Church and child abuse

[Thinking]

Quote

The following article was published in 2010. Some bloggers have written that the Church “re-released” this article on February 1, 2016. The article was not intended to be re-released. Because of a technical error on the website, some past articles have been showing up with the current date. Because of that issue, some understandably saw this as a current release from the Church.

The question about whether the Church monitors bloggers has been answered.

[stemelbow]

37 minutes ago, smac97 said:

The re-posting was accidental:

You weren't the only one to jump to an uncharitable conclusion (Jane Reiss did too).

Thanks,

-Smac

 

Fewf! that is a big relief to me to think it was a mistake rather than something purposeful. 

[smac97]

Just now, will227457 said:

In a normal world when people are victims or family members are victims the police should be called immediately....in this case that I know of the bishop didn't advise the victims mother to call the police until after he spoke with his 1st counsler (who happens to be a cop). Guess what he said.....

The operative word in the foregoing being "should."  Sometimes this happens.  Sometimes it doesn't.  Berating people who have just barely discovered a horrific thing for not doing what they probably "should" do about that thing is not helpful.

I can't speak to your anecdote.  The Church has published a pamphlet: Preventing and Responding to Child Abuse: Helps for Members.  In this manual the instructions are as follows:

Quote

Reporting Child Abuse

Anyone who knows or has cause to believe that a child has been or is a victim of physical, emotional, or sexual abuse has a solemn responsibility to do something constructive about the situation. A child’s mental and physical well-being may be in jeopardy.

The laws of most countries require that proper authorities be notified when child abuse is known or suspected. Persons with such information should determine their legal responsibilities and act in accordance with them. They should also contact their bishop for counsel and direction.

The Church also has this article on its "Topics" page:

Quote

Abuse

Abuse is the treatment of others or self in a way that causes injury or offense. It harms the mind and the spirit and often injures the body as well. It can cause confusion, doubt, mistrust, and fear. It is a violation of the laws of society and is in total opposition to the teachings of the Savior. The Lord condemns abusive behavior in any form—physical, sexual, verbal, or emotional. Abusive behavior may lead to Church discipline.

Additional Information

Those who have been abusive in any relationship are urged to repent of their sin, to plead with the Lord for forgiveness, and to ask for forgiveness from those who have been harmed. Those who have been abusive should also speak with their bishop or branch president so he can help them through the repentance process and, if necessary, help them receive additional counseling or other assistance. Part of the repentance process may also include accepting whatever penalties are imposed by law.

Victims of abuse should seek help immediately, normally from their bishop or branch president. His first responsibility is to help those who have been abused and to protect those who may be vulnerable to future abuse.

Victims of abuse should be assured that they are not to blame for the harmful behavior of others. They do not need to feel guilt. If they have been a victim of rape or other sexual abuse, whether they have been abused by an acquaintance, a stranger, or even a family member, victims of sexual abuse are not guilty of sexual sin.

Victims of abuse can seek help from their priesthood leader to guide them through the process of emotional healing. Through the blessings of the gospel, victims of abuse can stop the cycle of abuse and be freed from the suffering they have experienced.

Bishops, in turn, have a hotline to call when such issues arise, which sends them to attorneys for prompt and accurate legal advice.

Thanks,

-Smac

 

[Calm]

24 minutes ago, Thinking said:

The question about whether the Church monitors bloggers has been answered.

It could have been a reporter asking for information about the release and why it was done.  Or a friend of an employee drawing their attention to it.

Not saying they don't.  I think it would be a good idea for the Church leadership to make use of the internet to keep track of discussions going on about it and things related to it so they have that input on what is important to people.

Edited February 2, 2016 by Calm

[Calm]

31 minutes ago, will227457 said:

In a normal world when people are victims or family members are victims the police should be called immediately....in this case that I know of the bishop didn't advise the victims mother to call the police until after he spoke with his 1st counsler (who happens to be a cop). Guess what he said.....

When did this occur?

Hopefully the cop told him the legal requirements for the area and encouraged him to act accordingly.

[will227457]

22 minutes ago, smac97 said:

The operative word in the foregoing being "should."  Sometimes this happens.  Sometimes it doesn't.  Berating people who have just barely discovered a horrific thing for not doing what they probably "should" do about that thing is not helpful.

