Duck Dynasty: Phil Robertson (And Anyone Similar) A Source Of Truth? A Voice Of Warning? A Stumbling Block?

[BCSpace]

No, I don't watch it.

 

“You lose your religion, you lose your morality, you lose your freedom,” Robertson said. “You cannot be right for America if you are not right with God.”
 

Phil Robertson

 

Seems to me this guy has a handle on principles taught in verses such as:
 

 

10 For behold, this is a land which is choice above all other lands; wherefore he that doth possess it shall serve God or shall be swept off; for it is the everlasting decree of God. And it is not until the fulness of iniquity among the children of the land, that they are swept off.

 11 And this cometh unto you, O ye Gentiles, that ye may know the decrees of God—that ye may repent, and not continue in your iniquities until the fulness come, that ye may not bring down the fulness of the wrath of God upon you as the inhabitants of the land have hitherto done.

 12 Behold, this is a choice land, and whatsoever nation shall possess it shall be free from bondage, and from captivity, and from all other nations under heaven, if they will but serve the God of the land, who is Jesus Christ, who hath been manifested by the things which we have written.

 

Ether 2:10-12

 

 

Now it strikes me that many would consider this Phil Robertson to be uncouth to put it mildly.  Nevertheless....

 

 

 25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

 26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

 27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

 28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:

 

1 Corinthians 1:24-28

 

 

I would be curious to know your thoughts on messages or sermons of truth, warning, revelation, etc. coming from sources like this. Obviously we have the true prophets, but does not God also use these types of instruments?  Is it not true that for some, hearing our prophets is beset by stumbling blocks whereas some would harken to truth taught by to Phil Robertson and vice versa?

 

Is there not a danger for anyone to whom Phil Robertson is a stumbling block and thus they do not believe the message even from a 'more respectible' source because they heard it first from, for example, Phil Robertson?

 

Are we excused for not listening, heeding, or believing because of stumbling blocks?

[Tacenda]

Willie and Korie Robertson of Duck Dynasty are in a Christian movie that didn't get the best reviews, too many Atheists, . It's called "God's Not Dead".

I haven't seen it but it's a movie about a guy in college that stands up for belief in God to his college professor who's conducting some kind of test with all the students. So that movie is a way to reach people also.

[bluebell]

As LDS members know, truth comes from many different sources, not just the prophet.  

[BCSpace]

I haven't seen it but it's a movie about a guy in college that stands up for belief in God to his college professor who's conducting some kind of test with all the students. So that movie is a way to reach people also.

 

Articles and examples of standing up to college professors and the like are published in the Ensign et. al. from time to time.

[thesometimesaint]

That Mr. Robinson is a rich white racist little jerk that wouldn't know the US Constitution if God smacked him upside the head with it.

[strappinglad]

Having at least one jerk in the mix is de rigueur in all current ' reality shows' . Jerry Springer showed the way.

[bluebell]

That Mr. Robinson is a rich white racist little jerk that wouldn't know the US Constitution if God smacked him upside the head with it.

 

What part of the constitution doesn't he know?

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

That Mr. Robinson is a rich white racist little jerk that wouldn't know the US Constitution if God smacked him upside the head with it.

Mighty strong words. I read something about bearing a false witness once.  Careful saint. May God judge you the way you judged this man.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

What part of the constitution doesn't he know?

That part that doesn't agree with Saint's liberal, progressive, world view.

[thesometimesaint]

What part of the constitution doesn't he know?

 

14th Amendment.

[thesometimesaint]

That part that doesn't agree with Saint's liberal, progressive, world view.

 

Like the 14th Amendment that conservative retrograde white southerners fought bitterly against.

[BCSpace]

Mighty strong words. I read something about bearing a false witness once.  Careful saint. May God judge you the way you judged this man.

 

He's obviously a stumbling block in this case.

 

[thesometimesaint]

For all that don't know Phil Robertson views on the Pre Civil  Rights Era of Louisiana.

