Robert J Anderson Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 5 minutes ago, Ipod Touch said: Nope. Nothing out of the usual. A couple of days of feeling sore/ill. Then back to normal. I did get covid after having received the vaccine but it was only a couple of days of being sick. So it seems that for me, the vaccine didn't prevent infection but it made my illness pretty mild. And given my risk factors, I think I made out pretty well. I support and promote the vaccine. But I oppose efforts to force people to take an experimental medicine. As I mentioned above, this is quite different from the polio or other vaccines that we've been taking for decades. It is no unreasonable to think there are a lot of unknowns re: the vaccine. And so I blame no one for being skeptical and taking a wait-and-see approach. Do I think they are making a mistake? Yep. Especially if they are at high risk -- which most Americans are because we are a bunch of land whales. I took the vaccine in May/June. I agree that those who are hesitant shouldn't be forced to take it. If they get it, I guess that's on them.
pogi Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, Harry T. Clark said: Take a look again and maybe listen to the interview with Dr. Walensky. She mentions your points. Also take a look at the quote in my post where Dr. Walensky claims the vaccines are effective. The site mentions what you say it doesn't. Nice try though. I haven’t listened to it. The script in the link you provided doesn’t mention that transmissibility is reduced. If the link does address all of this, then I have no idea how you think your point makes sense based on this link. If you agree that the vaccine is effective at reducing severe infection, and is effective at reducing transmission, than why can’t you understand why we are concerned that many people are choosing not to get vaccinated? Vaccination is our greatest hope to improve the hospital situation, reduce transmission, and prevent severe illness. Edited August 22, 2021 by pogi 2
Popular Post The Nehor Posted August 22, 2021 Popular Post Posted August 22, 2021 1 hour ago, Ipod Touch said: I read the documents I signed before receiving the vaccine. I have no legal recourse against the manufacturers. And frankly, I don't trust the government to compensate people fairly. call me crazy You get the same warning in the documents of EVERY vaccine in the US. If you do not get the compensation you seek through the arbitration process with the government you can take it to the courts to get compensation from the government. Unless you don't trust the courts either in which case why would you care about losing the ability to sue the company through the same court system? It is easier to get money out of the government than big pharma. Guess who has the better lawyers and more of a vested interest in shutting down any precedent for being sued? The lack of curiosity about this is annoying. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Childhood_Vaccine_Injury_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Vaccine_Injury_Compensation_Program Read that and educate anyone who comes at you with the "THEY DEMANDED NO LIABILITY SO YOU KNOW IT IS DANGEROUS" bit. 10
Popular Post The Nehor Posted August 22, 2021 Popular Post Posted August 22, 2021 1 hour ago, Robert J Anderson said: I took the vaccine in May/June. I agree that those who are hesitant shouldn't be forced to take it. If they get it, I guess that's on them. And on anyone else who dies because that person gave them Covid or on anyone who needs the hospital resources the unvaccinated person needs. 5
bsjkki Posted August 22, 2021 Posted August 22, 2021 https://worldmedicinefoundation.com/health-news/delta-variant-symptoms-the-key-different-symptoms-to-look-out-for/ 2
Calm Posted August 22, 2021 Author Posted August 22, 2021 Unfortunate as that is me waking up every ‘morning’ or after eating…don’t ask me why my nose now runs while eating, even with the blandest of foods. Ah well, good practice for control of anxiety.
Calm Posted August 23, 2021 Author Posted August 23, 2021 Just an interesting read… https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/08/will-pandemic-fatigue-change-how-we-process-disasters/619858/ 1
The Nehor Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 Here is a Reddit thread that is largely nurses discussing how things are going. Spoilers: It is bad. People are quitting everywhere. Patient to nurse/doctor ratios are getting worse. Seriously be careful and avoid dangerous activities if you are in areas where ICUs are overloaded. 2
Ipod Touch Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 (edited) On 8/22/2021 at 12:38 PM, The Nehor said: hospital resources the unvaccinated person needs. They should be vaccinated then, no? If an unvaccinated person gets severely ill, that's 100% on them. PSA: If you are worried about others not being vaccinated, then get vaccinated yourself. If you do: A) You won't get Covid (yay vaccines!!!) or B) Will get Covid but be sick for a few days (yay vaccines!!) Edited August 24, 2021 by Ipod Touch
Hamba Tuhan Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Ipod Touch said: If an unvaccinated person gets severely ill, that's 100% on them. You seem to be missing the fact that, when very large numbers of unvaccinated people consume a hugely disproportionate amount of finite hospital resources, that impacts literally every other person who needs access to hospital care, whether vaccinated or not, whether sick with something else or the victim or an accident. And then the impacts reach outside of the medical sphere and into every household: Quote Officials in Orlando, Florida, urged residents Friday to shorten their showers and cut down on watering their lawns and washing their cars because the city is running short on the liquid oxygen it uses to purify its water system with hospitals in the region using massive amounts of it to treat Covid-19 patients ... if water usage is not reduced and liquid oxygen remains in short supply, the water supply may be impacted, possibly requiring the need for a boil water advisory to be put into effect for an indefinite amount of time. Edited August 24, 2021 by Hamba Tuhan 2
Hamba Tuhan Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 1 hour ago, The Nehor said: Here is a Reddit thread that is largely nurses discussing how things are going. Spoilers: It is bad. Thanks for posting that. I went down the rabbit hole just a little bit ...
