theplains Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 I had an observation and question about this specific talk. https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2017/10/the-plan-and-the-proclamation?lang=eng God created this earth according to His plan to provide His spirit children a place to experience mortality as a necessary step toward the glories He desires for all His children. While there are various kingdoms and glories, our Heavenly Father’s ultimate desire for His children is what President Monson called “eternal life in the kingdom of God,” which is exaltation in families. This is more than salvation. President Russell M. Nelson has reminded us, “In God’s eternal plan, salvation is an individual matter; [but] exaltation is a family matter.” The Religion 430-431 - Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual said Jesus became a god when he reached a pinnacle of intelligence and was ranked as a god - being married was not a pre-condition to exaltation. In LDS theology, did the Holy Spirit also become a god without being married? Thanks, Jim
ksfisher Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 10 minutes ago, theplains said: I had an observation and question about this specific talk. https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2017/10/the-plan-and-the-proclamation?lang=eng God created this earth according to His plan to provide His spirit children a place to experience mortality as a necessary step toward the glories He desires for all His children. While there are various kingdoms and glories, our Heavenly Father’s ultimate desire for His children is what President Monson called “eternal life in the kingdom of God,” which is exaltation in families. This is more than salvation. President Russell M. Nelson has reminded us, “In God’s eternal plan, salvation is an individual matter; [but] exaltation is a family matter.” The Religion 430-431 - Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual said Jesus became a god when he reached a pinnacle of intelligence and was ranked as a god - being married was not a pre-condition to exaltation. In LDS theology, did the Holy Spirit also become a god without being married? Thanks, Jim Could you provide a link or the exact quote from the Religion 430-431 manual? 1
Rivers Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 Yes. The Holy Ghost is part of the Godhead/Trinity. So obviously a god. I guess godhood and exaltation aren't necessarily the same thing. 2
cdowis Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Rivers said: Yes. The Holy Ghost is part of the Godhead/Trinity. So obviously a god. I guess godhood and exaltation aren't necessarily the same thing. Heb 1 [2] Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds; Heb 5 [8] Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;[9] And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Edited October 4, 2017 by cdowis 1
JLHPROF Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Rivers said: Yes. The Holy Ghost is part of the Godhead/Trinity. So obviously a god. I guess godhood and exaltation aren't necessarily the same thing. Maybe he was just a god, not a God to begin with. Isn't that how it works? Seriously though, we know the requirements for exaltation and godhood. Christ either met them some how in the premortal existence or was not fully God until after his resurrection. Kind of like the first counselor is not the Bishop/President even though they are part of the Bishopric/Presidency. Which would also apply to the Holy Ghost if he has yet to receive a body. Edited October 4, 2017 by JLHPROF 1
Duncan Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 One thing to keep in mind is that while exaltation is a family affair we aren't dependant on them for exaltation. So, if someone in my family turns rogue it isn't that the rest of us are doomed forever because of them, it's dependant on the Saviour's Atonement. It's not like a bathtub and someone in your family pulls the plug and "all yall" go heading for the drain, it's that we can't do it alone we need Christ and our family to get there and help through here 1
JLHPROF Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 8 minutes ago, Duncan said: One thing to keep in mind is that while exaltation is a family affair we aren't dependant on them for exaltation. So, if someone in my family turns rogue it isn't that the rest of us are doomed forever because of them, it's dependant on the Saviour's Atonement. It's not like a bathtub and someone in your family pulls the plug and "all yall" go heading for the drain, it's that we can't do it alone we need Christ and our family to get there and help through here Except that we ARE dependent upon family for exaltation. That doesn't mean if our family "turn rogue" that we cannot be blessed with new family. But family is still absolutely required for exaltation.
Duncan Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 Just now, JLHPROF said: Except that we ARE dependent upon family for exaltation. That doesn't mean if our family "turn rogue" that we cannot be blessed with new family. But family is still absolutely required for exaltation. What I am saying is it's not all or nothing, we aren't dependant on others for exaltation. How far back to we go for family anyways? Why would you want a new family anyways? unless they are Edmonton Oiler supports then I can see
JLHPROF Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 8 minutes ago, Duncan said: What I am saying is it's not all or nothing, we aren't dependant on others for exaltation. How far back to we go for family anyways? Why would you want a new family anyways? unless they are Edmonton Oiler supports then I can see We are not dependent on the decisions of others for exaltation. But it is impossible to be exalted singly. How to resolve that? A new family. Preferably one who supports the Calgary Flames. 1
Duncan Posted October 4, 2017 Posted October 4, 2017 1 minute ago, JLHPROF said: We are not dependent on the decisions of others for exaltation. But it is impossible to be exalted singly. How to resolve that? A new family. Preferably one who supports the Calgary Flames. I think we are saying the same thing here, the Flames
Calm Posted October 5, 2017 Posted October 5, 2017 3 hours ago, Duncan said: I think we are saying the same thing here, the Flames We still have a number of Calgary Flames t-shirts in the house. 1
Duncan Posted October 5, 2017 Posted October 5, 2017 58 minutes ago, Calm said: We still have a number of Calgary Flames t-shirts in the house. I do too actually! only one though, the other got burned
Kenngo1969 Posted October 5, 2017 Posted October 5, 2017 6 hours ago, JLHPROF said: ... Seriously though, we know the requirements for exaltation and godhood. Christ either met them some how in the premortal existence or was not fully God until after his resurrection. ... I believe the latter. Compare Matthew 5:48 and 3 Nephi 12:48.
