Interesting changes for 3rd hour block in 2018

[sheilauk]

4 hours ago, bluebell said:

The Sunday school class on the essays sounds amazing.  I think that people are just getting bored with Sunday school after studying the same thing for decades on end.  Change is always nice and the essay topics are definitely refreshing.

As long as there is a choice available as not everyone has been studying the same thing for decades.   I've been a member for only 8 years,  so only twice through the cycle and for most of the time I've had a calling which means not being in the adult Sunday school, including at present.   In fact,  I've never done a complete year there.  I certainly wouldn't be bored yet. I have read the essays myself and am aware of the issues, I find it harder to go through the scriptures!.Then there are the other converts who have not done them at all.  

[clarkgoble]

1 minute ago, Calm said:

I get why they want families to be on the same page...images of gospel discussions around the dinner table or family home evenings where everyone can have something to say about what they were taught in the OT, but as you say Primary can be very overwhelming even if you have your own kids and the lessons may be in the same book, but often aren't about the same subject or scripture people.  

Since everyone now has quick and easy access to the manuals, it can be good to just look up the manuals so you're prepared when you ask them what they learned at church during lunch (or dinner). I tend to do FHE on Sunday night since my Mondays are typically so busy. (Today is an exception) So I might start looking up the manuals during SS and teach a lesson that builds upon what they learned.

[Calm]

1 hour ago, clarkgoble said:

I should note that by bad I meant the manuals not the teaching experience. Since I have a new Sunbeam and a little girl who is a Star I appreciate them a great deal. If you're comfortable with kids that age it's a great experience.  I just glanced through the manual and did my own thing. But I've seen newly married guys get thrown into those callings who really struggle. Heck I was pretty clueless when I was called to nursery having a brother only a few years younger than I and both of us getting married fairly late. Fortunately my wife was in there with me. Had I been called without someone who knew what they were doing I'd probably be freaking out.

I sat in last month on a Star A class with a young mother newly called due to a new ward being formed as my granddaughter was going on her own the first time.  I don't know if it was last minute, but I had forgotten how excruciating it could be for that age trying to get everyone involved and not just the bright one that doesn't want to be quiet. First thing I always did after prayer was take my shoes off, sing an exercise song, then spread out the blanket, have everyone plop down and tell a flannel board story or filmstrip story with their help.  Also always have crayons and something to color and don't depend on kids cutting things out though glue sticking is manageable.  And be prepared for three answers to any question.."sad", "happy", or "Jesus".

Blanket didn't work for the kid who was a violent offender by the time he got into nursery as he needed space from others to avoid hurting them, but for everyone else it worked great.

Rather than scriptures, for up to 8 and 9 I got everyone scripture story books as I always had slow readers and it just wasn't right to make them struggle to contribute.  We could always just talk about the pictures if they had a problem reading.

[Calm]

14 minutes ago, clarkgoble said:

Since everyone now has quick and easy access to the manuals, it can be good to just look up the manuals so you're prepared when you ask them what they learned at church during lunch (or dinner). I tend to do FHE on Sunday night since my Mondays are typically so busy. (Today is an exception) So I might start looking up the manuals during SS and teach a lesson that builds upon what they learned.

Our ward needs to make much better use of the online info so as to keep an up to date schedule.  There are always changes these days it seems due to unknowns when the calendar was made like Temple dedications and regionals.  There was one month two years ago iirc where we meant twice in 5 weeks.  Then you get the substitute teacher who was told the wrong lesson....

Edited June 5, 2017 by Calm

[Calm]

3 hours ago, bluebell said:

Some of the manuals are laughable.  My parents subbed for Sunbeams two weeks ago and the title of their lesson was "I am thankful for my ears."  That was it.  40 minutes with 3 and 4 year olds and that was all the manual had to offer.  

It can take quite a bit of time to look at each kid's ears and have them tell you all the interesting stories about what they have managed to get stuck in them or other totally unrelated stories for that week.

There are worse lessons.  The recording of sounds so they can guess them can be a fun activity.  I would bring instruments too (nothing like cymbals, more like sand blocks) and do the quiet loud game.  Teaching them sign language was fun too...though some kids sometimes didn't get the why.  Did it with a SeeandSay one year.

