Daybell-Vallow trial

[Calm]

This are the threats Charles sent the previous day.  That first one is unfortunate in its wording (I think the rest make it clear his revenge/justice will be her exposure) and likely will be a big part of her defense if she goes to court for Charles’ death as well as attacking his credibility based on his online relationships and possible date that night.  He wasn’t as blinded by love as was first portrayed in the media.

Quote

6/30/19: Charles Vallow sends Lori a series of text messages, including some vague threats (source😞

5:01 am:

Be sure to look over your shoulders today. This may be the day. It’s coming. That much I promise you.

5:04 am:

And your boyfriend too

6:22 am:

You will reap the destruction you have sown. I’ll be there for JJ. Don’t worry about that. Have a wonderful day being a hypocrite in church.

8:42 am:

Lori I know you don’t much care how I feel but just imagine this. How could my actions or breaking your heart result in what you’ve done? You accuse me of Infidelity [sic] but it’s you who has been having an affair. It just keeps killing me. Maybe that’s your goal. How can you live with yourself destroying our life, Mel and Brandon’s, probably Mel and Brenden too. Now add Chad Daybell family and you’ve got a home run. The fact that you continue to go to the temple after all you’ve done shocks even me. There really is something wrong with you. I really don’t want to do what I have to dobut you have to be exposed for what you really are. You won’t even deny it or talk to me as to your reasons. That’s what’s amazing to me. You could allay some of what’s about to happen but I don’t think you will.Lying has become second nature to you. You have been impressive in blaming me for all that’s happened. You have destroyed me. I’ve never been lower in my life. It’s you that has done it. Please tell me why. Please. I will slow or minimize what’s about to happen. It’s you who has caused it. We have a son to raise but that’s all we have in common. I will work with you in his best interest and will be there Monday evening. You owe me an apology for all the false accusations you’ve made. You know I’ve been entirely faithful to you since the first day we met. I deserve an apology from you. Please respect that much.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/lc8vep4ivj59f47/charles-text-to-lori-threats-jun-30-2019.png

Quote

7/2/19: Charles Vallow tells Adam Cox he believes Chad and Tammy Daybell are ring leaders of the cult (source).

Note: According to a search warrant drafted by Chandler Police Det Nathan Duncan, they believed that Lori found out about the intervention from Chad (source). They surmised he found out from Tammy. Tammy deleted the emails from her account so they weren’t able to confirm she received the emails. I disagree with that conclusion and addressed who I thought was the mole in this YouTube live. (Spoiler alert: I believe it’s far more feasible that Chad monitored Tammy’s emails because Charles told Lori ahead of time that he had Tammy’s email and was going to reach out to her. It was summer break, so Tammy may not have been monitoring email as closely. Also, this might explain why the day after Charles was supposed to speak to Tammy, he told Adam she was a ring leader of the cult. I believe Chad may have replied harshly from Tammy’s email and then deleted everything.)

Quote

7/2/19: According to a text from Charles Vallow to Adam Cox, Lori Vallow purchased a new health insurance policy that included Charles, JJ, and Tylee but not herself because, as a translated being, she didn’t need it (source).

 

https://www.annielytics.com/blog/personal/timeline-events-around-disappearance-of-tylee-ryan-jj-vallow/

Quote

7/8/19: Melani and Brandon Boudreaux begin divorce proceedings. Melani continues to pay for the life insurance on Brandon despite seeking a divorce (source).

 

Edited April 17, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

Quote

Lori sent Melani a text, “They are gathering witnesses. It’s just like twilight. They are the vulture.”

Twilight, as in the book.  She was living in fantasyland.

hmm…

Quote

In reviewing Lori’s cellular phone records, she had contact with only Chad, Phebe**, Melani, Charles, Summer and Alex during the hours leading up to and following the discovery of the intervention.**

Notes:

Emphasis is mine because I think this one sentence is key to understanding who was most involved in the planning of Charles’ murder.

“Phebe” is Melanie Gibb. She was supposedly Lori and Chad’s daughter in a previous life. According to Det Ray Hermosillo, Melanie actually called Lori “Mom” 

 

[Calm]

Quote

Alex says Charles attacked him with a baseball bat but only had trace amounts of blood on a napkin he dabs the back of his head with (source). Also, Charles’ fingerprints were not found on the bat (source).

