Has Modern Revelation stopped?

[MiserereNobis]

11 minutes ago, carbon dioxide said:

Younger Gen Z women are getting more liberal while the men are getting more conservative.  Men generally are not attracted to the more feminist type of women.

CFR on both of these sentences. 

[Calm]

1 hour ago, carbon dioxide said:

All of those things are reversible

So?

[Bernard Gui]

8 hours ago, Frank11 said:

Perhaps it is because of the date of the post, 9/11, that the rhetoric of the post reminds me of texts by fundamental Islamists. But it could also be due to the last sentence, which is similar to Surah 6:5 in the Quran: 

So they have indeed rejected the truth [Quaran and Muhammad] when it came to them; therefore the truth of what they mocked at will shine upon them.

Because of the date 9/11? Islamic fundamentalists? Seriously?

Teddyaware didn’t invent those ideas. They are consistent with what I have personally heard from the Brethren for over 65 years and read from leaders since Joseph Smith. It’s the constant message of the prophets of the Restoration. 

Edited September 13, 2024 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

On 9/11/2024 at 11:13 PM, 3DOP said:

Maybe we will need to look to the "dark continent" for wisdom.

Maybe so. Lots of new Mormons there…and in Latin America. Not so many in Western countries. 

[Frank11]

48 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

Because of the date 9/11? Islamic fundamentalists? Seriously?

Teddyaware didn’t invent those ideas. They are consistent with what I have personally heard from the Brethren for over 65 years and read from leaders since Joseph Smith. It’s the constant message of the prophets of the Restoration. 

I underlined rhetoric in my post, I already realize that Teddyaware is wholeheartedly Mormon and has nothing to do with the Islamic faith. I just want to point out that it's all a matter of perspective. The thought patterns are the same, even if one believes in Joseph Smith and the other in Muhammad.

Anyone can ask themselves what they would believe in if they were born into a conservative Muslim family in Iran.

 

[Calm]

4 minutes ago, Frank11 said:

The thought patterns are the same

How can you be so certain?

[Frank11]

13 minutes ago, Calm said:

How can you be so certain?

Because we are all children of God.

Of course we are different in character and our upbringing plays a major role in this, but in most cases this would only influence how conservative or liberal we would be. 

[Nofear]

11 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

CFR on both of these sentences. 

There are actually several studies suggesting the trend (or lack thereof). This is one report: https://www.americansurveycenter.org/newsletter/are-young-men-becoming-conservative/

That's not to say Gen-Z young men are adopting all the traditionally conservative positions. They are more liberal in some areas than in others. But disengagement from society, politics, work, and a general malaise is in increasing problem.

[Calm]

10 hours ago, Frank11 said:

Because we are all children of God.

Of course we are different in character and our upbringing plays a major role in this, but in most cases this would only influence how conservative or liberal we would be. 

But brains are different, autists process differently than allistics; people with chronic depression look at things differently than those who don’t have it, etc.

Maybe I am missing your point (because my thought process is different  ).

[Frank11]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

But brains are different, autists process differently than allistics; people with chronic depression look at things differently than those who don’t have it, etc.

Maybe I am missing your point (because my thought process is different  ).

I must have expressed myself incorrectly and meant it more in connection with the original text. I'll try to explain it in more detail. A devout Muslim, like a devout Mormon, believes that his faith is the only true faith. The others only have parts of the truth. Those who do not accept my faith in the end or even mock it are lost to a certain extent, I in contrast will be rewarded for my faithfulness. There are similar thought patterns, especially between believing Christians, Muslims and Jews. Everyone tends to look down on the other “misguided” person to a greater or lesser extent because they are not doing what they believe God expects of them. I am primarily talking about believing adults here, but even atheists sometimes smile at believers for what they see as “pointless” efforts. Only small children, whom Jesus named as a role model, do not yet have this black and white thinking. 

Edited September 13, 2024 by Frank11

[Calm]

8 minutes ago, Frank11 said:

Everyone tends to look down on the other “misguided” person to a greater or lesser extent because they are not doing what they believe God expects of them

Are you open to the possibility of devout believers who do not have this thought pattern?  That believe while there is one true path, that there are many ways of walking it and others are not misguided if they chose to walk it differently, in fact it is very reasonable if they do?

Edited September 13, 2024 by Calm

[Frank11]

15 minutes ago, Calm said:

Are you open to the possibility of devout believers who do not have this thought pattern?  That believe while there is one true path, that there are many ways of walking it and others are not misguided if they chose to walk it differently, in fact it is very reasonable if they do?

Yes, that is a very commendable attitude.

[carbon dioxide]

16 hours ago, Calm said:

So?

When I say western nations re in decline I am looking forward not at the present.  For example at current projections the US may pay up to 9 trillion on interest of the debt over the next 10 years.  That is going to have an effect.  You will see what I mean over time.