Edited June 5, 2017 by Calm

[clarkgoble]

1 minute ago, Calm said:

It can take quite a bit of time to look at each kid's ears and have them tell you all the interesting stories about what they have managed to get stuck in them or other totally unrelated stories for that week.

Part of the problem is that class size varies quite a bit. Our ward made two sunbeam classes due to numbers. But planning a lesson that you can shift from one to five kids can be tricky.

[Calm]

3 hours ago, clarkgoble said:

Yeah. I subbed for Sunbeams and it was bad. Requires a lot of work on the teacher's part to do well. Again, very stressful for people not used to little kids. The Nursery manual sucks too. Although by and large everyone just ignores it and does their own thing. 

I was told as a ward librarian the current one is tons better than the old one I used.

[Hamba Tuhan]

9 hours ago, sheilauk said:

Then there are the other converts who have not done them at all.  

Yep. It can be easy for those in the 'core' of the Church to forget that most members in places like where I live haven't even been in the Church for 'decades on end'.

Edited June 6, 2017 by Hamba Tuhan

[bluebell]

20 minutes ago, Calm said:

It can take quite a bit of time to look at each kid's ears and have them tell you all the interesting stories about what they have managed to get stuck in them or other totally unrelated stories for that week.

There are worse lessons.  The recording of sounds so they can guess them can be a fun activity.  I would bring instruments too (nothing like cymbals, more like sand blocks) and do the quiet loud game.  Teaching them sign language was fun too...though some kids sometimes didn't get the why.  Did it with a SeeandSay one year.

I remember the "I'm thankful for fish" lesson being pretty bad.  I'm hoping next time that whoever they get to help do the sunbeam manual has actually taught sunbeams (lately).  

[JLHPROF]

1 hour ago, Lemuel said:

How did the church survive for 140 years before correlation?

Quite well.

You had the President of the Church threatening to box the ears of the President of the Quorum of the 12 Apostles if he didn't see his way on doctrine.
You had Joseph Smith stating he didn't like disciplinary action being taken against someone for erring in his doctrine.
You had one doctrine being taught publicly and a different doctrine being professed privately among leaders.

And most important of all....you had recorded, written, able to be studied revelation.  Seemed to work ok.
The so-called troublesome speculative doctrines didn't cause any real trouble (with one obvious exception...)

[Calm]

38 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I remember the "I'm thankful for fish" lesson being pretty bad.  I'm hoping next time that whoever they get to help do the sunbeam manual has actually taught sunbeams (lately).  

Last minute subbing for those classes mean at least 20 minutes of coloring unless the teacher knows a lot of good and familiar songs.  Then it is 15 minutes of coloring.  Primary presidencies should have emergency lesson packets,that include an outline of an extra lesson with a few games (I always brought a bean bag and we could throw them at pictures and take turn telling the stories or have a symbol for a popular primary song, I made my own in a star shape), coloring stuff, a picture book to read, video, etc.  I keep finger puppets (IKEA has nice and very cheap ones) in my purse for the squirmy kid in Church...I can relate too well.  Some kids love them, sometimes not so great.  Flannel board stories used to be popular, not so much anymore, but individual whiteboards are good (as in "draw a picture of something that swims in the ocean).

Edited June 6, 2017 by Calm

[mrmarklin]

Tough to see this working in a ward with less than 50% or so activity. Which is the norm for the church. 

 

The repetitive nature of the SS manuals is getting very stale and in my ward for the last few years, attendance is declining with a lot of people leaving after Sacrament meeting.  Having lessons on the essays is not a program, but pablum for the people that care about tenets IMNSHO.  Better to incorporate the ideas in an upgraded series of manuals.  The church has decades of material to draw on for this as some of the old manuals were quite good and could be revised.

Hard to see how on going council meeting third block does anything to improve third hour, especially with attendance declining as it is already.  An unstructured program is a recipe for boredom and disaster in wards that are not blessed with as many hard core members as the pilot project. 

Im not qualified to opine on Primary classes, but valuing ears?  Really?

