TheSkepticChristian Posted February 14, 2016 Posted February 14, 2016 (edited) A family member is having a tough time because her husband no longer believes in the LDS church. She is in constant depression and could possibly request divorce just because her husband no longer has a testimony. There is no other reason, only that. She knows her husband is a good man, but says she will never be happy with him. I think that shouldn't destroy a marriage, it doesn't have to be that way. I am looking for church leader statements that can help her understand it is not the end of the world. A statement that says you can still have a happy marriage with an inactive husband. Perhaps that is why there are plenty of cultural Mormons, they lie about having a testimony to save the marriage. Edited February 14, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian
Tacenda Posted February 14, 2016 Posted February 14, 2016 I'm on the phone, so hard to post but there was an Ensign article and a general conference talk about it. If that helps, will try to find and get back.
Tacenda Posted February 14, 2016 Posted February 14, 2016 (edited) http://archive.sltrib.com/story.php?ref=/sltrib/lifestyle/55780726-80/church-says-faith-believing.html.csp In this article it mentions an article in the Ensign and Friend. And some information for those going through this. There is also a support group called Faces East...http://www.faceseast.org/. And a post with some links...http://www.faceseast.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=187 Another in a StayLDS thread...http://www.staylds.com/staylds/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1280 Edited February 14, 2016 by Tacenda
Glenn101 Posted February 14, 2016 Posted February 14, 2016 First one might want to check with one of the very early Church Authorities who said in 1 Corinthians Chapter 7: 12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away. 13 And the woman which hath an husband that believeth not, and if he be pleased to dwell with her, let her not leave him. 14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy. 15 But if the unbelieving depart, let him depart. A brother or a sister is not under bondage in such cases: but God hath called us to peace. 16 For what knowest thou, O wife, whether thou shalt save thy husband? or how knowest thou, O man, whether thou shalt save thy wife? Please note that D&C Section 74 explains the controversy that had arisen that that gave cause for this bit of advice. I have not looked at what is currently being advised by the Church, but in the past, it has been much the same as that which Paul advocated. Glenn 4
sheilauk Posted February 14, 2016 Posted February 14, 2016 Maybe it would help more to know that there are others who are living in the same situation. I know two women in my ward who both have inactive husbands and so far have remained married. I know they find it hard but I don't know how they try to make it work as I haven't spoken to them about it. But it might help your friend to talk to someone like them.
Duncan Posted February 14, 2016 Posted February 14, 2016 2 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said: A family member is having a tough time because her husband no longer believes in the LDS church. She is in constant depression and could possibly request divorce just because her husband no longer has a testimony. There is no other reason, only that. She knows her husband is a good man, but says she will never be happy with him. I think that shouldn't destroy a marriage, it doesn't have to be that way. I am looking for church leader statements that can help her understand it is not the end of the world. A statement that says you can still have a happy marriage with an inactive husband. Perhaps that is why there are plenty of cultural Mormons, they lie about having a testimony to save the marriage. I was in the same boat 10 years ago, except we got divorced. She isn't alone 1
Calm Posted February 14, 2016 Posted February 14, 2016 https://www.lds.org/ensign/2012/07/when-he-stopped-believing?lang=eng 2
TheSkepticChristian Posted February 15, 2016 Author Posted February 15, 2016 I will take a look at the articles, thanks. I hope it helps her.
