The purported Joseph Smith daguerreotype

[Nofear]

A fairly lengthy discussion, some opinions from facial recognition professionals, and more. Spoiler, Curtis Weber is now 100% convinced it is Joseph Smith.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3S4ExlyzYtA

 

[Peppermint Patty]

11 minutes ago, Nofear said:

A fairly lengthy discussion, some opinions from facial recognition professionals, and more. Spoiler, Curtis Weber is now 100% convinced it is Joseph Smith.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3S4ExlyzYtA

 

That was an interesting video with compelling evidence that it really is Joseph Smith.

But, we need to give your thread a better title to draw more interest. How about, "Unbelievable And Shocking New Evidence About Joseph Smith!" 

[OGHoosier]

do you think we could get Eddie Redmayne to do a biopic of Joseph Smith? If the daguerrotype is actually him then Redmayne would be a pretty good facematch. 

[teddyaware]

3 hours ago, Nofear said:

A fairly lengthy discussion, some opinions from facial recognition professionals, and more. Spoiler, Curtis Weber is now 100% convinced it is Joseph Smith.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3S4ExlyzYtA

 

I was fascinated when I viewed the following “cleaned up” version of the daguerreotype under discussion when I used my hands to cover the long outcroppings of hair on either side of the gentleman’s head. It was then that I came to appreciate the fact that the man in the photo is what could be described to be ruggedly handsome with a penetrating mind and strength of character etched on his face. Try putting your fingers over the outcroppings of hair on the side of the man’s head and perhaps you’ll see what I see?

 

Edited April 30, 2025 by teddyaware

[manol]

3 hours ago, teddyaware said:

I was fascinated when I viewed the following “cleaned up” version of the daguerreotype under discussion when I used my hands to cover the long outcroppings of hair on either side of the gentleman’s head. It was then that I came to appreciate the fact that the man in the photo is what could be described to be ruggedly handsome with a penetrating mind and strength of character etched on his face. Try putting your fingers over the outcroppings of hair on the side of the man’s head and perhaps you’ll see what I see?

 

Agreed! 

The first time I saw the mirror-corrected version of this daguerreotype it LOOKED to me like the man I had read books about.  The standard portrait of him does not look like a man of commanding presence and powerful character, at least not to me.  This one does (especially if you cover up the Shirley Temple-esque curls). 

And the Scannel daguerreotype (below) LOOKS TO ME like it could be the younger - and much-lower-mileage - version of that same man.  Ears can be a give-away when two people otherwise look similar, imo, and the ears and overall features are close enough that it could be the same man photographed many hard years apart:

 

 

 

 

Edited May 1, 2025 by manol

[Senator]

4 hours ago, teddyaware said:

I was fascinated when I viewed the following “cleaned up” version of the daguerreotype under discussion when I used my hands to cover the long outcroppings of hair on either side of the gentleman’s head. It was then that I came to appreciate the fact that the man in the photo is what could be described to be ruggedly handsome with a penetrating mind and strength of character etched on his face. Try putting your fingers over the outcroppings of hair on the side of the man’s head and perhaps you’ll see what I see?

 

Why crop his hair?

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, Senator said:

Why crop his hair?

To make him look less gay.

[teddyaware]

8 hours ago, Senator said:

Why crop his hair?

It’s because when I do so I’m better able to visualize how brother Joseph would look as a modern-day general authority. I agree with Manol that the side hair looks like “ShirleyTemple-esque curls.” When the distracting side curls are no longer visible, I’m able to more clearly see the face of a man I actually could believe is mighty prophet of God. By today’s grooming standards, I think the side curls are weird looking and unflattering. I know I’m being a bit silly, but it’s how I honestly feel.

 

John D. Lee

Joseph Smith was a most extraordinary man; he was rather large in stature, some six feet two inches in height, well built though a little stoop shouldered, prominent and well-developed features, a Roman nose, light chestnut hair, upper lip full and rather protruding, chin broad and square, and eagle eye, and on the whole there was something in his manner and appearance that was bewitching and winning; his countenance was that of a plain, honest man, full of benevolence and philanthropy and void of deceit or hypocrisy. He was resolute and firm of purpose, strong as most men in physical power, and all who saw were forced to admire him, as he then looked and existed.

Edited May 1, 2025 by teddyaware

[manol]

8 hours ago, teddyaware said:

When the distracting side curls are no longer visible, I’m able to more clearly see the face of a man I actually could believe is mighty prophet of God.

Same here. 

"After 40 years, every man gets the face he deserves." - Abraham Lincoln.   Yeah I know Joseph didn't make it to 40 but he more than made up for it in mileage. 

[teddyaware]

2 hours ago, manol said:

Same here. 

"After 40 years, every man gets the face he deserves." - Abraham Lincoln.   Yeah I know Joseph didn't make it to 40 but he more than made up for it in mileage. 

So true! I can easily visualize the man in this daguerreotype standing before the saints and declaring the following most stirring words of vivid hope and unsurpassed encouragement!

