Thinking Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 My wife bought some books online today. She would never go to a bookstore on Sunday. Thoughts?
VideoGameJunkie Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 It's the same as going to a store and buying something. It's best to avoid all types of purchases on Sunday to keep it holy.
Stargazer Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 I'm with Rivers on this one. But just to throw a little complication into those who insist that buying online on Sunday is Sabbath-breaking: Do you watch TV or listen to commercial radio on Sunday? If so, then whether you buy anything or not, you listened to a commercial, and thus participated in an economic transaction (the advertiser paid the station to broadcast the commercial to YOU on Sunday). If buying an item from a store on Sunday breaks the Sabbath, then you have broken the Sabbath to listen to an ad.Do you receive the Sunday paper on Sunday? Well, you've broken the Sabbath, because not only did the paperboy have to work on the Sabbath to bring you the paper, which you effectively paid him to do, you have also viewed advertisements in the paper and have participated in an economic activity.What? You're posting HERE on Sunday? Well, you've done it again. Don't think so? How many ads have you viewed in the process of surfing the internet?Oh, and expending electricity on the Sabbath is got to be a violation, then, too. You're paying for that electricity, and buying something on the Sabbath is forbidden, right? You drove to Church, I bet. Well, genius, you have broken the Sabbath there, too. Don't believe me? Well, you expended gasoline on the Sabbath, which you will have to replace at some point, and thus you have participated in an economic activity on the Sabbath. Why else do you think that Jews are supposed to live within a certain distance of the Synagogue? So they can avoid breaking the Sabbath by walking or driving more than a particular distance (which was determined by some learned Rabbi at some point). Except in the case of driving a car, the question is more along the lines of whether you lit a fire on the Sabbath (as you know, an internal combustion engine BURNS gasoline). For this reason it is typically forbidden for a Jew to turn on an electric light on the Sabbath. You have to turn it on BEFORE the Sabbath if you want light ON the Sabbath, and you can't turn it off again until AFTER the Sabbath. On the other hand, when you buy something on the Sabbath, the actual monetary transaction may not take place until a day later, so technically no funds have changed hands. So you might be OK buying online on the Sabbath. Yes, going by the Spirit is so much easier than coming up with a bunch of Pharisaic rules. 1
Duncan Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 no offense but do you really think the Holy Ghost would tell you one way or the other to shop online on sunday? Maybe I am a believer that the Spirit tells us stuff for the bigger things than shopping online on sunday
thesometimesaint Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 My wife bought some books online today. She would never go to a bookstore on Sunday. Thoughts? The Sabbbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. Let's not get too Pharisaical about it. 2
The Grimace Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 Can one place orders on Deseretbook.com on Sunday?
thesometimesaint Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 Depends on what time zone you're in.
Calm Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 no offense but do you really think the Holy Ghost would tell you one way or the other to shop online on sunday? Maybe I am a believer that the Spirit tells us stuff for the bigger things than shopping online on sundayYes, I find it rather easy to tell if I should be shopping online on Sunday or not...does it create a feeling of frustration, anxiety (as shopping online often does for me) or anything else that might interfere with the day of rest from mundane cares if not God's work.
Calm Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 I'm with Rivers on this one.... On the other hand, when you buy something on the Sabbath, the actual monetary transaction may not take place until a day later, so technically no funds have changed hands. So you might be OK buying online on the Sabbath. These days people have made the choice to open their stores on Sunday off and online and the majority seems to be with them and probably would prefer us to stop till we dropped to make it worthwhile for them, so honestly except in some rare cases my concern for making others work has dropped considerably. So pretty much my only standard is if an activity takes me away from the Sabbath day feeling I try to create in myself and in my home....and making decisions on what to buy is more than enough usually to take me out of that zone.
The Grimace Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 I dunno - Sabbath observance, from my experience, is one of those commandments where members profess one thing, yet do another. I've heard talks by GAs and by members outlining what the Sabbath is, what we should and shouldn't do, and then throw Superbowl parties, watch TV all day, play sports...everything BUT shop!
rpn Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 To the OP, if you were asking for yourself, that would be different than asking because you have questions about your wife's activities. The Sabbath breaking issue discussion ALWAYS gets muddled when we are looking at other's behaviors. Your wife is entitled to her own views of what is consistent with the sabbath or not. And the issue isn't really whether or not it is sabbath breaking. I'm sure there are plenty of people who believe it is or might be sabbath breaking, but do it anyway. 1
Stargazer Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 no offense but do you really think the Holy Ghost would tell you one way or the other to shop online on sunday? Maybe I am a believer that the Spirit tells us stuff for the bigger things than shopping online on sunday Do I really think the HG would do it? Well, yes. Why not, do you think? It's too minor? Not worth the HG's time and attention? Shall we second guess what the HG considers small potatoes? I once knew someone who thought that the Spirit wouldn't bother itself with whether or not we should take one job over another, and was only concerned with matters of religious truth. Is his opinion more valid than yours, or mine? I'll say this: when I break the Sabbath by buying something unnecessary on the Sabbath (and yes, I'm guilty as charged), I feel stung by my conscience. Question: is it me, or the Spirit stinging my conscience. I don't know, actually, but I'd be surprised if the Spirit considered it small potatoes, since all it takes to keep you out of the Celestial Kingdom is ONE unrepented sin. One sin that I repeat over and over like there was no commandment about it at all. One complete failure to obey. Remember that the punishment for Sabbath-breaking was once death, and say that it's too minor for the Spirit to inspire about. And I don't feel any pang of conscience at all for buying things online on the Sabbath.