 

This is the second time you have accused me of berating people, please show me where I did.

[will227457]

6 minutes ago, Calm said:

When did this occur?

Hopefully the cop told him the legal requirements for the area and encouraged him to act accordingly.

Yes in fact he said "why did you have to call me to figure this out"

The perpetrator is now in jail, looking at a long sentence

Edited February 2, 2016 by will227457

[Nofear]

The article has its shortcomings and that would have been true in 2010 too (the new topics post does better while still using much of the 2010 one). But I don't recall a social media/blog response then.

[Calm]

20 minutes ago, will227457 said:

Yes in fact he said "why did you have to call me to figure this out"

The perpetrator is now in jail, looking at a long sentence

Sounds like they ended up where they should be even if there was a slight delay (minutes?).  I can see a bishop who was very familiar and comfortable with a cop (who just happened to be his first counselor) getting the impulse to call him first because of concern of doing the right thing and this was a new occurrence for him, especially given that this appears to have been a major crime reported to him (assuming this from the long sentence).  Do you know if he also called the hotline?  We have a friend who is a paramedic/former cop and we call him quite a bit with questions in that line.  And family and friends that are doctors and nurses are often our first call in emergencies that we are not quite sure about.  In fact, last two times I hit the emergency room it was after a call to or advice from a friend (one was a nurse, the other our paramedic friend) present saying it was time.

You didn't say when this occurred?  Is it in the last decade and a half?  I think that has been how long the hotline process has been established.

Edited February 2, 2016 by Calm

[Calm]

15 minutes ago, Nofear said:

The article has its shortcomings and that would have been true in 2010 too (the new topics post does better while still using much of the 2010 one). But I don't recall a social media/blog response then.

It appears he wrote it as a personal response and then it got adopted by the Church newsroom (someone can correct me if I am wrong, but wiki and a link to what might be the original article on a legal site leads me to believe this).  So it is from the POV of a lawyer and quite probably not a lawyer who specialized in such things (chief outside counsel sounds more general).  I think it would be better to be from professionals dealing with it from both legal and health care aspects.  Perhaps the Child Abuse one is that.  Wouldn't be disappointed myself if it got removed, but can understand why it might not if they are in the habit of keeping all their releases over the years posted on the site.

[ksfisher]

59 minutes ago, Thinking said:

The question about whether the Church monitors bloggers has been answered.

Does the church "monitor bloggers?"  Or do some members of the church read blogs?

Or is it that the people who say that the church is run by a bunch of old men who are out of touch, really want them be that way and not know what is going on.

[Kenngo1969]

7 hours ago, Kenngo1969 said:

I've been the chaperone outside the door.  It may be a small thing, but as far as I'm concerned, anyone who feels the need can avail himself of my services any time I'm available.  I cannot speak for you, but if I were in your position (very unlikely, since I'm a confirmed bachelor, but ... ) I'd have spent a lot of time lately on my knees in prayer.  I wish you well.

 

7 hours ago, ALarson said:

Thank you, Kenngo! 

You're welcome.

[Jeanne]

You're a good man Kenngo!  That is a great thing to do. 

[Yirgacheffe]

10 hours ago, rpn said:

Bishops needs to protect penitent-clergy privilege, and the confessional (whether the abused or the abuser).   And in any case, most of what a bishop could say would be inadmissible hearsay, anyway.   

And it can be hard to be an effective shepherd when different members want different things and the bishop gets involved in things that aren't his shepherding duties.

The handbook doesn't say that a bishop cannot testify.  It says they need to talk with someone who understands not just the facts, but the law.

I don't see it this way at all, the abused is not "confessing" they are telling what was done to them.

[Yirgacheffe]

9 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

This was done by my school district....all teachers' offices, practice rooms, and some other specialized rooms were refitted with windowed doors for this very purpose. In a bishop's or stake president's office, there would have to be a way to protect the privacy of the other person, but I'm sure it could be done. Any steps like this can only be for the better.

The grade school I attended in a small town in the midwest was built in the 1950's, later in a suburban setting I attended grade, middle and high schools that were built in the 50's, 60's and 70's, every single school I attended had either doors with windows or solid doors that had windows next to them.  It's the same with my kids though these days the question is how to cover the windows if a shooter enters the the school.

