Rivers Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/07/opinion/maynard-assisted-suicide-cancer-dignity/?c=&page=1I am guessing most of us have heard this story. Is there any reason to object to Brittany Maynard's decision from an LDS point of view?
rodheadlee Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Endure until the end. Pain and suffering makes us humble. This is a necesarry trait to become like Christ. Edited October 30, 2014 by rodheadlee 1
Tacenda Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 This is a wonderful option. I'd be first in line.
Storm Rider Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 This is a challenging topic for me. I am fearful of medical science and how far it has progressed - it enables life to continue far past the time that individuals would have naturally past away. Do we demand that we do all we can to stay alive as long as possible? At what point can we surrender to a natural death? It splits hairs to argue that a person who takes medication and dies today is somehow wrong when had they fought on, in great amounts of pain for seven more days, they would have died "normally". I think we are putting too much emphasis on what dying normally is. Few of us die normally anymore. Many of us take medications daily to keep us healthy. This is not normal and there is a good argument that it is not enduring. It is ameliorating a poorer existence unnaturally or artificially by those daily medications. I expect that we should all be more conscious about our health decisions. We need to be more prayerful and more cognizant of what we eat, what medications we take, and how much exercise we get. If we are diagnosed with a terminal disease those same decisions are even more important. Should someone choose differently than me I will keep that stone in my pocket and choose to pray for them. We should teach of the sacredness of life to all and keep our judgments to ourselves. 2
VideoGameJunkie Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 This is a very tough topic. I would be for it except I don't think God is for it, so that changes my viewpoint. I feel really really bad for those that suffer and fear myself suffering one day.
Kenngo1969 Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) This young woman has the right to make, and to carry out, whatever decision the law of the jurisdiction in which she resides allows her to. That said, it's not a giant leap between allowing someone to make and to effect a "dying-with-dignity" decision, on the one hand, and allowing a third party to make (and to effect) such a decision for someone whose life, in the judgment of the third party, lacks appropriate value, on the other hand. If, for example, Peter Singer had been propounding his theories regarding the propriety of infanticide at the time I was born in the late '60s; if he had been allowed to determine, prospectively, the value of my life; and if he had been allowed to effectuate such a decision, I might not be here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Singer P.S.: In my judgment, "enduring to the end" does not require us merely to prolong quantity of life while sacrificing quality of life. Edited November 3, 2014 by Kenngo1969 2
Calm Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Normal for me and my daughter is dead. 60 years ago we would have been I bet.I thi k this is something that includes so many variables that I never feel comfortable making a judgment. I think it should be an option to remove all medical care, but like abortion, only in very limited cases and for LDS at least only after sincerely seeking out God's Will for one. Edited October 30, 2014 by calmoriah
KevinG Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 You mean this thread isn't about sending missionaries to China? 1
LOSTONE Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 It is not just about her suffering, but about those who love her that suffer because they have to watch her suffer until the end unnecessarily. That is so wrong. As someone who as watched several terminally ill family members ‘suffer to the end’, I can say the horror of it hers the persona and the loves ones. I simply can not justify that kind of suffering. If you have been there, you know. If you haven’t, you just got an unfounded opinion. I have been there more than once.We don’t let animals suffer in pain, but we will let people suffer in pain? That is just stupid.We will execute a murder for their crimes, but won’t release a terminal ill person from their suffering? That is also stupid.We say we care, but our actions speak of our unfounded opinions. That is really stupid.
Buckeye Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 There have been a few other threads about this topic in the past few weeks. Here is one: http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/64374-the-right-to-die/ FWIW, I read the phrase "endure to the end" differently from many members. For me, the "end" is Christ, not death. We are supposed to endure until we become like Him, which for nearly everyone will take place, if at all, after this life. Thus, I believe there will still be much enduring after we leave this life. 1
ksfisher Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/07/opinion/maynard-assisted-suicide-cancer-dignity/?c=&page=1I am guessing most of us have heard this story. Is there any reason to object to Brittany Maynard's decision from an LDS point of view?21.3.3 EuthanasiaEuthanasia is defined as deliberately putting to death a person who is suffering from an incurable condition or disease. A person who participates in euthanasia, including assisting someone to commit suicide, violates the commandments of God. (See also 21.3.8.)21. Selected Church Policies and Guidelineshttp://www.lds.org/handbook/handbook-2-administering-the-church/selected-church-policies?lang=eng 2
rodheadlee Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 We are all terminally ill, where do you draw the line? I didn't mean to sound cold hearted in my short post. Someitmes my wife is in so much pain I want to put her to sleep, like a pet. But yet she is down at my Mom's helping her through a family crisis. I have administered morphine drip to someone who was dying (under the care of hospice) until they expired. I hope someone does the same for me. As an Aaronic Preisthood holder I felt woefully inadequate in my prayer/ blessing for her. This is certainly one of the drawbacks to allowing your spiritual growth to be stunted by addiction to tobacco. 3
KevinG Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I want to die peacefully in my sleep like Grandpa. Not like the passengers in his car who were screaming for their lives. 2
Tacenda Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I want to die peacefully in my sleep like Grandpa. Not like the passengers in his car who were screaming for their lives.I feel so rotten for laughing at this, especially if it's true! If it's not, you're evil KevinG! 1
katherine the great Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I feel for this girl and her family. I don't view something like this as a suicide. I think the reason suicide is looked up as so horrific is because of the consequences to everyone around the person--especially family and loved ones. In a situation like this, if she is going to die anyway and her family is supportive of her decision, I just don't see why it is really anyone else's business. It was standard procedure for decades during the excruciatingly painful end of a cancer patient's life for the doctor to raise the level of morphine until the person just died. I don't see how this is much different. 4
Popular Post Buzzard Posted October 30, 2014 Popular Post Posted October 30, 2014 I've commented on this before, but here we go again, I suppose, Talked to my doctor after the latest scan. The place where my tumors are growing is in my lungs, the other tumors around my body are dead or not getting larger. If the lung nodules continue to grow, in anywhere from a few to several months, I will be short of breath. Then I will need supplemental oxygen, then kind of like emphysema, as the tumors take up more and more space in my lungs, I will not be able to take in enough air to survive. I'll pass away gasping for breath. That does not sound like a lot of fun, and I'm not looking forward to it.But where do I have the right to say it's time to off myself? When I can't climb a mountain? When I can't work full time? When my lung capacity falls below a certain level? No, it's not my decision to make. God has reserved that decision for himself, and I'm not smart or wise enough to presume to override him. I totally have empathy for what this young lady is going through, but have no sympathy for the decision she has made. 7
ksfisher Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 You mean this thread isn't about sending missionaries to China? Senior couples only, no youth-in-Asia yet. 3
thesometimesaint Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I don't know the answer but http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/10/she-hasnt-changed-her-mind-but-woman-may-delay-decision-to-die-i-still-have-enough-joy/
KevinG Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I feel so rotten for laughing at this, especially if it's true! If it's not, you're evil KevinG! I kid. I tease.
