What does our Father expect from us?

[Ahab]

I have a belief which I would like to use as a premise for a discussion.  I will now state this belief and try to describe what I am talking about and then ask for your comments and ideas about it.

I believe our Father in heaven desires to bless all of us with everything he can give us that is good for us but rather than giving everyone every good thing autocratically he wants us to show him by our actions when we want something from him. And when we do that, if we do, our Father then provides or grants that blessing if it is something good that he can give us.  The blessing or gift being something that isn’t contingent on everyone receiving it before one person can receive it, and the act that our Father requires from the person requesting the gift being something he or she can do to show their desire to receive that gift from him.

I should maybe also point out that I realize we can do some things for ourselves to the extent that we have the ability to do something all on our own, but I tend to give our Father the credit for all kinds of good things which, it seems to me, most people take for granted.  Like where we live, which for now is on this planet, which has all of the good things we have here to enjoy and make use of.

Anyway, so, now, how can we test this belief I have? What good blessing would someone like to receive from our Father in heaven, and what is it that you would need to do to receive it? 

I'll start with something easy, like some revelation of information. What is it that you would like to know from our Father and what do you need to do to know it?  I’m thinking simply asking our Father for information on an issue would be something we would need to do to show him we want some information from him.  But is just asking enough?  Is there anything else we would need to do to receive information from our Father in heaven other than to ask him about it?

Or how about being resurrected with celestial glory, for anyone who might like to receive that blessing?  What is it that we need to do to receive that, if we desire it?  Other than dropping dead, of course, since before we are resurrected, we would need to be dead first.  But what else would we need to do to receive that blessing? Accepting celestial ideas and living celestial laws is something we would need to do, I think.  Anything else we need to do to receive this particular blessing?

What other blessings can our Father give and what is our part for what we must do to receive them?  And how might we find out about all of the blessings we can possibly receive from him?  If we can imagine it and think it is good does that mean it is something our Father is willing to give us?  How are we supposed to know what we need to do to receive any blessing from him?  I’m fairly certain we must do something to show him which blessings we want to receive.  And I'm also fairly certain he desires to give us every good thing he can give us.

I now invite some comments and would like to see some discussions about this.

Is grammar important?  Any particular words we need to use? 

Any limitations to the blessings we can receive from our Father in heaven?

Do we need to come to any consensus on anything or about anything before we can get something from our Father in heaven?  If a blessing we desire involves other people, other than our Father in heave, I can see how we would need their consent and participation in order to receive that blessing, but I don’t think so if it is just between us, individually, and our Father in heaven.  I believe we just need to know what we need to do to receive particular blessings.

Does it make any difference if some of our brothers or sisters do not agree with what we think or believe?  Or if others don’t like or want what we want from our Father in heaven? Or if some people think we are creepy or patriarchy or just not very much like how they think we should be?  Does any of that make any difference to what we can receive from our Father in heaven?

From your own experiences of receiving blessings from our Father, what insights can you share?  Do you feel other people have limited you or somehow prevented you from receiving some blessings from our Father in heaven?  Or maybe just slowed you down some by giving you some false information which you needed to sift through before being able to access some blessing(s) from our Father in heaven?

If you believe our Father in heaven desires to bless everyone with every good thing and that basically all we need to do is show our Father in heaven that we desire to receive a blessing from him, can you imagine anything anyone could possibly do to stop or prevent you from receiving that blessing from our Father in heaven?  Or anything that would stop or prevent him from giving it to you if you showed him how much you wanted to receive that blessing from him?

[ksfisher]

4 minutes ago, Ahab said:

If you believe our Father in heaven desires to bless everyone with every good thing and that basically all we need to do is show our Father in heaven that we desire to receive a blessing from him, can you imagine anything anyone could possibly do to stop or prevent you from receiving that blessing from our Father in heaven?  Or anything that would stop or prevent him from giving it to you if you showed him how much you wanted to receive that blessing from him?

20 There is a ^alaw, irrevocably decreed in ^bheaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all ^cblessings are predicated—

21 And when we obtain any ^ablessing from God, it is by ^bobedience to that law upon which it is predicated.

(D&C 130)

Obedience is the key to obtaining blessings.