How stupid can they be?  That might be the one piece of evidence for me they didn’t plan this….but he could have forgotten that step.

Legally Alex shouldn’t have had the gun in the first place, being a felon.

Quote

Det Moffat told them that Alex wasn’t a prohibited possessor and implied he didn’t really care about his actions from 2007 (source). He was wrong. An FBI analyst actually researched this issue and found out Alex’s carry rights had not been restored because in Travis County gun rights are only restored if the person’s record is expunged, and Alex’s wasn’t (source).

Annie Cushing, Tylee’s aunt who collected all this, is rather unhappy with the Chandler police.  Probably blames them in part for Tylee’s death as the police should have at least barred Lori from leaving town, made her more cautious, etc,

Edited April 17, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

This is more weird texting, it shows this zombie, evil spirit stuff and casting outs of some sort were always on their minds, everyday conversation almost.  I am leaning towards CD’s actually believing his own crap now, though it could still be just manipulation, distancing LVD from her kids.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/na2qicyoc8pzwuw/chad-said-tammy-3-jj-2-heavily-shielded-jul-30-2019.png

CD got himself a seer stone…

https://www.dropbox.com/s/vx17fgejvk1beei/melanie-listed-who-participated-in-aug-prayer-circle-casting.png

Edited April 18, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

Thought some might be wondering whatever happened to Bailey, JJ’s dog that LVD first tried to make a buck off of.  Elsewhere it was said (Zulema?) that Bailey had to go because evil spirits could more easily enter animals and then jump to humans, which put JJ at risk.  I can’t figure out why she couldn’t sell him from looking at the website.  My guess is they went the quick route and bought a fully trained dog and the “lessons” were personalizing his training for JJ and the family.  There may have been a stipulation she had to return the dog in the contract.  Wonder if she got a refund.  Another possibility is the government funded part of the purchase so it didn’t officially belong to JJ as his property.  My mind is so in ramble mode.

Quote

8/9/19: Lori Vallow puts JJ Vallow’s service dog Bailey up for sale (source). City: Chandler, AZ. Ad number: 20875. Description:

Bailey has such a sweet spirit- he has brought so much love to his home, but his owner recently died and he needs a new home. He is fully trained with certification as a service dog. Up to date on vaccinations. Has been trained with children in the home, non-smoking home. Bailey is sweet and friendly around other dogs. Looking for new owners who will appreciate and love him the way he has been loved! Spent 7,000 on service training, he is a full bred golden doodle, has experience on airplanes, has experience with people with autism.

Notable: Lori was later told by the organization they got the dog from that she couldn’t sell the dog; she would need to return him. Bailey has since been placed with a new family of a boy with autism. (This was shared in a private Facebook post.)

From Timeline

He has gone to another likely loving autistic boy who needs him very much.

Edited April 18, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

Quote

 

8/11/19: Lori Vallow sends Chad Daybell a text telling him to go back to his family (source):

U should give all of you [sic] love and your attention to your wife and family. I’m just a distraction. Go have fun with your family. I really do want you to. I just can’t be in the way anymore. If things change we can talk. But we have nothing until things change anyway. 

 

Timeline

More evidence, imo, that both CD and LVD were manipulating each other to get what they wanted, CD with all his spiritual cosplay and dungeon mastering that goes too far and LVD with her victim playing, attention getting manipulation, etc.  CD always tried to dominate by making sure he was one up on LVD; she was Moroni’s favorite wife, but he was the brother of Jesus; she had Emmeline Wells as her guardian Angel and had been married to Neal A Maxwell when she was Methuselah’s daughter and the third GreatGrandmother of Joseph Smith and all the women in her group had been her daughters at some time in the past, but CD had been a Holy Ghost; CD had at least one more probation, one more light decimal point, etc…supposedly you can gain a point for every probation/life you have on this earth, maybe starting at 2, but that appears to max out at 4 lives and then you start going up by tenths…as in first life 2, second life 3, third life, 4.1, fourth 4.2, etc.  LVD was 4.3, the highest rating of anyone (she shared it with a few other women in the group) besides apostles who were rated 5 and iirc CD (need to find the doc that has his info on it, but I think he was 4.4 or 4.5.). Added:  she had 21 probations total and his were 31.  While she would seem to make suggestions on who he should judge as dark to justify distancing herself or treating them like crap.  For example, JJ was high light until LVD texts CD that JJ is acting weird, is restless in his sleep, CD responses JJ is successful in fighting off evil demons, sounds more reassuring than condemning JJ as evil, but I get the impression LVD becomes more insistent about it over time.  Bailey the dog has to go because he’s possessed; JJ has to get castings done to kick out the evil spirits starting in August iirc.  He probably hadn’t gotten his medications since Charles stopped being primary caregiver, so he would likely become more disruptive.  However, LVD also talked about drugging him at night so she could sleep when they were in Idaho, so don’t know what was go8ng on with his meds.  I wonder if they did a hair analysis for what drugs he was taking long term.

