JAHS Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 Here is a possible list of reasons I have come up with: 1. Because the original dedication is not effective enough to carry on through whatever happens to the temple. 2. Because people working on the temple are either not members or do not have recommends and therefore the sanctity of the temple has been desecrated by these "unworthy" people. 3. Because the temple structure itself has been desecrated by parts of it being destroyed to accommodate the renovation. 4. Because it is an opportunity to give the public the chance to see what the temple looks like inside and out. Temples have been violated and damaged before by intruders but were not rededicated. Which one or more of these is correct? Any other reasons?
Calm Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 Because it helps reassure those who go to the temple that a truly sacred space is there for them.
Scott Lloyd Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, JAHS said: Here is a possible list of reasons I have come up with: 1. Because the original dedication is not effective enough to carry on through whatever happens to the temple. 2. Because people working on the temple are either not members or do not have recommends and therefore the sanctity of the temple has been desecrated by these "unworthy" people. 3. Because the temple structure itself has been desecrated by parts of it being destroyed to accommodate the renovation. 4. Because it is an opportunity to give the public the chance to see what the temple looks like inside and out. Temples have been violated and damaged before by intruders but were not rededicated. Which one or more of these is correct? Any other reasons? Of your possible reasons, I like the last two, not so much the first two. In some cases the building is altered so drastically it is almost like construction from scratch. A temple dedication is among other things an expression of faith in Heavenly Father. We hope it will invoke His protection on the structure, but as in all things we trust His wisdom and will In granting blessings as He chooses to bestow them. It is like a prayer in that respect. Edited June 17, 2020 by Scott Lloyd
JLHPROF Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 6 minutes ago, JAHS said: Here is a possible list of reasons I have come up with: 1. Because the original dedication is not effective enough to carry on through whatever happens to the temple. 2. Because people working on the temple are either not members or do not have recommends and therefore the sanctity of the temple has been desecrated by these "unworthy" people. 3. Because the temple structure itself has been desecrated by parts of it being destroyed to accommodate the renovation. 4. Because it is an opportunity to give the public the chance to see what the temple looks like inside and out. Temples have been violated and damaged before by intruders but were not rededicated. Which one or more of these is correct? Any other reasons? A temple is sacred ground. It is rededicated after those outside influences that enter have been removed. It is to be kept sacred and unspotted from the world. Whether the worldly element is a workman as in #2 or the open house to the public as in #4. We have rededicated our home on occasion after certain influences have entered and left. In much the same way as we retake the sacrament after sinning to renew our baptismal cleanliness. Rebaptism was also once a key practice of Mormonism for the same reason. 3
Scott Lloyd Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 5 minutes ago, Calm said: Because it helps reassure those who go to the temple that a truly sacred space is there for them. True. And it provides an occasion for an outpouring of the Spirit on attendees at the dedication. I have experienced this on multiple occasions, especially during the Hosannah Shout and Hosannah Anthem.
JAHS Posted June 17, 2020 Author Posted June 17, 2020 10 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: A temple is sacred ground. It is rededicated after those outside influences that enter have been removed. It is to be kept sacred and unspotted from the world. Whether the worldly element is a workman as in #2 or the open house to the public as in #4. We have rededicated our home on occasion after certain influences have entered and left. In much the same way as we retake the sacrament after sinning to renew our baptismal cleanliness. Rebaptism was also once a key practice of Mormonism for the same reason. Can not the original dedication cover whatever happens to the temple? One reason rebaptisms were discontinued is because they were determined to be unnecessary because the original first baptism is all a person needs.