[bluebell]

6 minutes ago, Ahab said:

 

From your own experiences of receiving blessings from our Father, what insights can you share?  Do you feel other people have limited you or somehow prevented you from receiving some blessings from our Father in heaven?  Or maybe just slowed you down some by giving you some false information which you needed to sift through before being able to access some blessing(s) from our Father in heaven?

 

I have learned that blessings don't always look like blessings, sometimes they look like a trial or a loss.  Some blessings are painful.  But no, I don't really think that anyone has prevented me from receiving any blessing that God was willing to grant, and which I was will to receive.  

[Ahab]

2 minutes ago, ksfisher said:

20 There is a ^alaw, irrevocably decreed in ^bheaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all ^cblessings are predicated—

21 And when we obtain any ^ablessing from God, it is by ^bobedience to that law upon which it is predicated.

(D&C 130)

Obedience is the key to obtaining blessings.

I understand that, so the question is: What do we need to do to receive a particular blessing from him?  

I also understand that asking him for ideas can be helpful, to help us know what we need to do to receive something from him.

Anything else?  And how are we to know about all of the blessings he is willing to give us?  I don't know of a master list anywhere.  Are we just supposed to ask him about that too?

I have asked him and I am willing to continue to ask him as I continue to talk with him about things but I was wondering if maybe I might pick up some ideas from some people on this board.

[MustardSeed]

It is my opinion that good things and bad things simply occur, and that we are to be thankful to God for all things but that he rarely if ever interjects.  

Obedience will bring about reward in the hereafter.  Imo. 

I

[Ahab]

6 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I have learned that blessings don't always look like blessings, sometimes they look like a trial or a loss.  Some blessings are painful.  But no, I don't really think that anyone has prevented me from receiving any blessing that God was willing to grant, and which I was will to receive.  

I can see how some people slow some other people down though when it comes to knowing about some blessing that are available from our Father in heaven. When people don't know about some blessings that are available they can't share any information about them because they don't know about them, or they don't believe they are available.  My parents never told me about the Church, even though they were trying to be good Christians in their church where my Dad was the minister, so they didn't help me to know about a lot of things that are available from our Father.  Which meant I had to find out from somebody else.  So in that sense I believe they did prevent me, although not permanently.  And even when I found about the Church and many of the blessings available from our Father through the work of the Church my parents tried to dissuade me told me that I shouldn't believe what I had learned and was still learning.

So just as there are people who can help us to know about blessings that are available from our Father in heaven, there are also people who can slow us down and even prevent us, to some extent, from accepting many of the blessings our Father desires to give us.

My focus in this thread is to try to find more that is or might be available from our Father in heaven.

[longview]

I consider mortality, the fallen nature of this world and of our bodies, all the rigors, challenges, griefs, etc, to be GIFTS to each and every one of us.  We are gaining insights, perspectives, experiences, development of talents, a more profound kind of maturity that we as spirit children in the pre-existence would have had a difficult time understanding or fully appreciating.  I read somewhere that spirits who have gone through mortality are in Paradise exclaiming their immense joy for having had the experience.  Spirits standing by who are waiting their turn to be born into the world can only observe with befuddlement and incomprehension at the joyful shouts.

[Ahab]

3 minutes ago, longview said:

I consider mortality, the fallen nature of this world and of our bodies, all the rigors, challenges, griefs, etc, to be GIFTS to each and every one of us.  We are gaining insights, perspectives, experiences, development of talents, a more profound kind of maturity that we as spirit children in the pre-existence would have had a difficult time understanding or fully appreciating.  I read somewhere that spirits who have gone through mortality are in Paradise exclaiming their immense joy for having had the experience.  Spirits standing by who are waiting their turn to be born into the world can only observe with befuddlement and incomprehension at the joyful shouts.

I appreciate this insight, and I have thought about this a lot.  My wife has a LOT of medical problems... diabetes with an insulin pump and sensor she has to monitor several times a day, neuropathy, osteoarthritis, lost most of her hearing at age 2 and gradually kept losing more until now she has about 2% of normal hearing in one ear with a cochlear implant in the other, stage 3 kidney disease now, some really terrible things to deal with yet she takes it all in stride as well as she can... and we talk often about how this is just a short time compared to eternity and it won't be too much longer until she gets her perfect resurrected body where all of this will be a distant memory, yet something she can still draw on to empathize with others who go through similar things.