JLHPROF Posted October 5, 2017 Posted October 5, 2017 14 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said: I believe the latter. Compare Matthew 5:48 and 3 Nephi 12:48. I agree. But expressing that Christ wasn't fully God in premortality can get you in trouble these days. Since Jehovah in the OT was clearly fully God.
Storm Rider Posted October 5, 2017 Posted October 5, 2017 (edited) I tend to think that we divert into splitting hairs on these types of topics. Here is what we know: The three members of the Godhood are Father, Son, and Holy Ghost...full stop. Attempting to define how much an individual member is God is to attack the unity of the Godhood. For me, it is simply better to say, "I don't know; more importantly, I don't care." When questions attempt to scrutinize the issues beyond which we have been given information then it has little value. I just find it safer to say that Jesus was a full member of the Godhood as was the Holy Spirit. They were not half members or some percentage of a member; they are full members of the Godhood. Edited October 5, 2017 by Storm Rider 4
Avatar4321 Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 what can we do to take the proclamation more seriously?
mfbukowski Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 On 10/4/2017 at 1:56 PM, theplains said: I had an observation and question about this specific talk. https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2017/10/the-plan-and-the-proclamation?lang=eng God created this earth according to His plan to provide His spirit children a place to experience mortality as a necessary step toward the glories He desires for all His children. While there are various kingdoms and glories, our Heavenly Father’s ultimate desire for His children is what President Monson called “eternal life in the kingdom of God,” which is exaltation in families. This is more than salvation. President Russell M. Nelson has reminded us, “In God’s eternal plan, salvation is an individual matter; [but] exaltation is a family matter.” The Religion 430-431 - Doctrines of the Gospel Student Manual said Jesus became a god when he reached a pinnacle of intelligence and was ranked as a god - being married was not a pre-condition to exaltation. In LDS theology, did the Holy Spirit also become a god without being married? Thanks, Jim No one knows how that works I happen to think She is married. 1
mfbukowski Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 On 10/4/2017 at 2:30 PM, JLHPROF said: Seriously though, we know the requirements for exaltation and godhood. Actually come to think of it, we only know those requirements for US. There may be other requirements for others. That never occurred to me before so thanks for mentioning it. As we know "what was done on other worlds" may be different.
Kenngo1969 Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 16 minutes ago, Avatar4321 said: what can we do to take the proclamation more seriously? Memorize it? (That's on my to-do list.) 1
mfbukowski Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 On 10/4/2017 at 3:05 PM, Duncan said: One thing to keep in mind is that while exaltation is a family affair we aren't dependant on them for exaltation. So, if someone in my family turns rogue it isn't that the rest of us are doomed forever because of them, it's dependant on the Saviour's Atonement. It's not like a bathtub and someone in your family pulls the plug and "all yall" go heading for the drain, it's that we can't do it alone we need Christ and our family to get there and help through here I think you have just broken some huge cosmic rule and the world is therefore doomed. Canadians are not allowed to say "all y'all"
Duncan Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 7 minutes ago, mfbukowski said: I think you have just broken some huge cosmic rule and the world is therefore doomed. Canadians are not allowed to say "all y'all" well in that case i'll wash my mouth out with American flaaaaag soap then https://www.soapqueen.com/bath-and-body-tutorials/melt-and-pour-soap/american-flag-soap-final-reveal-2/ 1
mfbukowski Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 3 hours ago, Duncan said: well in that case i'll wash my mouth out with American flaaaaag soap then https://www.soapqueen.com/bath-and-body-tutorials/melt-and-pour-soap/american-flag-soap-final-reveal-2/ This is a very odd world. 1
Duncan Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 6 minutes ago, mfbukowski said: This is a very odd world. I should say so!
Avatar4321 Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 5 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said: Memorize it? (That's on my to-do list.) Already started on that 1
mfbukowski Posted October 6, 2017 Posted October 6, 2017 9 hours ago, Avatar4321 said: Already started on that You know we are in for a tough time on this issue. Tougher than now even. What's your prediction on the future?
Recommended Posts