Prayer Request from Houston Temple Presidency

[jkwilliams]

I hope this is OK to post, but we've set up a fund to help my daughter and her husband get back into their home.

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[Darren10]

1 minute ago, The Nehor said:

I think God changes his mind is an inaccurate way of putting it. God knows the end from the beginning so he does not decide on a course of action and then when a request is made changes it at that point.

Instead God can hear all our prayers from the beginning and factors all of them into every decision God makes. In this way we can influence God's decisions but we do not change his mind at some point in time. He was always going to do it that way because we prayed.

If I understand you correctly, I agree. The way I describe God is omniscient for sure. however, my understanding of God is that all things He knows, even the outcome will NEVER go against our own free will. This is especially true for repentance and fervent, sincere supplications to the Lord.

"4 But now I go unto the Father, and also to show myself unto the lost tribes of Israel, for they are not lost unto the Father, for he knoweth whither he hath taken them.

5 And it came to pass that when Jesus had thus spoken, he cast his eyes round about again on the multitude, and beheld they were in tears, and did look steadfastly upon him as if they would ask him to tarry a little longer with them.

6 And he said unto them: Behold, my bowels are filled with compassion towards you.

7 Have ye any that are sick among you? Bring them hither. Have ye any that are lame, or blind, or halt, or maimed, or leprous, or that are withered, or that are deaf, or that are afflicted in any manner? Bring them hither and I will heal them, for I have compassion upon you; my bowels are filled with mercy."

(3 Nephi)

Here I understand that Jesus, the very God of Israel, was about to leave to the Father but decided not to due to the supplication of the hearts of the people He was with who earnestly desired that he stay longer. This shows me God making a decision based on peoples' prayer and he made it out of compassion for them.  

 

[Darren10]

7 hours ago, bsjkki said:

Thank you for this perspective...it made me think about things. In some troubles, I have wondered 'why pray at all?' God knows what to do and what he is willing to do and I trust him...so if my prayers don't change anything, why bother. I know this seems faithless but I had faith that the desired outcome may not be God's will. 

 

2 minutes ago, Darren10 said:

If I understand you correctly, I agree. The way I describe God is omniscient for sure. however, my understanding of God is that all things He knows, even the outcome will NEVER go against our own free will. This is especially true for repentance and fervent, sincere supplications to the Lord.

"4 But now I go unto the Father, and also to show myself unto the lost tribes of Israel, for they are not lost unto the Father, for he knoweth whither he hath taken them.

5 And it came to pass that when Jesus had thus spoken, he cast his eyes round about again on the multitude, and beheld they were in tears, and did look steadfastly upon him as if they would ask him to tarry a little longer with them.

6 And he said unto them: Behold, my bowels are filled with compassion towards you.

7 Have ye any that are sick among you? Bring them hither. Have ye any that are lame, or blind, or halt, or maimed, or leprous, or that are withered, or that are deaf, or that are afflicted in any manner? Bring them hither and I will heal them, for I have compassion upon you; my bowels are filled with mercy."

(3 Nephi)

Here I understand that Jesus, the very God of Israel, was about to leave to the Father but decided not to due to the supplication of the hearts of the people He was with who earnestly desired that he stay longer. This shows me God making a decision based on peoples' prayer and he made it out of compassion for them.  

 

I think that portion of 3 Nephi pertains to you.

God bless.

[bsjkki]

This is a good update on how the hurricane has affected church members. http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865687658/Tropical-Storm-Harvey-displaces-scores-of-Mormon-families.html

"President Cluff is also thankful for the Church’s ongoing support. He has worked closely with humanitarian relief officials in Salt Lake City and knows people across the globe are asking God to bless Texas.

“Just knowing people are remembering us in their prayers — that makes a huge difference.”

I have felt strengthened at times when people have been praying and fasting for me. It did help. Have any of you felt the prayers coming your way and gained strength because of it?

[bsjkki]

Newsroom update

"Further assessments have been made at the Houston Texas Temple, where flooding has caused significant damage. In the temple basement water rose from nearly a foot deep to waist deep in some areas. The baptistry room was flooded to the top. On the main floor, several inches of water will require the replacement of carpet and furniture. "

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/latter-day-saints-prepare-hurricane-harvey

[Hamba Tuhan]

1 hour ago, bsjkki said:

Have any of you felt the prayers coming your way and gained strength because of it?