[Stargazer]

On 9/11/2024 at 11:59 PM, The Nehor said:

You’re dancing around the point. D&C 134 says governments are ordained by God. Historically most governments are violent and awful. Talking about how God isn’t culpable is an argument but it doesn’t deal with the central point. If God ordains all governments God ordains a lot of bad governments and IS culpable. If God doesn’t ordain all governments everything makes more sense.

Just because governments are ordained by God, does not mean that every government or every act of any government is endorsed by God. Sex is ordained by God, but you wouldn't use that principle to say that God endorses rape. 

What particular disagreements do you have with D&C 134? Or do you feel that the entire thing is bogus?

[carbon dioxide]

21 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

CFR on both of these sentences. 

I partially misstated things.  Men are pretty stable.  It is the women that have gone off the rails.

"Forty-four percent of young women counted themselves liberal in 2021, compared to 25 percent of young men, according to Gallup Poll data analyzed by the Survey Center on American Life. The gender gap is the largest recorded in 24 years of polling. The finding culminates years of rising liberalism among women ages 18 to 29, without any increase among their male peers....

The share of men who identify as liberal has held fairly steady for almost 25 years, according to annual Gallup surveys. Roughly one-quarter of men ages 18 to 29 term themselves liberal, year after year.  Meanwhile, among young women, liberalism has exploded. In the late 1990s and early 2000s, fewer than 30 percent of women identified as liberal. The liberal camp grew through the second term of former President George W. Bush. It expanded further during the tenure of former President Obama. It reached 39 percent in 2017 with the inauguration of Trump. In the last two years, liberalism surged anew."

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3675477-young-women-are-trending-liberal-young-men-are-not/

 

As to men being more attracted to conservative women, I say attracted not in the physical sense of course and there are plenty of men that will have liberal girlfriends but being a guy and having watched a lot of videos on the subject, men trend towards more conservative women.  I would say to all young women if you want to increase your chances of dating and marriage, trend towards the conservative side.  

 

[carbon dioxide]

1 hour ago, carbon dioxide said:

I partially misstated things.  Men are pretty stable.  It is the women that have gone off the rails.

"Forty-four percent of young women counted themselves liberal in 2021, compared to 25 percent of young men, according to Gallup Poll data analyzed by the Survey Center on American Life. The gender gap is the largest recorded in 24 years of polling. The finding culminates years of rising liberalism among women ages 18 to 29, without any increase among their male peers....

The share of men who identify as liberal has held fairly steady for almost 25 years, according to annual Gallup surveys. Roughly one-quarter of men ages 18 to 29 term themselves liberal, year after year.  Meanwhile, among young women, liberalism has exploded. In the late 1990s and early 2000s, fewer than 30 percent of women identified as liberal. The liberal camp grew through the second term of former President George W. Bush. It expanded further during the tenure of former President Obama. It reached 39 percent in 2017 with the inauguration of Trump. In the last two years, liberalism surged anew."

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3675477-young-women-are-trending-liberal-young-men-are-not/

 

As to men being more attracted to conservative women, I say attracted not in the physical sense of course and there are plenty of men that will have liberal girlfriends but being a guy and having watched a lot of videos on the subject, men trend towards more conservative women.  I would say to all young women if you want to increase your chances of dating and marriage, trend towards the conservative side.  

It should not be a surprise that the number of women who have not been married by age 30 to 40 are at very high levels and its just going to go up.   Not a big problem now but in about 20 years when they have not kids or grand kids and they are getting old, who is going to look out for them?  Add to that that many are leaving religion which is a major source of social bonding, I believe a lot of women 30 years from now will be old and alone.  It will be pretty sad. 

 

 

[bluebell]

18 minutes ago, carbon dioxide said:

I partially misstated things.  Men are pretty stable.  It is the women that have gone off the rails.

"Forty-four percent of young women counted themselves liberal in 2021, compared to 25 percent of young men, according to Gallup Poll data analyzed by the Survey Center on American Life. The gender gap is the largest recorded in 24 years of polling. The finding culminates years of rising liberalism among women ages 18 to 29, without any increase among their male peers....

The share of men who identify as liberal has held fairly steady for almost 25 years, according to annual Gallup surveys. Roughly one-quarter of men ages 18 to 29 term themselves liberal, year after year.  Meanwhile, among young women, liberalism has exploded. In the late 1990s and early 2000s, fewer than 30 percent of women identified as liberal. The liberal camp grew through the second term of former President George W. Bush. It expanded further during the tenure of former President Obama. It reached 39 percent in 2017 with the inauguration of Trump. In the last two years, liberalism surged anew."

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3675477-young-women-are-trending-liberal-young-men-are-not/

 

As to men being more attracted to conservative women, I say attracted not in the physical sense of course and there are plenty of men that will have liberal girlfriends but being a guy and having watched a lot of videos on the subject, men trend towards more conservative women.  I would say to all young women if you want to increase your chances of dating and marriage, trend towards the conservative side.  