So, yeah, while this life is a gift and we do get a lot of good things out of it, I'm looking forward to even better things in the future, even in the remaining years of my and our mortal life here.

[longview]

8 minutes ago, Ahab said:

So, yeah, while this life is a gift and we do get a lot of good things out of it, I'm looking forward to even better things in the future, even in the remaining years of my and our mortal life here.

Yes, the Lord is with us every step of the way.  His tender mercies are always extended.  Even in the midst of our trials He will alleviate to some degree our sufferings so that we will be better able to work our way through it.  We see this in Alma the Elder's experiences  with his people while under the oppression of the vindictive wicked priest of King Noah:

Mosiah 24:8 And now it came to pass that Amulon began to exercise authority over Alma and his brethren, and began to persecute him, and cause that his children should persecute their children.  
9 For Amulon knew Alma, that he had been one of the king’s priests, and that it was he that believed the words of Abinadi and was driven out before the king, and therefore he was wroth with him; for he was subject to king Laman, yet he exercised authority over them, and put tasks upon them, and put task-masters over them.  10 And it came to pass that so great were their afflictions that they began to cry mightily to God.

15 And now it came to pass that the burdens which were laid upon Alma and his brethren were made light; yea, the Lord did strengthen them that they could bear up their burdens with ease, and they did submit cheerfully and with patience to all the will of the Lord.

[Ahab]

6 minutes ago, longview said:

Yes, the Lord is with us every step of the way.  His tender mercies are always extended.  Even in the midst of our trials He will alleviate to some degree our sufferings so that we will be better able to work our way through it.  We see this in Alma the Elder's experiences  with his people while under the oppression of the vindictive wicked priest of King Noah:

Mosiah 24:8 And now it came to pass that Amulon began to exercise authority over Alma and his brethren, and began to persecute him, and cause that his children should persecute their children.  
9 For Amulon knew Alma, that he had been one of the king’s priests, and that it was he that believed the words of Abinadi and was driven out before the king, and therefore he was wroth with him; for he was subject to king Laman, yet he exercised authority over them, and put tasks upon them, and put task-masters over them.  10 And it came to pass that so great were their afflictions that they began to cry mightily to God.

15 And now it came to pass that the burdens which were laid upon Alma and his brethren were made light; yea, the Lord did strengthen them that they could bear up their burdens with ease, and they did submit cheerfully and with patience to all the will of the Lord.

I see our "what do we need to do" part of this being to have an eternal perspective.  Don't get so bogged down with mortal trials that we don't look beyond them to see that this will be only for a short little while.  

I wonder if Alma and his people smiled more when they felt their burdens were made lighter.  I see the record stating that they submitted cheerfully and with patience to all the will of the Lord but how about to all that Amulon and his taskmasters were doing to them?  I don't think that was according to the will of the Lord.  My wife and I don't fault the Lord when things don't go well for us and it does help us to feel better when we see more with an eternal perspective how all of this is going to turn out.

[katherine the great]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

Or how about being resurrected with celestial glory, for anyone who might like to receive that blessing?  What is it that we need to do to receive that, if we desire it? 

Have faith in Jesus Christ. The kind of faith that is written in our hearts and results in good works.

 

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

  But is just asking enough?  Is there anything else we would need to do to receive information from our Father in heaven other than to ask him about it?

Of course. Study it out in our minds and use those minds to come to our own conclusion. Then we ask if our conclusion is correct. However, I don't think God chooses to disclose the mysteries of the universe to people very often (except for maybe astrophysicists who probably skip that last step).

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

s grammar important?  Any particular words we need to use? 

No. God looks on our hearts.

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

Any limitations to the blessings we can receive from our Father in heaven?

