Avatar4321 Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 Listening to the talk president Nelson gave to the sisters, the fast was only 1 of 4 invitations he made. how many of those rejecting the first and most likely easiest one are doing any of the others?
Popular Post Garden Girl Posted October 9, 2018 Popular Post Posted October 9, 2018 (edited) 13 hours ago, sunstoned said: I think it is just silly. Things like this lead me to believe that the leadership is out of touch. People connect through social media. Please support each other through social media. People stay in touch through social media. A ten day social media fast is about as silly as asking president Nelson to take a ten day telephone fast. I had the opportunity the other day to sit in a mall situation, and as I did I observed the numerous people walking along... I was appalled and amused by what I saw... almost without exception, people were walking along with heads down, eyes riveted on the device held in their hand... unaware of their surroundings... others walking were talking on their phones... those sitting near me were talking loudly into their phones until I wanted to stand up and shout at them... IF I WANTED TO LISTEN TO YOUR STUPID CONVERSATION... Last year at a family gathering nearly everyone, particularly the younger ones, were sitting around engrossed in whatever they were doing on their devices vs interacting meaningfully with each other... sad really, because I remember such gatherings when conversation was lively, backyard volleyball/badminton exciting, the generations melding as we developed relationships... what a difference from when I was a girl... I think a fast from devices and social media is a wonderful suggestion. And, the uproar over this proves just how addicted we have become to our devices and how in touch our leaders really are with the effect on families/individuals... Individuals could still carry a device for emergencies and/or safety... just stay off of them... for instance, I carry a gun in my car (w/permit to carry concealed) as well as a trac phone in my purse for safety... I'm going to start my fast from even this board and checking in on my facebook for family... GG Edited October 9, 2018 by Garden Girl 9
MorningStar Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, stemelbow said: I'm still perplexed why Mormon women are on here condemning other Mormon women who have objected to the directive to fast for their various reasons. I think we all should happily acknowledge that some women feel marginalized and they have a valuable voice. These attempts to shut down and fight those people seems counter-productive to me. My wife always said the biggest obstacle from women getting a seat at the table in Mormonism are other women. She definitely got tired of the rancor, manipulation, and condescension. I don't think looking for reasons to be offended is valuable and that's what I see from a lot of members after conference. That's what perplexes me. Edited October 9, 2018 by MorningStar 2
Jeanne Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 14 hours ago, Calm said: I won't be doing it right away...maybe once my back allows to move more. Unless physical therapy in .wednesday is a minor miracle. I hope things get better for you Calm. My prayers are with you in overcoming the health issues you deal with.
Jeanne Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 3 hours ago, Avatar4321 said: Nooooooooo! jk Gee thanks...!!!😋
The Nehor Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Storm Rider said: At a recent family get-together, I recall observing as we all sat together throughout the home, how many individuals were on their phones rather than talking to the people around them. It is just strange how we think that the people on the phone are more important than the people right in front of us. Do I think we need to put the phone down? Absolutely. Do I think the prophet is right to ask any of us to give up social media and be present for the people around us? Yes. I just wish that my home had a button that would shut down completely the ability for phones to receive social media of any kind. I think it would help humans to relearn how to be better social individuals. People who find themselves ignored in favor of phones need to look within themselves for the problem.
The Nehor Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 1 hour ago, stemelbow said: I'm still perplexed why Mormon women are on here condemning other Mormon women who have objected to the directive to fast for their various reasons. I think we all should happily acknowledge that some women feel marginalized and they have a valuable voice. These attempts to shut down and fight those people seems counter-productive to me. My wife always said the biggest obstacle from women getting a seat at the table in Mormonism are other women. She definitely got tired of the rancor, manipulation, and condescension. I have gotten divine personal exemptions from invitations and even a few commandments in the gospel along with getting a few extra commandments. Know why no one bugs me about it? Because I do not scream loudly about it. 2
ttribe Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Storm Rider said: Lastly, I do have to wonder about these women that are complaining; are they really active members of the Church as a whole or are they just individuals who may have had a relationship in the distant past with the Church and are no longer attending church or attempting to live a Christ-centered life? I guess we can consider that well poisoned at this point. Edited October 9, 2018 by ttribe
stemelbow Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 1 hour ago, MorningStar said: I don't think looking for reasons to be offended is valuable and that's what I see from a lot of members after conference. That's what perplexes me. Can you clarify? This feels largely off topic and disconnected from what was said. Who is looking for reasons to be offended? The ladies who object to the fast? How do you know their motivations? And aren't we talking about a bunch of people you don't know? I still go back to my wife's impression, it sure seems like Mormon women treat other Mormon women as enemies a lot. I don't see why. It's perplexing.