 

So, being a liberal = going off the rails?  Am I understanding you correctly?

From my perspective, I think a lot of times people tend to lean toward the ideology that gives them the most power and "takes care of their own".  For men, that's conservatism and for women it's liberalism.  

(I say that as a conservative woman)

[Calm]

1 hour ago, carbon dioxide said:

is the women that have gone off the rails.

😝  right, because how dare we women believe that equality is part of higher civilization 

Edited September 13, 2024 by Calm

[MiserereNobis]

1 hour ago, carbon dioxide said:

It is the women that have gone off the rails.

Explain, please.

1 hour ago, carbon dioxide said:

As to men being more attracted to conservative women, I say attracted not in the physical sense of course and there are plenty of men that will have liberal girlfriends but being a guy and having watched a lot of videos on the subject, men trend towards more conservative women. 

This does not satisfy the CFR. Please provide a reference beyond "I am a guy and I watch videos" that shows that men are more attracted to/trend towards conservative women. If you cannot, then please retract your statement.

[Calm]

1 hour ago, carbon dioxide said:

I would say to all young women if you want to increase your chances of dating and marriage, trend towards the conservative side.  

Reminds me of relatives and friends telling me to act dumb and above all else don’t talk about myself, but ask questions about the guy when giving me dating advice.

[supersc]

22 hours ago, Calm said:

Reminds me of relatives and friends telling me to act dumb and above all else don’t talk about myself, but ask questions about the guy when giving me dating advice.

That would be bad advice IMHO.  

We've recommended that all our children and grandchildren be themselves, and listen more than they speak... even if only slightly.

[teddyaware]

On 9/13/2024 at 6:26 PM, bluebell said:

So, being a liberal = going off the rails?  Am I understanding you correctly?

From my perspective, I think a lot of times people tend to lean toward the ideology that gives them the most power and "takes care of their own".  For men, that's conservatism and for women it's liberalism.  

(I say that as a conservative woman)

I can’t help but chuckle as I wonder how well this 1971 General Conference Address would be received by the members today’s church! The howling and blistering expressions of outrage would go on for months. The frog in the heating kettle of water analogy applies.

 

[bluebell]

35 minutes ago, teddyaware said:

I can’t help but chuckle as I wonder how well this 1971 General Conference Address would be received by the members today’s church! The howling and blistering expressions of outrage would go on for months. The frog in the heating kettle of water analogy applies.

 

It would be funny to see how well it would be received by the quorum of the 12 apostles and the prophet today. They would be howling with the rest of us.  

They are pretty good company to keep. 😁

[Duncan]

3 hours ago, teddyaware said:

I can’t help but chuckle as I wonder how well this 1971 General Conference Address would be received by the members today’s church! The howling and blistering expressions of outrage would go on for months. The frog in the heating kettle of water analogy applies.

 

I don't buy into your usual nonsense but if Pres. Benson knew the Church aligned itself with the NAACP he would split in two

https://newsroom.churchofjesuschrist.org/article/juneteenth-naacp-church-of-jesus-christ-2023

Said Joseph Smith, 

"“Our Heavenly Father is more liberal in his views, and boundless in his mercies and blessings, than we are ready to believe or receive, and, at the same time, is more terrible to the workers of iniquity, more awful in the executions of his punishments, and more ready to detect every false way than we are apt to suppose him to be"

 

Edited September 15, 2024 by Duncan
addition

[Peacefully]

On 9/13/2024 at 5:04 PM, carbon dioxide said:

I partially misstated things.  Men are pretty stable.  It is the women that have gone off the rails.

"Forty-four percent of young women counted themselves liberal in 2021, compared to 25 percent of young men, according to Gallup Poll data analyzed by the Survey Center on American Life. The gender gap is the largest recorded in 24 years of polling. The finding culminates years of rising liberalism among women ages 18 to 29, without any increase among their male peers....

The share of men who identify as liberal has held fairly steady for almost 25 years, according to annual Gallup surveys. Roughly one-quarter of men ages 18 to 29 term themselves liberal, year after year.  Meanwhile, among young women, liberalism has exploded. In the late 1990s and early 2000s, fewer than 30 percent of women identified as liberal. The liberal camp grew through the second term of former President George W. Bush. It expanded further during the tenure of former President Obama. It reached 39 percent in 2017 with the inauguration of Trump. In the last two years, liberalism surged anew."

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3675477-young-women-are-trending-liberal-young-men-are-not/

 

As to men being more attracted to conservative women, I say attracted not in the physical sense of course and there are plenty of men that will have liberal girlfriends but being a guy and having watched a lot of videos on the subject, men trend towards more conservative women.  I would say to all young women if you want to increase your chances of dating and marriage, trend towards the conservative side.  

 

Can you define “liberal woman”?