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How To Tell Someone To Get Divorced Without Telling Them?


Duncan

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hahaha! It's my lean, mean, low down dirty opinion but to me and like many, many others think the same as I do and you should read the emails about this from the ward council if you think I am harshing on them. I am not deciding her life but I care about people! I agree with you it's her choice but she needs to know she shouldn't be wasting her life she has options ad how to present those options is what I am wondering about. I was around when she was dating this man and our Bishop ramped up marriage and pressured us all to do it and missions and all these kinds of things "you can't be happy unless you're married" meanwhile his own marriage was in tatters but hindsight is 20/20. So, now all these years we are dealing with the effects. So, definately he pressured us all into these hinky slinky situations and now they tell us , "oh well they shouldn't have done that"

I wonder if she's been taught to stay married no matter what, unless there's sexual/physical abuse or drug abuse. And she doesn't recognize the mental abuse.
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hahaha! It's my lean, mean, low down dirty opinion but to me and like many, many others think the same as I do and you should read the emails about this from the ward council if you think I am harshing on them. I am not deciding her life but I care about people! I agree with you it's her choice but she needs to know she shouldn't be wasting her life she has options ad how to present those options is what I am wondering about. I was around when she was dating this man and our Bishop ramped up marriage and pressured us all to do it and missions and all these kinds of things "you can't be happy unless you're married" meanwhile his own marriage was in tatters but hindsight is 20/20. So, now all these years we are dealing with the effects. So, definately he pressured us all into these hinky slinky situations and now they tell us , "oh well they shouldn't have done that"

I wonder if she's been taught to stay married no matter what, unless there's mental/sexual/physical abuse or drug abuse. And she doesn't recognize abuse. Who knows, maybe she's grown up with abuse and doesn't know any different. Edited by Tacenda
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I wonder if she's been taught to stay married no matter what, unless there's mental/sexual/physical abuse or drug abuse. And she doesn't recognize abuse. Who knows, maybe she's grown up with abuse and doesn't know any different.

 

 

I think so too, her own parents marriage is a wreck and she comes from a very dysfunctional family, heck her brother was exed at 17 because he thought he was a prophet and wanted to marry the young women and move to Utah. She's the oldest and I think she tries to save people and she married her problem. She told me once, "I signed up for this" and like, no you didn't at all.

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.. our Bishop ramped up marriage and pressured us all to do it ... and all these kinds of things "you can't be happy unless you're married" ...

Oh, brother! :rolleyes:

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There's nothing better than a good marriage ... and perhaps nothing worse than a bad one.  Or, so I hear. :huh::unknw:

 

;):D

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There is the old story of a young couple wanting to get married asked an Apostle to officiate. He said he would be glad to and told the couple they were at the end of their problems. Well six months passed and the couple came in and complained bitterly about how hard married life was. The Apostle simply looked at them and said "I didn't say which end". :rolleyes:

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I home teach this woman that I have known forever. She is married and she married her first boyfriend. This guy is bad news all over the place. He isn't active at all and she is the I hate to say it but  Molly Mormonish type, she doesn't wear make up and wears pioneer women clothing. They have NOTHING In common at all, I think you could pick two people off the street who have more in common with each other. They have been married since maybe 2003? They have no kids, which she wants. they have been on again off again since before they got married and have been fighting and he is emotionally abusive and she keeps taking him back and she keeps making excuses. I and the world that knows them thinks if she dumped him, cut her hair, burned all of her clothes she would feel and think better about herself. She is wasting her life with this guy. The last time he came to church he almost got into a fight with a guy. Anyways the latest, he is bi polar, but he abused her and the police came over and he was in the psych ward and all that legal stuff but she tells me she signed for this and they have two places and one of them is to use her words a "safehouse". It truly blows my mind why she is still with him. I know the Church can't tell her to get divorced but does anyone know a way to tell someone to get divorced without actually saying it. Why he is still with her is a mystery as well, he's cheated on her so many times and she just keeps taking him back in.

She is still with him because she is honor bound. The words to a temporal wedding are : do you________________ take ______________ to be your lawful wedded husband in sickness and in health , for better or for worse, til death do you part? Or some such thing.

 

It's a covenant she made. Instead of looking down on her for tolerating a bad situation admire her courage .  If I dumped my wife for abusing me and cheating on me I would have missed the best years of my marriage.

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She is still with him because she is honor bound. The words to a temporal wedding are : do you________________ take ______________ to be your lawful wedded husband in sickness and in health , for better or for worse, til death do you part? Or some such thing.

