BYU bans fan for racial slur

[sunstoned]

On 8/27/2022 at 11:09 PM, bsjkki said:

 

The BYU athletic director has spoken out condemning the racist actions, as has the Utah governor.  Has the church made a statement yet? 

[bsjkki]

30 minutes ago, sunstoned said:

The BYU athletic director has spoken out condemning the racist actions, as has the Utah governor.  Has the church made a statement yet? 

Not that I know of. But, I think letting BYU deal with this is the right call. 

[teddyaware]

On 8/27/2022 at 11:32 PM, Okrahomer said:

If you've never attended a volleyball game in the Smith Fieldhouse, you're missing out; but this sort of thing is just so...disappointing. 

The possibility that this is another racial hoax, a-la Jussie Smollett, is now coming to the fore. https://www.dailywire.com/news/video-casts-doubt-on-story-that-fan-shouted-n-word-at-duke-volleyball-player 

[Calm]

14 minutes ago, teddyaware said:

The possibility that this is another racial hoax, a-la Jussie Smollett, is now coming to the fore. https://www.dailywire.com/news/video-casts-doubt-on-story-that-fan-shouted-n-word-at-duke-volleyball-player 

If she is wrong, most likely she is simply mistaken about who it was or what was said. Given all the yelling, that is not that unusual.  Telling where a sound comes from can be difficult at times as well as what is said if there are a lot of different sounds together, especially if one is trying not to pay attention to what is said.  She could also have mistaken playing a game on his phone with recording.  Given her overall reaction afterwards reported in the ESPN link posted earlier and below, I see no reason to assume the worst of her; if she intended a hoax she would have been pushing the drama for all it was worth instead of telling people it has addressed well by those at BYU, etc.  From how she is described by others, she does not seem the kind of person who would see a hoax as useful nor does she seem malicious.

That does not mean there weren’t others who jumped on it and went to extremes, but that was not her responsibility, but theirs.

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/34488855/duke-volleyball-player-rachel-richardson-praises-byu-ad-actions-racial-slur-incident-involving-cougars-fan

[teddyaware]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

If she is wrong, most likely she is simply mistaken about who it was or what was said. Given all the yelling, that is not that unusual.  Telling where a sound comes from can be difficult at times as well as what is said if there are a lot of different sounds together, especially if one is trying not to pay attention to what is said.  She could also have mistaken playing a game on his phone with recording.  Given her overall reaction afterwards reported in the ESPN link posted earlier and below, I see no reason to assume the worst of her; if she intended a hoax she would have been pushing the drama for all it was worth instead of telling people it has addressed well by those at BYU, etc.  From how she is described by others, she does not seem the kind of person who would see a hoax as useful nor does she seem malicious.

That does not mean there weren’t others who jumped on it and went to extremes, but that was not her responsibility, but theirs.

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/34488855/duke-volleyball-player-rachel-richardson-praises-byu-ad-actions-racial-slur-incident-involving-cougars-fan

Here’s an article from the anti-LDS Salt Lake Tribune that casts doubt on the whole thing. It appears the poor guy who was “banned from BYU sports events for life” is innocent. I smell a big fat lawsuit coming. Further, this apparently totally innocent victim of a rush to judgement was the individual who approached the Duke player after the game, mistakenly thinking she was an old friendly acquaintance. He says he was just being friendly, but the alleged Duke victim says he said “you’d better watch your back.” As a consequence of this, I’m now more than 50% convinced the racial slurs never happened. If the Duke player lied about being threatened after the game, why wouldn’t she be lying about the rest of  her story? https://www.sltrib.com/sports/2022/08/30/fan-who-was-banned-by-byu-does/

Edited August 31, 2022 by teddyaware

[Stargazer]

On 8/28/2022 at 4:41 AM, Calm said:

Can the police charge someone for that?  

Maybe in Canada.

Frankly, as much as I hate slurs based on inherent characteristics, I would also hate if this became a chargeable offense. The principle of freedom of speech seems always to be on the precipice for one reason or another. Making unpleasant speech against the law could easily devolve into no speech at all. 1984.