Absolutely!

[rongo]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

I think God changes his mind is an inaccurate way of putting it. God knows the end from the beginning so he does not decide on a course of action and then when a request is made changes it at that point.

Instead God can hear all our prayers from the beginning and factors all of them into every decision God makes. In this way we can influence God's decisions but we do not change his mind at some point in time. He was always going to do it that way because we prayed.

This seems too much like predestination to me. I understand it as the McConkie-ite/Fielding Smith strain of Mormon theology (it is a valid viewpoint within Mormonism), but it doesn't seem right to me. 

One of the things that really attracted me to my wife (besides the obvious!)  was the deep doctrinal discussions we had and which continue to this day. We still do not agree on the issue of absolute vs. limited foreknowledge (B.H. Roberts: "That which can be known, God knows. As people make choices and use agency, God knows the new present with perfect knowledge"). I remember one point where I had her in King Agrippa territory ("Almost thou persuadest me to accept limited foreknowledge) was when we discussed petitionary prayer. If we can't actually ever change God's mind or get him to deviate from what he knows will unavoidably be, that takes a lot of the wind out of our sails when it comes to fervent prayer for things that are important to us. When the chips are down and we are in need, simply praying to be in alignment with his will is a poor substitute. And, a lot of scripture seems to support the ability of people with standing and worthiness to change his mind (or at least, the unavoidable things that must be). 

If God knows what we are going to ask for, and won't ever change what unavoidably must be, there doesn't seem to be a lot of point to prayer, other than communing with him. 

[Darren10]

1 hour ago, bsjkki said:

This is a good update on how the hurricane has affected church members. http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865687658/Tropical-Storm-Harvey-displaces-scores-of-Mormon-families.html

"President Cluff is also thankful for the Church’s ongoing support. He has worked closely with humanitarian relief officials in Salt Lake City and knows people across the globe are asking God to bless Texas.

“Just knowing people are remembering us in their prayers — that makes a huge difference.”

I have felt strengthened at times when people have been praying and fasting for me. It did help. Have any of you felt the prayers coming your way and gained strength because of it?

Many times.

This reminds me of the time I danced with my aunt at my little sister's wedding. She brought up her son / my cousin who went downhill very quickly after becoming a cocaine addict. As we danced, she asked, now, your dad (her brother-in-law) asked you all to fast for [my son], correct?" I said that he did,. That he sent out an email to all his children asking us to fast on a certain date. I gave the date to her but for the life of me I do not remember it now. She, smiled, shook her head and said, "that's the exact day he decided to rehabilitate himself." He is doing very well. Still a bit emotionally unpredictable but a good man, a great father and he even got his own business back up and running after destroying it when cocaine became top priority in his life.

God is a wonderful God!

Edited August 31, 2017 by Darren10

[The Nehor]

48 minutes ago, rongo said:

This seems too much like predestination to me. I understand it as the McConkie-ite/Fielding Smith strain of Mormon theology (it is a valid viewpoint within Mormonism), but it doesn't seem right to me. 

One of the things that really attracted me to my wife (besides the obvious!)  was the deep doctrinal discussions we had and which continue to this day. We still do not agree on the issue of absolute vs. limited foreknowledge (B.H. Roberts: "That which can be known, God knows. As people make choices and use agency, God knows the new present with perfect knowledge"). I remember one point where I had her in King Agrippa territory ("Almost thou persuadest me to accept limited foreknowledge) was when we discussed petitionary prayer. If we can't actually ever change God's mind or get him to deviate from what he knows will unavoidably be, that takes a lot of the wind out of our sails when it comes to fervent prayer for things that are important to us. When the chips are down and we are in need, simply praying to be in alignment with his will is a poor substitute. And, a lot of scripture seems to support the ability of people with standing and worthiness to change his mind (or at least, the unavoidable things that must be). 

If God knows what we are going to ask for, and won't ever change what unavoidably must be, there doesn't seem to be a lot of point to prayer, other than communing with him. 

I find that equally unpleasant but have not reached the same conclusion. You are thinking linearly. Your prayers do have an influence. It is just that effect precedes cause as we see it which seems illogical. God who sees all as an eternal Now probably sees it differently. You do not change God's mind but your prayers and my prayers are a part of the original plan. My choice to pray tonight echoes through eternity and is part of God's design from the beginning and resonates to the end but it originated with me. I was not predestined to do it. It did change things, just not in the normal way humanity views them where cause precedes effect.

