Guidelines for Trek Reinactments

[Buckeye]

2 hours ago, cinepro said:

FYI, here's a "women's pull".  Notice the text at the beginning and its claim that the pull "simulated conditions faced by Mormon women pioneers after the mustering of the Mormon Battalion by the U.S. Army".  The idea that the men would leave their women to pull handcarts to Utah is a little...insulting.

 

Frankly, I'm surprised that some stakes didn't go full-board "mormon battalion" and have the boys use black powder rifles to shoot down some local cattle in order to reenact the only "battle" seen by the battalion. http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865619513/Picturing-history-Site-of-the-Mormon-Battalions-battle-with-the-bulls.html

 

[Jane_Doe]

5 hours ago, bluebell said:

I agree.  If a group wants to do a women's pull (and I think a lot do because so many who have participated have thought it was the best part of the whole trek) they can symbolize their absence by death, since many men died.

They don't have to conflate the two different experiences.

Speaking personally, when I was a youth we had the who surprise thing which has since been known as the "Mormon Battalion and Women's pull".  We all knew it was historically inaccurate, but so was sitting on our plastic coolers during dinner.  Still, the purpose in this case was not historical accuracy, but a spiritual experience- and that it certainly was.  They got all the guys up to "march" at the break of dawn, and off they went to the Martian's Cove fireside and along the trek.  

Us ladies followed (relatively) quickly, spending longer to bond and figure out how we were going to do this.  We spent MUCH longer at the fireside, bonding, and then finally headed up the steep hills.  

Meanwhile, the guys had marched several miles down the trial, so much that the leaders eventually called a halt and "let's just hang out for a while" break.  One of the 14 years olds yelled "We got to go help the girls!"  And off all the young men went- running as fast as they could, leaving all the shocked leaders in the dust.  They ran back for miles!   

For my perspective, I'm pushing my cart up one of the steepest hills when all of a sudden I hear shouting and seeing our boys crest down the join in beside me.  I admit, I had a very low opinion of the young men growing up (only slightly deserved), but at that moment I saw the spiritual giant a young man in Christ can be.  

 

 

Was my experience historically accurate?  Heck no!  But that moment was one of the most profound spiritual moments I have ever experienced.  

Edited February 27, 2017 by Jane_Doe

[Ahab]

5 hours ago, HappyJackWagon said:

We even killed chickens because...well, they were for dinner.

Sorry, fresh meat is not allowed unless it has already been killed and packaged before the trek.

I guess that rules out taking guns along for hunting, too.

[cinepro]

20 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

Was my experience historically accurate?  Heck no!  But that moment was one of the most profound spiritual moments I have ever experienced.  

No, but it was contrived.

I think this is part of the problem that can arise from the Treks.  We can all understand the spirit and miracles of the pioneers.  They were actually leaving their homes and journeying to Utah, often at huge sacrifice and risk.  It's easy to understand why God and the Holy Ghost would accompany these people and honor them with spiritual support.

I can understand why we might feel the spirit when reading about these events, or viewing a dramatic reenactment, although I think there is also some sort of psychological component that gives us what we interpret as "spiritual feelings" that can get triggered when we see certain types of behavior dramatized, even if it isn't real, like when Han Solo returns and helps Luke blow up the Death Star in Star Wars...

So when kids have experiences that they interpret as  "the Spirit" on Treks, sometimes I'm not sure what they thought they were feeling.  Could it have been the Holy Ghost coming to help them on their wholly contrived reenactment of something that probably never happened?  Possibly.  But could it also have been a natural emotional reaction to stress and situations involving sacrifice and charity?  Who knows? 

Do I think LDS teens are any good at telling the difference?  Probably not. 

And I think that's part of the problem leaders face on these things.  It is very tempting (and easy) to fabricate situations that will trigger these emotions, and the guidance from the Church seems to be a desire to limit their efforts in this regard.

 

 

[bluebell]

4 minutes ago, cinepro said:

No, but it was contrived.