In this life? Yes. God did not heal my daughter from her type one diabetes or her bipolar disorder. Raising her has been the most challenging and painful experience of my life so I look for the blessing associated with this intense and persistent trial (like Bluebell said). Just to clarify, I have never asked the Lord to heal her from these conditions because I know that there is not one documented case of a faith healing for type one diabetes. In fact I almost never ask the Lord to bless me (and yet still He does). I guess I really believe in going out and getting our own blessings within the realm of where God has put us and thanking Him just the same. Like Jimmy Stewart in Shenandoah:

Lord, 
We cleared this land; 
We plowed it, sowed it, and harvested it. 
We cooked the harvest. 
It wouldn't be here—we wouldn't be eating it—if we hadn't done it all ourselves. 
We worked dog-bone hard for every crumb and morsel 
But we thank you just the same anyway, Lord, for this food we're about to eat. 
Amen.

 

[JLHPROF]

3 hours ago, ksfisher said:

20 There is a ^alaw, irrevocably decreed in ^bheaven before the foundations of this world, upon which all ^cblessings are predicated—

21 And when we obtain any ^ablessing from God, it is by ^bobedience to that law upon which it is predicated.

(D&C 130)

Obedience is the key to obtaining blessings.

Also:

D&C 82:10 I, the Lord, am bound when ye do what I say; but when ye do not what I say, ye have no promise.

God cannot lie.  If he promises a blessing for obedience to a law and we meet the conditions he is absolutely bound to provide the blessing or he would be a liar and cease to be God.

Christ's statement to the Brother of Jared is a good example of God being unable to withhold an earned blessing.

However more often than not we think we have complied with all conditions but we have fallen short and no blessing is realized.

[Ahab]

15 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

Have faith in Jesus Christ. The kind of faith that is written in our hearts and results in good works.

I agree that we need that, with God as the one who has given us our faith/assurance that Jesus really is.  Thank you for pointing out what I failed to mention.

15 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

Of course. Study it out in our minds and use those minds to come to our own conclusion. Then we ask if our conclusion is correct. However, I don't think God chooses to disclose the mysteries of the universe to people very often (except for maybe astrophysicists who probably skip that last step).

Mysteries are mysteries only to people who don't understand enough about how it all works.  Many of us understand things that are still a mystery to others of us.

15 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

No. God looks on our hearts.

No KJV language requirements, then? I sometimes use that language when giving public prayers in Church meetings just because it seems to be popular in our Church culture, but I agree that it really doesn't need to be used.

15 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

In this life? Yes. God did not heal my daughter from her type one diabetes or her bipolar disorder. Raising her has been the most challenging and painful experience of my life so I look for the blessing associated with this intense and persistent trial (like Bluebell said).  Just to clarify, I have never asked the Lord to heal her from these conditions because I know that there is not one documented case of a faith healing for type one diabetes. In fact I almost never ask the Lord to bless me (and yet still He does).

 

I struggle with this one sometimes.  My wife has a LOT of medical problems and I would love nothing more than for our Father to just make them go away. She has suffered and learned enough from them I think.  Still, though, when I have given her blessings, I haven't felt prompted to bless all of those problems away, so as of yet she still suffers with those problems.  I keep hoping that maybe someday I will get prompted to bless them all away, though.  I try to stay in tune with the Spirit to make sure I do what our Father wants me to do.

15 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

I guess I really believe in going out and getting our own blessings within the realm of where God has put us and thanking Him just the same. Like Jimmy Stewart in Shenandoah:

Lord, 
We cleared this land; 
We plowed it, sowed it, and harvested it. 
We cooked the harvest. 
It wouldn't be here—we wouldn't be eating it—if we hadn't done it all ourselves. 
We worked dog-bone hard for every crumb and morsel 
But we thank you just the same anyway, Lord, for this food we're about to eat. 
Amen.

 

I think Jimmy's character in that movie failed to realize that God put all of the food plants and animals on this planet to start with, so Jimmy was just working with what God had given to him.

[Tacenda]

29 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

Also:

D&C 82:10 I, the Lord, am bound when ye do what I say; but when ye do not what I say, ye have no promise.

God cannot lie.  If he promises a blessing for obedience to a law and we meet the conditions he is absolutely bound to provide the blessing or he would be a liar and cease to be God.

