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Daybell-Vallow trial


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Posted (edited)

From Justin Lum via Websleuths (he is the other reporter I follow for this, so will likely put a link up later….am still debating how much attention I want to give to this right now):

Quote

Who’s here? Larry and Kay Woodcock (JJ’s grandparents) Annie Cushing (Tylee’s aunt) Gerry Vallow (Charles Vallow’s brother) Brandon Boudreaux (ex of Lori’s niece) Cole & Zach Vallow (Charles’ sons) Cheryl Wheeler (ex wife of Charles)

Not surprising, Colby isn’t there even though he is permitted as family of the victims**.  Wonder how his life is going.  For those not aware of his issues:

https://ksltv.com/505921/rape-charges-dropped-against-ryann-colby-lori-vallows-son/
 

If you have been following this case, you are likely aware that even as a kid his mom used him in twisted ways to manipulate others; he has to be one messed up kid.  I hope he has not alienated those willing to be his family.

**CourtTV lists him being there

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Calm said:

Now if she had said “he can’t do anything right” that would be easily understood seeing as how he missed Brandon.  I will be interested in how they interpret this. 

Looks like this was a Freudian slip by Nate and the text was “he can’t do anything right”…proves conspirator before or after the fact there imo for Tammy’s attempted murder. 

Edited by Calm
Posted

According to websleuths, Nate Eaton said one of his sources said we the public only know half the evidence, so might be lots more coming.

Posted (edited)

Anyone who is following this….

I would greatly appreciate if you mention here any questions you see about the Church arising from testimony or anything else attached to this case.  FAIR is likely to put up some resources and knowing what people are asking will be helpful.

My disorders are not liking the fact that Spring is trying to finally to launch itself and decided to strike back by draining me of life, so no way am I going to be able to go cruising around looking for people’s questions myself. (Not asking for sympathy as taking it in stride and all, just explaining why I am not doing it myself.)

Edited by Calm
Posted
18 minutes ago, Calm said:

Anyone who is following this….

I would greatly appreciate if you mention here any questions about the Church arising from testimony or anything else attached to this case.  FAIR is likely to put up some resources and knowing what people are asking will be helpful.

My disorders are not liking the fact that Spring is trying to finally to launch itself and decided to strike back by draining me of life, so no way am I going to be able to go cruising around looking for people’s questions myself. (Not asking for sympathy as taking it in stride and all, just explaining why I am not doing it myself.)

Wondering if the AVOW group is still doing meetings. I was so shocked when I saw a flyer posted online at one time of a gathering and saw a member in my stake, my neighbor's brother who was a stake leader, bishop, you name it. Well known citizen in the community too, large family that my kids went to school with as well. And he was speaking at this group's meeting. Hopefully several woke up and smelt the coffee. But I'm thinking that this guy didn't go down the road Daybell went down, but was speaking with Daybell. :(  Nevermind, I looked it up and there's a website, sadly.

https://www.ldsavow.com/features-benefits/

Posted
2 hours ago, Tacenda said:

This should not, not ... not (!!!) ... be read, in any way or to the least degree, as any kind of an endorsement of AVOW.  It is not.  I don't really have any basis for comparison, any sort of a "before-and-after" to show any kind of an evolution.  But I wouldn't be surprised if the site has been toned down considerably.

Posted
11 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

This should not, not ... not (!!!) ... be read, in any way or to the least degree, as any kind of an endorsement of AVOW.  It is not.  I don't really have any basis for comparison, any sort of a "before-and-after" to show any kind of an evolution.  But I wouldn't be surprised if the site has been toned down considerably.

My guess is the more public areas perhaps, but the private areas not necessarily 

Posted
34 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

This should not, not ... not (!!!) ... be read, in any way or to the least degree, as any kind of an endorsement of AVOW.  It is not.  I don't really have any basis for comparison, any sort of a "before-and-after" to show any kind of an evolution.  But I wouldn't be surprised if the site has been toned down considerably.