Ipod Touch Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 Unvaccinated adults 50+ are 17x more likely to die than vaxxed counterparts https://www.foxla.com/news/unvaccinated-adults-50-are-17x-more-likely-to-die-than-vaxxed-counterparts
Popular Post The Nehor Posted August 24, 2021 Popular Post Posted August 24, 2021 Just saw someone on my social media feed that announced that since the Pfizer vaccine now has full FDA authorization he got his first shot. He had a picture of the vaccination card. He got the Moderna vaccine. I mean, good I guess but….. 6
Robert J Anderson Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 5 hours ago, Ipod Touch said: Unvaccinated adults 50+ are 17x more likely to die than vaxxed counterparts https://www.foxla.com/news/unvaccinated-adults-50-are-17x-more-likely-to-die-than-vaxxed-counterparts It would help me counter my family who are hesitant if the above news report gave the data that supports the conclusions made. That question will be raised if I show them this report. I guess we are all becoming more science literate.
Calm Posted August 24, 2021 Author Posted August 24, 2021 13 minutes ago, Robert J Anderson said: It would help me counter my family who are hesitant if the above news report gave the data that supports the conclusions made. That question will be raised if I show them this report. I guess we are all becoming more science literate. Unfortunately the data isn’t shown. It is from LA County’s Public Health report: http://publichealth.lacounty.gov/phcommon/public/media/mediapubdetail.cfm?unit=media&ou=ph&prog=media&cur=cur&prid=3331&row=25&start=1
CA Steve Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 My DIL is an ER nurse in the Augusta Ga. area. She has a 30 min dive to and from work and will frequently call me on her way home at night just to talk. The last few weeks she has been quite emotional when she calls me because the situation in her hospital is so bad. She is on the verge of quiting because she is unable to give people the level of care they need. When she arrives to work there will be dozens and dozens of people in the ER waiting room, many of them have been there for hours, most of them there due to Covid. When she leaves there is just as many people as when she arrived which have been waiting just as long or longer. They do not have enough beds for the really sick so some of them are being put in wheelchairs which are supposed to have oxygen tanks, tanks they cannot refill fast enough due to demand and lack of personnel. She sees people bring in children as young as four weeks just to get tested for Covid who sit in that waiting room full of other Covid patients. ("If they didn't have it before they came, they do now". Don't people realize how easy it is to get tested elsewhere?") Most Covid patients are unvaccinated and are pleading for the vaccine. ("How can people be so stupid about how the vaccine works? If you already have Covid it is too late to get the vaccine!") She gets yelled at by some of the sick to administer Ivermectin to them, another erronous belief common in her area. ("They were hesitant to get the vaccine but want Ivermectin, sheesh!!!") One of her Covid patients was a Meth drug addict who was telling people he wouldn't get the vaccine because it was not FDA approved, unaware of the irony of a drug addict making such a statement. I don't really care what personel reasons people have for not getting vaccinated. I believe their actions are endangering the lives of others. If you have to go to my DIL's ER for something other than Covid, you will probably get it there too, to go along with whatever else brought your there. 3
Tacenda Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, CA Steve said: My DIL is an ER nurse in the Augusta Ga. area. She has a 30 min dive to and from work and will frequently call me on her way home at night just to talk. The last few weeks she has been quite emotional when she calls me because the situation in her hospital is so bad. She is on the verge of quiting because she is unable to give people the level of care they need. When she arrives to work there will be dozens and dozens of people in the ER waiting room, many of them have been there for hours, most of them there due to Covid. When she leaves there is just as many people as when she arrived which have been waiting just as long or longer. They do not have enough beds for the really sick so some of them are being put in wheelchairs which are supposed to have oxygen tanks, tanks they cannot refill fast enough due to demand and lack of personnel. She sees people bring in children as young as four weeks just to get tested for Covid who sit in that waiting room full of other Covid patients. ("If they didn't have it before they came, they do now". Don't people realize how easy it is to get tested elsewhere?") Most Covid patients are unvaccinated and are pleading for the vaccine. ("How can people be so stupid about how the vaccine works? If you already have Covid it is too late to get the vaccine!") She gets yelled at by some of the sick to administer Ivermectin to them, another erronous belief common in her area. ("They were hesitant to get the vaccine but want Ivermectin, sheesh!!!") One of her Covid patients was a Meth drug addict who was telling people he wouldn't get the vaccine because it was not FDA approved, unaware of the irony of a drug addict making such a statement. I don't really care what personel reasons people have for not getting vaccinated. I believe their actions are endangering the lives of others. If you have to go to my DIL's ER for something other than Covid, you will probably get it there too, to go along with whatever else brought your there. My heart breaks for your daughter in law! And then on the opposite side, I have my daughter and son-in-law tell me about someone they know that has kidney failure from getting the vaccine. I wanted to ask for proof, or explain that the vaccine wins out over the percentages that have side effects to that extreme. And I have a son that refuses to get one and another daughter that doesn't believe covid is real and another son that could care less. I have one child, my third son, out of 5 that got the vaccine! My children don't have or watch the news, sadly, and the more I push the more push back I get. So I'm pretty much up a creek. I'm hoping the FDA approval will convince them, at least the one son was willing to take another look if it became approved so now that it is, we'll see. Edited August 24, 2021 by Tacenda
Robert J Anderson Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Calm said: Unfortunately the data isn’t shown. It is from LA County’s Public Health report: http://publichealth.lacounty.gov/phcommon/public/media/mediapubdetail.cfm?unit=media&ou=ph&prog=media&cur=cur&prid=3331&row=25&start=1 This is a press release and doesn't included the raw data either. I looked at the LA County Health site and couldn't find the data either. Oh well.
