Daybell-Vallow trial

[Calm]

Another point in the time line I was not aware of…in addition to the pool party, exactly a week after Charles’ death, Melanie Gibb hosts a presentation by David Warrick at LVD’s home…where Charles was shot. I think LVD might have been in Houston clearing out Charles’ home of anything of value, but they were besties after all. And she certainly owes Melanie for backing her up with the police and Charles by lying for her and running interference. 

[Calm]

I am just starting another of Noor’s videos covering the cast of characters.  I was quite impressed with her background/summary of events and people video I posted about above.

She has gone through the police interviews and such so I am expecting a worthwhile expose here, but going to break and see what is happening in court.

https://youtu.be/w4IQa-Zhjyo

At the very beginning, she shows a few seconds of Tylee in the interrogation room by herself after Charles’ death and she is self comforting by humming a little song to herself.  It got me tearing up.All these self obsessed childish adults, needing to be special, either using and abusing this girl or ignoring her or thinking she is dirt when she is just a young woman trying to survive her narcissistic mother.  Colby said she was heartbroken about Charles’ death, my guess is the adults who thought she hated Charles probably listened to LVD’s description of her.  And I wouldn’t be the least surprised if the conflict between her and Charles was in part caused by LVD’s jealousy of any attention that was given to someone else.  Charles called her his daughter and maybe he didn’t know how to parent a teenage girl, but at least he was trying hard.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/day-12-live-updates-rexburg-police-detective-back-on-the-stand-in-daybell-trial/
 

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8:40 a.m. First document presented to the jury — a loan document for the Jeep Wrangler seized by Rexburg Police. The vehicle was purchased in April 2019. Tylee began paying $599 a month in June. Automatic payments were made in June, July and August. The September car payment from Tylee’s account came back as insufficient funds

So Tylee was paying for this herself from her bank account (SSA benefits), but LVD had switched banks shortly before .Tylee was killed and then LVD completely drained it.  The Jeep was seized by the police in November.

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8:57 a.m. Wood asks Kunsaitis if he ever did any pharmaceutical searches when JJ Vallow was missing. The detective says he did. He submitted requests to agencies in Arizona, Hawaii, Montana and Idaho. There were no records of any prescriptions being filled for JJ in any of those states during 2019.

I want to know what she used to get him to sleep early.  Added:  One friend, Christina, remembers her talking of giving Charles JJ’s Valium or whatever kept him calm by crushing the pills and putting it in his protein powder….fatal doses are very rare though.

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9:07 a.m. We are now viewing an email Lori sent to her accountant. She explains to the accountant that Charles Vallow died and she wanted information about how to forward tax returns to her new address. The email is dated Sept. 9, 2019 at 5:03 p.m. Kunsaitis says Tylee was killed Sept. 8 or 9 — so the email was sent “hours after we believe Tylee was buried in the backyard.”

Weird timing…kill your daughter and deal with taxes all at once!

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9:09 a.m. Flight records from American Airlines are being submitted for evidence. Kunsaitis says there is flight information for Tylee and Lori. Tylee flew to Hawaii twice = in February and March of 2019. Lori flew multiple times with American. There are no flight records for JJ

Where is all this money coming from?  Charles?  She dumps him and makes him pay for her partying.  Ugh!

Edited April 20, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

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9:56 a.m. Next exhibit is a timeline detailing Tammy Daybell’s life insurance policy.

9:54 a.m. There’s also a timeline Douglass calls “the grand theft timeline” that he prepared to help the jury understand the financial information he learned through his investigation.

9:52 a.m. Douglass wrote the dates the kids were killed on the timelines. Archibald asks him if he determined those dates or if they were told to him. Douglass says they were told to him. Archibald asks if the rest of the dates on the timelines are correct. Douglas says they are.

9:51 a.m. Next exhibit is a timeline related to JJ from Charles Vallow’s death moving forward.

9:50 a.m. Rawlings asks Douglass to explain the first exhibit that will be admitted. It’s a timeline he prepared relating to Tylee’s life from when her father, Joseph Ryan, passed away

Look forward to seeing these.