Yes, I'm sure it has, I read over several pages on the website. But they do speak about the end of times, I just hope no wackiness comes from it. And revelations etc. But to each their own I guess. 

Posted (edited)

I keep forgetting the early timeline, Brandon’s case got attention of police in Idaho first.  From Justin Lum’s tweets
 

Quote


On 11/4/19, RPD seized the Jeep. On 11/18/19, is when Hermosillo says they were made aware of concern for JJ through Kay Woodcock. That’s when police learned of the two siblings.

I was not aware/did not remember they were as thorough as this on the first welfare check (they knew about the wedding, so knew CD was lying.

Quote

Hermosillo called Det. Ron Ball and said he was concerned about JJ's whereabouts. Other detectives were called and they began knocking on doors at the complex.

 

Edited by Calm
Posted
Quote

The 1st photo is the exterior of Lori's apartment. The 2nd photo is the front room of apt. 175 looking into the living room/dining area. The next photo shows the living room/area going upstairs. The next photo is a Star Wars suitcase with 3-5 preparedness bags with emergency kits

The next photo was taken looking down the stairs. The next photo is the master bedroom. The next photo is the master bedroom closet with all the empty hangers in the closet. No clothes - just a towel hanging on the back door.

"Normally when people go on trips and plan to come home, they don't take all their belongings from their closet. This caught our attention because there was nothing in the closet other than empty hangers."

The next photo is another bedroom with some of Alex Cox's belongings. His name was on a plastic tub in the closet. In another room was some Hazmat-looking white suits lying on the floor. A tub on the closet had Alex Cox's belongings.

Hazmat….my guess for disposing of the bodies.

Alex’s apartment was empty.  Looks like he was living in his sister’s apartment at least by then.

Posted (edited)
Quote

First image shows items in a garage that were taken out of a tub. There is a Ghilli (camouflage) suit laid out on the ground. Police also found gun magazines and silencers to put on the end of a gun to keep it quiet when it's fired.

Second image shows clothing laid out on the ground. Third image shows several rounds of ammunition that was discovered in a tub. "A lot of ammunition in that specific tub," Hermosillo says.

Fourth image shows a rifle found in the garage and the barrel is threaded for a silencer. Fifth image shows the same rifle laid down on the table at the police department. Another rifle was inside of the same bag.

Next image shows two silencers found inside the garage. Next image shows knives that were found near the rifles. Next image shows a handgun found in a tub in the garage. Next image is a Halloween mask that was found on top of a plastic Walmart bag.

Inside the bag was rope and duct tape. Next image shows Alex Cox's active passport found inside the garage.
 

Websleuths is offering a nice summary of about 30 tweets at a time or so if you don’t want to wait till end of day reporting.  This section was from Nate Eaton

Quote

Hermosillo says the last date he is aware of "proof of life" of Tylee Ryan is from Sept. 8, 2019 based on a photo of her in Yellowstone. Last date of "proof of life" for JJ is Sept. 22, 2019 based on a photo of JJ sitting on a couch in Lori's front room.
 

 

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)

The detective seems to have a sense of humor.

Quote

Exhibit 10A. Wood wants it entered. Thomas objects, asking Hermosillo if he’s ever seen the aerial view of the property. Hermosillo says he’s walked the area and looked up.

:snort:
From Nate

 

Quote

Chad asked to call his attorney who, at the time, was Mark Means. Chad called Mark & police went into the front room with Chad, where they served him with the warrant. Chad asked if he needed to leave. Police said he did not but if he left, an officer would need to accompany him.

Chad went outside to his car to make a call. The FBI and other law enforcement officers arrived to help execute the search warrant. (Personal note: it was around this time I received a tip that something was happening at Chad's house.

Hermosillo says Chad was looking over his shoulder while he was in the car on the phone. Hermosillo said he looked where Chad was looking and saw the tree and pond in the backyard area.