pogi Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Buzzard, I am sorry to hear about your situation and completely respect your commitment to life and decision to fight to the end. However, I also understand the decision of others who's situation and prognosis is vastly different from your own, to choose a more peaceful way out. Sometimes just knowing that they have a choice gives people all the comfort they need to endure the scary and difficult moments of their illness. Having the option available gives tremendous comfort to those with terrible and frightening prognosis. It offers them a peace and assurance knowing that they maintain some control over their situation, when control is in short supply. A recent study shows that 60% of people who have lethal prescriptions actually use them. I can assure you that for those 40%, that prescription worked far better than any other prescription they actually use. This is a personal choice that I feel belongs to the individual after consulting with their doctor, their family and their God. Edited October 30, 2014 by pogi 1
pogi Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) 21.3.3 EuthanasiaEuthanasia is defined as deliberately putting to death a person who is suffering from an incurable condition or disease. A person who participates in euthanasia, including assisting someone to commit suicide, violates the commandments of God. (See also 21.3.8.)21. Selected Church Policies and Guidelineshttp://www.lds.org/handbook/handbook-2-administering-the-church/selected-church-policies?lang=eng If something similar to the "Dying with Dignity" act in Oregon becomes law in Utah, as a hospice nurse and a Mormon, would the church expect me to refuse to assist a patient who is seeking a lethal prescription? Would I be expected to not educate a patient about that option? What about the LDS doctors who write the prescription and the pharmacist who fills them? Would they be violating the commandments of God? Edited October 30, 2014 by pogi
Calm Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I think they will issue a statement if it happens so your questions an be answered as they have done in the case of legal gay marriage.
Guest Posted October 31, 2014 Posted October 31, 2014 It is not just about her suffering, but about those who love her that suffer because they have to watch her suffer until the end unnecessarily. That is so wrong. As someone who as watched several terminally ill family members ‘suffer to the end’, I can say the horror of it hers the persona and the loves ones. I simply can not justify that kind of suffering. If you have been there, you know. If you haven’t, you just got an unfounded opinion. I have been there more than once.We don’t let animals suffer in pain, but we will let people suffer in pain? That is just stupid.We will execute a murder for their crimes, but won’t release a terminal ill person from their suffering? That is also stupid.We say we care, but our actions speak of our unfounded opinions. That is really stupid.Just one thing...when you list question and then answer with, "that's just stupid". Then it would suggest that those who would oppose this for Spiritual or moral issues, and then "stupid".
followerofemmanuel Posted October 31, 2014 Posted October 31, 2014 One thing we should worry about is http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2779624/Number-mentally-ill-patients-killed-euthanasia-Holland-trebles-year-doctors-warn-assisted-suicide-control.html I supported both of my parents through palliative care. There was suffering but also great moments of joy, peace and beauty. My Mother put her faith, hope and trust in our saviour in her final days. Suffering can help us focus on eternal matters and allow time for repentence. I was able to demonstrate my love for my parents in practical ways after the life time that they cared for me. What an honour. No one desires to suffer. I admit that I had to advocate strongly to ensure my parents had proper palliative care so that they would be as comfortable as possible (only becuase the system was overhelmed, shortage of nurses etc) I think in most cases the medical professionals can provide comfort care. My heart goes out to those who are facing the end of this life. I pray that they will get the love and care that they so deserve. I also pray that God would be their strength, hope and comfort. 2
Rivers Posted October 31, 2014 Author Posted October 31, 2014 21.3.3 EuthanasiaEuthanasia is defined as deliberately putting to death a person who is suffering from an incurable condition or disease. A person who participates in euthanasia, including assisting someone to commit suicide, violates the commandments of God. (See also 21.3.8.)21. Selected Church Policies and Guidelineshttp://www.lds.org/handbook/handbook-2-administering-the-church/selected-church-policies?lang=engI guess that settles it then.
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