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10:04 a.m. “Tylee was responsible with her money. I never saw her have one negative balance,” Douglass says. She had two automatic payments set up — her Jeep and T-mobile accounts. The money she received following Joe Ryan’s death went into the Chase account.

Ah…he paid her more attention and respect than her mom did.

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11:04 a.m. When asked what Douglass found on Chad Daybell’s bank accounts, he says, “it was more of what I didn’t find.” He references the flight purchases for Chad. They were made with Lori’s accounts.

Yes, Tammy might have wondered.

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11:11 a.m. Tammy’s life insurance increase was requested Sept. 8, 2019. 

Same time Tylee is killed.  How could this not be premeditated?

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11:15 a.m. Douglass says during the search of the Chad’s property between 9:50-10 am, there were there transfers of $8,000 each from Chad’s Mountain America bank account to three of his kids. The transfers occurred as officers were searching his grounds. Around $4,400 was left in the account

Trying to save his money from a frozen account perhaps?

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11:16 a.m. Douglass says tickets were purchased to Knotts Berry Farm right after Tammy died. Rawlings has no further questions for Douglass.

So that was not a last minute way to say goodbye to his kids.  Perhaps it was meant as a goodbye though.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

Love that they are able to bring in details of Charles’ death.  While I understand learning of past crimes is prejudicial, they seem very relevant to me.  Especially so in a case like this where it is a repeat.

Question for law knowledgeable people…is character allowed to be part of evidence for a crime or only the sentencing part?

Another question…is this 404 law unusual or do a lot of states allow for past crimes as evidence if part of a pattern of behaviour?  If common, what are the conditions attached to it?

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Archibald has no further questions as he already objected to the entirety of the testimony. Cowden is dismissed.

A nice way to show like you are standing on principle and not taking advantage where you could when the reality is there is nothing you could ask the guy without making it look worse for your client, lol.

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Archibald says he objects as Lori isn’t being tried in Idaho for anything that happened in Arizona.

This is likely to happen with every reference to Charles’ death, I suspect.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

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1:47 p.m. Ynclan was assigned to do follow-up, extensive interviews with Lori Vallow and Tylee Ryan. The interviews were not done on scene but Ynclan drove Lori and Tylee back to the police station in the family advocacy center. Ynclan says they try not to talk on the way to the police station to preserve the information for interviews but on the car ride, Ynclan says Lori was calm and not upset. Lori spoke with Tylee about school and her future plans. “She was almost nonchalant about the conversation.”

1:45 p.m. When Ynclan first observed Lori and Tylee, they were standing near Charles’ rental car. “She appeared calm, very non-emotional, was kind of hanging out and having general conversations. She was not really upset and at one point she was laughing.”

1:44 p.m. Ynclan was with Lori when a sergeant informed Lori that Charles was dead. “She didn’t have much of a reaction. When she was informed that Charles was deceased, she responded that she already knew and made statements that she was present when it happened. This was new information to detectives.”

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At one point in the interview, she said Charles took JJ back to Houston with him and she allowed that to happen.

Yes, she “allowed” him to do so even though it pained her so, the concerned mother who had abandoned her son for 58 days and only showed up likely to cause a scene when Charles was moving out with JJ (most likely tipped off by someone in her family I am guessing; Kay, who was helping Charles move, said she was or looked ready to record the encounter) and then didn’t even stay long enough to see her son, but took off for two more weeks to Hawaii because a “friend” needed her.

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Lori told Ynclan about JJ’s special needs care, his services plan and everything involved to take care of him. She said Charles didn’t have those services or support for JJ in Houston.

What a lying hypocrite!  First off he did have them.  Second, LVD had taken JJ’s meds, his IPad, and at other times, Bailey’s special collar so he could go everywhere with JJ and she is the one all concerned with his needs?

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2:08 p.m. Archibald asks if Alex Cox was ever arrested.

For someone who thinks the use of this incident is a travesty, he appears happy enough to use it when it benefits him.

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2:15 p.m. Blake has further questions for the detective. She asks Ynclan if she is aware of whether Alex Cox is alive. Ynclan says she is aware Alex Cox is deceased. Blake says, “If Alex Cox was still alive, do you believe your agency would have made a recommendation that charges be filed?” Archibald objects to the question. 