[body discovered but not removed so it couldn’t have been seen from the road where CD was, just that people were milling around that area] At this point, officers were told Chad was leaving his daughter's house across the street "at a high rate of speed." Officers followed Chad, pulled him over and he was taken into custody

This and the phone call he was on (talking to LVD in jail, so it was recorded) seals the deal on him qualifying for life for me.

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)

Poor little Lolo.  She’s suffering and so fragile.  She needs a hug…(heavy, heavy sarcasm here in case anyone thinks I am the least bit sorry for this…woman).

There was a bit of drama after lunch.  It appears LVD didn’t want to play anymore and wanted to go home for the rest of the day and any other not so fun days.  Read the quote below from bottom up.  Love, love the judge here.  I have liked his rulings in the trial so far…all in favor of the prosecution of course, lol.  The prosecution has been doing a good job imo, btw.  But the judge has been generous for the defense imo in the past with all the motions, which is good as she deserves a fair trial.  Some were even speculating he had the hots for LVD, which was stupid.  He was just being careful.  But LVD knew what she would be seeing today and still was quite chipper and laughing until forced to look.  I wouldn’t be surprised if she had refused to look or discuss graphic details with her attorneys before.  She needs to see what happened to her beautiful children.  What she is seeing are the nightmares that will be haunting the ones who actually loved Charles, JJ, Tylee, and Tammy the rest of their lives.

Quote

57 p.m. Lori has no reaction to the judge’s decision.

1:56 p.m. Boyce says the court has authority to override the request of defendant to voluntarily excuse herself from certain portions of the trial where she has been here for the first day and a half of the trial. Boyce says her presence can and should be required so the judge denies the request and orders that Lori cannot leave.

1:54 p.m. Boyce says Idaho law allows some defendants to waive their right to be present during part of their trial but there is a process if someone wants to be voluntarily absent. Boyce discussing what authority the court has to allow someone to miss part of the trial.

1:51 p.m. Boyce cites Idaho Criminal Rule 43 and says presence is required at a defendant’s trial in every stage of the trial, but part of the law says a defendant can waive their right to to be present under certain circumstances. 

1:51 p.m. Blake says if Lori is allowed to leave, the state would be allowed to comment to the jury during closing arguments that she was not present during this portion of the trial.

1:49 p.m. Lindsey Blake argues it’s important to have the defendant present and the state of Idaho deserves to have her here. “This isn’t the first time the defendant has been uncooperative with this court.”

1:48 p.m. Archibald says Lori wishes to waive her right to be present for the remainder of the afternoon. He says it was emotional this morning and Lori has fragile mental health.

1:47 p.m.Boyce is on the bench and says a legal issue has arisen that needs to be taken up outside of the presence of the jury. Archibald will now argue that issue.

1:46 p.m.Lori’s mood is visibly different. This morning she was chatting with her attorneys, smiling, laughing. This afternoon she is silent and appears upset. 

1:45 p.m. Lori has entered the courtroom. Her face is red and she appears to have been crying. The deputy is locking her leg shackles into the floor. She sits down and is looking down.

1:43 p.m. Larry Woodcock is in the courtroom and Kay Woodcock has joined him. She was not here this morning. Other family members are also in the courtroom.

1:41 p.m. Jim Archibald and John Thomas are looking at some papers while the prosecutors remain seated at their table. Judge Boyce is not in the courtroom.

1:40 p.m. All attorneys have re-entered the courtroom but Lori is not here.

1:37 p.m. Before lunch, we saw images of where JJ and Tylee were found. Det. Hermosillo was going to continue his testimony this afternoon and we were warned the evidence would be graphic. Lori has some idea of what would be shown and discussed this afternoon. It’s possible her attorneys have shown her the images before today.