[Yirgacheffe]

8 hours ago, Calm said:

They may be crying or otherwise emotional.  Some are afraid of gossip (I think this is likely unwarranted except in a few cases where a ward has an extreme gossip addict).

Seems to me that those with a gossip problem should be among the ones seen in the bishops office.  Why is it that gossip isn't seen as a problem that needs to be confronted and confessed?

[Calm]

1 hour ago, Yirgacheffe said:

I don't see it this way at all, the abused is not "confessing" they are telling what was done to them.

It is not always from the abused that a bishop finds out about abuse.

add-on:  I see you may be responding to the use of "abused or abuser" after "confessional".  One can "confess" more than sins.  Oneof the definitions of confess is "admit or acknowledge something reluctantly, typically because one feels slightly ashamed or embarrassed".

Edited February 3, 2016 by Calm

[Calm]

10 minutes ago, Yirgacheffe said:

Seems to me that those with a gossip problem should be among the ones seen in the bishops office.  Why is it that gossip isn't seen as a problem that needs to be confronted and confessed?

Who says it isn't?  But just like other sins, confronting it does not always remove it.

[The Nehor]

7 hours ago, Thinking said:

The question about whether the Church monitors bloggers has been answered.

Actively monitors? I doubt it.

Has employees who look things up while at work? Almost definitely. My company does not have anyone formally assigned to monitor the competition and what they release but I and several other employees look around all the time. Then we pass stuff around and it gets filtered to upper management.

[rpn]

Quote

I don't see it this way at all, the abused is not "confessing" they are telling what was done to them.

Of course that is true.  But what if the person who is telling the story to the bishop does not want to report the matter to the police or to their parents or to anyone but a bishop who can give ecclesiastical comfort.   Sure the bishop would try to persuade the victim differently, but isn't the victim as entitled to protection of the confessional, every bit as much as an abuser might be?   Isn't a victim as entitled to talk to their bishop with absolute protection of that conversation from disclosure?   Yes, the penitent clergy privilege gives that right.

[Johnnie Cake]

 

I guess what I don't understand is why a Hot Line to Legal Council is needed at all and why the handbook doesn't direct all church leaders who become aware of an abuse situation to immediately involved the police? If the number one concern of the church is to protect the abused person rather than the abuser or the church, shouldn't the church just instruct its leaders to involve the police, irrespective of the legal requirement to do so in the state of country where the abuse takes place...so that the abused can be protected from their abuser, the case can be properly investigated and the charged abuser be held accountable?  Shouldn't the protection of the abused and anything that protects them be the gold standard?

 

[Gray]

A lot of churches require criminal background checks for people who work closely with children. I think that would be part of any gold standard. 

[Calm]

5 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

 

I guess what I don't understand is why a Hot Line to Legal Council is needed at all and why the handbook doesn't direct all church leaders who become aware of an abuse situation to immediately involved the police? If the number one concern of the church is to protect the abused person rather than the abuser or the church, shouldn't the church just instruct its leaders to involve the police, irrespective of the legal requirement to do so in the state of country where the abuse takes place...so that the abused can be protected from their abuser, the case can be properly investigated and the charged abuser be held accountable?  Shouldn't the protection of the abused and anything that protects them be the gold standard?

 

My understanding is there is a potential for harm in some situations if the clergy shares information inappropriately.  Their evidence and anything that resulted from it might be thrown out and that might place the victim or others in harm's way.  

The Handbook and Hot Line is not just for the US or various other countries we are familiar with that mostly have effective abuse laws (though to be honest, I have my doubts about that effectiveness given that I had two young relatives abused in their father's care by his stepsons and yet his custody was not removed immediately, iirc, because he was in a different state than where the accusation was made).  My understanding is there are countries who child abuse laws need an overhaul and in those cases getting legal education before proceeding can help ensure prompt and appropriate responses from those able to enforce and protect.

Edited February 3, 2016 by Calm

[Daniel2]

On ‎02‎/‎02‎/‎2016 at 9:01 PM, VideoGameJunkie said:

I recently saw the movie Spotlight about the catholic priest abuse going on in Boston and I am so glad we don't have something like that going on in our church.

That was a FANTASTIC movie.  I highly recommend it!!

[Tacenda]

I think the church has a lot of room for improvement.