ERayR Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 My wife bought some books online today. She would never go to a bookstore on Sunday. Thoughts? It is whatever significance you wish to put on it.
Duncan Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 I guess the reasons why you do or don't or as valid as when you buy something. I maybe wouldn't buy something on sunday because they would ship it out the same time, maybe, as if I had bought it on monday morning
rongo Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 I'll tell you what, though. When my wife and I drove home from church on Sunday as newlyweds (our church was by Cougar Stadium), the Wendy's south of campus was absolutely jam-packed with young college students in suits and dresses. Doesn't that one make you scratch your head?
Calm Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 I'll tell you what, though. When my wife and I drove home from church on Sunday as newlyweds (our church was by Cougar Stadium), the Wendy's south of campus was absolutely jam-packed with young college students in suits and dresses. Doesn't that one make you scratch your head?If it was like it was in my day, they only served one meal on Sunday in the dorms IIRC (maybe two meals on nonFast Sundays if the current schedule is the same, but it is only from 12-5:30 so if one has an 11 AM church, one really has to squeeze the meals together) and the vending machines were empty by Sunday already except for the really gross stuff. I can see why someone might be willing to hit Wendy's. I used to get sick on Sundays not knowing then of my blood sugar issues.
mtomm Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 You can order at the store.lds.org on Sunday. So there is that. And my ward does it almost every Sunday. 1
rongo Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 If it was like it was in my day, they only served one meal on Sunday in the dorms IIRC (maybe two meals on nonFast Sundays if the current schedule is the same, but it is only from 12-5:30 so if one has an 11 AM church, one really has to squeeze the meals together) and the vending machines were empty by Sunday already except for the really gross stuff. I can see why someone might be willing to hit Wendy's. I used to get sick on Sundays not knowing then of my blood sugar issues.Lack of preparation for the Sabbath Day (gasoline, meals, etc.) isn't really an excuse to break the Sabbath, though, is it?
Mola Ram Suda Ram Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 Its the same thing as buying something from a vending machine on sunday. I have no issues with it. I typically don't buy things on Sunday because it wont ship until Monday anyway. The Sabbath was about not working or causing some one else to work. Buying things online on Sunday generally doesn't make some one work. And if it does you shouldn't do it. 2
Calm Posted October 29, 2013 Posted October 29, 2013 Lack of preparation for the Sabbath Day (gasoline, meals, etc.) isn't really an excuse to break the Sabbath, though, is it?Just explaining why it might be that way, not suggesting it was the right thing to do.
theplains Posted October 29, 2013 Posted October 29, 2013 On the other hand, when you buy something on the Sabbath, the actual monetary transaction may not take place until a day later, so technically no funds have changed hands. So you might be OK buying online on the Sabbath. According to Gospel Principles, "Our prophets have told us that we should not shop, hunt, fish, attend sports events, or participate in similar activities on that day". If you really follow the prophet's counsel, you should also follow the 'spirit' of the law, and not seeksome technicality to break it. Regards,Jim
bluebell Posted October 30, 2013 Posted October 30, 2013 (edited) According to Gospel Principles, "Our prophets have told us that we should not shop, hunt, fish, attend sports events, or participate in similar activities on that day". If you really follow the prophet's counsel, you should also follow the 'spirit' of the law, and not seeksome technicality to break it. Regards,Jim Typically though, the counsel not to shop on Sundays is about not making another person work on Sunday and thus force them (or have their employer force them) to break the Sabbath just so you can buy some gummy bears or something. That's why the issue of vending machines and ordering online can be a quandary. It is shopping on Sunday, but it doesn't make anyone work on Sunday.... Hence, shopping online on Sunday could be described as actually keeping the Spirit of the law, even while breaking the letter of it. Edited October 30, 2013 by bluebell 1
ERayR Posted October 30, 2013 Posted October 30, 2013 According to Gospel Principles, "Our prophets have told us that we should not shop, hunt, fish, attend sports events, or participate in similar activities on that day". If you really follow the prophet's counsel, you should also follow the 'spirit' of the law, and not seeksome technicality to break it. Regards,Jim Yet Brigham Young used to picnic up the canyon.
ERayR Posted October 30, 2013 Posted October 30, 2013 If you really follow the prophet's counsel, you should also follow the 'spirit' of the law, and not seeksome technicality to break it. Regards,Jim That's what I always say then go right ahead and do it anyway. Oh and greet half my ward in the store too.
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