Just found this tidbit, figured that was what she thought, but ‘nice’ to be confirmed:

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The group also believed that once a person became "exalted," they couldn't be held responsible for their actions on Earth.

"Because Lori was already 'exalted,'" Pastenes told the investigators, according to their report, "she would often slam her hand on the counter and state, 'Doesn't count for me!'"

 

https://www.newsweek.com/accused-killers-chad-lori-daybell-had-cult-like-belief-system-documents-reveal-1637138

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Kenngo1969]

3 hours ago, Calm said:

... He has gone to another likely loving autistic boy who needs him very much.

At least the animals involved in this whole, sorry saga have met better fates than their human counterparts!    

 

Was Lori's attitude, "It only matters to me whether evil spirits can 'jump' from animals to me [or, maybe, to Chad]"?  If I were a prosecutor, I would do everything I could to put the finest point possible on that little inconsistency in Lori's thinking: As "crazy" as Lori's thinking might seem to the average person, in my opinion, this whole episode with Bailey (the dog) shows that her whole "system" is self-serving and, far and away, exists more for her own convenience than for any other reason.  It was like a suit that she put on when she felt like wearing it, and took off when she didn't.  "Tylee and JJ?  Meh, we can 'off' them and keep on collecting their Social Security checks, but we'll be on the hook for Seven Grand if we kill the dog!"  

 

Quote

 

The group also believed that once a person became "exalted," they couldn't be held responsible for their actions on Earth.

"Because Lori was already 'exalted,'" Pastenes told the investigators, according to their report, "she would often slam her hand on the counter and state, 'Doesn't count for me!'"

 

Narcissist?  

Edited April 18, 2023 by Kenngo1969

[Calm]

52 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

It was like a suit that she put on when she felt like wearing it

Well stated

[Calm]

Quote

12/30/19: Kay and Larry Woodcock send the FBI a text about how Lori Vallow and Alex Cox were shipping meth and money laundering through Chad Daybell’s business to raise money for their legal battle. It came to light because a reporter said s/he was sent the message from a family member, and it was passed around in a number of Facebook groups. Initially, family denied this was ever sent to the FBI, but later a family member confirmed sending this communication and said it was an attempt to get LE to take the case seriously, even though they knew it wasn’t true (source)…

In the true crime social media groups, this misstep became known as ‘#methgate’.

 

Timeline…

Quote

2/12/20: Brandon Boudreaux reaches out to Gilbert Police Det Pillar to tell him Melani Pawlowski (formerly Boudreaux) wouldn’t sign the papers to cancel the life insurance policy they had on him. Because they were both owners of the policy (something the broker noted as ‘unusual’), both of them had to sign the paper to remove her as a beneficiary of the policy. She also paid for the policy out of her personal account, so he couldn’t even stop payment on the policy (source).

This is after she has presented herself as doubting the extreme beliefs and distancing herself from LVD and CD as not that familiar with it all, which seems a massive lie based on texts and her behaviour overall.

Edited April 18, 2023 by Calm

[Tacenda]

8 hours ago, Calm said:

This is more weird texting, it shows this zombie, evil spirit stuff and casting outs of some sort were always on their minds, everyday conversation almost.  I am leaning towards CD’s actually believing his own crap now, though it could still be just manipulation, distancing LVD from her kids.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/na2qicyoc8pzwuw/chad-said-tammy-3-jj-2-heavily-shielded-jul-30-2019.png

CD got himself a seer stone…

https://www.dropbox.com/s/vx17fgejvk1beei/melanie-listed-who-participated-in-aug-prayer-circle-casting.png

Holy crap!