It's a covenant she made. Instead of looking down on her for tolerating a bad situation admire her courage . If I dumped my wife for abusing me and cheating on me I would have missed the best years of my marriage.

You don't know she is honor bound to stay with him. The Lord may have released her from that covenant the first time she was abused. This is why it is HER choice made with the Lord and not ours.

If YOU felt YOU were honor bound then that is between you and the Lord. It has nothing to do with someone else's marriage. And frankly, the thought of an abused person being told they are honor bound to stay makes me literally sick.

Edited by Rain
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She is still with him because she is honor bound. The words to a temporal wedding are : do you________________ take ______________ to be your lawful wedded husband in sickness and in health , for better or for worse, til death do you part? Or some such thing.

 

It's a covenant she made. Instead of looking down on her for tolerating a bad situation admire her courage .  If I dumped my wife for abusing me and cheating on me I would have missed the best years of my marriage.

 

No one is honor-bound to live with abuse.   If someone chooses to, then that is their decision.  It is not their duty however.

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You don't know she is honor bound to stay with him. The Lord may have released her from that covenant the first time she was abused. This is why it is HER choice made with the Lord and not ours.

If YOU felt YOU were honor bound then that is between you and the Lord. It has nothing to do with someone else's marriage. And frankly, the thought of an abused person being told they are honor bound to stay makes me literally sick.

Some people confuse emotional abuse with physical abuse. Frankly people that have no honor make me sick.

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No one is honor-bound to live with abuse.   If someone chooses to, then that is their decision.  It is not their duty however.

He said emotional abuse, that is in the eye of the beholder. Just exactly what do you think for better or for worse means?

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He said emotional abuse, that is in the eye of the beholder. Just exactly what do you think for better or for worse means?

 

 

I don't doubt for a second that he has physically abused, but I personally haven't seen evidence of it but I definately wouldn't put it past him. I am hoping today now that the latest thing is known to the Bishop that she'll be at church  and he can talk with her and do whatever. I know in the past he has had protection orders placed on him so he can be violent if whatever happens

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I don't doubt for a second that he has physically abused, but I personally haven't seen evidence of it but I definately wouldn't put it past him. I am hoping today now that the latest thing is known to the Bishop that she'll be at church  and he can talk with her and do whatever. I know in the past he has had protection orders placed on him so he can be violent if whatever happens

Well I'll leave it to those who actually know what is going on. I'm out. I have one more thing to say, I'm not willing to convict the guy on rumor and innuendo. My sister has a protection order against me for trying to say hi to my neice in a public place, it just means they know how to use the legal system.

Edited by rodheadlee
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i just left an almost 15 year relationship that was emotional abuse..for a long time I just believed what was said and didn't recognize it until I became so tired of trying to please.  Just ask her Duncan..would she rather him slap her than abusive hurt?  If she says yes, it is time to go.  Keep me posted.  Doesn't matter about religion whether he is active or not..it matters about his personality and frame of mind..which would for some be worse if religion is involved.  Just my IMO.  Hugs and good luck as this is hard to watch happen..frustrating too.

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Some people confuse emotional abuse with physical abuse. Frankly people that have no honor make me sick.

 

Anyone who thinks that leaving an abuser means that the person has no honor needs to rethink their priorities and morals.

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I know a woman who has stuck with her husband through long years of emotional abuse, she has survived, I believe, though minus any self esteem.

Her children otoh....one got into drugs at a young age and tried to commit suicide because of the abuse. It is still too early to see what will happen with the others, if they will be able to find someone they feel and are safe with or if the cycle repeats.

Edited by calmoriah
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One only loses honor when you break your covenants. If your spouse abuses you and the Lord releases you from your promises then no honor is lost if you get out of the marriage.

I know a woman whose husband had some covenant problems. She prayed, the Lord told her to stay and she felt honor bound to stay. No problem. Then at one point the Lord told her it was time to leave. She was no longer honor bound.

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I agree with most of the "whats" agreeing that we cannot judge whether she should stay or go, that abuse negates an obligation to stay...the "how"as others have said is helping her fill up with a sense of her own value, justice, and the Spirit. Why? Because stay or go, these are what succeed in both cases.

Help her feel the Spirit, especially in context of relationships. Invite them to join your family. Be authentic, so she can see a family does not have to be perfect to work or treat each other right.

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Anyone who thinks that leaving an abuser means that the person has no honor needs to rethink their priorities and morals.