Christ's statement to the Brother of Jared is a good example of God being unable to withhold an earned blessing.

However more often than not we think we have complied with all conditions but we have fallen short and no blessing is realized.

I don't belong in this thread, because I've always disagreed with this scripture, that God is bound to provide blessings. And I've always believed we do good because that's what is right, not for blessings. 

[Ahab]

7 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I don't belong in this thread, because I've always disagreed with this scripture, that God is bound to provide blessings. And I've always believed we do good because that's what is right, not for blessings. 

God is bound only because he has said he will do something, conditional upon us doing our part.  So if we do our part, then God will do his part, because he said he would.  Otherwise God would be a liar for promising to do something and then not doing it.

Maybe instead of thinking of what comes from doing what is right as a "blessing" you could instead think of it as a "consequence".  When we do what is right, good consequences follow.  I consider those good consequences to be blessings, usually.

[Maidservant]

I have really been working on and exploring this in the last couple of years or so and even now it is the front of the lessons for me. I have been trying to attain a state of manna, and I see it constantly in any case. My main change right now is simply to release my emotional fear, because what I need arrives in any case, so I am free to release the fear (as I keep reminding myself).

I have even experimented with not asking at one point because I felt that (in my case) it meant that God might not bless, that he had to make a decision each time. So refraining from asking, for me meant that I trusted already that all things would be given.

I am also being transformed as to the nature of my wants and desires, because if I really got all the levels of all my wants, we would go from ) 100 chocolate cakes right now; TO ) world peace for everyone immediately and the cessation of all suffering; and everything in between. And even I can tell that that would mess the universe's groove up if that all showed up in the next 10 seconds. There's something to the struggle.

I am struggling with the word 'prayer' and have been experimenting with difference manners, times, words. Right now, I simply take some quiet (breathing) time to connect each day. I long ago learned that real prayer is to live (i.e. pray always), to  live in a state of union with God and the actions and other results that would flow from that. However, it is still healthy to take dedicated moments to renew, recharge, refocus, reconnect to that GOD energy in ourselves and in life. However, I still use words of those concerns I have, such as my children. I don't know if it changes God's choices, but it adds my energy to them and focuses me, at least. So I at least say their name and hold their image and my sense of them in my mind/heart/body for a few moments. I'm not smart enough to know what to ask for them, but I just add my faith that all things work out for their good.

On the other hand, when I have needed some very specific things, such as a certain amount of money, I have learned to be very specific. Again, it's not that God needs me to ask in order to give, but there's something about the specificity. I don't always say a traditional prayer about it, but what I had been led to do is write it down. I will write the amount on a post it note and leave it on my desk. Then that amount arrives in some manner. This pattern has taken place more times than the fingers on my hands just in the past few weeks.

[ksfisher]

1 hour ago, Tacenda said:

I don't belong in this thread, because I've always disagreed with this scripture, that God is bound to provide blessings. And I've always believed we do good because that's what is right, not for blessings. 

I think you do understand.  God does bless us when we do what is right, but we need to be doing right because we want to do right, not because we expect something.  Our actions need to align with our intent and our desires.

[The Nehor]

Woah, way too controversial a proposition.

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, Maidservant said:

I have really been working on and exploring this in the last couple of years or so and even now it is the front of the lessons for me. I have been trying to attain a state of manna, and I see it constantly in any case. My main change right now is simply to release my emotional fear, because what I need arrives in any case, so I am free to release the fear (as I keep reminding myself).

I have even experimented with not asking at one point because I felt that (in my case) it meant that God might not bless, that he had to make a decision each time. So refraining from asking, for me meant that I trusted already that all things would be given.

I am also being transformed as to the nature of my wants and desires, because if I really got all the levels of all my wants, we would go from ) 100 chocolate cakes right now; TO ) world peace for everyone immediately and the cessation of all suffering; and everything in between. And even I can tell that that would mess the universe's groove up if that all showed up in the next 10 seconds. There's something to the struggle.