I think this is part of the problem that can arise from the Treks.  We can all understand the spirit and miracles of the pioneers.  They were actually leaving their homes and journeying to Utah, often at huge sacrifice and risk.  It's easy to understand why God and the Holy Ghost would accompany these people and honor them with spiritual support.

I can understand why we might feel the spirit when reading about these events, or viewing a dramatic reenactment, although I think there is also some sort of psychological component that gives us what we interpret as "spiritual feelings" that can get triggered when we see certain types of behavior dramatized, even if it isn't real, like when Han Solo returns and helps Luke blow up the Death Star in Star Wars...

So when kids have experiences that they interpret as  "the Spirit" on Treks, sometimes I'm not sure what they thought they were feeling.  Could it have been the Holy Ghost coming to help them on their wholly contrived reenactment of something that probably never happened?  Possibly.  But could it also have been a natural emotional reaction to stress and situations involving sacrifice and charity?  Who knows? 

Do I think LDS teens are any good at telling the difference?  Probably not. 

And I think that's part of the problem leaders face on these things.  It is very tempting (and easy) to fabricate situations that will trigger these emotions, and the guidance from the Church seems to be a desire to limit their efforts in this regard.

 

 

Maybe it could be the Holy Ghost testifying of the importance of sacrifice and charity?  When i have felt the spirit as a teenager during such things, that is what i have attributed it to.

[stemelbow]

I'm glad we have that Tucson West stake out there to help the Church formulate rules of what not to do with Treks.  It looks like the regulations that have been crafter came because of that stake.

[Jane_Doe]

45 minutes ago, cinepro said:

No, but it was contrived.

I think this is part of the problem that can arise from the Treks.  We can all understand the spirit and miracles of the pioneers.  They were actually leaving their homes and journeying to Utah, often at huge sacrifice and risk.  It's easy to understand why God and the Holy Ghost would accompany these people and honor them with spiritual support.

I can understand why we might feel the spirit when reading about these events, or viewing a dramatic reenactment, although I think there is also some sort of psychological component that gives us what we interpret as "spiritual feelings" that can get triggered when we see certain types of behavior dramatized, even if it isn't real, like when Han Solo returns and helps Luke blow up the Death Star in Star Wars...

So when kids have experiences that they interpret as  "the Spirit" on Treks, sometimes I'm not sure what they thought they were feeling.  Could it have been the Holy Ghost coming to help them on their wholly contrived reenactment of something that probably never happened?  Possibly.  But could it also have been a natural emotional reaction to stress and situations involving sacrifice and charity?  Who knows? 

Do I think LDS teens are any good at telling the difference?  Probably not. 

And I think that's part of the problem leaders face on these things.  It is very tempting (and easy) to fabricate situations that will trigger these emotions, and the guidance from the Church seems to be a desire to limit their efforts in this regard.

 

 

This post gives you the impression that teenagers are dumb.  No, that's not the case. 

As to my experience: the moving part was that the teenager guys *of their own free will and idea* decided to literally run miles to help me out, and then walk those same miles back with me.  No one made them do that.  No one pushed it.  In fact, some of the leaders yelled at the running YM to come back-- cause they were totally going renegade.  Nothing fabricated.  No one told them to.  Just an honest desire to help.  

[HappyJackWagon]

2 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

This post gives you the impression that teenagers are dumb.  No, that's not the case. 

As to my experience: the moving part was that the teenager guys *of their own free will and idea* decided to literally run miles to help me out, and then walk those same miles back with me.  No one made them do that.  No one pushed it.  In fact, some of the leaders yelled at the running YM to come back-- cause they were totally going renegade.  Nothing fabricated.  No one told them to.  Just an honest desire to help.  

I experienced similar things. I clearly remember some of the younger kids who had blisters on their feet and simply could not go on. Some of the older boys literally picked them up and carried them. It was amazing to watch that kind of service and kindness. I felt the spirit.

But what was the spirit testifying to me? That the trek reenactment was historically accurate? Doubtful.

That the church was true? Not necessarily.