I bet he does.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

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John Prior is sitting in front of me and just leaned over the court sketch artist. He jokingly asked that when she sketches him she make him 30 lbs. lighter and younger.

Ewww….

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2:52 p.m. Witnesses were told not to watch any stories or read anything about the trial. Archibald asks Raymond about the comments she read on the story. She says in general it was about the LDS Church’s influence on the trial.

2:50 p.m. Raymond says she watched about two minutes of the interview but turned it off. She says the story had nothing to do with the case or interviews. Raymond says she read some of the comments on the story.

2:48 p.m. An issue is being discussed outside of the presence of the jury because Raymond received a Facebook message showing an interview Justin Lum did with Lori Daybell’s cousin.

Seriously?  What the heck is she looking at it for two minutes even if it popped up in her feed and wasn’t friended or whatever.

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2:56 p.m. Boyce says there is no evidence that Raymond violated the exclusionary rules and she will be able to remain on the stand. Jurors are brought in. Lori has been looking at her former friend but I have not seen Raymond looks at Lori once.

2:53 p.m. Archibald asks Raymond if she has been contacted by reporters about doing interviews. She says she has given them the directive from the prosector’s office that she can not participate in any interviews at this time without the promise of any future interviews.

If it was the same one I saw, iirc the first few minutes was calling the church very toxic, very broken, and very manipulative and its culture was a significant contributor to what happened.  Besides the fact she makes me think there is a budding serial killer on the pew next to me on Sunday, not seeing the influence there. 

[Calm]

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 Lori was the primary president and she asked Raymond to be one of her counselors. 

Can you imagine thinking of your former Primary President, the serial killer?

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Lori told Raymond she didn’t bring JJ because “she was done with him” and Charles and Kay would need to figure it out.

So sweet and motherly.  I wonder how Tylee felt when she heard this.  Learned not to protest, I guess.  Or maybe thought JJ would be better off.

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Lori said “Charles was already dead and a demon was using his body as a host. The demon’s name was Ned Schneider.” When asked how she knew he wasn’t Charles, Lori said, “He’s shorter.”

Laughable.  And yet she was willing to leave her son in a demon’s care.

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She thought that Charles was going to serve her with divorce papers.

Why avoid them if she wanted a divorce?  They had to have meant him to die from early on.

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3:06 p.m. Lori left Raymond’s house and went to the Kauai Beach Resort. Melanie Gibb joined Lori in Hawaii and the three women went out for lunch and a few evenings for dinner. Tylee was back in Arizona working at her aunt’s chiropractic clinic

So LVD is still vacationing, but Tylee has to work to pay the bills.

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she would need to be separated from her children because “she had fulfilled her role in their lives” and Raymond had a great mission to now fulfill. Lori told Raymond to leave the kids with their father.

That’s what Gibb and Melani did.  I wonder if Melani getting pregnant was a mistake or maybe she thought it would help keep her out of jail or keep Ian under her control, but it seems odd.

[Calm]

10 hours ago, Calm said:

I am just starting another of Noor’s videos covering the cast of characters.  I was quite impressed with her background/summary of events and people video I posted about above.

She has gone through the police interviews and such so I am expecting a worthwhile expose here, but going to break and see what is happening in court.

https://youtu.be/w4IQa-Zhjyo

At the very beginning, she shows a few seconds of Tylee in the interrogation room by herself after Charles’ death and she is self comforting by humming a little song to herself.  It got me tearing up.All these self obsessed childish adults, needing to be special, either using and abusing this girl or ignoring her or thinking she is dirt when she is just a young woman trying to survive her narcissistic mother.  Colby said she was heartbroken about Charles’ death, my guess is the adults who thought she hated Charles probably listened to LVD’s description of her.  And I wouldn’t be the least surprised if the conflict between her and Charles was in part caused by LVD’s jealousy of any attention that was given to someone else.  Charles called her his daughter and maybe he didn’t know how to parent a teenage girl, but at least he was trying hard.

