BYU bans fan for racial slur

[bluebell]

32 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

You can’t assault anyone. You would be arrested. This ‘speech’ is not protected at a event like this. You can be asked to stop/leave or get banned. If you refuse to comply, the person can get arrested. It’s a privately owned venue. 

I'm talking about someone who had no connection to the private venue.  Just another person who was attending, do they have the right to stop someone from saying something they don't like?  

[bsjkki]

29 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I'm talking about someone who had no connection to the private venue.  Just another person who was attending, do they have the right to stop someone from saying something they don't like?  

Not physically but they can record or tell them to shut up or report it. I think asking them to stop and then reporting it would be the best thing to do as a fellow spectator. Shout them down with others? 
 

I don’t think a fist fight would be a great way to handle it. Get security.

[Tacenda]

Here's a post by Sistas in Zion, I wonder if she has a point.

A fan walks into a BYU, hosted volleyball tournament, sits in the student section, and each time some of the players serve the ball that fan yells, “Give women the priesthood!” Or “Polygamy should have never happened!” Or, “The priesthood ban was not of God!” Or “LGBTQIA+ people are not honor code violations!” How long does that go on before action is taken by BYU officials?

As the saying goes, historic behavior is the best predictor of future behavior. I personally have seen folks escorted out of the church’s conference center for yelling, “I object.” I also saw a person tackled, pinned down, and then forcibly removed for cheering, “It’s about time!” and similar comments regarding addressing the racial history of the church, prior to the event even starting while folks were still milling around, chatting, and finding seats. I have seen folks escorted off of BYU’s campus for asking students questions about social matters. These experiences lead me to believe that our hypothetical volleyball fan wouldn’t make it very long before being stopped.

So why then did Black Duke Volleyball players have to endure an entire game of racial harassment without anybody taking action? Not BYU, not their own university, not NCAA officials, not other students, not other adults.

No.

Body.

Why can The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, it's institutions, and it’s members act so swiftly when they are the target of the comments or the jeers, but not when a child of God is being called a nigger in their house? How does that go on an entire match?

In 2018 our church announced it’s relationship with the NAACP, we’ve got photo ops, church news articles, tours of welfare square, speeches, and monetary donations. What I want to know is, what is the impact? What is our church learning from the NAACP if despite our relationship this is what continues to happen? If it’s not a general leader of the church giving racist firesides, it’s a Black person being released as a temple worker for having locs, if it’s not that it’s racist dogma showing up in brand new church manuals, if it ain’t that it’s students having to create whole TikTok accounts just to mentally and emotionally survive having the audacity to be Black at BYU, and if that ain’t the thing it’s folks getting called a whole nigger in 2022, while everybody else gazes at their shoes and cringes.

Nobody wants to unpack WHY racism keeps showing up in Latter-day spaces despite all that diverse stock photography on our church website, despite giving money to the NAACP to fight racism in the world while we over here with racism in our wards. We can continue to purchase the optics of being good, but it will never buy us the impact of becoming better. It’s like we don’t want the work we just want the glory, but that’s not how true change is brought to pass. We cannot spend more time and money as a church trying to not be CALLED racist than we do becoming ANTIRACIST. The opposite of racist isn’t “not racist”, the opposite of racist is “antiracist.” So, we don’t have to be a racist church to be inviting to racists or foster racism, we do that if we refuse to be an antiracist church. Which is work, acknowledgment, action, repentance, and restoration. Listen, if we don’t start “rooting out racism” like the prophet called us to do then the racism in our roots will continue to be our reality.

Your sister in the Gospel,

Zandra

 

Me: 

I'm wondering what my son will post on FB about this, his girl friend is Black, it won't be faith promoting I know that. I noticed Zandra, the author of the FB post capitalized "black", so I will as well. 

Edited August 30, 2022 by Tacenda

[bsjkki]

 

[bluebell]

11 hours ago, bsjkki said:

Not physically but they can record or tell them to shut up or report it. I think asking them to stop and then reporting it would be the best thing to do as a fellow spectator. Shout them down with others? 
 

I don’t think a fist fight would be a great way to handle it. Get security.

Agreed.

I wasn’t sure what Gov. Cox was advocating in that tweet when he said that we needed to create an atmosphere where racists never feel comfortable. 

[bluebell]

10 hours ago, Tacenda said:

Here's a post by Sistas in Zion, I wonder if she has a point.

A fan walks into a BYU, hosted volleyball tournament, sits in the student section, and each time some of the players serve the ball that fan yells, “Give women the priesthood!” Or “Polygamy should have never happened!” Or, “The priesthood ban was not of God!” Or “LGBTQIA+ people are not honor code violations!” How long does that go on before action is taken by BYU officials?

As the saying goes, historic behavior is the best predictor of future behavior. I personally have seen folks escorted out of the church’s conference center for yelling, “I object.” I also saw a person tackled, pinned down, and then forcibly removed for cheering, “It’s about time!” and similar comments regarding addressing the racial history of the church, prior to the event even starting while folks were still milling around, chatting, and finding seats. I have seen folks escorted off of BYU’s campus for asking students questions about social matters. These experiences lead me to believe that our hypothetical volleyball fan wouldn’t make it very long before being stopped.

