Amulek Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 In speaking of how the new Elders Quorums are to be organized, Elder Christofferson explained that the elders quorum presidency may include both elders and high priests. And that an elder or a high priest may serve as the quorum president. He then quipped, "This is not a 'takeover' of elders quorums by high priests." I thought that was a rather humorous remark. I honestly don't think of organizational changes in the church as being 'takeovers,' but I suspect some may feel differently (even if only momentarily). Still, I suspect that in most cases, the new elders quorum president will, in fact, be a high priest. In our ward, for example, our high priests group is stacked full of former bishops and stake presidents. I wasn't at all surprised by the calling of our new elders quorum president. He is a former bishop and an imminently nice guy. So, out of curiosity, I decided to make a poll to see what sort of breakdown there is between elders and high priests being called to be elders quorum presidents. I suspect it will be skewed toward the latter, but I'm interested to see the results regardless. Note: I'm only talking about the president here, not members of the presidency. 2
Duncan Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 Our ward hasn't changed anything except the HP leadership, so I will let you know!
bluebell Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 They are still working on reorganizing our Elder's quorum so I can't answer the poll yet. But the question (and issue behind it) does make me think about how, in RS, this is never really an issue (at least, it hasn't ever been an issue that i've been aware of or told about). RS presidents are young or old, experienced or not, and most people don't think twice about it. I suppose that's because leadership positions for women are not hierarchal so we don't really think of them in those terms. From talking to my hubby, i think there probably will be some men who struggle with this change because of ego or because they view HPs as being a rung higher up the ladder than elders. It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. 3
Prof Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 In my ward, we haven't changed yet. The EQ and HPs meet together most weeks, because of the numbers. We probably have 4-5 times more High Priests than Elders. When the changes are announced in my ward, I doubt that anyone will be upset regardless of how it turns out.
Stargazer Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 (edited) 28 minutes ago, bluebell said: They are still working on reorganizing our Elder's quorum so I can't answer the poll yet. But the question (and issue behind it) does make me think about how, in RS, this is never really an issue (at least, it hasn't ever been an issue that i've been aware of or told about). RS presidents are young or old, experienced or not, and most people don't think twice about it. I suppose that's because leadership positions for women are not hierarchal so we don't really think of them in those terms. From talking to my hubby, i think there probably will be some men who struggle with this change because of ego or because they view HPs as being a rung higher up the ladder than elders. It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. I recall a situation years and years ago when there was this returned missionary elder in our ward who was inactive and then got married to a non-member, and after a number of months his parents came for their first visit. The father walked into the door and announced huffily to his new daughter-in-law that he was a high priest in good standing with the church, and basically acted like the King deigning to bless his subjects with his august presence. This was later told to me by the non-member wife on a HT visit. Needless to say, she was not impressed with this guy's posturing, and I felt supremely embarrassed that a "high priest in good standing with the church" could act like such an arrogant putz. Such people need humility thrust upon them. ETA: Our ward Elders Quorum won't get reorganized for another couple of weeks, as the SP is on vacation out of the country. So I can't answer the poll either. Edited April 9, 2018 by Stargazer 2
The Nehor Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 Think it is going to be a High Priest but it has not been finalized yet. Most of the rest of the Presidency will be Elders (maybe one High Priest) due to simply who is available as almost all our High Priests are on the High Council (I think we contribute 4 or 5) or in our Bishopric.
Waylon Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 I am trying to believe in this change. I really am. However, it seems like this change kind of undoes the welcome changes from before, where lessons were more discussion based and less lecture based. I had my EQ worked into a small support group for discussing the gospel, and that isn't going to work with the now enormous quorum I have on my hands. I fear I may have to go back to lesson-type presentations as opposed to the support group EQ I was running. Maybe my bishop will divide the quorum in half.
RevTestament Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 Elder, Elder, HP. The High Priest went from 2nd counselor to ... 2nd counselor... We had a pleasant discussion-oriented first meeting - it kept me awake. We talked about the new group implementation of the new Ministering Program, prior experiences, etc. Overall, I expect the new group will be a positive experience esp for elders, but I believe it may also help HP better appreciate some of the issues young elders are grappling with. 3
bluebell Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Waylon said: I am trying to believe in this change. I really am. However, it seems like this change kind of undoes the welcome changes from before, where lessons were more discussion based and less lecture based. I had my EQ worked into a small support group for discussing the gospel, and that isn't going to work with the now enormous quorum I have on my hands. I fear I may have to go back to lesson-type presentations as opposed to the support group EQ I was running. Maybe my bishop will divide the quorum in half. Do bishops divide elder's quorums or does the Stake President handle that? 1
Avatar4321 Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 No one has been called in my ward yet. However, whether it’s an elder or high priests I wouldn’t consider to take over by the high priest quorum. We need to stop thinking in terms of that. One of the biggest reasons for the change is to unify the priesthood. If we keep thinking in terms that have our offices divide us then we aren’t doing what the Lord means us to do. quite honestly I’m not sure i would know what office the new president will hold 3
JAHS Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 Hasn't happened yet, but I did notice that in our class discussion Sunday it was mostly High Priests who were talking. I hope the elders in the quorum don't shy away from participating. 1
Avatar4321 Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 12 minutes ago, bluebell said: Do bishops divide elder's quorums or does the Stake President handle that? Stake presidents 1
Ginger Snaps Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 In my ward they released the HPGL and kept the EQP. 1