For those who have been watching the main characters and getting info from news, but avoiding the podcasts, you may have missed (like me) Melanie Gibb when she is let loose.  She is quite the different person in this video and in the phone call with another friend when Gibb didn’t know she was being recorded, much more outgoing and assertive, much less “l can’t remember”, though there is a crucial moment when none of the three involved in the casting remember who it was for iirc.  I can now understand why so many were questioning her sincerity.  I have some major doubts about her now.  This feels like more than just fitting her delivery to a different audience.  Self protection over sharing the truth.

Audio is rather inconsistent between the clips, so I recommend using the CC option and prepare to be annoyed.  Again a useful podcast as Noor has collected the highlights of quite a few interviews of different individuals, some I am seeing input from for the first time.  You get a much greater sense of the group.  I was thinking it was 5 or 6 people, that CD wasn’t that influential and I was wrong.  Probably twice as many immediately involved.

Edited April 20, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

My apologies if this is not making sense.  If I put up enough info for full context, it would be massive, so I am assuming enough familiarity to know what I am talking about at least enough to know if you want to click on the link and read or watch the source or you aren’t interested enough in that detail to bother.

Anyone who has questions, wants more details just ask.

Edited April 20, 2023 by Calm

[Tacenda]

Haven't read through all of this thread yet, but read all of this link by Idaho reporter Nate Easton from Calm's post. And I'm flabbergasted. These people, Zulema, Melani, Melanie, Lori, Alex and Chad all act like they are in a childhood club and playing these parts and creating these weird scenarios, wish they had just play acted and not actually acted or done the horrible deeds. Thinking this will be another movie or documentary on Hulu. Reminds me of the movies in the 70's about devil worshipers that meet at a house and kill people and doing strange things. I feel for the families of Chad and Lori, how sick they must feel that they are related to these evil twisted sickening people. Chad and Lori should be bound by duct tape then suffer in a pile of maggots and then burned.   https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/day-10-live-updates-alex-coxs-widow-says-chad-and-lori-daybell-taught-demons-needed-to-be-bound-or-burned/

 

Starting on the left....light, light, dark, dark, light, light.

Edited April 20, 2023 by Tacenda

[Durangout]

On 4/19/2023 at 12:04 PM, Calm said:

I am just starting another of Noor’s videos covering the cast of characters.  I was quite impressed with her background/summary of events and people video I posted about above.

She has gone through the police interviews and such so I am expecting a worthwhile expose here, but going to break and see what is happening in court.

https://youtu.be/w4IQa-Zhjyo

At the very beginning, she shows a few seconds of Tylee in the interrogation room by herself after Charles’ death and she is self comforting by humming a little song to herself.  It got me tearing up.All these self obsessed childish adults, needing to be special, either using and abusing this girl or ignoring her or thinking she is dirt when she is just a young woman trying to survive her narcissistic mother.  Colby said she was heartbroken about Charles’ death, my guess is the adults who thought she hated Charles probably listened to LVD’s description of her.  And I wouldn’t be the least surprised if the conflict between her and Charles was in part caused by LVD’s jealousy of any attention that was given to someone else.  Charles called her his daughter and maybe he didn’t know how to parent a teenage girl, but at least he was trying hard.

I watched the interview video that you linked—wow, just wow.

[Calm]

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/audio-day-13-eight-witnesses-take-the-stand-in-lori-vallow-daybell-trial/
 

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/day-13-live-updates-police-body-camera-footage-played-in-lori-daybells-murder-trial-as-multiple-witnesses-take-the-stand/
 

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Schenk said the interview went well. She arrived, Lori greeted her warmly, gave her a hug and introduced her to JJ.

Random thought…how many of you give someone a hug when you first meet them?

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her daughter didn’t like to babysit without being paid so that’s why Lori was hiring Schenk.

Why not pay her daughter instead?  It is a great way to avoid having to give them gifts of money, so cheaper in the long run.

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. Lori then said they weren’t moving him to Louisana but would be homeschooling him. A cousin with similar needs would be working with JJ

A lie on the fly to avoid having to figure out how to transfer school records when there was no transfer?  Did one of Melani’s kids have autism?  I don’t remember hearing that.