So why then did Black Duke Volleyball players have to endure an entire game of racial harassment without anybody taking action? Not BYU, not their own university, not NCAA officials, not other students, not other adults.

No.

Body.

Why can The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, it's institutions, and it’s members act so swiftly when they are the target of the comments or the jeers, but not when a child of God is being called a nigger in their house? How does that go on an entire match?

In 2018 our church announced it’s relationship with the NAACP, we’ve got photo ops, church news articles, tours of welfare square, speeches, and monetary donations. What I want to know is, what is the impact? What is our church learning from the NAACP if despite our relationship this is what continues to happen? If it’s not a general leader of the church giving racist firesides, it’s a Black person being released as a temple worker for having locs, if it’s not that it’s racist dogma showing up in brand new church manuals, if it ain’t that it’s students having to create whole TikTok accounts just to mentally and emotionally survive having the audacity to be Black at BYU, and if that ain’t the thing it’s folks getting called a whole nigger in 2022, while everybody else gazes at their shoes and cringes.

Nobody wants to unpack WHY racism keeps showing up in Latter-day spaces despite all that diverse stock photography on our church website, despite giving money to the NAACP to fight racism in the world while we over here with racism in our wards. We can continue to purchase the optics of being good, but it will never buy us the impact of becoming better. It’s like we don’t want the work we just want the glory, but that’s not how true change is brought to pass. We cannot spend more time and money as a church trying to not be CALLED racist than we do becoming ANTIRACIST. The opposite of racist isn’t “not racist”, the opposite of racist is “antiracist.” So, we don’t have to be a racist church to be inviting to racists or foster racism, we do that if we refuse to be an antiracist church. Which is work, acknowledgment, action, repentance, and restoration. Listen, if we don’t start “rooting out racism” like the prophet called us to do then the racism in our roots will continue to be our reality.

Your sister in the Gospel,

Zandra

 

Me: 

I'm wondering what my son will post on FB about this, his girl friend is Black, it won't be faith promoting I know that. I noticed Zandra, the author of the FB post capitalized "black", so I will as well. 

Her thoughts are valid. 

[bluebell]

9 hours ago, bsjkki said:

 

I wonder if the death threats are from those who are mad she’s supportive of a black student or from those mad she’s not doing enough to support the student?

In this day and age either is very possible.

[bsjkki]

1 hour ago, bluebell said:

I wonder if the death threats are from those who are mad she’s supportive of a black student or from those mad she’s not doing enough to support the student?

In this day and age either is very possible.

It's the latter. The amount of hate filled posts against BYU and the entire student body is vitriolic and also against all 'Mormons' due to this incident. I don't suggest reading through this topic on twitter. They are painting with a very broad brush, and this is an opportunity for many to criticize and hate on the church. No matter the steps BYU is taking and the apologies given, it is not enough or good enough. The church and all BYU students are racist and awful (according to many posts I won't link to.) So, it's all very unfortunate. 

[bsjkki]

1 hour ago, bluebell said:

Her thoughts are valid. 

Did any officials hear the taunts? From what I understand as soon as they heard about what was happening, they were desperately trying to find out who was doing it and to eject them. It's hard to react to something that the coaches and officials are not hearing. They were trying to identify the person from video but it is not heard on the video. 

 

[bluebell]

8 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

Did any officials hear the taunts? From what I understand as soon as they heard about what was happening, they were desperately trying to find out who was doing it and to eject them. It's hard to react to something that the coaches and officials are not hearing. They were trying to identify the person from video but it is not heard on the video. 

 

I think her point is that if the volleyball player on that team was hearing them, then other people around the person yelling was hearing them too.  Did those people make any officials aware when it first happened? 

If no, then that's a problem.  If yes but the officials still couldn't figure out what to do when someone was standing in front of them pointing out a specific person yelling racial slurs, then that's also a problem.

It seems like, the only way that person could have gotten away with it for as long as they did, is if the people around them did nothing.

[bluebell]

16 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

It's the latter. The amount of hate filled posts against BYU and the entire student body is vitriolic and also against all 'Mormons' due to this incident. I don't suggest reading through this topic on twitter. They are painting with a very broad brush, and this is an opportunity for many to criticize and hate on the church. No matter the steps BYU is taking and the apologies given, it is not enough or good enough. The church and all BYU students are racist and awful (according to many posts I won't link to.) So, it's all very unfortunate. 

People love an easy target that will cost them nothing socially to malign.  

[bsjkki]

10 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I think her point is that if the volleyball player on that team was hearing them, then other people around the person yelling was hearing them too.  Did those people make any officials aware when it first happened? 

If no, then that's a problem.  If yes but the officials still couldn't figure out what to do when someone was standing in front of them pointing out a specific person yelling racial slurs, then that's also a problem.