On 8/28/2022 at 4:41 AM, Calm said:

I am glad they permanently booted him, but why wasn’t he kicked out the first time he yelled it?  Seriously, stop the game and get him out before continuing. 

It would be difficult, and might possibly lead to deliberate actions taken to interfere with games, especially if the perpetrator couldn't be identified immediately. Which seems to be the case here.

[gopher]

On 8/29/2022 at 3:08 PM, halconero said:

When non-members of that group, say, a white person who is a gentile, uses the slur, they are usually using it with hostility and to exert their superiority over the non-white person.

Many Jews, Indigenous people, Black people and others will sometimes use slurs that have been used against them in conversation with each other. It's a colloquial way of identifying with the shared history of oppression, trial, or difficulty among the group. It is also way of taking the words of those responsible for oppressing them (the Confederacy and other racist Americans, antisemitic European communities, etc.) and flipping them into a sort of honorific and form of recognition amongst fellow members of the group.

Put another way, a white person using the n-word is using it to exert their superiority or reduce the esteem of a black person. A black person using it with another black person is a way of exerting the commonality of their history and shared experiences as Black Americans. That doesn't make it non-vulgar, nor does it mean that a black person using it is doing some without some level of casualness. It just comes from a different place.

True, but I'm not certain many of the younger white generation feel that way.  One example - I once overheard a group of white high schoolers using the n-word with each other.  I strongly encouraged them to reconsider using that word even when using it among themselves.  They assured me that it was common in their school with the white kids who use it as an expression of friendship with each other.  I did ask if they use it with their black friends, which they denied.   In the US, I don't think any slur can get a white person in more trouble than using the n-word - you can lose your job (see the female Cincinnati cop this week) or even lose your pizza company like Papa John.  So it's kinda stupid as well as wrong and offensive.  There's also the story from a few years ago at a Kendrick Lamar concert where he invited a white girl from the crowd on stage to sing along to one of his songs which included the n-word.  So she sang the song - the crowd booed and he stopped to tell her she couldn't say that word.  A word he included in his song.  It's a weird world.

Unless we find out the fan is a white supremist with a deep hatred of blacks, it's also possible he intended to rattle the Duke team by using the offensive slur.  I guess it may have worked since BYU won.  But it doesn't help the reputation of Utah being a racist place for sports.  The Utah Jazz fans have a bad reputation for being racist towards black players on opposing teams.  So I would hope that others in the crowd would step in to stop it.

It's also sad since BYU was once on the other side of bad behavior by opposing fans

 

[Stargazer]

On 8/28/2022 at 4:53 PM, The Nehor said:

And a false flag insinuation.

Are you denying the possibility?

A false flag operation is an act committed with the intent of disguising the actual source of responsibility and pinning blame on another party. Who perpetrated this slur incident? It is said that it wasn't a BYU student. Was he a member of the church? I don't know. But regardless, it was a BYU event, and anything untoward that happens during the event at least potentially reflects on BYU, and through BYU, on the church. 

It is not impossible that the perp was either a member or a non-member who intended to act to cast BYU and the church in a bad light. This doesn't even require the perp to be a racist to achieve the goal of making the church look bad. On the other hand, the perp could be just a racist with a mouth-control problem.

Apparently, the player and her father are saying that BYU didn't act fast enough during the incident. I gather that they felt the perp was easily identifiable, and BYU officials didn't jump quickly enough. 

[Stargazer]

On 8/29/2022 at 5:09 AM, JustAnAustralian said:

He did slightly censor it

In my previous post that's the word I wanted to use. I considered using the German word instead, but thought it was too close to the English for proper decorum. So I used "perp" instead.

[Stargazer]

On 8/29/2022 at 8:08 PM, halconero said:

Many Jews, Indigenous people, Black people and others will sometimes use slurs that have been used against them in conversation with each other. It's a colloquial way of identifying with the shared history of oppression, trial, or difficulty among the group. It is also way of taking the words of those responsible for oppressing them (the Confederacy and other racist Americans, antisemitic European communities, etc.) and flipping them into a sort of honorific and form of recognition amongst fellow members of the group.