Buckeye Posted February 15, 2016 Posted February 15, 2016 If the concern is her eternal marriage, she should realize that, unless he resigns, she can't just go get sealed to someone else. So she might as well continue to invest in the good marriage they have now. If the concern is his influence on children, that is something they should seriously discuss. But divorce would not necessary help things and could seriously undermine them. Maybe suggest the biographies of recent/current apostles. Several of them were raised by inactive fathers. Oaks comes to mind. I know there are others but can't recall off the top of my head. 1
rpn Posted February 15, 2016 Posted February 15, 2016 (edited) She needs to understand that her divorce, absent adultery or abuse, means SHE is the one breaking her covenants, not him. She also needs to consider whether she worships a God who throws away those who don't believe, and whether her decision to do that means she has no testimony of the Gospel herself. Agency matters to God and perhaps the reason that murder is so heinous to Him is that it cuts short the life God gave her dh to work this out. What gives her the right to do that in the form of divorce. Having faith in the promise of 1 Corinthians 7:14 is important. Although faceseast.org is pretty defunct, there are lots of old threads that can help her figure this out. Suggest she read it. And tell her that everyone in her position mourns the loss of expectation and the changes in expectations. Edited February 15, 2016 by rpn
Jeanne Posted February 15, 2016 Posted February 15, 2016 23 hours ago, TheSkepticChristian said: A family member is having a tough time because her husband no longer believes in the LDS church. She is in constant depression and could possibly request divorce just because her husband no longer has a testimony. There is no other reason, only that. She knows her husband is a good man, but says she will never be happy with him. I think that shouldn't destroy a marriage, it doesn't have to be that way. I am looking for church leader statements that can help her understand it is not the end of the world. A statement that says you can still have a happy marriage with an inactive husband. Perhaps that is why there are plenty of cultural Mormons, they lie about having a testimony to save the marriage. I haven't read anything here except the OP..and I will admit that I have no scriptures or anything to help. But this touched me greatly. I am hoping that she keeps the word divorce out of the conversation. She says he is a good man..he hasn't changed, just his view has changed. Please...love should trump religion..I know concepts in the church are grounded on eternal aspects but I hope that she realizes that compromise is so worth the memories..and the love shared here. 1
Avatar4321 Posted February 15, 2016 Posted February 15, 2016 I can't imagine changing ones religious views doesn't change you. But the Lord is clear that we should stay married and wait on Him
theplains Posted February 15, 2016 Posted February 15, 2016 6 hours ago, Buckeye said: If the concern is her eternal marriage, she should realize that, unless he resigns, she can't just go get sealed to someone else. So she might as well continue to invest in the good marriage they have now. Is there a revelation showing that a sealing can be revoked so the woman can be sealed to another husband? Thanks, Jim
RevTestament Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 I don't have any articles to link to, but do have perhaps some words which may help. I look at the marriage as learning to be celestial. The man should treat his wife like the Lord loves His Church. The Lord cannot be exalted without His Church. The man is in the position of Christ. He is to lead/teach his seed. By the same token the woman is in the position of the church, and is designed to love her husband even as we love the Lord. She cannot be exalted without that priesthood. Temporal things are fleeting. If the man is honoring his covenant to his wife, she should honor hers. Testimonies change. Inactives return. I did. The prodigal son returned. People in the spirit world can change their testimony too. So he probably has a good chance of regaining his testimony if not in this estate, in the next. Perhaps if she realizes this, it will calm her concerns. If she wants to be exalted perhaps she should stick with her chosen partner to do that, rather than abandoning him, and dishonoring her own covenant in doing so. That doesn't seem too exalting.
Tacenda Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 I don't understand the need to be exalted in this church. I just want to live with Him, not be Her. This church putsoso many stipulations on it that no wonder marriages suffer the consequences of a spouse's disbelief of it's paradigm.
consiglieri Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 I think this type of situation is the unfortunate flip-side of the "families can be together forever" slogan. We teach that families can be together forever, but only if each and every one of them receives the necessary ordinances and is fully faithful throughout mortality. The corollary is that should a family member not remain fully faithful, that family is NOT going to be together forever. At the very least, the unfaithful member will have to be culled. When it happens in a temple marriage, things can become very difficult for the faithful spouse. Eternal consequences hang upon the decision to remain married.