1:35 p.m. I think I’m safe to assume that everyone in the courtroom is wondering what is going on. It has been 30 minutes and no updates. Jurors remain outside of the courtroom. They were never brought back in from their lunch break.

1:31 p.m. John Thomas opens the door to the hallway from where he, Archibald and Lori have been. He motions for prosecutors to come back there. 

1:30 p.m. Defense attorneys and Lori have not entered the courtroom.

1:28 p.m. Prosecutors are back in the courtroom. Also – it is Rob Wood’s birthday today.

1:10 p.m. Personal observation: Lori Daybell appeared upset this afternoon. I’ve seen her in multiple court hearings, in Hawaii, face-to-face at the Rexburg Airport — I’ve never seen upset/sad before today.

1:08 p.m.Prosceutors and defense attorneys came into the courtroom. Lori never returned. Prosecutor Rachel Smith grabbed some documents and all of the attorneys went back into the hallway area where they had originally met. Hearing will resume at 1:35 p.m.

1:06 p.m.We have just been told the court is taking a 30 minute recess.

1:02 p.m. Boyce said the afternoon session would begin at 12:45 p.m. Everyone was ready to go when John Thomas asked if he, Archibald and Lori could meet in private following lunch.

1 p.m. All the prosecutors and judge have left the courtroom and gone into the hallway where Lori was with her attorneys. 

12:54 p.m. Jurors have not yet been brought back into the courtroom. Rob Wood is ready to continue questioning Det. Hermosillo. I’ve been told the evidence this afternoon will be graphic.

12:52 p.m. Lori has left the courtroom with her attorneys to have a discussion in a private hallway.

12:50 p.m. Court was about to resume, but John Thomas asked for some time to visit with Lori. Lori appeared visibly upset. Court is in recess again.

11:40 a.m. Attorneys are now having a sidebar conference with the judge. Jurors are standing to stretch their legs. It’s now understandable why Kay Woodcock decided not to come this morning. We are headed into a lunch break until 12:45 p.m.

 

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)

Some are speculating she will eventually fold for a deal.  I hope she doesn’t as I want the texting and other evidence shared.  And if it’s a deal, it would mean something less than life imprisonment without parole as that is the max now…and I don’t think she should be ever be let out for the well being of Colby and the Vallow extended family as well as Tammy’s family.  Unless the texts between her and CD and her brother are explicit, I don’t know if they can get her for premeditated murder of her husband.  I hope they have a trial for his death as well.

 

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)

She is pouting.

From the Hidden True Crime podcaster:

Quote

Wood asking questions to Hermosillo, but I’m still looking at Lori who still hasn’t moved from this position—head turned, chair further back from her attorneys, staring into distance, not looking at jury or public

Her arms have been reported to have stayed crossed since she entered the courtroom again.  She is distancing herself, it seems.

From another observer, posted on WS:

Quote

Lori Vallow has found the one way to position her body where no one in this courtroom gallery can see her face.

@Leah_Sottile

On every break, Lori has laughed with or whispered to her attorneys. She has sat stone still for 15+ minutes, arms crossed. Her body language is that of a pissed person.

 

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)

It is very graphic.  Jurors and family are having a rough time.  She is just refusing to look.  Thankfully she has to still listen.

Some recommended as an additional source:  https://twitter.com/PrettyLiesAlibi

There is also Lori Hellis, a lawyer and author iirc.  She was/is writing a book about the case, iirc. (imthegoodlori is her tag)

Quote

Lori appears to be asleep. Remember, she is on a cocktail of psychotropics. If she was very upset this morning she may have been given something to calm her anxiety. Nonetheless it’s not a good look. #LoriVallowDaybell #imthegoodlori

 

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)

The first real signs of the defense, very predictable…from Lum

Quote

Thomas on the ghillie suit: That isn’t something that would fit her right? Hermosillo: I can’t answer that.

Quote

Thomas to RH on Tylee’s proof of life: Isn’t it true that you had hundreds of tips after 9/8/19 that came in? Hermosillo: We could not verify any additional sightings of Tylee. We followed up on every tip.