JLHPROF Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, JAHS said: Can not the original dedication cover whatever happens to the temple? One reason rebaptisms were discontinued is because they were determined to be unnecessary because the original first baptism is all a person needs. That's above my pay grade. All I know is spirits are very real, and when certain spirits are allowed to enter somewhere that is to be kept holy and unspotted from the world it sometimes requires an action to restore the spirit and presence of the Lord. After all, no unclean thing can dwell in the presence of God. Therefore it stands to reason if unclean things have been allowed into the Lord's house it may need to be cleansed before the Spirit of the Lord would return. That is in the Old Testament and New Testament. 2
Calm Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 15 minutes ago, JAHS said: Can not the original dedication cover whatever happens to the temple? One reason rebaptisms were discontinued is because they were determined to be unnecessary because the original first baptism is all a person needs. We partake of the sacrament though to renew baptismal covenants and promised (to us as well as to God). We don’t have something comparable for dedications.
strappinglad Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 Usually the renovation is so extensive that a lot of the materials which were used to build it were not there for the first dedication and IIRC when a temple is dedicated the prayer often references the materials used to construct the building. Now for a heretical opinion . Temples could be rededicated every few years because of unworthy members who attend under false pretences . Yes, I know , there are 3 fingers pointing back at me.
Calm Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) I like the idea of a yearly rededication. Make it about rededicating ourselves at the same time. It would not need to be a full dedication. Edited June 17, 2020 by Calm
JLHPROF Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, strappinglad said: Usually the renovation is so extensive that a lot of the materials which were used to build it were not there for the first dedication and IIRC when a temple is dedicated the prayer often references the materials used to construct the building. Now for a heretical opinion . Temples could be rededicated every few years because of unworthy members who attend under false pretences . Yes, I know , there are 3 fingers pointing back at me. I don't think that's heretical. I do see the same concerns as with Rebaptism, that it was being used like a video game reset button, a do-over. But if a temple is desecrated in some way it should be rededicated. Same with our homes. 3 minutes ago, Calm said: I like the idea of a yearly rededication. Make it about rededicating ourselves at the same time. It would not need to be a full dedication. Forgive my lack of knowledge in OT Judaism, but wasn't there an annual rededication involving purification etc?
mfbukowski Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 1 hour ago, JAHS said: Here is a possible list of reasons I have come up with: 1. Because the original dedication is not effective enough to carry on through whatever happens to the temple. 2. Because people working on the temple are either not members or do not have recommends and therefore the sanctity of the temple has been desecrated by these "unworthy" people. 3. Because the temple structure itself has been desecrated by parts of it being destroyed to accommodate the renovation. 4. Because it is an opportunity to give the public the chance to see what the temple looks like inside and out. Temples have been violated and damaged before by intruders but were not rededicated. Which one or more of these is correct? Any other reasons? Non members are in the temple all the time- workmen, government inspectors, EMT's, fire inspectors, delivery crews etc. If someone is having a heart attack, they don't ask for a recommend to enter an ordinance room in the middle of a session.
Popular Post smac97 Posted June 17, 2020 Popular Post Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) Quote Why Are Temples Rededicated After Renovation? This may be helpful: Salt Lake Temple Undergoes Decommissioning Some excerpts: Quote Within hours of the closure of the Salt Lake Temple for an extensive renovation, workers got busy transitioning the sacred structure from a working temple to a construction site. This process, known as decommissioning, takes several weeks. It is an important first step in the yearslong project that will restore and refresh the historic temple and help strengthen it against earthquakes. “Each time we renovate a temple of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, decommissioning occurs to remove sacred items and turn the building into a construction site,” said Rich Sutton, temple area director. “We have been preparing for months for this process, which began almost immediately after the temple closed to patrons on December 29.” ...What does decommissioning involve? During the decommissioning, the Church’s Temple Department works to remove sacred items from the building, including temple clothing, temple records and other items used in the completion of temple ordinances. As soon as this is completed, the temple is no longer considered a dedicated building, and a recommend is not needed for renovation crews to enter. Simultaneously, workers clean out the temple laundry, offices and custodial closets. I think temples often require upgrades, improvements, renovations, repairs, etc. Interim maintenance, repairs, etc. can be done by TR-holding members. For example, my brother-in-law is a master electrician in Utah, and he spent many months last year working in the Denver Temple on electrical issues. I understand that this was because he holds a temple