TheTanakas Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 I was reading the following in the Bible today as part of my devotional. Gen 3:16 - Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee". What was the marriage relationship like between Adam and Eve before it changed in the Fall? I couldn't find anything relevant in this Old Testament Study manual. Pete 1
CV75 Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 19 minutes ago, TheTanakas said: I was reading the following in the Bible today as part of my devotional. Gen 3:16 - Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee". What was the marriage relationship like between Adam and Eve before it changed in the Fall? I couldn't find anything relevant in this Old Testament Study manual. Pete The marriage relationship did not change. The dictum in Genesis 3:16 only confirms that it shall continue despite the life-altering events of the Fall. The previous Chapter (section 2-10 onward) is very instructive about the eternal nature of marriage.
Robert F. Smith Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 45 minutes ago, TheTanakas said: ................................ What was the marriage relationship like between Adam and Eve before it changed in the Fall? I couldn't find anything relevant in this Old Testament Study manual............ I'd speculate that the two of them were like innocent children, not at all conscious of good and evil, and had certainly not consummated their marriage. 3
Teancum Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 47 minutes ago, TheTanakas said: I was reading the following in the Bible today as part of my devotional. Gen 3:16 - Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee". What was the marriage relationship like between Adam and Eve before it changed in the Fall? I couldn't find anything relevant in this Old Testament Study manual. Pete Was just thinking how sad that so much misogeney and poor treatment of women has been a result of one small verse about two fictional characters. 1
Tacenda Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, TheTanakas said: I was reading the following in the Bible today as part of my devotional. Gen 3:16 - Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee". What was the marriage relationship like between Adam and Eve before it changed in the Fall? I couldn't find anything relevant in this Old Testament Study manual. Pete Another place in the Bible that I believe is man-made and is the start of many women being abused. Edited April 23, 2021 by Tacenda
JLHPROF Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Tacenda said: Another place in the bibile that I believe is man-made and is the start of many women being abused. Yeah...shame on that Moses for writing such a thing. He should have known man would abuse scripture for their own selfish acts. Edited April 23, 2021 by JLHPROF 2
Tacenda Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 10 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: Yeah...shame on that Moses for writing such a thing. He should have known man would abuse scripture for their own selfish acts. We don't know how it was transcribed. Or if the translation process could have been mistranslated. My God wouldn't do this to a woman.
JLHPROF Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 3 minutes ago, Tacenda said: My God wouldn't do this to a woman. See my signature.
Tacenda Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 1 minute ago, JLHPROF said: See my signature. My bad! But it helps me deal.
california boy Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 I think Eve was just his sidekick. Just ribbing you a little. 4
The Nehor Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 1 hour ago, TheTanakas said: What was the marriage relationship like between Adam and Eve before it changed in the Fall? 2
Teancum Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 51 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: Yeah...shame on that Moses for writing such a thing. He should have known man would abuse scripture for their own selfish acts. Moses did not write it. Moses is likely another fictional character. But I always did like the Ten Commandments with Charlton Heston. 1
CV75 Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, JLHPROF said: Yeah...shame on that Moses for writing such a thing. He should have known man would abuse scripture for their own selfish acts. Abuse is a good word for it, I think. "and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee" Adam did preside on a covenant level after the Fall, in which they blessed the name God and served Him together (Moses 5:5-12; 6:51-68 -- where Adam is more proactive) but also before (e.g. 3:19-20). As it was not good for man to be alone and so the helpmeet was provided by a power and authority outside his own (Genesis 2:18), neither was it good for woman to enter paradise without it having been prepared, through delegation, by that same power and authority, in other words, without someone that would cleave to her with added value. Edited April 23, 2021 by CV75 1
2BizE Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 3 hours ago, Teancum said: Was just thinking how sad that so much misogeney and poor treatment of women has been a result of one small verse about two fictional characters. I agree with this. Adam and Eve were not real people and are only symbolic.
JLHPROF Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 9 minutes ago, 2BizE said: I agree with this. Adam and Eve were not real people and are only symbolic. I disagree as should most believing Mormons. Several prophets have actually seen Father Adam. Of course, if you don't believe then you can consider anything symbolic. 2
CV75 Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 46 minutes ago, 2BizE said: I agree with this. Adam and Eve were not real people and are only symbolic. Whether figurative/symbolic or literal/actual, the underlying spiritual principles and the reality of the covenant application and relationship are the same. 2
Teancum Posted April 23, 2021 Posted April 23, 2021 (edited) On 4/23/2021 at 3:41 PM, JLHPROF said: I disagree as should most believing Mormons. Several prophets have actually seen Father Adam. Of course, if you don't believe then you can consider anything symbolic. Several prophets have CLAIMED to see Adam and Eve. That though is not evidence. No way all humans come from two people who lived 6000 years ago let alone the Noah and the flood problem. Edited April 24, 2021 by Teancum 1
CV75 Posted April 24, 2021 Posted April 24, 2021 3 hours ago, Teancum said: Several prophets have CLAIMED to see Adam and Eve. That though is not evidence. Now way all humans come from two people who lived 6000 years ago let alone the Noah and the flood problem. So what would you say are the spiritual principles to be gained by the scriptural account?
JLHPROF Posted April 24, 2021 Posted April 24, 2021 4 hours ago, Teancum said: Several prophets have CLAIMED to see Adam and Eve. That though is not evidence. Now way all humans come from two people who lived 6000 years ago let alone the Noah and the flood problem. God just isn't capable of allowing that I guess.
Teancum Posted April 24, 2021 Posted April 24, 2021 18 hours ago, JLHPROF said: God just isn't capable of allowing that I guess. Well if he is there is no evidence whatsoever to support it and a ton that refutes it.
Teancum Posted April 24, 2021 Posted April 24, 2021 18 hours ago, CV75 said: So what would you say are the spiritual principles to be gained by the scriptural account? Not sure what you are looking for? I know what the doctrine, both in traditional Christianity for the LDS Church, teaches about Adam and Eve and the fall. I know what teachings and principles come for it. I guess the main question is are they beneficial to human beings well being.
strappinglad Posted April 25, 2021 Posted April 25, 2021 (edited) Then there is the idea that Adam and Eve were a couple long before the Garden. Oh, and that story about Lilith etc. Edited April 25, 2021 by strappinglad
Calm Posted April 25, 2021 Posted April 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, strappinglad said: Then there is the idea that Adam and Eve were a couple long before the Garden. Oh, and that story about Judith etc. Do you mean Lilith? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilith Judith is quite a bit later than Adam and Eve. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Judith
strappinglad Posted April 25, 2021 Posted April 25, 2021 33 minutes ago, Calm said: Do you mean Lilith? I stand corrected. I knew there was a " th " in there somewhere!
mfbukowski Posted April 27, 2021 Posted April 27, 2021 On 4/23/2021 at 9:28 AM, Teancum said: Was just thinking how sad that so much misogeney and poor treatment of women has been a result of one small verse about two fictional characters. Even taking your apparent perspective, that is a pretty naive view. It would not be in there if it were not already in the culture. So you think women's equalty was in complete perfection until that verse was "published" to the few that could read it? I would disagree, even taking your perspective
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