[Calm]

8 minutes ago, mrmarklin said:

Im not qualified to opine on Primary classes, but valuing ears?  Really?

It is a lesson on listening mostly.  The general topic is I am a child of God and each lesson is about a blessing being a child of God gives you, for 3 and maybe 4 year olds, being grateful for one's body and what it can do is part of it, the world and its wonders another.

Edited June 6, 2017 by Calm

[mrmarklin]

4 minutes ago, Calm said:

It is a lesson on listening mostly.  The general topic is I am a child of God and each lesson is about a blessing being a child of God gives you, for 3 and maybe 4 year olds, being grateful for one's body and what it can do is part of it, the world and its wonders another.

I guess one has to have been there.

[Calm]

5 minutes ago, mrmarklin said:

I guess one has to have been there.

It can be a lot of fun as long as you forget about completing a lesson and look on Primary class as a way to help kids learn they are loved and cared about by others besides family including their teacher and God, that they are important to others including teacher and God, to be a part of a group, and hopefully pick up some self discipline so everyone else in the class can have the opportunity to do so as well.

The lesson is just there to give you a structure to do that in as little or as much as you need it, imo, for that age.  Doctrines come later.

Edited June 6, 2017 by Calm

[RevTestament]

7 hours ago, pogi said:

My parents invited us over for dinner last night in Orem.  They live in the ward I was talking about in a previous thread with close to 100% activity rate and almost no non-members in their ward boundaries.  We had an interesting discussion about a church program their ward is piloting that is supposed to be implemented church wide in January (according to my parents).  We also discussed a very interesting Sunday School class that their ward has started.  

One would expect a ward with such high activity rate in conservative Utah Valley to be super orthodox and conservative in their approach, but it turns out that their ward is currently one of the most progressive that I have ever heard of.  First, I will talk about the SS class in their ward.  Their first counselor in the bishopric approached the bishop with an idea for a SS class which covered the church essays.  The bishop liked the idea and the first counselor is teaching the class.  Last Sunday was their first lesson.  My parents said that almost the entire ward attended the class, and the regular SS class was almost empty.  There was incredible interest in the class and they had very open, interesting, and uplifting discussions.  The first was was the soft-ball topic "Are Mormon's Christian", but they will have lessons on every essay including polygamy and blacks and the priesthood etc. Has anyone heard of any other wards doing this?

I suggested this exact Sunday School class 10 days ago to Jeanne:

I'm sure I will be taking my own advice and attending this class.

Quote

Second, starting in January the church is doing away with the Presidents of the Church manuals, and all manuals all together for the 3rd hour block.  The idea is to structure the hour much like ward counsel with open discussion and dialogue regarding whatever specific needs and concerns are of interest in the individual wards.  The RS presidency, the Elders quorum, and HP presidencies will decide the topics for their quorums based on feedback from their group.  In other words, there will be no correlated materials used that hour.  Each ward in the church will have unique lessons which focus on the specific needs of each individual ward.  As far as I could tell, YM and YW will remain as it is now.  

After recently defending correlation in another thread, it appears that the church is listening to voices like that of stemelblow, and creating a space for a less correlated and more open forum (at least for the 3rd hour block).  

All I can say is that I am a little jealous of my parents ward!  Can anybody else confirm this change in January, and what are your thoughts about is?

Can't confirm change, but it is welcome. We'll see what happens. I was falling asleep again this last Sunday in priesthood. Getting involved in discussion will certainly help me. Often I am just plain bored.

Edited June 6, 2017 by RevTestament

[strappinglad]

I'm sure all my high priests are dutifully studying the scriptures during class time. Those ipads are certainly being well used. Then again , maybe they just have a few new games to keep boredom away !

[RevTestament]

4 hours ago, hagoth7 said:

I see it instead not only as a means to improve things as things currently stand, but as a prophetic step to prepare a people for what others will deem to be supposed disaster....when nations give way, and zion will govern itself in its various locations...and will arise....a true light amid encircling gloom.

Ok. I nominate you to teach a class!