I do not believe in predestination. God knows all but I still choose and God's actions from the beginning to end react to those choices. Just not linearly.

[Calm]

I am wondering now I am thinking about it if the picture with the hand in the air claiming water is 6 feet deep is for real.  For one, the temple president said the current was dangerous.  For two, I think this is the same place and the grass would appear to be on flat land:

https://www.ldstemple.pics/store/houston-temple-sunrise-west/

Can someone familiar with the temple confirm if it is deep enough for the hand above the water picture to be of a 5'8" man standing up with his hand over his head (he should be floating unless he has weights on his feet, right?) or is it a scam and he is really just lying down (which is still probably two feet deepish)?

Google maps indicates a pretty flat surface with a road...not deep at all.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.9998169,-95.5329894,19z/data=!3m1!1e3

Champion Forest Drive...

Edited August 31, 2017 by Calm

[rongo]

9 hours ago, The Nehor said:

I find that equally unpleasant but have not reached the same conclusion. You are thinking linearly. Your prayers do have an influence. It is just that effect precedes cause as we see it which seems illogical. God who sees all as an eternal Now probably sees it differently. You do not change God's mind but your prayers and my prayers are a part of the original plan. My choice to pray tonight echoes through eternity and is part of God's design from the beginning and resonates to the end but it originated with me. I was not predestined to do it. It did change things, just not in the normal way humanity views them where cause precedes effect.

I do not believe in predestination. God knows all but I still choose and God's actions from the beginning to end react to those choices. Just not linearly.

Yeah, that's the usual response. Your prayers had an effect, God just knew exactly what you were going to pray for --- before you knew you were going to pray. 

It comes back to my wife's and my original (and ongoing) question: Does God already know before we came to earth which ones of us will "make it" in the end, and which ones won't? Does he know what thoughts we will have, and to a T which choices we will make? The usual caveat is that knowing doesn't determine, but it seems like a distinction without a difference to me. I prefer Elder Roberts' explanation that the future is an unfolding comprised of the combined effects of zillions of constant choices, and as it unfolds, God knows it. Therein lies omniscience. I don't believe that for him to be all-knowing, he has to know ---- every thought and choice each of us will ever make.

[The Nehor]

45 minutes ago, rongo said:

Yeah, that's the usual response. Your prayers had an effect, God just knew exactly what you were going to pray for --- before you knew you were going to pray. 

It comes back to my wife's and my original (and ongoing) question: Does God already know before we came to earth which ones of us will "make it" in the end, and which ones won't? Does he know what thoughts we will have, and to a T which choices we will make? The usual caveat is that knowing doesn't determine, but it seems like a distinction without a difference to me. I prefer Elder Roberts' explanation that the future is an unfolding comprised of the combined effects of zillions of constant choices, and as it unfolds, God knows it. Therein lies omniscience. I don't believe that for him to be all-knowing, he has to know ---- every thought and choice each of us will ever make.

I do not understand how that can be a distinction without a difference. To me it is the key distinction.

And yes, God knows who will be exalted and who will go to Perdition. He knows our thoughts and choices. I do not like to think of it as God right now knowing what I am going to do. Instead God is outside of our timestream and sees the whole thing at once. He sees my choices as I make them and makes allowances and reacts to them in what we would call the past, present, and future but God does not see it that way (though he of course comprehends our viewpoint).

My concern about the limited foreknowledge idea is that God would have to be very careful about keeping his options open to compensate, future prophecy would be problematic as any of it could choose not to come to pass. Columbus might have resisted the Spirit and chosen not to go on his expedition. The Nephites might have repented and thwarted the vision Nephi saw. Moses, Joseph Smith, and other figures could have resisted their prophesied destiny.

[Rain]

20 hours ago, stemelbow said:

Rongo, getting back to your challenge yesterday:

Quoting rongo:

To clarify I was a bit confused about your condemnation over-all, and didn't really understand why you introduced the adorbs and cute stuff, until you explained, "You do that all the time".  I didn't realize you were so upset about it.  Oops on poking you on it again in this thread.  But I guess I still don't know where you get the all the time stuff. 