Most likely the spirit was testifying of the power of compassion and charity and the beauty of service. It's all in the interpretation.

 

[Johnnie Cake]

On ‎2‎/‎27‎/‎2017 at 9:26 AM, Buckeye said:

LDS trek reenactments occasionally pop up as discussion topics on this board and other places in the bloggosphere (e.g., this thread from last summer) Common concerns I have seen raised include:

• Safety issues, particularly regarding dehydration and forced fasting;
• Historically inaccuracy, particularly with the 'women's pull';
• Overzealous theater, such as burying dolls in makeshift graves and having faux mobs waking sleeping youth at gunpoint.

I was recently informed of Church Guidelines for Trek. While the guidelines are copyrighted 2015, I was not aware of them previously, and I supposed many others were not either. The guidelines provide very helpful advice and address (at least minimally) the common complaints I have seen raised with treks. Some of the insightful counsel includes: 

• "Licensed health care professionals should be present for the entire trek. At least one physician or other skilled Youth gather for a devotional during their handcart trek reenactment. 7 Callings, Assignments, and Roles health care professional should participate in the trek. In addition, one nurse or emergency medical technician (EMT) is recommended for every 50 to 100 participants." 
• "Symbolizing the absence of the young men by calling them to serve in the Mormon Battalion is historically inaccurate and is therefore inappropriate. The march of the Mormon Battalion occurred 10 years before handcart travel began."
• "The wearing of white clothing to represent deceased persons or angels from the other side of the veil is not to be included as part of treks." 
• "Leaders ensure that any stories that are told and reenacted during the trek are historically accurate. For a collection of historically accurate pioneer stories, see treks.lds.org "
• "Chickens, turkeys, or other live animals should not be killed during treks. Fasting should not be incorporated as part of treks." 

Wish these had been around during the 2 treks I was involved in...1 in which I did the planning and organizational work for and the other in which I was in a supportive role as a youth leader.   From the list I can see that we violated several of these directives

[sunstoned]

On 2/27/2017 at 2:47 PM, bsjkki said:

In December, I taught in RS and this quote by Howard W. Hunter is wise counsel. 

"Let me offer a word of caution on this subject. I think if we are not careful as professional teachers working in the classroom every day, we may begin to try to counterfeit the true influence of the Spirit of the Lord by unworthy and manipulative means. I get concerned when it appears that strong emotion or free-flowing tears are equated with the presence of the Spirit. Certainly the Spirit of the Lord can bring strong emotional feelings, including tears, but that outward manifestation ought not to be confused with the presence of the Spirit itself."

In the Teachings of the Presidents manual, the first two sentences are left out. In RS, we are not often professional teachers but the counsel to not try and counterfeit the spirit by unworthy and manipulative means is wise and blunt counsel. Trek can often devolve into this and I've seen this at girls camp too. I mentioned, in my lesson that we don't need to make a big production to invite the spirit or to testify and have the spirit present. Bigger is not always better.  

It seems that Bro. Hunter was speaking out against heartSell.

[Bernard Gui]

I have some concerns about treks and other such activities. In some past treks in our area there were planned situations that would put the youth under stress so they would request a blessing. That is not appropriate and I understand they don't do that any more.

Some workplace team-building and BSA Woodbadge training I have experienced are similar to trek in some respects. When I participated in the outdoor part of Woodbadge (where men experience scouting from the boys' point of view), we were divided into patrols, given very difficult tasks in which stronger scouters had to come to the rescue of weaker ones, persistently resisting fatigue and discouragement, emotionally removing members of the patrol after substantial bonding had taken place, testimonial-type ceremonies and meetings after the experiences, and other things. I came home from Woodbadge a changed person who was strongly committed to "do it for the boys." Learning later that everything in the course was carefully planned...even the selection of patrol members by personality to match their patrol name (I was a Bobwhite, not an Eagle, an Owl, or a Wolf ) to get the desired results.  I appreciate the experience now for what it was. I feel I was manipulated, perhaps for a higher purpose, but it has made me less enthusiastic about team-building programs. 