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 Gibb lives in Arizona and Warwick lives in Utah. They have a “distant” relationship and he says he has not talked with her about the trial as she needs some space…

Warwick says Gibb’s testimony will not affect his testimony and he has not spoken with his wife since last week….

He was sick and was listening for her tone of voice rather than what she actually said. 

 

Okay…

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Warwick had never met JJ, who was sitting on the couch playing with toys. Warwick has an autistic son with Down Syndrome so he tried to play with JJ but “it was like I wasn’t even there. He never acknowledged me….

 Warwick asked to see JJ so he could give him a blessing if there was a problem but Lori said she had Alex come and get him.

At least he tried, seems like the first of the social network who cared enough to do so.  And offered to give him a blessing rather than dismissing him as possessed.  Seems like a decent guy even though he has his own brand of fringe ideas.  Wonder if he was involved up close earlier if he might have set off an alarm since he was willing to openly criticize CD.

Gibb hasn’t mentioned she had an autistic son or an autistic stepson when asked about her experience with autism.  That has always struck me as weird.

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11:02 a.m. Warwick says he didn’t believe Chad and told him he didn’t believe it. Chad then had Warwick and Gibb meet him and Lori at a property next to a church. They started describing a heavenly building next to the church – not a physical building but a spiritual building. Warwick could not see the building but was trying to be respectful and follow along with what Chad and Lori were saying.

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11:06 a.m. Warwick saw Chad again that weekend. He says Chad and Lori were very loving with one another and very affectionate. Warwick knew Chad was still married to Tammy. “I asked Chad about how his marriage was with Tammy and if she was a good wife. He said he had no complaints and she was a good wife but her time was coming up and he and Lori were going to do the things they needed to do for God.” Chad told Warwick he had a dream three years prior that Tammy was going to die by the time Chad was 50.

And that is where I would be dropping any thought of becoming friends and seriously question my relationship with someone who associated so closely with them.  Think about it, if Gibb was comfortable enough to hang around two obvious cheaters, would she be that committed to a relationship with Warwick?  Seems like a risk.

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11:08 a.m. Chad told Warwick he was “one of them” and Warwick said if that was the case, it would come through the prophet of the church. Chad said it was a separate calling through the Church of the Firstborn and Chad had authority through John the Beloved.

That is new. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

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1:34 p.m. Dean says the date of the text message stood out to him because he was originally assigned to look for tips about JJ and Tylee from Yellowstone on Sept. 8, 2019. Then Chad sent the message the next day and Dean “became concerned” because the text was sent the day after Tylee was last seen alive. Rammell has no further questions for Dean.

1:32 p.m. Dean says the first message from Chad to Tammy stood out to him because normally their text exchanges were very short. “This message appeared to be the first and only time wherein Chad texted Tammy a rather detailed and step-by-step explanation of his day’s events in any sort of a narrative style.”

Dean is an FBI analyst.

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2:13 p.m. Stubbs says nobody ever inquired about the Jeep – where it had gone, why it was towed, nothing. Stubbs says police even reached out and tried to talk to someone but were unsuccessful. 

2:11 p.m. Smith asks if Stubbs was aware of the relationship between Chad and Lori at the time. He says he had been told they were together. The Jeep was found Nov. 4 in the parking lot outside Apt. 175. The vehicle was towed to a secure impound lot. The owner listed on the registration was Joe Ryan and Tylee Ryan. 

Were they just not paying attention or were they just so stupid as to not get nervous when the Jeep went AWOL?

[Calm]

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2:24 p.m. Lori lets the officers in and Lori says JJ is in Arizona with one of her friends – Melanie Gibb in Arizona. Lori says, “What is all this?” Ball says they are concerned and officers who were there earlier “got a bad vibe” because they couldn’t find JJ. Lori says one of her brothers is trying to kill her for her $2 million life insurance policy.” A lot of stuff has gone on and this past year has been horrible for us. We’ve had to move around.” Lori says JJ went to school at Kennedy for two months.

How does that even make sense?  How is the brother supposed to get his hands on the money?