 

Anyway, I didn't really care for your functional non-believer label...

You don't do it ALL the time,  but you do it often enough that I and others have noticed and you've been asked at least twice, that I have seen, what you meant by it (as far as I know you never answered). Not trying to pile on.  It just seems you are unaware how often this occurs and I'm hoping it helps with communication between you and others. 

[Rain]

21 hours ago, bsjkki said:

Thank you for this perspective...it made me think about things. In some troubles, I have wondered 'why pray at all?' God knows what to do and what he is willing to do and I trust him...so if my prayers don't change anything, why bother. I know this seems faithless but I had faith that the desired outcome may not be God's will. 

This is how I have often felt with one of my sons.  He had his agency and we know we can't pray away agency so what is the use in praying? But then we have Alma the Elder praying for his son. So I've had to read those passages to try to figure out how to pray for my own son.  I wish it were more detailed! I have got some answers through reading, though I couldn't explain them verbally well. 

Edited August 31, 2017 by Rain

[Rain]

12 hours ago, bsjkki said:

This is a good update on how the hurricane has affected church members. http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865687658/Tropical-Storm-Harvey-displaces-scores-of-Mormon-families.html

"President Cluff is also thankful for the Church’s ongoing support. He has worked closely with humanitarian relief officials in Salt Lake City and knows people across the globe are asking God to bless Texas.

“Just knowing people are remembering us in their prayers — that makes a huge difference.”

I have felt strengthened at times when people have been praying and fasting for me. It did help. Have any of you felt the prayers coming your way and gained strength because of it?

Yes. I realize it is cliche, but I have felt like it was a warm blanket or warm air kind of seeping into our house through the cracks (it was while living in Utah, not Arizona!).

This reminds me of a thought I had last night,  but I will start another thread for it. 

[bluebell]

8 hours ago, Calm said:

I am wondering now I am thinking about it if the picture with the hand in the air claiming water is 6 feet deep is for real.  For one, the temple president said the current was dangerous.  For two, I think this is the same place and the grass would appear to be on flat land:

https://www.ldstemple.pics/store/houston-temple-sunrise-west/

Can someone familiar with the temple confirm if it is deep enough for the hand above the water picture to be of a 5'8" man standing up with his hand over his head (he should be floating unless he has weights on his feet, right?) or is it a scam and he is really just lying down (which is still probably two feet deepish)?

Google maps indicates a pretty flat surface with a road...not deep at all.

https://www.google.com/maps/@29.9998169,-95.5329894,19z/data=!3m1!1e3

Champion Forest Drive...

I assumed it was a hoax but it would be interesting to know for certain.

[rongo]

Just now, Rain said:

Yes. I realize it is cliche, but I have felt like it was a warm blanket or warm air kind of seeping into our house through the cracks (it was while living in Utah, not Arizona!).

This reminds me of a thought I had last night,  but I will start another thread for it. 

I'll tell you something else: there is great power in the prayer circle in the temple. It's kind of a tough needle to thread, because I believe (and exhort people) that God will hear the prayers of any who earnestly seek him. But, for those who have access to the temple, taking a problem or people special to us to the temple specifically to pray for them and include them in the prayer circle is powerful. I have seen miracles wrought instantly as we have gone as a bishopric, or RS presidency with the bishopric, etc. to the temple to pray for specific people. Miraculous such that it makes your head spin in the speed of the help!

There are two really good stories out of Journal of Discourses on this. One is from Wilford Woodruff. While trying to land in San Francisco, his ship was unable to for a long time (like 2 weeks) due to weather. While on the ship, he dreamed that they were in that situation (they couldn't lift the anchor), and Joseph Smith appeared to him in his temple clothes. He had Wilford go with him to the highest point of the ship, and he had him pray with him for the ship "after the order of prayer." Then, he told Wilford to pull in the anchor. To his surprise, he pulled it in effortlessly, when all of the shiphands were unable to. He told him to remember that great things can be accomplished when we use the order of prayer.