It seems like, the only way that person could have gotten away with it for as long as they did, is if the people around them did nothing.

But so far we have no evidence that anyone besides the player(s) heard them. The officials, line refs, coaches. The refs are all from the NCAA and there is a line judge right there. Did he hear anything?  I read a report they interviewed 100 students that heard nothing. Are they all lying? It wasn't until after the game the Duke players could point to anyone because the ejected person approached the team. So, it would be nice to get a good timeline of the time of the report, what actions were immediately taken, what the investigation has discovered. This should never happen to any player anywhere. 

[bluebell]

3 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

But so far we have no evidence that anyone besides the player(s) heard them. The officials, line refs, coaches. The refs are all from the NCAA and there is a line judge right there. Did he hear anything?  I read a report they interviewed 100 students that heard nothing. Are they all lying? It wasn't until after the game the Duke players could point to anyone because the ejected person approached the team. So, it would be nice to get a good timeline of the time of the report, what actions were immediately taken, what the investigation has discovered. This should never happen to any player anywhere. 

It does seem weird that all of the players heard it, but no one else.  I'm not sure how that is even possible.

[Tacenda]

3 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

But so far we have no evidence that anyone besides the player(s) heard them. The officials, line refs, coaches. The refs are all from the NCAA and there is a line judge right there. Did he hear anything?  I read a report they interviewed 100 students that heard nothing. Are they all lying? It wasn't until after the game the Duke players could point to anyone because the ejected person approached the team. So, it would be nice to get a good timeline of the time of the report, what actions were immediately taken, what the investigation has discovered. This should never happen to any player anywhere. 

I'm not sure if this helps, but maybe:

https://www.deseret.com/2022/8/29/23327055/espn-first-take-addresses-racial-incident-byu-volleyball?utm_campaign=kelsey_dallas&utm_content=chorus&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&fbclid=IwAR2CgkC7o45gW32DtRcP0Um3eYja2JDKtN2dh0X8IPHABjRo

[bsjkki]

12 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I'm not sure if this helps, but maybe:

https://www.deseret.com/2022/8/29/23327055/espn-first-take-addresses-racial-incident-byu-volleyball?utm_campaign=kelsey_dallas&utm_content=chorus&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&fbclid=IwAR2CgkC7o45gW32DtRcP0Um3eYja2JDKtN2dh0X8IPHABjRo

This did not help. The twitter mob definitely felt his efforts were not enough. 

[bsjkki]

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/story/_/id/34488855/duke-volleyball-player-rachel-richardson-praises-byu-ad-actions-racial-slur-incident-involving-cougars-fan

[Calm]

The variety of stories of what happened is frustrating.

[bsjkki]

15 minutes ago, Calm said:

The variety of stories of what happened is frustrating.

The original post by the godmother has some inaccuracies which fueled the initial articles on this. 

[Calm]

But BYU said one fan, but Richardson implies it was more than one when she talked about the whole student section having a different sense.  

[bsjkki]

7 minutes ago, Calm said:

But BYU said one fan, but Richardson implies it was more than one when she talked about the whole student section having a different sense.  

I’ve watched the video. You can’t hear it but that doesn’t mean it didn’t happen. She says they didn’t react fast enough. 
 

I think the only thing more that could be done is to stop the game immediately and lecture the crowd. BYU increased security and could not identify who did it and Duke players didn’t identify anyone until after the game and based identification on the voice. No officials heard it at the time.  The line judge should have been able to hear but maybe was so focused on his job…he could easily be used to tuning out crowd noise.

[Calm]

So other Duke players are reporting they heard it?  Good, I hope that puts to rest most claims it is a hoax by her.  I say most because I have no doubt some wanting to believe the worst of her will claim that other Duke players are lying just to back her up.  I think if she was the type to lie about it she would have made a much bigger drama of it, though I am not intending to imply that if she had made a big drama of it, that suggests she lied.  Such behaviour is uncalled for these days and anyone subjected to such treatment has a right and sometimes an obligation to make a big deal of it.

[bsjkki]

54 minutes ago, Calm said:

But BYU said one fan, but Richardson implies it was more than one when she talked about the whole student section having a different sense.  

There was only one fan identified...it seems he approached the team after the game which is against the rules and that is when they identified his voice. He was banned. No one else has been identified. The video is not helpful.

[Calm]

1 hour ago, bsjkki said:

There was only one fan identified...it seems he approached the team after the game which is against the rules and that is when they identified his voice. He was banned. No one else has been identified. The video is not helpful.

So it is agreed there was more than one fan calling out slurs?

nevermind, for some reason this didn’t register for me:

”To say we are extremely disheartened in the actions of a small number of fans in last night’s volleyball match in the Smith Fieldhouse between BYU and Duke is not strong enough language…”

Edited August 30, 2022 by Calm

[bsjkki]

The fan banned by BYU does not appear to have yelled slurs, campus police say (sltrib.com)

[bsjkki]