[Calm]

Reading the 6/2/19 texts between Zulema and Lori…it seems clear both LVD and ZP intend Charles to die and JJ too since he was in the car and they apparently knew it.

That they actually believe they could harm him this way….especially since she layers asks if there was a way to turn Charles to the light.  Why would she be asking then if that was her intent earlier?

Unfortunately I can’t copy them.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hw775ro5c123ijz/chandler-affidavit-probable-cause-lori-fully-unredacted-shareable.pdf

 

Edited April 18, 2023 by Calm

[bsjkki]

This is horrible stuff. 

 

Edited April 18, 2023 by bsjkki

[Calm]

8 hours ago, bsjkki said:

This is horrible stuff. 

I hadn’t realized he had talked to Tylee hours before she died.  How he must hate and despise his mother…and love the part of her that once (hopefully) cared for him.  He must have so much self doubt.  I hope he is in therapy.  

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10:01 a.m. Wood asks Colby about the night of Sept. 8, 2019. Colby asked Tylee for money, and Tylee responded that she was no longer in control of her money, but her mom was handling it. Colby says he spoke with Lori that day. He heard Tylee over the phone, and Lori said they were at the Yellowstone National Park gift store.

 

Quote

10:38 a.m. Earlier I said Lori may be crying or wiping her face. Chanley Painter with Court TV is on the other side of the courtroom with a better angle of Lori’s face and tells me she did not see tears.

Considering she is laughing during the break (I assume the jury isn’t present), my guess is unless she is feeling uncomfortable, the tissues she took are an act, maybe for Colby, maybe the jury.  Her lawyers must tell her she is not presenting well.

 

I am glad they didn’t require Colby to listen to the phone call. I wonder if that was his choice. Going through that once is enough. 
 

Added:  I got interrupted and then skipped the part the judge calls him back in when I came back to it…how unfortunate he had to listen, but I was shocked he wasn’t going to.  Didn’t think they could be so kind.  Apparently they can’t.  But it wasn’t even necessary in the long run.  Poor guy.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[ksfisher]

On 4/12/2023 at 1:27 PM, Calm said:

Here, in a nutshell, are seven characteristics that should alert you that a psychopathic personality might be in your sights.

Superficial Charm. ... 

Puffed-Up Self-Esteem. ... 

Deceitfulness. ... 

Shallow Emotions. ... 

Boredom and a Need for Stimulation. ... 

A History of Shady Conduct. ... 

A Riddle of Contradictions.

You've accidentally copied the seven characteristics for identifying politicians instead of the list of how to identify psychopaths. 🫠

[Calm]

2 hours ago, ksfisher said:

You've accidentally copied the seven characteristics for identifying politicians instead of the list of how to identify psychopaths. 🫠

Dang, that happens to me all the time for some reason!

[Wilderland]

How utterly crushing for Colby.

I think the prosecution is laying out a pretty effective case, but who knows how effective her defense team will be.

Did I read somewhere Zulima made some immunity deal for her testimony? I find it hard to believe she didn’t at a minimum know about the murder of Charles, let alone the children. The day he was killed she was in the temple using her “powers” against him?? 

And she forgets her wedding date to Alex, as well as the date she claims Heavenly Father, Heavenly Mother, and the Savior appeared to her?  Zulima has ‘earthbending’ (Avatar reference) powers? I’ve read a bit on this case, but had no idea how twisted and surreal this group was. Binding and burning? Zulima and Lori ‘spiritually attacking’ Charles as he drives from Texas to Arizona? All in the name of heaven? I feel like I’m driving by a violent car accident and I can’t help but slow down to gawk, then feel unclean afterwards. 

[Calm]

9 hours ago, Wilderland said:

How utterly crushing for Colby.

I think the prosecution is laying out a pretty effective case, but who knows how effective her defense team will be.

Did I read somewhere Zulima made some immunity deal for her testimony? I find it hard to believe she didn’t at a minimum know about the murder of Charles, let alone the children. The day he was killed she was in the temple using her “powers” against him?? 