Another one was after Dr. Bernhisel (the delegate to Washington for Utah Territory) reported to President Taylor that a sure-thing anti-polygamy bill had been inexplicably defeated. It was a "can't miss" vote, but one by one, Senators had left the chamber and could not be found. The bill's sponsor spent over a day furiously trying to get a quorum in attendance to pass the bill, but had to pull the bill when it wasn't possible. President Taylor asked him what the date of the vote was, and then pulled out his journal and showed him that on that very day, greatly troubled in mind, the First Presidency and apostles had held a special prayer circle with their wives and asked God to discomfit their enemies. 

I believe that people can approach God in any way available to them (fasting and prayer if no access to the temple), but there are special things we can do by way of ordinances for special causes and reasons. Psychologically, they help because they are something tangible that we can do when we feel powerless, if nothing else, but I have seen miracles through that. 

[bluebell]

1 hour ago, rongo said:

Yeah, that's the usual response. Your prayers had an effect, God just knew exactly what you were going to pray for --- before you knew you were going to pray. 

It comes back to my wife's and my original (and ongoing) question: Does God already know before we came to earth which ones of us will "make it" in the end, and which ones won't? Does he know what thoughts we will have, and to a T which choices we will make? The usual caveat is that knowing doesn't determine, but it seems like a distinction without a difference to me. I prefer Elder Roberts' explanation that the future is an unfolding comprised of the combined effects of zillions of constant choices, and as it unfolds, God knows it. Therein lies omniscience. I don't believe that for him to be all-knowing, he has to know ---- every thought and choice each of us will ever make.

This reminds me of a missionary story i read a while ago (not LDS).  It's published on this website.

Quote

 

One night I had worked hard to help a mother in the labor ward; but in spite of all we could do, she died leaving us with a tiny premature baby and a crying two-year-old daughter. We would have difficulty keeping the baby alive, as we had no incubator (we had no electricity to run an incubator).

We also had no special feeding facilities. Although we lived on the equator, nights were often chilly with treacherous drafts. One student midwife went for the box we had for such babies and the cotton wool that the baby would be wrapped in. Another went to stoke up the fire and fill a hot water bottle. She came back shortly in distress to tell me that in filling the bottle, it had burst (rubber perishes easily in tropical climates). “And it is our last hot water bottle!” she exclaimed. As in the West, it is no good crying over spilled milk so in Central Africa it might be considered no good crying over burst water bottles. They do not grow on trees, and there are no drugstores down forest pathways.”All right,” I said, “put the baby as near the fire as you safely can, and sleep between the baby and the door to keep it free from drafts. Your job is to keep the baby warm.”

The following noon, as I did most days, I went to have prayers with any of the orphanage children who chose to gather with me. I gave the  youngsters various suggestions of things to pray about and told them about the tiny baby. I explained our problem about keeping the baby warm enough, mentioning the hot water bottle, and that the baby could so easily die if it got chills. I also told them of the two-year-old sister, crying because her mother had died.
During prayer time, one ten-year old girl, Ruth, prayed with the usual blunt conciseness of our African children. “Please, God” she prayed, send us a water bottle. It’ll be no good tomorrow, God, as the baby will be dead, so please send it this afternoon.”

While I gasped inwardly at the audacity of the prayer, she added, “And while You are about it, would You please send a dolly for the little girl so she’ll know You really love her?”

As often with children’s prayers, I was put on the spot. Could I honestly say, “Amen”. I just did not believe that God could do this. Oh, yes, I know that He can do everything, the Bible says so. But there are limits, aren’t there? The only way God could answer this particular prayer would be by sending me a parcel from homeland. I had been in Africa for almost four years at that time, and I had never, ever received a parcel from home. Anyway, if anyone did send me a parcel, who would put in a hot water bottle? I lived on the equator! Halfway through the afternoon, while I was teaching in the nurses’ training school, a message was sent that there was a car at my front door.

By the time I reached home, the car had gone, but there, on the veranda, was a large twenty-two pound parcel. I felt tears pricking my eyes. I could not open the parcel alone, so I sent for the orphanage children. Together we pulled off the string, carefully undoing each knot. We folded the paper, taking care not to tear it unduly. Excitement was mounting. Some thirty or forty pairs of eyes were focused on the large cardboard box.