That's understandable. My background is mainly European, but with a small bit of Native American. I can perhaps imagine a couple of my cousins getting together and one saying to the other in disagreement, "Look here, featherhead, you don't know what you're talking about!" That particular slur I had never heard before, but I just now found it on an interesting website called The Racial Slur Database. I won't link to it, as some sensitive soul might find that insensitive (though the RSDB has slurs for everyone, including whites and Mormons). Google it if you want.

Now, I hope that Nemesis doesn't come along and suspend or ban me for the "featherhead" slur. As I mentioned, I am a member of the group referred to by the slur, so I should have a "get out of jail free" card just like the one Dave Chapelle has for the N-word. One interesting slur I found on the RSDB that would apply well to me is "pretendian" -- because I'm only 1/16th Native American. Some tribes won't acknowledge someone as a member with that small of a degree of blood, but my tribe is so starved for members that if you can truthfully claim descent from an acknowledged member of the tribe, you're "in." The Gold Rush and European diseases cleaned us out. Though ironically, that's how my great grandfather, John Adams Clark, made his living, as a very successful prospector and miner.

 

Edited August 31, 2022 by Stargazer
corrected a spelling error

[rodheadlee]

Up on further review these may be false allegations. I won't bother posting a link because it's Fox News and you all won't believe it anyways.

[teddyaware]

57 minutes ago, rodheadlee said:

Up on further review these may be false allegations. I won't bother posting a link because it's Fox News and you all won't believe it anyways.

In a strange irony, the usually anti-LDS Salt Lake Tribune is casting doubt on the Duke racial slur story as well. I would assume the “enlightened” progressives on this board find the anti-Mormons at the Salt Lake Tribune to be a more reliable source of information than Fox News? For them it’s important to at least make a bow courteous respect before the smirking “intellectual” enemies of the Church who stand at the windows of the great and spacious building.

[gopher]

There's some speculation that the fan or fans may have been yelling "netter" during the volleyball serve in an attempt to cause the opposing player to hit the ball into the net.  I guess that could sound like the n-word in a crowded setting.  Plus people in Utah talk funny so it could be easily mistaken by someone from the East Coast (I'm a few hours from Duke, but I can speak Utahn somewhat fluently)

[provoman]

The Slat Lake Tribune has published an article that the police report does not support the claims made by the players.

 

Also, I really cannot believe that the players heard the slur, but zero BYU fans reported - I grew up near a town with a “sunset sign”, and people from that town/area who went to BYU would not be tolerant of racial slurs.

So I find it hard to accept it happened as reported, due to no BYU student has spoke up.

 

Edited August 31, 2022 by provoman

[Stargazer]

11 minutes ago, provoman said:

The Slat Lake Tribune has published an article that the police report does not support the claims made by the players.

 

Also, I really cannot believe that the players heard the slur, but zero BYU fans reported - I grew up near a town with a “sunset sign”, and people from that town/area who went to BYU would not be tolerant of racial slurs.

So I find it hard to accept that no BYU student has spoke up.

 

What is a "sunset sign"?

[Okrahomer]

It may be worthwhile to think about what role the sheer volume of spectators and noise played in all of this.  Compare average attendance at BYU women's home volleyball matches v. Duke women's home volleyball matches in 2019:

In 2019, BYU attendance at Smith Fieldhouse, capacity 5,000+ = 2,718, so on average more than 50%

In 2019, Duke attendance at Cameron Indoor, capacity 9,314 = unknown because they did not make the top 50 list; however, it's probably less than 780 (based on the average for the ACC conference), so on average less than 10%

If I'm used to playing in front of an audience of less than 1,000 in a space that holds more than 9,000; and suddenly I'm playing in front 5,500 in a space that officially accommodates just over 5,000 -- I would probably feel intimidated even before the match started.  I don't think it would take much in the way of heckling to really get to me. 