And she forgets her wedding date to Alex, as well as the date she claims Heavenly Father, Heavenly Mother, and the Savior appeared to her?  Zulima has ‘earthbending’ (Avatar reference) powers? I’ve read a bit on this case, but had no idea how twisted and surreal this group was. Binding and burning? Zulima and Lori ‘spiritually attacking’ Charles as he drives from Texas to Arizona? All in the name of heaven? I feel like I’m driving by a violent car accident and I can’t help but slow down to gawk, then feel unclean afterwards. 

I have not been impressed by anything the defense has done.  As far as I can see, they are trying to establish many in the group shared the same beliefs so either the beliefs had nothing to do with killing since not everyone died or had someone close die…or they are going to try and push it was someone else trying to help them out, but not with their backing at all.  But the prosecution is going for greed for money, power, and sex, not religion motivated, so maybe something else is going on,

Added:  someone on Websleuths figures the defense is going to try and paint LVD as just another sincere female believer who had no clue what CD actually intended.

Quote

4 months of dating and getting to know each other. Thomas says you told the state Alex would do anything for Lori and you knew that. How is it you knew him between Aug-Sept and you know all this stuff. Maybe you didn't know him that well and he wouldn't do anything for Lori"

Maybe he is trying to make Alex just CD’s fanboy and not LVD’s…with the attack on Joe Ryan, seems unlikely to fly.

Yeah, I think Zulema is downplaying her actual intent.  Her immunity was dependent on her testifying and possibly only attached to what she testified about, I don’t believe it’s been shared in detail though, just named as a limited-use immunity***.  My guess if they figured out the poison used for Tammy and tied the same drug to her and Alex somehow or CD shared that they used Zulema to kill Alex, she could be prosecuted, but who knows.  Maybe she got her immunity before they figured out how twisted or involved others were.  Still, surely she would be suspected as a possible hitman for Alex by LE, so prosecutors would have been careful.  Alex supposedly told her there was several thousand in cash in a duffle bag (can’t remember how much, think it was maybe $7000) in the closet that was for her if anything happened to him, but Annie Cushing thinks it was CD paying her to off Alex. Maybe CD had decided Alex’s obsession for his sister was more annoying than useful now.

Strangely, Alex may have intended (under instruction) to kill Zulema as he was offered to give her a massage and bought one of those plastic tarps you put down for painting to put on the bed to kept from getting oil all over.  No therapist I know makes you lay on plastic.  And it’s not like you are dripping in oil.  Only makes sense if he was going to strangle her (sounds like she was drugged) and then get rid of the body and wanted to be able to get rid of evidence easily by wrapping her up in it to transport to the desert and then be off to join his true love…excuse me, his sister and her husband in Hawaii.  But he couldn’t go through with it.  Maybe he didn’t give her a big enough dose and he couldn’t face her being conscious.  My guess is both JJ and Tylee were drugged as he had meds that helped him to sleep, Tammy had to have been, so most likely Zulema was as well….but maybe they didn’t have enough.  Alex went down to Mexico because drugs were cheaper, I wonder if he was stocking up for another try and then when he heard of the exhumation, took them himself.  
 

Another option is Zulema made up the story to make herself look more innocent.  Alex was dead, no one to contradict her.

***https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/day-10-live-updates-alex-coxs-widow-says-chad-and-lori-daybell-taught-demons-needed-to-be-bound-or-burned/

Quote

Zulema was offered a limited-use immunity agreement signed four years ago with prosecutors.

Limited use means prosecution can’t use her own statements against her.  I am not sure if they can use evidence found through those statements against her or not.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

Quote

Saari says JJ Vallow received benefits because Charles died in July 2019. JJ received $1,951 per month. They began around Sept. 18, 2019 and were stopped in January 2020 because JJ was gone.

 

I wonder if she kept him alive longer than Tylee in case she needed him to prove to the SSA she was caring for him. That was a Wednesday and he was buried the following Monday.  I never understood why she waited given he was so hard to take care of.  Even Chad pitched in. (Him carrying JJ upstairs when JJ was throwing a fit and getting scratched by JJ makes me wonder if he killed JJ as before I didn’t know how he was playing Daddy already…and probably not enjoying it). LVD had been going on about him being possessed off and on for quite some time, so it seems likely she always intended to do it, as much as she formed intent.  