“The standard of truth has been erected; No unhallowed hand can stop the work from progressing; persecutions may rage, mobs may combine, armies may assemble, calumny may defame, but the truth of God will go forth boldly, nobly, and independent, till it has penetrated every continent, visited every clime, swept every country, and sounded in every ear, till the purposes of God shall be accomplished, and the great Jehovah shall say the work is done.” Joseph Smith, History of the Church, 4:540.

[Senator]

12 hours ago, teddyaware said:

It’s because when I do so I’m better able to visualize how brother Joseph would look as a modern-day general authority. 

That's curious as to the need to make to him look contemporary.

[Calm]

3 hours ago, Senator said:

That's curious as to the need to make to him look contemporary.

I don’t need curls removed or a contemporary look, but I do prefer to look at faces without bangs as well if I am making a judgment on looks for whatever reason because face shape and proportions are important. This may be even if I find their hair around or over the face attractive (which I do for many).

A contemporary style to make someone more acceptable as a general authority/spiritual leader is a bit odd to me given the pictures we have available of less recent church leaders, but I have my own hangup I realized some years ago. I find men with fuller heads of hair as more naturally spiritually authoritative impressive because my first prophet was David O McKay and of course all those pictures of Joseph with tons of hair; in the child’s brain that still lingers within me, bald general authorities have to try harder to impress me, lol.  

My dad had a good head of hair for my childhood and youth as well, so that likely helped equate authority with hairline in my heart.

These days I think voices have a greater emotional impact than looks.

Edited May 1, 2025 by Calm

[Duncan]

I don't believe for a second this photo, IIRC the owner or anyone couldn't open the locket until the early 1990's? It's a locket, not a iron door! Besides why wait until a few years ago to tell anyone about it?

[webbles]

4 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I don't believe for a second this photo, IIRC the owner or anyone couldn't open the locket until the early 1990's? It's a locket, not a iron door! Besides why wait until a few years ago to tell anyone about it?

The owner first found it in a trunk that he inherited from his mother in 1992 and tried to open it.  He thought it was a pocket watch but since its latch was broken, he didn't want to force it open.  He didn't open it till 2020 when he was basically bored at home during covid.

[The Nehor]

44 minutes ago, webbles said:

The owner first found it in a trunk that he inherited from his mother in 1992 and tried to open it.  He thought it was a pocket watch but since its latch was broken, he didn't want to force it open.  He didn't open it till 2020 when he was basically bored at home during covid.

I could very much see this happening to me. Try to open, realize I can’t without risking damage, think I will take it to an expert or friend later, and then promptly forget about it.

[Calm]

19 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I could very much see this happening to me. Try to open, realize I can’t without risking damage, think I will take it to an expert or friend later, and then promptly forget about it.

There was so much stuff from my grandparents and parents moving that got dumped with us that I quickly went through and then stored and only really got to it after my mother died as I was trying to go through all the papers and stuff first with her (she had dementia but could maybe remember family stuff) which took forever because she wasn’t interested in doing it.  Once it was time to pass out everything, I went through all the smaller jewelry and keepsakes, so there was possibly 30 years between looks into some of my grandparents’ stuff. Grandma had a watch that I later figured out had a locket on the back. I had thought it was just to see the guts and my fingernail wasn’t enough to get it open, so I just put it aside for later. No picture though.

Edited May 1, 2025 by Calm

[Kenngo1969]

Nah!  The real Joseph Smith looks like Paul Wuthrich! 😆😁

[Stargazer]

Placeholder to bury spam

[Calm]

29 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

Placeholder to bury spam

For a few hours at least.   
Appreciate the effort

[Tacenda]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

For a few hours at least.   
Appreciate the effort

I wondered what Stargazer was doing, at first I thought he was "following". I hope his scheme works!

[talltimber]

This is the photo of Joseph Smith that his son, Joseph III, put into the Library of Congress. It has evidence of being touched up with paint. Which was a thing being done in that age. He was about 12 when his Father died. One would think he would remember what his father looked like.

 

 

 

Here is a colorized version someone made:



 

[Kenngo1969]

If that is a genuine photo [and not a fauxto ] of Joseph Smith, the remarkable thing about it is ... even after everything he went through ... no gray hair!  

[webbles]

21 minutes ago, talltimber said:

This is the photo of Joseph Smith that his son, Joseph III, put into the Library of Congress. It has evidence of being touched up with paint. Which was a thing being done in that age. He was about 12 when his Father died. One would think he would remember what his father looked like.

 

 

 

Here is a colorized version someone made:



 

That's not a photo of Joseph Smith.  That's a photo of the portrait that the Community of Christ has.  And we know that it isn't perfectly accurate because it doesn't match the death mask and the profile that was done.

[webbles]

8 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

If that is a genuine photo [and not a fauxto ] of Joseph Smith, the remarkable thing about it is ... even after everything he went through ... no gray hair!  

Joseph had light brown hair, so if he did get grey hair, it might have blended in nicely.  That's one reason why the portrait (and this photo of it) is not accurate.

[Kenngo1969]

1 hour ago, webbles said:

Joseph had light brown hair, so if he did get grey hair, it might have blended in nicely.  That's one reason why the portrait (and this photo of it) is not accurate.

So, perhaps Paul Wuthrich isn't such a bad likeness, huh?