recommend. When the improvements, repairs, etc. become too large, too complex, etc., such that a renovation is necessary, skilled workers will need to have access to the temple for an extended period of time. The temple is therefore "decommissioned" (apparently through the removal of "sacred items of from the building"), which renders the temple "no longer ... a dedicated building." Non-TR-holding workers and "renovation crews" thereafter can enter the building without any problem. The authority of the priesthood allows those who hold it exercise it to both do and undo things. "Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." (Matt. 18:18) Consequently, I think it stands to reason that if the Church has authority to dedicate a temple, it also has authority to un-dedicate ("decommission") one. This may be why there is no particular problem with the Church having lost ownership of the Kirtland and Nauvoo temples way back in the day. Thanks, -Smac Edited June 18, 2020 by smac97 6
mfbukowski Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 Does anyone ever rededicate their home for no particular reason ? What's the problem with that? 1
Robert F. Smith Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 1 hour ago, JAHS said: Here is a possible list of reasons I have come up with: 1. Because the original dedication is not effective enough to carry on through whatever happens to the temple. 2. Because people working on the temple are either not members or do not have recommends and therefore the sanctity of the temple has been desecrated by these "unworthy" people. 3. Because the temple structure itself has been desecrated by parts of it being destroyed to accommodate the renovation. 4. Because it is an opportunity to give the public the chance to see what the temple looks like inside and out. Temples have been violated and damaged before by intruders but were not rededicated. Which one or more of these is correct? Any other reasons? After the temple precincts have been sullied or desecrated by the presence of Gentiles, the Jews have a specific ceremony to purify it -- they sacrifice a red heifer, then burn it, and scatter the ashes on the desecrated holy area. Only then can it be used again for holy sacrificial rites. Currently, for example, the Temple Mount in Jerusalem is regarded as desecrated, and Orthodox Jews will not set foot in that area. 1
Calm Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 52 minutes ago, JLHPROF said: Forgive my lack of knowledge in OT Judaism, but wasn't there an annual rededication involving purification etc? That is what made me think of it.
JAHS Posted June 17, 2020 Author Posted June 17, 2020 52 minutes ago, strappinglad said: Usually the renovation is so extensive that a lot of the materials which were used to build it were not there for the first dedication and IIRC when a temple is dedicated the prayer often references the materials used to construct the building. This makes sense that brand new materials that were not there for the first dedication need to be dedicated 17 minutes ago, smac97 said: This may be helpful: Salt Lake Temple Undergoes Decommissioning Some excerpts: I think temples often require upgrades, improvements, renovations, repairs, etc. Interim maintenance, repairs, etc. can be done by TR-holding members. For example, my brother-in-law is a master electrician in Utah, and he spent many months last year working in the Denver Temple on electrical issues. I understand that this was because he holds a temple recommend. When the improvements, repairs, etc. become too large, too complex, etc., such that a renovation is necessary, skilled workers will need to have access to the temple for an extended period of time. The temple is therefore "decommissioned" (apparently through the removal of "sacred items of from the building"), which renders the temple "no longer ... a dedicated building." Non-TR-holding workers and "renovation crews" thereafter can enter the building without any problem. The authority of the priesthood allows those who hold it substantial authority. "Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." (Matt. 18:18) Consequently, I think it stands to reason that if the Church has authority to dedicate a temple, it also has authority to un-dedicate ("decommission") one. This may be why there is no particular problem with the Church having lost ownership of the Kirtland and Nauvoo temples way back in the day. Thanks, -Smac This idea of considering a temple decommissioned I think is also a good reason for a re-dedication a renovated temple. 3
Robert F. Smith Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 19 minutes ago, mfbukowski said: Does anyone ever rededicate their home for no particular reason ? What's the problem with that? I have seen Roman Catholic priests bless someone's new home, and they may do that also when there has been an infestation of evil spirits in someone's home. As for the Jews, you've heard the one about the Jewish guy who wanted the rabbi to bless his new Lamborghini: He goes to a Reform Rabbi and asks to have him to do a beraka on his new Laborghini. The Reform Rabbi says, congratulations on your new Lamborghini, but what is a beraka? The guy says, Never mind, and goes to an Orthodox Rabbi and asks the same question. The Orthodox Rabbi says, certainly, but what is a Lamborghini? 2
Robert F. Smith Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 1 hour ago, JAHS said: Can not the original dedication cover whatever happens to the temple? One reason rebaptisms were discontinued is because they were determined to be unnecessary because the original first baptism is all a person needs. Among the Jews, there is a baptism (mikveh) of conversion for Gentiles who wish to become Jews. However, the same font is also used by Jews for repeated ritual purification, and they have been doing so for over two thousand years.