cinepro Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 Everyone already shared the stuff I would, so I can only give you this: Testimony Equals Sex in Orem Marriage By Paul Browning OREM, UT - Local couple Nathan and Brittney McAllister have found an unlikely factor in their marital intimacy: Nathan’s testimony. After nine years of happy marriage, it was discovered that the church was playing a larger role in their lives than anyone previously knew. Last year, Nathan sat down and had a serious talk with his wife, admitting he didn’t think he believed a lot of LDS doctrine to be factual. “Ever since I told my wife I was unsure about the church, she’s been pretty cold,” said McAllister. The couple had been copulating weekly, on average, with both of them “generally satisfied” with the other’s performance. Now, McAllister says the two are intimate “about once a month, and even then the sex has a sick tension.” His wife Brittney said, “It affected me deeply to have the priesthood holder in my home question the church. His study of alternative beliefs and worldly trash is like a personal attack on me.” Nathan’s belief in the church of his upbringing began to shake after his mission, when he attended BYU. “I saw a lot of weird teachings there,” reports Nathan. “Each teacher had his own doctrine, and when I asked questions that weren’t in the manual, the teacher would tell me to pray about it.” Nathan’s doubts included blacks and the priesthood, Brigham Young’s teachings, and “blatantly racist” remarks made by the prophet Ezra Taft Benson. The deeper into the scriptures and conference talks he would go, the more confused he would get. He would even ask old seminary teachers, friends, and coworkers for answers, to no avail. With the arrival of the Internet, Nathan took his search for truth online. Now Nathan feels that many of the basic beliefs he held true for so many years are based on inconsistencies and lies. “If Nathan would only read the scriptures and pray, the Holy Ghost would answer him,” Brittney says. She claims that while he is a good husband and father, he would be a more attractive man if he continued to share her beliefs in Mormonism. Strangely enough, his disbelief in the church has not prevented him from continuing to be a model member. His home teaching remains at a solid 90 percent, and he has held several callings, including Sunday school teacher. “You can always count on Brother McAllister to be there if we need volunteers,” stated his bishop, Lloyd Rivera. “He participates in priesthood class and is a fully active member of our ward.” Nathan says, “I wish my own member were as active. Once, after a fast and testimony meeting, we were in bed, and I started rubbing her shoulder. She said, “Is Joseph Smith a true prophet?” and I didn’t have the right answer. She rolled over and made light snoring sounds.” Brittney confirms her loss of interest that night. “I have borne my testimony to him that the church is true and that he will get his crazy bumpin’ nasty freak on once he testifies of the same truth.” In fact, Brittney has allowed Nathan to briefly see some lingerie she recently purchased. She calls them her “faith-promoters” and says he will see them again when he throws away The Essence of Zen, a book of Buddhist teachings. Dr. Bruce P. Alexander, a marriage and sex therapist, maintains that testimony and sex are closely related in Mormon marriages. He recommends that men, especially, make sure they have a strong testimony if they want to please their wives. “A study completed last year shows that women who are married to men with strong testimonies report 67 percent more pleasure in bed. The link between spirituality and staying power is surprisingly strong.” Nathan says he doesn’t doubt those numbers. He reports that, at times, their intimacy will improve after Nathan attends a priesthood service activity or reads scriptures with his three kids. However, “until Nathan feels he is sufficiently confident to baptize his daughter, their level of sexual activity will continue to drop,” claims LDS family therapist R. Gene Duncan. “The trust level is no longer there with Nathan and Brittney.” Nathan has three years until his daughter turns eight. Until then, he says he will continue to serve his wife’s church and try to find a resolution to his doubts.
Lemuel Posted February 16, 2016 Posted February 16, 2016 Said Hyrum Smith, in 1842, when he was co-president with Joseph: Whereas, in times past persons have been permitted to gather with the Saints at Nauvoo, in North America—such as husbands leaving their wives and children behind; also, such as wives leaving their husbands, and such as husbands leaving their wives who have no children, and some because their companions are unbelievers. All this kind of proceedings we consider to be erroneous and for want of proper information. And the same should be taught to all the Saints, and not suffer families to be broken up on any account whatever if it be possible to avoid it. Suffer no man to leave his wife because she is an unbeliever. These things are an evil and must be forbidden by the authorities of the church or they will come under condemnation; for the gathering is not in hast nor by flight, but to prepare all things before you, and you know not but the unbeliever may be converted and the Lord heal him; but let the believers exercise faith in God, and the unbelieving husband shall be sanctified by the believing wife; and the unbelieving wife by the believing husband, and families are preserved and saved from a great evil which we have seen verified before our eyes. Behold this is a wicked generation, full of lyings, and deceit, and craftiness; and the children of the wicked are wiser than the children of light; that is, they are more crafty; and it seems that it has been the case in all ages of the world. And the man who leaves his wife and travels to a foreign nation, has his mind overpowered with darkness, and Satan deceived him and flatters him with the graces of the harlot, and before he is aware he is disgraced forever; and greater is the danger for the woman that leaves her husband. The evils resulting from such proceedings are of such a nature as to oblige us to cut them off from the church. And we also forbid that a woman leave her husband because he is an unbeliever. We also forbid that a man shall leave his wife because she is an unbeliever. If he be a bad man (i.e., the believer) there is a law to remedy that evil. And if the law divorce them, then they are at liberty; otherwise they are bound as long as they two shall live, and it is not our prerogative to go beyond this; if we do it, it will be at the expense of our reputation. These things we have written in plainness and we desire that they should be publicly known, and request this to be published in the STAR. May the Lord bestow his blessings upon all the Saints richly, and hasten the gathering, and bring about the fullness of the everlasting covenant are the prayers of your brethren.
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