I am struggling with the word 'prayer' and have been experimenting with difference manners, times, words. Right now, I simply take some quiet (breathing) time to connect each day. I long ago learned that real prayer is to live (i.e. pray always), to  live in a state of union with God and the actions and other results that would flow from that. However, it is still healthy to take dedicated moments to renew, recharge, refocus, reconnect to that GOD energy in ourselves and in life. However, I still use words of those concerns I have, such as my children. I don't know if it changes God's choices, but it adds my energy to them and focuses me, at least. So I at least say their name and hold their image and my sense of them in my mind/heart/body for a few moments. I'm not smart enough to know what to ask for them, but I just add my faith that all things work out for their good.

On the other hand, when I have needed some very specific things, such as a certain amount of money, I have learned to be very specific. Again, it's not that God needs me to ask in order to give, but there's something about the specificity. I don't always say a traditional prayer about it, but what I had been led to do is write it down. I will write the amount on a post it note and leave it on my desk. Then that amount arrives in some manner. This pattern has taken place more times than the fingers on my hands just in the past few weeks.

I appreciate your thoughts on this, and I agree that prayers don't need to be verbalized, at least not always.  Prayer to me means to have my heart and soul drawn out to God, asking or inviting (in some sense) for him to be with me in my thoughts to help me with whatever I'm doing, and I can do that at all times and in all places. I don't think we can intercede for everybody though, so jumping to a condition where we all have world peace in the next 10 seconds isn't doable because even if there were no wars each person would still need to come to the point where they feel at peace with themselves and with God and all other people, doing that for themselves rather than having it all done for them.  I know we can ask our Father to give everybody good ideas to think about, with good actions hopefully flowing from those good thoughts, but each person is responsible for their own choices about what to do with those good thoughts and as hard as it is for me to understand why some people just choose to ignore them or see them as bad ideas, rather than good ideas.  Maybe because they want to do something bad and a good idea just gets in their way.  Not everyone wants to be good.  I have come to terms with that.  Some people actually want to do bad things, desiring to be evil rather than good. :

[JLHPROF]

3 hours ago, Tacenda said:

I don't belong in this thread, because I've always disagreed with this scripture, that God is bound to provide blessings. And I've always believed we do good because that's what is right, not for blessings. 

Then do you believe God can lie?

[Tacenda]

2 hours ago, JLHPROF said:

Then do you believe God can lie?

I am not as faithful as you are in the belief that everything in the D&C is from God. 

[JLHPROF]

31 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I am not as faithful as you are in the belief that everything in the D&C is from God. 

Doesn't answer the question.

God made many promises.  So did Christ.  If we truly fulfill the requirements they are either bound to provide the blessing or they lied.

Which is it?

[Calm]

1 minute ago, JLHPROF said:

Doesn't answer the question.

God made many promises.  So did Christ.  If we truly fulfill the requirements they are either bound to provide the blessing or they lied.

Which is it?

I think Tacenda has doubts that the promises conveyed by the writings of men, even in the scriptures, are actually promises of God as opposed to what men think he promises.  Therefore even if the alleged promises are wrong God has not lied since they weren't his promises in the first place.

[JLHPROF]

13 minutes ago, Calm said:

I think Tacenda has doubts that the promises conveyed by the writings of men, even in the scriptures, are actually promises of God as opposed to what men think he promises.  Therefore even if the alleged promises are wrong God has not lied since they weren't his promises in the first place.

I realize that.  But there must be some she believes to be promised by them.  Unless we are back at knowing nothing at all about God and Christ.

[let’s roll]

What has God told us He is willing to bless us with?  All that He has.  The good and the bad.  The beautiful and the the ugly.  The easy and the difficult.  Are we willing to ask Him to bless us with all of those things? 

Resurrected with Celestial glory means we’ve agreed to join God in His work, which is filled with both great joy and great sorrow.  God weeps.  

Only when we have inherited all that He has and our work and glory has become bringing Celestial glory to our own spiritual offspring will we realize just how exquisite both that joy and that pain/sorrow can be.

If I truly desire to join Him in His work, I think I should be asking Him for mortal experiences that provide preparation for that work, the wisdom to both identify those experiences and how best to learn from them, with sufficient tender mercies and thin veil experiences that I can recognize and feel of the joy in the journey.