pogi Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, stemelbow said: I'm still perplexed why Mormon women are on here condemning other Mormon women who have objected to the directive to fast for their various reasons. I think we all should happily acknowledge that some women feel marginalized and they have a valuable voice. These attempts to shut down and fight those people seems counter-productive to me. My wife always said the biggest obstacle from women getting a seat at the table in Mormonism are other women. She definitely got tired of the rancor, manipulation, and condescension. Women feel marginalized over this? I think you have it backwards. The prophet is not marginalizing women by inviting them to fast from social media, it is those who object and ridicule the prophet, calling him out-of-touch, who are marginalizing the prophet. He is offering them an opportunity for real spiritual growth, to be more mindful (people get lost in their phones as Garden Girl points out), to be more introspective, to be more aware of and connected with our loved ones around them, to disconnect from measuring themselves against the lives of others, to slow down the influx of constant digital information and allow time for spiritual processing, to disconnect from the digital world and reconnect with the spiritual world. TS Eliot's words are more true today then ever before: Quote Where is the wisdom we have lost in knowledge? Where is the knowledge we have lost in information? Women do have a voice, but when they use it to marginalize the prophet over an innocent and sound invitation to reconnect with themselves and the world around them, then they will get push back from me. Edited October 9, 2018 by pogi 2
stemelbow Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 23 minutes ago, The Nehor said: I have gotten divine personal exemptions from invitations and even a few commandments in the gospel along with getting a few extra commandments. Know why no one bugs me about it? Because I do not scream loudly about it. So you're saying if they heard you talking about it they'd bug you about it? Bug in what way?
stemelbow Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 1 minute ago, pogi said: I think you have it backwards. The prophet is not marginalizing women by inviting them to fast from social media, it is those who object and ridicule the prophet, calling him out-of-touch, who are marginalizing the prophet. You've clearly not considered my point. I didn't say anything about the prophet marginalizing people. I didn't say anything about those who object to his invite and whether they are right or wrong in doing so. I merely pointed out that many Mormon women are quick to condemn and attack other Mormon women in this case and many others. 1 minute ago, pogi said: He is offering them an opportunity for real spiritual growth, to be more mindful (people get lost in their phones as Garden Girl points out), to be more introspective, to be more aware of and connected with our loved ones around them, to disconnect from measuring themselves against the lives of others, to slow down the influx of constant digital information and allow time for spiritual processing, to disconnect from the digital world and reconnect with the spiritual world. TS Eliot's words are more true today then ever before: Women do have a voice, but when they use it to marginalize the prophet, then they will get push back from me. Every grown up I've ever known takes breaks from social media as long as it doesn't disrupt work or other important ventures. I'm not sure telling women to take a break from it is all that interesting, innovative, nor prophetic. I think most who have decided not to fast, have seen it as rather patronizing. I get their point. I don't see the point in attacking them for their very worthwhile point. That's all I'm saying about it. It seems you have misread, misunderstood or assumed much.