LVD knew from Tylee that once SSA benefits were established they checked only once a year or so in detail as I understand it. (This was discussed on websleuths or Reddit, read it either last night or the night before, so I may be way off as I haven’t researched it yet).  She might have believed she had a year before she would have to offer up proof and she believed Christ would have come by then (July 2020).

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/04/day-11-live-updates-detective-takes-stand-in-daybell-trial-testifies-about-bank-transfers-and-deposits-around-time-of-deaths/

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

According to one website I just checked, the cost of living for one month in Hawaii is $2500, another says comfortably between $70,000 and 120,000$ a year.  She was getting more than twice the monthly amount, so with CD’s contribution of Tammy’s life insurance of $400,000 iirc, sounds like they could have lasted till July easily.  After that, no doubt Jesus would make sure they had all they needed, them being such good buddies and running errands for them.

Quote

2:38 p.m. Kunsaitis says deposits were made on Sept. 10 and Sept. 16 into Tylee’s account from her mother’s account. “The money that was coming in from Lori’s account is immediately Venmoed out and we were able to show those Venmos went to Colby Ryan, Lori’s son.” Kunsaitis says there were 29 deposits into Tylee’s account from Lori’s account and then the money was immediately turned around and sent to Colby on those same days.

So Colby wouldn’t want to suspect Tylee wasn’t Tylee?

I wonder if Tylee’s money was sent to Colby in the previous year on such a frequent basis.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

https://www.fox10phoenix.com/news/lori-vallows-cousin-says-the-discovery-of-jjs-and-tylees-remains-was-not-surprising-but-horrifying
 

Also in second video…

She claims Chad’s crap is close to mainstream church teachings.  Obviously I think she is way off base.  To jump from personal revelation (as if other faiths don’t believe God guides them in their lives or have visions) to the murders is ignoring all the apostate and nonsense stuff that is piled around as well as ignoring the safeguards of using personal revelation in tandem with revelation from leaders.

 

 

 

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

Memory refresher:  CD was excommunicated after the children were found.

https://preview.redd.it/wre1wnxe8l081.jpg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&v=enabled&s=6bd6374201fcc5137a77872184522ba5a3bfb1e4

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

One of these days I will get caught up on the WS timeline and get more tidbits I missed, but in regards to LVD having been a good mom previously…from her best friend in Hawaii:

Quote

c. 2016– According to AR speaking to NG Jul 2020 (paraphrased):- LV always had a lot of help with JJ. When they lived on Kauai she always had a nanny, usually a live-in nanny, and once he went to school CV was always there to help her manage JJ. It wasn’t something she could do on her own. AR would describe LV as more of a martyr with regards to JJ. CV would help JJ reach certain developmental milestones and LV would discount them and act as if CV was reading too much into JJ’s progress, things like learning the alphabet and recognizing words. She didn’t seem to celebrate those accomplishments the same way that CV did.

24 Sep 2019 – when AR later heard that LV had told JJ’s school she was going to homeschool him it didn’t make sense to her because LV had always had a lot of help and even with a lot of help JJ requires a lot of attention and time. (source Nancy Grace podcast interview April Raymond 6 Jul 2020)

Melani, her niece, was their live in nanny for awhile.  Once Tylee was old enough, she was homeschooled iirc (finished high school when 16) and could have been caring for JJ when he was home.  I read something that said when Charles was home, he was 24/7 caring for JJ, so LVD only had to deal with him half the week.  The babysitter up in Idaho reported iirc that LVD admitted to giving JJ sleep meds early so he would go to bed sooner.

 

[Calm]

I am watching this video by Noor Jasmine who has a lot of details not mentioned on the WS site from the 2500 page document dump

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s34wKJLFvuE&list=PLj2BTyW0AgZQFkWPjOmAoIc_TbuTkI79R&index=43

Shortly after Charles is killed, Alex returns to Chile (which he has just come back from, likely on his sex/get a wife tour, but I can’t remember the date for that) and stays there for a couple of weeks (maybe waiting to see what the direction the police are taking) and LV takes off for Houston 4 days after the killing, leaving JJ, who just lost his father, with a friend.  She may have gone with Colby to get anything valuable from Charles’ home there, but also interesting she takes off, maybe a just in case.