If I did that I would have been divorced long ago and lonely. Verbal and emotional abuse is not a one way street and most often both parties are guilty. There are 3 sides to every story his side, her side and the truth. Hurling the word abuser around is quite fashionable these days. I'll wager 99% of the marriages in America involve some form of verbal or emotional abuse. The ability to repent and forgive is crucial to a long term relationship. If you think there is honor in divorce you are mistaken.

Edited by rodheadlee
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If I did that I would have been divorced long ago and lonely. Verbal and emotional abuse is not a one way street and most often both parties are guilty. There are 3 sides to every story his side, her side and the truth. Hurling the word abuser around is quite fashionable these days. I'll wager 99% of the marriages in America involve some form of verbal or emotional abuse. The ability to repent and forgive is crucial to a long term relationship. If you think there is honor in divorce you are mistaken.

 

Good morning, Rod...

It is rare that I disagree with your posts, but this one is something that is very difficult... there are too many aspects that can enter into a situation that leads to divorce... aspects that can't be ignored, even forgiven... my mom and dad divorced when I was about 3 yrs old... they tried to work it out but my dad was just a Cad so to speak.  Couldn't leave the other women alone and loved to spend time at the local pub.  I have some horrific memories  of my drunken dad that are with me today like they were yesterday.  I can still feel the cool night air on my face as my mom fled down our long driveway, holding my sis's and my hands... running to a neighbor's... pounding on the door... my mom in tears... the neighbor taking us in... sleeping on the couch... my little girl mind confused at what what was going on... that was about the final straw... but the worst was yet to come... I've told about it here on the board and titled it "The night I rode with angels."  It plays like a movie in my mind and is very much a part of me and influenced me so traumatically that when my dad showed up when I was a young woman I refused to see him. 

No, Rod, there's too many aspects that enter into situations leading to divorce... Certainly one should try to work things out... I know my folks did try as my mom loved my dad very much... but he left her broken, alone at 29 to raise two little girls by herself, at a time when divorce and divorced women were looked down on.  My sis and I didn't realize until years later how very poor we were during those years.  I know my mom was lonely  but she put us first... 

My story has a happy ending... when I was nine, mom met and married a wonderful man... the step-father to whom my sis and I are sealed as part of an eternal family. He honored my mom and us girls all of his life... Now that was truly honor... 

But the movie from those early experiences continues to play in my mind and still brings tears, 70 years later.

 

GG

Edited by Garden Girl
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That is why you are single and will remain so. All marriages involve pain.

If I did that I would have been divorced long ago and lonely. Verbal and emotional abuse is not a one way street and most often both parties are guilty. There are 3 sides to every story his side, her side and the truth. Hurling the word abuser around is quite fashionable these days. I'll wager 99% of the marriages in America involve some form of verbal or emotional abuse. The ability to repent and forgive is crucial to a long term relationship. If you think there is honor in divorce you are mistaken.

If the alternative is inevitable abusing and being an abuser then I probably made the right choice. That you believe it is inevitable makes me glad I did not marry you.

Marriage does involve pain. Life involves pain but pain should not be the main feature of either.

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If I did that I would have been divorced long ago and lonely. Verbal and emotional abuse is not a one way street and most often both parties are guilty. There are 3 sides to every story his side, her side and the truth. Hurling the word abuser around is quite fashionable these days. I'll wager 99% of the marriages in America involve some form of verbal or emotional abuse. The ability to repent and forgive is crucial to a long term relationship. If you think there is honor in divorce you are mistaken.

 

What you need to consider is that just because it was right for you to stay, does not automatically mean that it then must be right for everyone to stay.  

 

And I don't think i agree about 99% of marriages involving some kind of abuse.  I only have personal knowledge of three marriages (my own, my parents, and my maternal grandparents) and i can testify that none of those marriages involve any abuse of any kind.  My husband has never yelled at me, called me a name, or said anything mean to me, even when we fight, and i've never done any of that to him.  

 

I only know of one fight of my parents, but whether during that fight or in life in general, they have always treated each other like best friends.  I've never even heard them seriously complain about each other.  

 

My grandparents had a more traditional marriage in how they related to each other (my grandfather was definitely 'in charge', for example) but he never ever raised his voice to my grandmother and she never to him.  He never uttered a cross or cruel word.

 

Of course abusive relationships exist, and there are probably a lot of them, but it's very possible to have human weakness in a marriage (even to the point of hurting each others feelings or causing each other pain sometimes) without being abusive or being abused.  

 

We should never give anyone the idea that a 'normal' marriage is one where abuse happens.

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