Amulek Posted April 9, 2018 Author Posted April 9, 2018 3 hours ago, Duncan said: Our ward hasn't changed anything except the HP leadership, so I will let you know! Thanks! I probably should have waited a couple of weeks to post this. But it popped into my head this morning and I started writing...and then I wanted to see if the poll would actually work. Hopefully, responses will continue to come in over the next week or two. 2
Amulek Posted April 9, 2018 Author Posted April 9, 2018 3 hours ago, bluebell said: But the question (and issue behind it) does make me think about how, in RS, this is never really an issue (at least, it hasn't ever been an issue that i've been aware of or told about). RS presidents are young or old, experienced or not, and most people don't think twice about it. I suppose that's because leadership positions for women are not hierarchal so we don't really think of them in those terms. From talking to my hubby, i think there probably will be some men who struggle with this change because of ego or because they view HPs as being a rung higher up the ladder than elders. It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. One of the initial thoughts I had during conference when this was announced was that it would make the priesthood (holders) organized more like the RS, and that that was a good thing in my mind. I suspect that some people may struggle with the changes, and I think you're probably right about ego being an issue there. For myself, I'm totally fine with the changes, and I wholeheartedly share in Elder Christopherson's "hope that we will no longer speak in terms of being “advanced” to another office in the Melchizedek Priesthood." 1
The Nehor Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 1 hour ago, Ginger Snaps said: In my ward they released the HPGL and kept the EQP. Your ward is apostate. Flee before Babylon burns! 2
rongo Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 1 minute ago, The Nehor said: Your ward is apostate. Flee before Babylon burns! That's (hopefully) what our stake president does as well (call the current EQP again). I requested that he remain as EQP, with a HP or two in the presidency. It's the SP's call, though. My ward has no discomfort with the change, nor did I think they would. They met yesterday combined while we await the stake presidency to move on this (which will be several weeks), and they sat in a big circle in the gym. We also don't seem to have a big disparity with HPs dominating discussion and Elders meekly hiding in the shadows. Our breakdowns are 26 high priests, and 69 elders, but primary and young men callings mean that many men aren't able to go to quorum meetings, so it isn't quite that large of a group.
kllindley Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 3 hours ago, Waylon said: I am trying to believe in this change. I really am. However, it seems like this change kind of undoes the welcome changes from before, where lessons were more discussion based and less lecture based. I had my EQ worked into a small support group for discussing the gospel, and that isn't going to work with the now enormous quorum I have on my hands. I fear I may have to go back to lesson-type presentations as opposed to the support group EQ I was running. Maybe my bishop will divide the quorum in half. I sure hope you don't have to go back to lessons. That is not the goal. I would hope that your support group can continue to be vulnerable and teach the rest of the Quorum how to be more like what you had. That is the direction I think we are heading and the combination of quorums has the potential to help. I know my wife, in teaching Relief Society, often assigned groups of 4-8 to discuss and talk for most of the "lesson." No reason that couldn't work in a larger Priesthood quorum.
Jeanne Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 2 hours ago, RevTestament said: Elder, Elder, HP. The High Priest went from 2nd counselor to ... 2nd counselor... We had a pleasant discussion-oriented first meeting - it kept me awake. We talked about the new group implementation of the new Ministering Program, prior experiences, etc. Overall, I expect the new group will be a positive experience esp for elders, but I believe it may also help HP better appreciate some of the issues young elders are grappling with. I believe this is what the change is for...generations melding together to learn from each other. I hope this is what it will do. I still care about the younger people in the church..let them lead..and they will still follow you 1
RevTestament Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 21 minutes ago, Jeanne said: I believe this is what the change is for...generations melding together to learn from each other. I hope this is what it will do. I still care about the younger people in the church..let them lead..and they will still follow you I agree. I have no problem following an Elder, so long as he speaks truth. Truth is truth, and I follow it, no matter the source. I am probably an exception - I didn't stay an elder very long - about 1-2 years. However, I think I do understand most of the issues elders are grappling with, and I believe more exposure to High Priests can have a stabilizing effect and help them. Instead of HP just going into "retirement" in the HP group, young men can directly benefit from their experience. HP can also benefit from the elders - especially in terms of technical expertise, and other advancements. I think you are right about the probable reason for the change, and I am glad you care.... 3
Waylon Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 Another reason I don't like the change: I liked buying treats for my EQ every time I taught . . . we would have cheesecake, stroopwaffles, rolls, whatever I felt a craving for. It was moving towards a little breakfast club, in the middle of Church. Now that I have 55 people in my quorum, I can't do this anymore (too expensive!) I'm not murmuring here (OK maybe a little), but this change is cramping my style.
Waylon Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 Just now, Waylon said: Another reason I don't like the change: I liked buying treats for my EQ every time I taught . . . we would have cheesecake, stroopwaffles, rolls, whatever I felt a craving for. It was moving towards a little breakfast club, in the middle of Church. Now that I have 55 people in my quorum, I can't do this anymore (too expensive!) I just figure - Jesus fed people when He taught, and as the hymn goes I am trying to be like Jesus, so I started feeding the class . . . I'm not murmuring here (OK maybe a little), but this change is cramping my style.
bluebell Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 13 minutes ago, Waylon said: Another reason I don't like the change: I liked buying treats for my EQ every time I taught . . . we would have cheesecake, stroopwaffles, rolls, whatever I felt a craving for. It was moving towards a little breakfast club, in the middle of Church. Now that I have 55 people in my quorum, I can't do this anymore (too expensive!) I'm not murmuring here (OK maybe a little), but this change is cramping my style.
Guest Posted April 9, 2018 Posted April 9, 2018 In every unit, (in our Stake) all Elders. In fact the model is Elder as President, Elder as first counselor and High Priest as second counselor.
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