pogi Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 10 hours ago, The Nehor said: Here is a Reddit thread that is largely nurses discussing how things are going. Spoilers: It is bad. People are quitting everywhere. Patient to nurse/doctor ratios are getting worse. Seriously be careful and avoid dangerous activities if you are in areas where ICUs are overloaded. Frontline needs to do a documentary of ICU/ER/medsurge RNs during COVID. I don't think people really get what is going on. 3
The Nehor Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 Sorry for bringing so much dark into the thread. Have a laugh:
bsjkki Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309762 Study of vaccine vs natural infection rates. From July. I keep looking for more numbers. Delta doesn't really care about vaccination status for infection but hopefully, drastically reduces hospitalization and death. *My fully vaccinated in laws have covid but so far, they are doing fine. They are 79. They had no fever, no loss of taste of smell. Drippy noses, cough. My father in law went to the dr. early last week and the doctor didn't test for covid because he was sure he didn't have it. My mother in law got tested and she did and he then got tested and was positive. Be careful with mild cold symptoms. Because they thought it was 'just a cold' or allergies they exposed a lot of people. They most likely got it from working in the temple. 4
pogi Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, bsjkki said: https://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/309762 Study of vaccine vs natural infection rates. From July. I keep looking for more numbers. Delta doesn't really care about vaccination status for infection but hopefully, drastically reduces hospitalization and death. I would be cautious in suggesting that "Delta doesn't really care about vaccination status for infection". While natural immunity may be more effective (I think that needs to be looked at further as it appears there is disagreement on interpreting the data), vaccination is still much better at protection against infection from COVID than nothing: Quote Two doses of mRNA vaccines were 74.7% effective against infection among nursing home residents early in the vaccination program (March–May 2021). During June–July 2021, when B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant circulation predominated, effectiveness declined significantly to 53.1%. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7034e3.htm Also, there is this - for anyone wanting to rely on natural immunity alone: Quote In today’s MMWR, a study of COVID-19 infections in Kentucky among people who were previously infected with SAR-CoV-2 shows that unvaccinated individuals are more than twice as likely to be reinfected with COVID-19 than those who were fully vaccinated after initially contracting the virus. These data further indicate that COVID-19 vaccines offer better protection than natural immunity alone and that vaccines, even after prior infection, help prevent reinfections. https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html#:~:text=In today's MMWR%2C a study,after initially contracting the virus. 1 hour ago, bsjkki said: Be careful with mild cold symptoms. Because they thought it was 'just a cold' or allergies they exposed a lot of people. Thank you for posting this - it needs to be said. Not to mention the RSV going around which can be mild in adults. Edited August 24, 2021 by pogi 3
The Nehor Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 4 hours ago, pogi said: Frontline needs to do a documentary of ICU/ER/medsurge RNs during COVID. I don't think people really get what is going on.
bsjkki Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 3 hours ago, pogi said: Also, there is this - for anyone wanting to rely on natural immunity alone: The studies I am looking for are the numbers of people with reinfections vs being vaccinated and comparisons between vaccinated and the naturally immune. Those are hard to find. It has been shown in 3 studies cited by the CDC that for those who have had covid, they gain more immunity by getting vaccinated (and show one shot is probably enough.) It is less clear if the naturally immune or only vaccinated are better off. If you have find numbers or studies that compare these two groups, I would like to read them. Interesting interview if you follow the link in the article. https://sharylattkisson.com/2021/08/u-s-official-finally-acknowledges-covid-19-natural-immunity-as-good-as-vaccine/ "No data showing vaccine immunity is greater than natural immunity." 1
Hamba Tuhan Posted August 24, 2021 Posted August 24, 2021 1 hour ago, bsjkki said: The studies I am looking for are the numbers of people with reinfections vs being vaccinated and comparisons between vaccinated and the naturally immune. Those are hard to find. On the first page of this thread, I posted a link to lab research on this exact topic. Whether that translates to real life or not seems unclear. 2
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