Quote

Thomas says when the search warrant was going on at Chad's he says you can't say for sure where he was looking when over his shoulder? Hermasillo - he was looking at the tree. Thomas - we can agree to disagree #LoriVallowtrial 
@LawCrimeNetwork

 

Edited by Calm
Posted (edited)
Quote

Surviving the Survivor on YT has a fantastic panel on tonight including Angenette Levy and 3 attorneys, one who practices in Idaho. Fascinating discussion.

For those who want more discussion

I am not going to listen to anything,  Too much pain even from those who never met the kids.  

Edited by Calm
Posted
1 hour ago, Calm said:

She is pouting.

From the Hidden True Crime podcaster:

He arms have been reported to have stayed crossed since she entered the courtroom again.  She is distancing herself, it seems.

From another observer, posted on WS:

 

If it were me that did this hellacious evil, I'd kill myself, maybe torture myself, because of the terrible guilt. I wouldn't be sitting there pissed. But I feel I wouldn't deserve to be killed, because maybe I'd deserve a lifetime of sitting in my cell knowing what I did. If anyone thinks they have a bad day, imagine the kind of day you'd have if you did this to two beautiful children, a former husband, a husband's former wife, and maybe even a brother..... wait, maybe she's pure evil or possessed, then maybe you'd be fine in prison. Even if she didn't do it with her own hands, she's guilty as heck. 

Posted
1 hour ago, Tacenda said:

Even if she didn't do it with her own hands, she's guilty as heck. 

I agree.

Posted

Oh my... is this about those Mormons and the shootings? That's an disturbing and sad storie. Well... i'm going to read the whole topic first. Bevore i am going to mengle myself into an Discussion. 

Oh my oh my. 

Posted
10 hours ago, Tacenda said:

If it were me that did this hellacious evil, I'd kill myself, maybe torture myself, because of the terrible guilt. I wouldn't be sitting there pissed.

I wonder if Lori may be sociopathic.  See here:

Quote

Antisocial personality disorder, sometimes called sociopathy, is a mental health condition in which a person consistently shows no regard for right and wrong and ignores the rights and feelings of others. People with antisocial personality disorder tend to purposely make others angry or upset and manipulate or treat others harshly or with cruel indifference. They lack remorse or do not regret their behavior.

People with antisocial personality disorder often violate the law, becoming criminals. They may lie, behave violently or impulsively, and have problems with drug and alcohol use. They have difficulty consistently meeting responsibilities related to family, work or school.

I do not think she has been diagnosed with this, though, so it may not play a role in the legal proceedings.

I am not sure whether Antisocial Personality Disorder is, in and of itself, sufficient to negate mens rea.  I suspect not.

10 hours ago, Tacenda said:

But I feel I wouldn't deserve to be killed, because maybe I'd deserve a lifetime of sitting in my cell knowing what I did. If anyone thinks they have a bad day, imagine the kind of day you'd have if you did this to two beautiful children, a former husband, a husband's former wife, and maybe even a brother..... wait, maybe she's pure evil or possessed, then maybe you'd be fine in prison. Even if she didn't do it with her own hands, she's guilty as heck. 

I think guilty conduct is the only viable explanation for all the bodies that stacked up around her.

Thanks,

-Smac

Posted

There are at least two kinds of "crazy" (Remember: I live in Crazytown! :crazy: I love the place! :blink: (I think I saw Lori a time or two at those apartments on the next block over from mine ;))  (1) A person may be "crazy," may know (or may not know) he or she is "crazy," and may regret all of the ways in which one's "craziness" affects others; or (2) a person may be "crazy," may realize he or she is crazy, and may not give a !$%&@#!! how one's craziness affects others (or at least, may not do so enough to want to change).  From (admittedly little) I've seen and heard of Lori, I think she's the latter.

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