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2:28 p.m. Lori says she’s going to go back to Arizona because school was too hard for JJ. Lori has her armed folded across her chest as she speaks with the officers. She blames everything on Kay and Stubbs tells her that their main concern is the child. “It’s awful. I feel like I’m being tracked all the time.” Ball says detectives were at the house earlier that day and they ran into two guys. Lori says one was his brother. Ball asks who the other guy was. Lori says, “My brother and his friend.” Ball asks what the friend’s name is. “Chad.” Ball asks about the Chad Daybell and says, “Didn’t his wife pass away recently?” Lori says nothing….

2:37 p.m. “Not only were we dealing with a situation where one of these individuals was possibly involved in an attempted shooting in Arizona but the individuals were being evasive and lying,” Stubbs says. He was concerned that Lori said Alex was there yet he didn’t come downstairs. “My attention was drawn because at the top of the stairs, I could see movements…I was concerned for our safety if someone was to come down and try and surprise us.”

They know she is married to him.  They know about the attempted shooting of Brandon Boudreaux.  I don’t know if they know about Charles yet.  Probably don’t know about the so called paintball attempt on Tammy.  Still I don’t understand why they didn’t take her in for further questioning at that point.  They could have called for backup.

Since they are going so much faster than expected, skipping court tomorrow. I guess no big deal since jury isn’t sequestered.

Edited April 21, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

9 hours ago, Durangout said:

I watched the interview video that you linked—wow, just wow.

Yes, her pulling out the informative highlights intensifies the experience of the bizarre.

Edited April 21, 2023 by Calm

[Rain]

44 minutes ago, Calm said:

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/audio-day-13-eight-witnesses-take-the-stand-in-lori-vallow-daybell-trial/
 

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/day-13-live-updates-police-body-camera-footage-played-in-lori-daybells-murder-trial-as-multiple-witnesses-take-the-stand/
 

Random thought…how many of you give someone a hug when you first meet them?

I do occasionally.  It really depends on the situation.  

44 minutes ago, Calm said:

Why not pay her daughter instead?  It is a great way to avoid having to give them gifts of money, so cheaper in the long run.

A lie on the fly to avoid having to figure out how to transfer school records when there was no transfer?  Did one of Melani’s kids have autism?  I don’t remember hearing that.

Okay…

At least he tried, seems like the first of the social network who cared enough to do so.  And offered to give him a blessing rather than dismissing him as possessed.  Seems like a decent guy even though he has his own brand of fringe ideas.  Wonder if he was involved up close earlier if he might have set off an alarm since he was willing to openly criticize CD.

Gibb hasn’t mentioned she had an autistic son or an autistic stepson when asked about her experience with autism.  That has always struck me as weird.

And that is where I would be dropping any thought of becoming friends and seriously question my relationship with someone who associated so closely with them.  Think about it, if Gibb was comfortable enough to hang around two obvious cheaters, would she be that committed to a relationship with Warwick?  Seems like a risk.

That is new. 

 

[Tacenda]

Stumbled across this on youtube, has it been shared already? Very in depth stuff coming from Chad's sister in law, Heather married to his brother Matt. Wow, it goes into what happened when they moved to Rexburg where his brother and Heather had already moved, Heather wasn't too happy when Chad said he wanted to move there. 

It's a three part series. 

 

 

[Calm]

25 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Stumbled across this on youtube, has it been shared already? Very in depth stuff coming from Chad's sister in law, Heather married to his brother Matt. Wow, it goes into what happened when they moved to Rexburg where his brother and Heather had already moved, Heather wasn't too happy when Chad said he wanted to move there. 

It's a three part series. 

 

 

I came across it when I found the cousin’s clip. I thought I put up a link, but might have missed it. The cousin’s stuff should be online now unless they aren’t doing it three days in a row.  I haven’t looked at it yet. I am still working through Noor’s stuff. 