From the top, I lifted out brightly colored, knitted jerseys. Eyes sparkled as I gave them out. Then there were the knitted bandages for the leprosy patients, and the children looked a little bored. Then came a box of mixed raisins and sultanas – that would make a batch of buns for the weekend. Then, as I put my hand in again, I felt the … could it really be? I grasped it and pulled it out – yes, a brand-new, rubber hot water bottle. I cried. I had not asked God to send it; I had not truly believed that He could. Ruth was in the front row of the children. She rushed forward, crying out, “If God has sent the bottle, He must have sent the dolly too!  Rummaging down to the bottom of the box, she pulled out the small, beautifully dressed dolly. Her eyes shone! She had never doubted! Looking up at me, she asked: “Can I go over with you and give this dolly to that little girl, so she’ll know that Jesus really loves her?”

That parcel had been on the way for five whole months. Packed up by my former Sunday school class, whose leader had heard and obeyed God’s prompting to send a hot water bottle, even to the equator. And one of the girls had put in a dolly for an African child – five months before, in answer to the believing prayer of a ten-year-old to bring it “that afternoon.”

“Before they call, I will answer” (Isaiah 65:24).

This awesome prayer takes less than a minute. When you receive this, say the prayer, that’s all you have to do. No strings attached. Just send it on to whomever you want but do send it on. Prayer is one of the best free gifts we receive. There is no cost but a lot of rewards.

Let’s continue praying for one another:  Father, I ask you to bless my friends reading this right now. I am asking You to minister to their spirit at this very moment. Where there is pain, give them Your peace and mercy. Where there is self doubting, release a renewed confidence to work through them. Where there is tiredness or exhaustion, I ask You to give them understanding, guidance, and strength as they learn submission to Your leading.

Where there is spiritual stagnation, I ask You to renew them by revealing Your nearness, and by drawing them into greater intimacy with You. Where there is fear, reveal Your love, and release to them Your courage. Where there is a sin blocking them, reveal it, and break its hold over my friend’s life. Bless their finances, give them greater vision, and raise up leaders and friends to support and encourage them. Give each of them discernment to recognize the evil forces around them, and reveal to them the power they have in You to defeat it. I ask you to do these things in Jesus’ name.  Amen.

Helen Roseveare, Missionary to Africa
Helen Roseveare a doctor missionary from England to Zaire , Africa, told this as it had happened to her in Africa .

 

 

[SmileyMcGee]

15 hours ago, Darren10 said:

No buttheadeness taken.

"I see the request as potentially creating an interesting, almost comical view of a God that would allow his own house to be partially ruined by a natural disaster that he can control unless his children ask him not to."

Isn't that how God works period?

Not sure I know what you mean.

[Duncan]

This may go without saying but do you think they'll have to tear down the Temple and rebuild it? 

[jkwilliams]

Just now, Duncan said:

This may go without saying but do you think they'll have to tear down the Temple and rebuild it? 

Amost certainly not. It's mostly drywall, carpets, furniture, and maybe some electrical work. 

[Duncan]

2 minutes ago, jkwilliams said:

Amost certainly not. It's mostly drywall, carpets, furniture, and maybe some electrical work. 

aha! make it easier to do that than rebuild and cheaper too i'm sure

[jkwilliams]

1 minute ago, Duncan said:

aha! make it easier to do that than rebuild and cheaper too i'm sure

I've helped with flood cleanup a few times, and that's usually the problem. The first thing to do is go in and remove the carpets and then cut out the drywall from about a foot above the high-water mark. Once we did that for a very poor family in our stake in central Texas, and when we cut away the drywall, we found the one wall was badly damaged by termites, and the other 3 had been charred in a fire. The house literally started wobbling, so we brought in 2x4s and braced the walls as well as we could, but it had been the drywall holding the house up. That was one time when a flood was going to take much more extensive work to repair.

[Darren10]

On ‎8‎/‎31‎/‎2017 at 0:12 PM, SmileyMcGee said:

Not sure I know what you mean.

While I am convinced God provides many miracles all the time, despite us not being worthy of them, I think it is part of God's nature to require prayer from His children in order for certain miraculous things to happen. It is one of many means God uses to bring his chlidren to Him. Don't ask me to detail which miracles necessarily fall into this category and exactly why. That's way above my paygrade. 

Edited September 6, 2017 by Darren10

[The Nehor]

44 minutes ago, Duncan said:

This may go without saying but do you think they'll have to tear down the Temple and rebuild it? 

Nope, but clean up will mean stripping a lot of stuff down. The hardest part after rebuilding the walls is getting rid of the smell.