[RevTestament]

3 hours ago, Lemuel said:

Moroni could imagine it:

Moroni 6:9 And their meetings were conducted by the church after the manner of the workings of the Spirit, and by the power of the Holy Ghost; for as the power of the Holy Ghost led them whether to preach, or to exhort, or to pray, or to supplicate, or to sing, even so it was done.

Hey, i can imagine this too. The Church reanimated! The Spirit moving in all the meetings! I haven't felt that in awhile. We'll see if the Church is ready for it!

[carbon dioxide]

7 hours ago, bluebell said:

My only complaint with Come Follow Me is how the same exact manual is used for sunday school.  I've had kids who have had the same lesson, watched the same movies, twice on a sunday and that would be hard for an adult, let alone a kid who might be struggling with wanting to be there anyway.

I will second that.  The weakness of the manual is that it is geared to the 12 to 18 year old groups.  There is a BIG difference between a 12 and a 17 and 18 year old.  Any manual that is directed at such this age range is either going to be to hard for the 12 year old or too easy and boring for the 17 and 18 year old group.  In my going through the Come Follow Me manual, it does not challenge the 17 year old group at all.  Take for example this instructional suggestion and I am just picking randomly:

"Invite some of the youth to read President Henry B. Eyring’s experience as a youth in his priests quorum (in his talk “Learning in the Priesthood”), and invite the others to read his 20 years later as a bishop (in the same talk). Ask them to retell the stories to each other. What do they learn from these stories about councils? What makes councils such an effective way to do the Lord’s work? What are some opportunities the youth have to counsel together?"  https://www.lds.org/youth/learn/ss/priesthood-keys/councils?lang=eng

This is a great idea for a 12 or 14 or perhaps a 15 year old to do.  But this in my view is not challenging enough for a 16 or 17 year old.  The manuals need to be more specific to the age group and they need to learn new stuff.  If a 17 year old has heard the same basic lesson year after year, of course they are going to get bored.  We need to teach kids new stuff.  They naturally want to learn new stuff they have never heard before. 

[probablyHagoth7]

7 hours ago, juliann said:

....and is fluent in Mormonspeak :-)

? What is deemed Mormonspeak?

[Traela]

35 minutes ago, carbon dioxide said:

I will second that.  The weakness of the manual is that it is geared to the 12 to 18 year old groups.  There is a BIG difference between a 12 and a 17 and 18 year old.  Any manual that is directed at such this age range is either going to be to hard for the 12 year old or too easy and boring for the 17 and 18 year old group.  In my going through the Come Follow Me manual, it does not challenge the 17 year old group at all.  Take for example this instructional suggestion and I am just picking randomly:

"Invite some of the youth to read President Henry B. Eyring’s experience as a youth in his priests quorum (in his talk “Learning in the Priesthood”), and invite the others to read his 20 years later as a bishop (in the same talk). Ask them to retell the stories to each other. What do they learn from these stories about councils? What makes councils such an effective way to do the Lord’s work? What are some opportunities the youth have to counsel together?"  https://www.lds.org/youth/learn/ss/priesthood-keys/councils?lang=eng

This is a great idea for a 12 or 14 or perhaps a 15 year old to do.  But this in my view is not challenging enough for a 16 or 17 year old.  The manuals need to be more specific to the age group and they need to learn new stuff.  If a 17 year old has heard the same basic lesson year after year, of course they are going to get bored.  We need to teach kids new stuff.  They naturally want to learn new stuff they have never heard before. 

Personally, I think the biggest problem with the SS program is that there are too many Teacher Improvement lessons.  The kids want doctrine!  But instead they get up to ten lessons (when combined with YW/YM) in a month on one topic.  

I understand the theory behind the structure.  But the implementation leaves something to be desired.

 

[Calm]

"The kids want doctrine!  But instead they get up to ten lessons (when combined with YW/YM) in a month on one topic."

Please explain to me the difference of teaching doctrine and teaching a topic.  I would have thought it was the same thing (topic is baptism, teach the doctrine on baptism).

[hagoth7]

8 hours ago, RevTestament said:

Ok. I nominate you to teach a class!

Willing. 

[Gray]

I was hoping they were finally going to drop the third hour.