I am a cynic, and I believe that both of these people's experiences are probably self induced and do not involve any other people, alive or dead. For those who insist on definitions by 'dead' I mean someone whose life here on earth is over, though to be fair, I am not sure if any of my wife's friends experiences include spirits who have not yet be born.
mnn727 Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 Sounds like she needs professional help to me. Possibly with medication.
ERayR Posted June 21, 2014 Posted June 21, 2014 Sounds like she needs professional help to me. Possibly with medication. Or maybe all she needs to learn is to keep private communications private. 1
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