[Kenngo1969]

 

[teddyaware]

Here’s what I believe is the most likely explanation for Lori Daybell’s diabolical behavior: Lori was very likely born a genetically hardwired sociopath. Her tragic inborn sociopathy was exacerbated by growing up in a wacky, dysfunctional family where a lack of humility and Pharisaic pride normalized her inward experience of never feeling shame, regret, guilt or remorse of conscience when she did something wrong. Further driven by a narcissistic need to be loved, respected and admired, she strategically chose to project the outward persona of a dotting mother and dynamic member of the church, but all the while being internally nagged with the mystery as to why she was so lacking in moral conscience and authentic empathy. Of course her true malevolent state of mind did peek through and manifest itself many times throughput her life (for example, she could be very vicious and implacable if you crossed her), but otherwise she did do a pretty good job of acting, presenting herself as a loving and faithful Molly Mormon in order to satisfy her vanity.

Then along comes Chad Daybell who was finally able to explain to Lori why she never feels bad when she does something wrong. He “enlightens” her mind when he tells her that she’s actually a goddess whose righteousness and glory are so great that every thought that enters into her mind is automatically a holy thought — even when plotting the “necessary” murder of her own children —  and now she’s finally able to understand why she never feels guilt when she commits sin.

Because she has finally come to the “realization” that she’s a powerful heavenly being, who’s already fully divine, she no longer needs to wonder why she never feels remorse of conscience when she violates the law of God. You see, the laws that govern this world don’t apply to her because she’s transcended this world and is living the law of a higher, holier kingdom. I can only image the “joy” she must have felt when Chad revealed to her that everything in her entire life is good and right, and that she never did anything wrong. Only beings of the greatest holiness always feel good about themselves. Mystery solved.

Edited April 22, 2023 by teddyaware

[Tacenda]

I heard Chad has been excommunicated recently, how true I don't know. 

[Tacenda]

25 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I heard Chad has been excommunicated recently, how true I don't know. 

Dummy me, he's been excommunicated for a few years now. 

[The Nehor]

On 4/22/2023 at 11:19 AM, teddyaware said:

Here’s what I believe is the most likely explanation for Lori Daybell’s diabolical behavior: Lori was very likely born a genetically hardwired sociopath. Her tragic inborn sociopathy was exacerbated by growing up in a wacky, dysfunctional family where a lack of humility and Pharisaic pride normalized her inward experience of never feeling shame, regret, guilt or remorse of conscience when she did something wrong. Further driven by a narcissistic need to be loved, respected and admired, she strategically chose to project the outward persona of a dotting mother and dynamic member of the church, but all the while being internally nagged with the mystery as to why she was so lacking in moral conscience and authentic empathy. Of course her true malevolent state of mind did peek through and manifest itself many times throughput her life (for example, she could be very vicious and implacable if you crossed her), but otherwise she did do a pretty good job of acting, presenting herself as a loving and faithful Molly Mormon in order to satisfy her vanity.

Then along comes Chad Daybell who was finally able to explain to Lori why she never feels bad when she does something wrong. He “enlightens” her mind when he tells her that she’s actually a goddess whose righteousness and glory are so great that every thought that enters into her mind is automatically a holy thought — even when plotting the “necessary” murder of her own children —  and now she’s finally able to understand why she never feels guilt when she commits sin.

Because she has finally come to the “realization” that she’s a powerful heavenly being, who’s already fully divine, she no longer needs to wonder why she never feels remorse of conscience when she violates the law of God. You see, the laws that govern this world don’t apply to her because she’s transcended this world and is living the law of a higher, holier kingdom. I can only image the “joy” she must have felt when Chad revealed to her that everything in her entire life is good and right, and that she never did anything wrong. Only beings of the greatest holiness always feel good about themselves. Mystery solved.

Doubt it. Sociopathic narcissists are rare. Very rare. It is likely one or the other. A psychopath or sociopath would be unlikely to worry about their lack of moral conscience or empathy nor would they likely be vain. The whole being a goddess/divine being might appeal to a narcissist but a sociopath or psychopath wouldn’t need that kind of rationale and would probably reject it as laughable. Lori also wouldn’t need anything to ameliorate her guilt if she was a psychopath or sociopath.

This is nice fiction but very unlikely.

[MustardSeed]

26 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Sociopathic narcissists are rare

At this point the label is pointless. Damage done. Can’t medicate for or reverse  narcissism or psychopathy anyway.