Popular Post pogi Posted October 9, 2018 Popular Post Posted October 9, 2018 11 minutes ago, stemelbow said: You've clearly not considered my point. I didn't say anything about the prophet marginalizing people. I didn't say anything about those who object to his invite and whether they are right or wrong in doing so. I merely pointed out that many Mormon women are quick to condemn and attack other Mormon women in this case and many others. Every grown up I've ever known takes breaks from social media as long as it doesn't disrupt work or other important ventures. I'm not sure telling women to take a break from it is all that interesting, innovative, nor prophetic. I think most who have decided not to fast, have seen it as rather patronizing. I get their point. I don't see the point in attacking them for their very worthwhile point. That's all I'm saying about it. It seems you have misread, misunderstood or assumed much. Sorry if I misunderstood. Your problem is about women speaking out against other women. I don’t understand that line of thinking at all. If a woman marginalizes the prophet and his counsel, she is thereby marginalizing all those women who sustain him and hold to his counsel. How is that better? Do women not have a right to speak out against messages they disagree with, or should we marginalize them even further? It is my pet peeve when sex is always brought into issues. Women are not what we are speaking out against. We don’t have an issue with their sex speaking out. We are speaking out against the horrible messages they are spreading, ironically through social media. 5
RevTestament Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 3 hours ago, The Mean Farmer said: When the Men are asked to abstain from porn, video games, and social media in the Spring I will happily do that fast as well. The way you worded this makes it sound... Well, hopefully rather than a fast from Porn, it will be abstinence.
The Nehor Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 38 minutes ago, stemelbow said: So you're saying if they heard you talking about it they'd bug you about it? Bug in what way? Probably telling me to humble myself and be obedient to the general commandments. Or worse, if I shared those exceptions and commandments others might try to excuse themselves in what is disobedience for them or obey commandments not intended for them.
ttribe Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 3 minutes ago, The Nehor said: Probably telling me to humble myself and be obedient to the general commandments. Or worse, if I shared those exceptions and commandments others might try to excuse themselves in what is disobedience for them or obey commandments not intended for them. Humble yourself and be obedient! Can you give me a list of these exceptions so I can use them, too? 😉
The Nehor Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 5 minutes ago, ttribe said: Humble yourself and be obedient! Can you give me a list of these exceptions so I can use them, too? 😉 No and no. 😞
The Nehor Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 16 minutes ago, RevTestament said: The way you worded this makes it sound... Well, hopefully rather than a fast from Porn, it will be abstinence. Baby steps.
stemelbow Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 44 minutes ago, pogi said: Sorry if I misunderstood. Your problem is about women speaking out against other women. I don’t understand that line of thinking at all. I don't care if women speak out against other women. My goodness, talk and share. I dont' care. It's more about Mormon women using social media, not to speak out against, but to actually condemn other women for choosing not to fast from social media. I find it ironical, at least, and pretty mean-spirited otherwise. 44 minutes ago, pogi said: If a woman marginalizes the prophet and his counsel, she is thereby marginalizing all those women who sustain him and hold to his counsel. I see, so anyone who disagrees with a teaching, idea, or policy that a church leader espouses is marginalizing anyone who doesn't disagree with that leader? I find that a silly idea on the face of it. But, pogi, I'm glad you said it. Because I certainly could not understand why Mormon women are using social media to condemn other Mormon women who feel a bit marginalized by the prophet and the rest of the leadership. 44 minutes ago, pogi said: How is that better? Do women not have a right to speak out against messages they disagree with, or should we marginalize them even further? Sure. It's anyone's right to condemn others for stating their opinion. And it's my right to point out what I see. 44 minutes ago, pogi said: It is my pet peeve when sex is always brought into issues. Women are not what we are speaking out against. We don’t have an issue with their sex speaking out. We are speaking out against the horrible messages they are spreading, ironically through social media. I dont' mind people taking issue with their opinions at all.
Storm Rider Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 54 minutes ago, pogi said: Sorry if I misunderstood. Your problem is about women speaking out against other women. I don’t understand that line of thinking at all. If a woman marginalizes the prophet and his counsel, she is thereby marginalizing all those women who sustain him and hold to his counsel. How is that better? Do women not have a right to speak out against messages they disagree with, or should we marginalize them even further? It is my pet peeve when sex is always brought into issues. Women are not what we are speaking out against. We don’t have an issue with their sex speaking out. We are speaking out against the horrible messages they are spreading, ironically through social media. Pogi, please get on board with the Left. I can criticize you all I want about anything I want whenever I want. However, you may not ever criticize anything I may ever think, do, or say because I am right and you are unforgivably wrong. Women are only victims and if the right kind of woman speaks, then you must absolutely stop thinking, stop talking, and accept what is said as the truth....always. It gets so tiring to listen to this drivel. It is like they carry this weight around and refuse to put it down. Playing the martyr is so much more gratifying than actually thinking with your mind and engaging in sincere conversation.