I understand President Hunter's words of caution that we should take care not to cross the line and misinterpret strong emotion as the workings of the Spirit. I deal with the same issue in my profession as a musician. Music can create very powerful emotions, but they are not necessarily from the Holy Spirit.

What if all the time, effort, material, and money expended on trek were directed at a significant and meaningful community service project that affected the lives of disadvantaged people? The youth seeing the impact on the lives of those being served could produce a similar spiritual experience.

Just my opinion, nothing more.

Edited March 2, 2017 by Bernard Gui

[Danzo]

On 2/27/2017 at 8:38 AM, bluebell said:

I can't believe that they had to make a 'don't kill things' rule.  

Though I totally understand the reason for the rule, you know its obviously a United States thing.

In many countries, if meat is on the menu, something was killed recently.

I remember visiting mexico a few months ago where my children had to learn this lesson.  

Chicken for dinner meant somethings going to die tonight.  The little lamb that they played with one day was on their plate the next.

 

 

[Bernard Gui]

On March 2, 2017 at 3:33 PM, Danzo said:

Though I totally understand the reason for the rule, you know its obviously a United States thing.

In many countries, if meat is on the menu, something was killed recently.

I remember visiting mexico a few months ago where my children had to learn this lesson.  

Chicken for dinner meant somethings going to die tonight.  The little lamb that they played with one day was on their plate the next.

 

 

On my mission in Central America, tomorrow's chicken dinner was clucking in the kitchen the night before. No fridges.

My grandma was good at wringing their necks, and then we kids had to pluck them. Then she fried them up....tasty.

 

 

Edited March 4, 2017 by Bernard Gui

[bsjkki]

We had our pioneer lesson in RS today. I pointed out how successful the pioneers were. So often, we only discuss the hardships and not the huge success the pioneers had. We focus on the worst moment in pioneer history with the Martin and Willie Handcart companies and do not emphasize how many made the journey successfully. How often do we focus on our failures instead of successes. I think trek reenactments that also focus on accurate stories and point out that Mormons were really good pioneers with only a slightly higher than normal death rate could be beneficial. https://www.lds.org/church/news/5-things-we-learn-from-database-of-mormon-pioneers?lang=eng I had one sister tell me she didn't know that so many pioneers survived the journey. Even the Martin and Willie Handcart company only lost 16 1/2 percent of the company. While these are big numbers, I think most people believe a higher percentage died. The church organized a highly successful migration west in an orderly, mostly safe journey that benefited the saints for generations to come. 

[Rain]

Just talked with my daughter. I couldn't remember which trek experiences are hers and which I heard from someone else.

When we went to the information meeting they announced that this was the hardest trek they knew about.  I have no problem with it being hard, but being the hardest isn't a goal I liked. We have found, at least with the women in our stake, that many think of emotional experiences as spiritual and I was afraid that would also be the case with hard experiences.

My daughter is pretty on top of things spiritually. She always has been. She is also pretty emotional, so we have had many talks on what is spiritual and what is emotional. Both of us know, from experience that spiritual experiences can sometimes make you feel emotional, but we watch to see if something is actually a spiritual experience rather than emotional before getting spiritual guidance from it.

Our stake did kill chickens for dinner on the trek. My daughter helped pluck some. They had a women's pull/mormon battalion. They also had a day when they pulled late into the night and were exhausted.

I just asked her about her experiences in light of this guide. She had wanted to go on a trek since she had first heard about them. She was a bit disappointed when she was done because she hadn't had the ground breaking testimony experiences she had heard about. She had some little experiences here and there, but didn't come out remarkably changed. That really bothered her for a long time, though knowing her and how spiritual she already is it made complete sense.

I asked her if she was glad she went a few minutes ago. She said yes. Some because of those little experiences, but mostly because she learned she could do hard physical things that she never believed she could do before. This made complete sense knowing her. I am big on the idea of how spiritual and temporal things are "the same" so it feels like a good thing she was strengthening the side of hers that was weaker.