Charles was paying over a $1000 a month for phones, likely most of that for LVD and all her family (my guess is he could get a good deal and started doing this back when they were all friendly and kept doing it because he was a nice guy and didn’t want to alienate them.

There is a really sweet letter where Charles is appealing to LVD to just contact them where he is detailing everything that JJ was doing and accomplishing.  He was a good dad, when they moved to Houston, he got a tutor immediately for JJ and JJ was having a lot of success.  Charles was obviously proud of him.

Melanie then Boudreaux stopped her divorce proceedings two days before the attempt on Brandon’s life, apparently because she couldn’t collect life insurance if a divorce was pending.  I think I already posted she continued to pay for Brandon’s life insurance even after they were divorced.  Brandon couldn’t cancel it because her name was on the policy as well.  Nor could he stop her paying for it.  No wonder he went into hiding.

Looks like LVD was staying with Melani when Tammy was almost shot at (likely misfire).  Iirc she was also with Zulema that day and went through the roof about someone being a moron who couldn’t do anything right by himself after she got a phone call…likely info Alex had failed. (I may be mixing up the Brandon attempt and the Tammy attempt).  She did not return to Idaho until after the day after Tammy was dead.  

The FBI joined AVOW and there are some screenshots of posts included in the dump.  The day that Tammy died, CD spent much of that day online at AVOW basking in all the condolences.  One AVOW poster thinks Tammy handpicked Lori when she learned she was to die for Chad to marry and Chad is off in Hawaii with wife and new kids protecting them.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

Anyone want to see the overall crazy or just get a picture of what members of the extended inner PaP group look like, watch this…especially Julie Rowe ranting and melting down starting out at about 5:30; oh, my gosh…condemns the world to burn in anger, she is being threatened but will walk with gods.

The Tin Foil hat is just the podcaster’s joke, she is pretty laid back  This is mostly clips she has collected from interviews from all over  I am impressed by her coverage  

https://youtu.be/8cC7DKm3YKg

Eric Smith, Julie Rowe’s sidekick, turns out he was Isaiah in a previous life.

I really hope the exposure of these murders wakes up these people to their tripping on down to destroying their lives.  Got to wonder about the divorce rate among attendees of the PaP and inner AVOW groups.  Bizarre.

The source is claiming that more than one was predicting their spouse would die, it wasn’t just Daybell.  Julie Rowe said the same thing about her husband, now ex husband.   The man who was going after her said it.

Melanie Gibb is much more verbal when she doesn’t realize she is being recorded.  On a phone call with a friend, it comes out it’s her idea for Lori to tell Kay she is sick and so Kay needs to take JJ.  What is strange is she herself has an autistic son (I think he was 15 in 2020) and yet it sounds like she thinks LVD is going to have to force Kay to take him and she so gets why LVD wants to dump him on someone else.  She also disliked Tylee, I have never heard any real words of sympathy for the children.  I thought maybe she was protecting her own kids by not talking about them, especially in cross examination.  She just says she is somewhat acquainted with autistic kids.  She doesn’t talk about herself as a mother.

If any evidence is needed this is not a faithful LDS group, the rejection of the role of mother by at least these two women in preference to be leaders of adults, to be warriors, to make no room for any child in their future as they talk about it, the total lack of interest in children as individuals….it feels so unfamiliar, even more in a sense than the sci-fi fantasy portals and demons and casting out with powers of fire, etc. because that just feels more like playing dressup while erasing their families from their lives is truly alien.  They replaced their families with their like minded fellows, being daughters and sisters in previous lives.

Edited April 19, 2023 by Calm

[Calm]

She talks about how she is the advocate of Christ and his friend, not how Christ is our advocate. 
 

I couldn’t find any “advocate of Christ” on the Church’s website. Am I just forgetting or has she actually reversed how we talk about our relationship with Christ?  I looked on line and it appears to a phrase that is used by Evangelicals. I am wondering if it is a common phrase. I assume it means the same thing as being a witness for Christ, so not trashing it, it just surprised me.