pogi Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 (edited) 21 minutes ago, stemelbow said: I don't care if women speak out against other women. My goodness, talk and share. I dont' care. It's more about Mormon women using social media, not to speak out against, but to actually condemn other women for choosing not to fast from social media. Maybe it is all in how you interpret "speaking out against" and "condemning". I don't see anyone "condemning" other women, we are speaking out against them. 21 minutes ago, stemelbow said: I see, so anyone who disagrees with a teaching, idea, or policy that a church leader espouses is marginalizing anyone who doesn't disagree with that leader? No, that is not what I said. There is a distinct difference between disagreeing with a prophet and publicly condemning his message and marginalizing him by saying that the prophet is "out-of-touch". A person can disagree with a prophet without marginalizing him. To simply disagree with the prophet is NOT to marginalize his followers, but anytime a person marginalizes a leader (from the church or not), they marginalize his/her followers. There is no escaping it. If a leader is criticized as being "out-of-touch", then so to are his followers - it goes without saying. Edited October 9, 2018 by pogi 1
The Mean Farmer Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 1 hour ago, RevTestament said: The way you worded this makes it sound... Well, hopefully rather than a fast from Porn, it will be abstinence. I though about wording that differently for a few minutes, but thought it would be fun to see the reactions to the poorly worded sentence. I think it is definitely worth it. And I did actually say use the word abstain instead of fast. I hope Pres. Nelson includes Anime and reality TV in there as well.
The Nehor Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 25 minutes ago, Storm Rider said: Pogi, please get on board with the Left. I can criticize you all I want about anything I want whenever I want. However, you may not ever criticize anything I may ever think, do, or say because I am right and you are unforgivably wrong. Women are only victims and if the right kind of woman speaks, then you must absolutely stop thinking, stop talking, and accept what is said as the truth....always. It gets so tiring to listen to this drivel. It is like they carry this weight around and refuse to put it down. Playing the martyr is so much more gratifying than actually thinking with your mind and engaging in sincere conversation. Give that straw man what for! 3
The Nehor Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Mean Farmer said: I though about wording that differently for a few minutes, but thought it would be fun to see the reactions to the poorly worded sentence. I think it is definitely worth it. And I did actually say use the word abstain instead of fast. I hope Pres. Nelson includes Anime and reality TV in there as well. Throw wasting time watching sports in there too while we are at it. I suspect there is a reason we have a prophet offering these kinds of things and not a bunch of curmudgeons such as myself picking on all our pet peeves.
stemelbow Posted October 9, 2018 Posted October 9, 2018 20 minutes ago, pogi said: Maybe it is all in how you interpret "speaking out against" and "condemning". I don't see anyone "condemning" other women, we are speaking out against them. No, that is not what I said. There is a distinct difference between disagreeing with a prophet and publicly condemning his message and marginalizing him by saying that the prophet is "out-of-touch". A person can disagree with a prophet without marginalizing him. To simply disagree with the prophet is NOT to marginalize his followers, but anytime a person marginalizes a leader (from the church or not), they marginalize his/her followers. There is no escaping it. If a leader is criticized as being "out-of-touch", then so to are his followers - it goes without saying. I admit I don't even know who you are condemning with this "out-of-touch" business. I suppose I missed something. I"m just thinking of all the women who have chosen not to fast. Someone early on seemed to say something like, "if my daugher's young woman's leader said she wasn't going to fast, I'd have a problem with it" (not a quote...I admit I'm not eager to back and re-read the thread as there was plenty of unpleasantries if you ask me, and as I recall) or something. That feels personal and condemning to me. Saying some leader of the Church is out of touch on something like this, seems a general observation and has nothing to do with condemning. But again, I don't know what you are talking about. Im just commenting on the OP's observation of a daughter-in-law and her ward friends deciding not to fast.
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