I asked her to tell me what spiritual experiences she had. She was good in evaluation of what was spiritual and what was emotional. These are her experiences so I won't be sharing them. 

Then she had an interesting insight looking back on it. She felt in some ways that the physical hardness diminished what she could have felt spiritually because she was so exhausted. She was glad it was hard, but it was too hard, which she felt made her miss spiritual things she should have felt. 

Which makes complete sense with these guidelines. It is good to have spiritual experiences and work, but we need to keep the focus on that and not make "hard" the goal.

[Ouagadougou]

On 27.02.2017 at 8:26 AM, Buckeye said:

LDS trek reenactments occasionally pop up as discussion topics on this board and other places in the bloggosphere (e.g., this thread from last summer) Common concerns I have seen raised include:

• Safety issues, particularly regarding dehydration and forced fasting;
• Historically inaccuracy, particularly with the 'women's pull';
• Overzealous theater, such as burying dolls in makeshift graves and having faux mobs waking sleeping youth at gunpoint.

I was recently informed of Church Guidelines for Trek. While the guidelines are copyrighted 2015, I was not aware of them previously, and I supposed many others were not either. The guidelines provide very helpful advice and address (at least minimally) the common complaints I have seen raised with treks. Some of the insightful counsel includes: 

• "Licensed health care professionals should be present for the entire trek. At least one physician or other skilled Youth gather for a devotional during their handcart trek reenactment. 7 Callings, Assignments, and Roles health care professional should participate in the trek. In addition, one nurse or emergency medical technician (EMT) is recommended for every 50 to 100 participants." 
• "Symbolizing the absence of the young men by calling them to serve in the Mormon Battalion is historically inaccurate and is therefore inappropriate. The march of the Mormon Battalion occurred 10 years before handcart travel began."
• "The wearing of white clothing to represent deceased persons or angels from the other side of the veil is not to be included as part of treks." 
• "Leaders ensure that any stories that are told and reenacted during the trek are historically accurate. For a collection of historically accurate pioneer stories, see treks.lds.org "
• "Chickens, turkeys, or other live animals should not be killed during treks. Fasting should not be incorporated as part of treks." 

If they wanted to practice an accurate historical reenactment of these treks, then they should go to Walmart and purchase alcohol, tea, coffee, and tobacco, because that is what BY had in his private wagons coming across the plains.  

Reference is below:

https://www.amazon.com/South-Pass-Continent-Will-Bagley/dp/080614842X

[rongo]

17 hours ago, bsjkki said:

We had our pioneer lesson in RS today. I pointed out how successful the pioneers were. So often, we only discuss the hardships and not the huge success the pioneers had. We focus on the worst moment in pioneer history with the Martin and Willie Handcart companies and do not emphasize how many made the journey successfully. How often do we focus on our failures instead of successes. I think trek reenactments that also focus on accurate stories and point out that Mormons were really good pioneers with only a slightly higher than normal death rate could be beneficial. https://www.lds.org/church/news/5-things-we-learn-from-database-of-mormon-pioneers?lang=eng I had one sister tell me she didn't know that so many pioneers survived the journey. Even the Martin and Willie Handcart company only lost 16 1/2 percent of the company. While these are big numbers, I think most people believe a higher percentage died. The church organized a highly successful migration west in an orderly, mostly safe journey that benefited the saints for generations to come. 

B.H. Roberts, in his autobiography, and in his Comprehensive History of the Church (volume 3 has the trek west in it), emphasizes that it was an adventurous, romantic experience for most people. He included himself in this, and he walked much of it in bare feet, with his sister (his mother had emigrated years earlier, and they were joining her in Bountiful). 

I agree that it is kind of strange that we emphasize the hardship so much. It wasn't that hard for most people, and as Roberts wrote, unfortunately, most of us will never know such an adventure. 

[Jeanne]

On 2/27/2017 at 1:46 PM, CA Steve said:

By that same reasoning instead of a "Ma & Pa" assigned to each group there should be several Ma's assigned to each "Pa".

 

 

Whose your mama???