SEE Here:

 

“I never, with my eyes, saw the mistreatment of any black person," Robertson is quoted in GQ. "Not once. Where we lived was all farmers. The blacks worked for the farmers. I hoed cotton with them. I’m with the blacks, because we’re white trash. We’re going across the field.... They’re singing and happy. I never heard one of them, one black person, say, ‘I tell you what: These doggone white people’—not a word!... Pre-entitlement, pre-welfare, you say: Were they happy? They were godly; they were happy; no one was singing the blues.”

 

For all that don't know Phil Robertson views on Jeebus. No insult to the real Jesus just this jerk's ideas about him.

SEE Here:

 

"Look at any society where there is no Jesus. I'll give you four: Nazis, no Jesus ...".

 

For the record the NAZI'S were Christians.

SEE NAZI Christian iconography:

http://www.nobeliefs.com/mementoes.htm

 

Mr. Robertson certainly is entitled to his own opinion. He is not entitled to his own facts.

[bluebell]

14th Amendment.

 

I haven't read anything where he is against the 14th amendment.

[bluebell]

For all that don't know Phil Robertson views on the Pre Civil  Rights Era of Louisiana.

SEE Here:

 

“I never, with my eyes, saw the mistreatment of any black person," Robertson is quoted in GQ. "Not once. Where we lived was all farmers. The blacks worked for the farmers. I hoed cotton with them. I’m with the blacks, because we’re white trash. We’re going across the field.... They’re singing and happy. I never heard one of them, one black person, say, ‘I tell you what: These doggone white people’—not a word!... Pre-entitlement, pre-welfare, you say: Were they happy? They were godly; they were happy; no one was singing the blues.”

 

For all that don't know Phil Robertson views on Jeebus. No insult to the real Jesus just this jerk's ideas about him.

SEE Here:

 

"Look at any society where there is no Jesus. I'll give you four: Nazis, no Jesus ...".

 

For the record the NAZI'S were Christians.

SEE NAZI Christian iconography:

http://www.nobeliefs.com/mementoes.htm

 

Mr. Robertson certainly is entitled to his own opinion. He is not entitled to his own facts.

 

He is entitled to his own interpretation of the facts however.

 

The relationship that the nazis had with Christianity was pretty convoluted.  While they used Christianity to further their cause, Hitler was not a Christian, and many high ranking Nazis were anti-Christian.  Hitler's ultimate plan was to take down the church's and force them to adopt his ideology. He knew he had to bide his time with that though, so in the meantime he ordered his Nazi officials to remain members, even though they had nothing but contempt for religion.

 

Their use of Christian iconography was just a tool to help them control the Christian masses.

[thesometimesaint]

He is entitled to his own interpretation of the facts however.

 

The relationship that the nazis had with Christianity was pretty convoluted.  While they used Christianity to further their cause, Hitler was not a Christian, and many high ranking Nazis were anti-Christian.  Hitler's ultimate plan was to take down the church's and force them to adopt his ideology. He knew he had to bide his time with that though, so in the meantime he ordered his Nazi officials to remain members, even though they had nothing but contempt for religion.

 

Their use of Christian iconography was just a tool to help them control the Christian masses.

 

No he isn't. Any more than I can say that my interpretation of the color red is blue. That makes hash of facts.

 

While the Devil can use Scripture to his own ends. It is not a good idea to tell other people what they believe. The NAZI'S claimed to be Christian. That they did many of the same things that other Christians have done is indisputable. If some group claims a religion, acts on that religion, uses iconography of that religion, establishes churches based on that religion. It is very hard to say that they don't believe what they say they do. As despicable as the NAZI'S were, and I can't think of any that were worse. They had a right to believe as they did. They were Christians. We object when someone claims we are not Christians because of our rather unique beliefs about Christ. But that doesn't make us not Christians.

 

Christianity has used faith as not only as shield, but as a sword since its beginnings.

[bluebell]

No he isn't. Any more than I can say that my interpretation of the color red is blue. That makes hash of facts.

While the Devil can use Scripture to his own ends. It is not a good idea to tell other people what they believe. The NAZI'S claimed to be Christian. That they did many of the same things that other Christians have done is indisputable. If some group claims a religion, acts on that religion, uses iconography of that religion, establishes churches based on that religion. It is very hard to say that they don't believe what they say they do. As despicable as the NAZI'S were, and I can't think of any that were worse. They had a right to believe as they did. They were Christians. We object when someone claims we are not Christians because of our rather unique beliefs about Christ. But that doesn't make us not Christians.