It seems the university is having difficulty identifying the person(s) who engaged in the racist taunting.  I am sure the sheer volume of noise and size of the crowd makes it difficult.  Maybe the Duke athletes "thought" they heard racist words, when none were actually uttered?  I don't know.  Since multiple Duke athletes have reported hearing it, it seems unlikely.  Whatever the truth is, I am fairly certain BYU and we (as a people and culture) still have work to do to internalize the Prophet:  "God does not love one race above another."

[ksfisher]

42 minutes ago, gopher said:

people in Utah talk funny

Yup, we're just a barrel of laughs.

Actually, it's the rest of the world that talks funny.

[teddyaware]

Her’s another article that casts doubt on the story… If it turns out this is another concocted Jussie Smollett type hoax, made instantly viral by the gullibility of the eager to believe woke mob, I wonder if the accuser will follow Smollet’s example and continue to insist it happened.  https://townhall.com/tipsheet/juliorosas/2022/08/31/surprise-another-racist-incident-turned-out-to-be-fake-n2612463

Edited August 31, 2022 by teddyaware

[bsjkki]

45 minutes ago, gopher said:

There's some speculation that the fan or fans may have been yelling "netter" during the volleyball serve in an attempt to cause the opposing player to hit the ball into the net.  I guess that could sound like the n-word in a crowded setting.  Plus people in Utah talk funny so it could be easily mistaken by someone from the East Coast (I'm a few hours from Duke, but I can speak Utahn somewhat fluently)

I think a mishearing of what was being said is the most likely explanation. Too bad the BYU student body  has been slandered far and wide on social media and in the press. 
 

 

 

[provoman]

1 hour ago, Stargazer said:

What is a "sunset sign"?

*racial slur, Don’t let the sunset on you in this town

[Stargazer]

Just now, provoman said:

*racial slur, Don’t let the sunset on you in this town

Ah, ha! Learn something new every day.

[Okrahomer]

1 hour ago, gopher said:

There's some speculation that the fan or fans may have been yelling "netter" during the volleyball serve in an attempt to cause the opposing player to hit the ball into the net.  I guess that could sound like the n-word in a crowded setting.  Plus people in Utah talk funny so it could be easily mistaken by someone from the East Coast (I'm a few hours from Duke, but I can speak Utahn somewhat fluently)

This makes a lot of sense.

[provoman]

1 hour ago, ksfisher said:

Yup, we're just a barrel of laughs.

Actually, it's the rest of the world that talks funny.

Won’erful = wonderful

Moa’ens   = Mountains

Crick        = Creek

ruuf         = roof

 

Though I did visit deep woods Louisiana, and a gal (singular no one else) said to me “You talk funny” I replied “Y’all tawlk funny”

Edited August 31, 2022 by provoman

[HappyJackWagon]

2 hours ago, teddyaware said:

In a strange irony, the usually anti-LDS Salt Lake Tribune is casting doubt on the Duke racial slur story as well. I would assume the “enlightened” progressives on this board find the anti-Mormons at the Salt Lake Tribune to be a more reliable source of information than Fox News? For them it’s important to at least make a bow courteous respect before the smirking “intellectual” enemies of the Church who stand at the windows of the great and spacious building.

Your words drip with bitterness and disdain. Wasn't it Pres. Hinkley who said, "Don't be gloomy"? You should look into that.

Having said that, the story seems to continue developing and it appears the police have reviewed surveillance cameras and can't find any evidence of the racial slurs being yelled by this guy. Black volleyball player went viral after claiming fan pelted her with racial slurs – but surveillance video shows otherwise: report (msn.com)

 

[ksfisher]

51 minutes ago, provoman said:

Won’erful = wonderful

Moa’ens   = Mountains

Crick        = Creek

ruuf         = roof

 

Though I did visit deep woods Louisiana, and a gal (singular no one else) said to me “You talk funny” I replied “Y’all tawlk funny”

There are all kinds of variations across the west.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_American_English