Duncan Posted June 17, 2020 Posted June 17, 2020 Our Temple, 6 hours, away has been renovated several times but it has never been re dedicated. I like what Pres. Joseph Fielding Smith said at the Provo Temple dedication in 1972, paraphrasing, but he said that what we really do is dedicate ourselves to the Lord at a Temple dedication. So, if that's the case then it's a renewal for both the Temple and the Temple attender 1
bluebell Posted June 18, 2020 Posted June 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Duncan said: Our Temple, 6 hours, away has been renovated several times but it has never been re dedicated. I like what Pres. Joseph Fielding Smith said at the Provo Temple dedication in 1972, paraphrasing, but he said that what we really do is dedicate ourselves to the Lord at a Temple dedication. So, if that's the case then it's a renewal for both the Temple and the Temple attender It sounds like a re-dedication is only needed if the temple was decommissioned when it was remodeled. 1
Duncan Posted June 18, 2020 Posted June 18, 2020 4 minutes ago, bluebell said: It sounds like a re-dedication is only needed if the temple was decommissioned when it was remodeled. I think that would be a fair assesment 1
mfbukowski Posted June 18, 2020 Posted June 18, 2020 7 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said: I have seen Roman Catholic priests bless someone's new home, and they may do that also when there has been an infestation of evil spirits in someone's home. As for the Jews, you've heard the one about the Jewish guy who wanted the rabbi to bless his new Lamborghini: He goes to a Reform Rabbi and asks to have him to do a beraka on his new Laborghini. The Reform Rabbi says, congratulations on your new Lamborghini, but what is a beraka? The guy says, Never mind, and goes to an Orthodox Rabbi and asks the same question. The Orthodox Rabbi says, certainly, but what is a Lamborghini? 1
Garden Girl Posted June 18, 2020 Posted June 18, 2020 10 hours ago, JLHPROF said: We have rededicated our home on occasion after certain influences have entered and left. In much the same way as we retake the sacrament after sinning to renew our baptismal cleanliness. Rebaptism was also once a key practice of Mormonism for the same reason. When I moved into my little home after my husband died, I had it dedicated.... a few years ago I did some remodeling with lots of workers in and out. When all was completed, I had it rededicated. It didn't "feel" right until that was done... GG 3
CV75 Posted June 18, 2020 Posted June 18, 2020 17 hours ago, JAHS said: Here is a possible list of reasons I have come up with: 1. Because the original dedication is not effective enough to carry on through whatever happens to the temple. 2. Because people working on the temple are either not members or do not have recommends and therefore the sanctity of the temple has been desecrated by these "unworthy" people. 3. Because the temple structure itself has been desecrated by parts of it being destroyed to accommodate the renovation. 4. Because it is an opportunity to give the public the chance to see what the temple looks like inside and out. Temples have been violated and damaged before by intruders but were not rededicated. Which one or more of these is correct? Any other reasons? I would suggest the incorporation of new materials on a larger scope than routine than preventive maintenance and incidental repairs warrant a new dedication.
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