Christianity has used faith as not only as shield, but as a sword since its beginnings.

My point TSS is that there are many reputable historians who also deny that the Nazis were Christians.

It doesn't mean they are making up their own facts, and it doesn't mean that Robertson did either. It just means they are interpreting the facts differently than you are.

And that is allowed.

[thesometimesaint]

My point TSS is that there are many reputable historians who also deny that the Nazis were Christians.

It doesn't mean they are making up their own facts, and it doesn't mean that Robertson did either. It just means they are interpreting the facts differently than you are.

And that is allowed.

 

I think it is arguable that any individual is or isn't a Christian by someone else's standards. I have profound questions about my own ancestors actions reflecting their Christian beliefs, and sometimes even my own. But it isn't up to me to decide on what they really did believe. Historians bless their hearts are no better at it than I am.

 

Sorry that just doesn't make any sense to me. Some have believed the moon to have been made of green cheese. When I look at the moon I see a man riding a bicycle. It is my interpretation and I won't deny those the right to believe anything they want. But facts are stubborn things and it doesn't really matter what any of us believe. It doesn't change the facts. Our moon didn't suddenly go from a disk of green cheese to a man riding a bicycle just because I think it looks like one. It really is just a ball of dirt and rock.

 

Mr. Robertson claims that Blacks didn't sing the Blues before the Civil Rights movement of the 1960's in this country. That is a demonstrably false claim. It is also a demonstrably false claim that the NAZI'S didn't have Jesus.

[bluebell]

I think it is arguable that any individual is or isn't a Christian by someone else's standards. I have profound questions about my own ancestors actions reflecting their Christian beliefs, and sometimes even my own. But it isn't up to me to decide on what they really did believe. Historians bless their hearts are no better at it than I am.

To be clear, Historians are not talking about whether or not they were 'good' Christians, but whether or not Nazi's considered themselves followers of Christ. (And to be clear we are talking about real Nazis who believed the Nazi ideology)

Which they generally did not.  They had no use for Christ's gospel and no loyalty to Him in any way.  They did not believe they were subject to Him but served a different god altogether.  

 

They did not, again in general, consider themselves to be Christians-they only pretended to be to serve their purposes.

 

 

 

 

[thesometimesaint]

To be clear, Historians are not talking about whether or not they were 'good' Christians, but whether or not Nazi's considered themselves followers of Christ. (And to be clear we are talking about real Nazis who believed the Nazi ideology)

Which they generally did not.  They had no use for Christ's gospel and no loyalty to Him in any way.  They did not believe they were subject to Him but served a different god altogether.  

 

They did not, again in general, consider themselves to be Christians-they only pretended to be to serve their purposes.

 

Believe me that rationalization has been used against whatever faith is being talked about including ours. No group is immune. However I'm especially not impressed by the likes of John D. Lee or the Saints he lead to the MMM, The Crusades, the Pogroms, the Inquisition, the Reformation, and Lord knows all the other insults to his good name committed by Christians.

[bluebell]

Believe me that rationalization has been used against whatever faith is being talked about including ours. No group is immune. However I'm especially not impressed by the likes of John D. Lee or the Saints he lead to the MMM, The Crusades, the Pogroms, the Inquisition, the Reformation, and Lord knows all the other insults to his good name committed by Christians.

I'm pretty sure "they don't consider themselves to be Christians" hasn't ever been used against our group by historians.

[thesometimesaint]

I'm pretty sure "they don't consider themselves to be Christians" hasn't ever been used against our group by historians.

 

It is mixed bag. There are some 40,000 different flavors of Christians in the US alone. Catholic Christians, Evangelical Christians, LDS Christians just to mention a few. Each vying for the title of the only true Scotsmen er Christian.  

[boblloyd91]

The thing I wonder about is how feels about the LDS....I bet he doesn't like us

[thesometimesaint]

TTBOMK Mr. Robertson personally has never spoken in public about his feeling concerning the LDS. But he is in a church that strongly disagrees with us.