What Is Utah Culture And What Is Church Culture?

[Bernard Gui]

In another thread, Calmoriah said,

In my experience, there is Church culture and there is Utah culture (which varies from place to place within Utah) and sometimes they overlap and sometimes they don't.

So, what is Church culture, what is Utah culture, and where do they overlap?

Edited May 11, 2013 by Bernard Gui

[thesometimesaint]

Utah culture...1950's White Bread.

Church culture.. More and more ethnic Tortilla

[Calm]

I see this as Church culture, a feeling of responsibility for others, a sense of expanded family:

http://www.sctimes.com/article/20130505/LIFE/305050013/St-Cloud-Hospital-nurse-donates-her-organ-Apollo-teenager-kidney-disease?nclick_check=1

Edited May 8, 2013 by calmoriah

[guerreiro9]

So, what is Church culture, what is Utah culture, and where to they overlap?

I don't think it should come as any surprise that every geographical region has its own cultural quirks. There are many things that play a part in the development of cultural traits, religion being just one aspect of this development. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints has certainly informed and influenced the culture in Utah (and the West in general), but it was not and is not the only influence.

I think a similar thing occurred anciently with the development of the early Christian church first among the Jews at Jerusalem and then later among the Greeks, Romans, and others. Certainly the gospel and teachings of Jesus and the Apostles were the same amongst all the people, but the culture and the way each people interpreted the teachings varied by location. I don't think anyone would argue that Jewish, Roman, and Greek cultural were identical anciently just because there happened to be Jewish, Roman, and Greek Christians.

People everywhere interpret the world through a lens colored by their culture. The members of the Church in Utah interpret the teachings of the Prophets and Apostles through their cultural lens. Sometimes this lens consistently displays the teachings as the Church intends, sometimes it does not. The same can be said of people everywhere.

So where does the culture in Utah currently color the teachings of the Church? I think that is a hard question to answer and would probably need to be addressed on a case by case basis. I think the biggest thing that sticks out in my mind is that the majority of Utah has chosen to align itself with the Republican party while the Church has not done so. The teachings of the Church are viewed by many people through a Republican lens. Sometimes this lens allows them to see the teachings of the Church clearly, sometimes it does not. The same can be said about those who align themselves with the Democratic or any other political party.

Really what I see happening is that opponents of the Church try to blame all of Utah's negative cultural aspects on the Church, while proponent's of the Church try to attribute all of Utah's positive cultural aspects to the Church. Neither one of these statements is entirely true or fair, but that is the polarized world we live in.

I don't know if this has answered your question or not. People everywhere has their own unique cultural traits, why should Utah be any different?

-guerreiro9

[bluebell]

Maybe it's like how so many members in Utah refer to places outside of Utah as 'the mission field' and how no one outside of Utah actually thinks of themselves as such, (and how many members outside of Utah have never even heard of such a concept)?

The difference between LDS culture that exists only in Utah, as compared to LDS culture that is likely to be found in many different places?

[Danzo]

Not having spent much time in Utah, but looking in from the outside, it seems that a big difference is that out here in "the mission field", when someone stops believing and stops being active in the church, they usually don't continue to identify with being "Mormon". Nobody would know you were "Mormon" and you usually don't identify yourself as such. Where in Utah, even if you don't believe, don't follow and don't attend, there is still social advantages to identifying and being "Mormon".

As a result here in the "Mission Field", only people who are practicing are identified as "Mormon" which makes our image seem better. Those that don't practice, disappear from the church (at least from the worlds point of view).

By contrast, in Utah, Many people who would not be identified as a member elsewhere still identify as a member for social, family and reasons that don't have anything to do with the gospel.

My wife, who served a mission in Utah, always says that everyone in Utah who was baptized, was baptized because they knew a member, everyone who wasn't baptized, wasn't baptized because they knew a member.

[CV75]

In another thread, Calmoriah said,

So, what is Church culture, what is Utah culture, and where to they overlap?

Utah culture is what is parodied in cheesey comedies popular along the Wasatch Front. Church culture is how those who find those movies cheesy live their religion.

[Stone holm]

Maybe it's like how so many members in Utah refer to places outside of Utah as 'the mission field' and how no one outside of Utah actually thinks of themselves as such, (and how many members outside of Utah have never even heard of such a concept)?

The difference between LDS culture that exists only in Utah, as compared to LDS culture that is likely to be found in many different places?

A fair number of the young marrieds who are not from Utah, seem to be aware. They often refer to move ins as ULDS until they go through detox. It usually refers to uber materialistic, politically illiterate, very well groomed, and superficially spiritual people with no environmental ethic. In other words...

[ksfisher]

Maybe it's like how so many members in Utah refer to places outside of Utah as 'the mission field'

But this is how things used to be. You either lived in one of the stakes of zion or you lived in the mission field. When elders left on missions they were sent into the mission field, which was outside of the Idaho, Utah, Arizona mormon corridor. Growing up in Salt Lake City I never saw a real life missionary elder until I entered the MTC. There just weren't any.

In recent years the demographic in Utah, especially Salt Lake City, has changed, and the church has responded by sending hundreds of missionaries to Utah. Ingrained speech patterns take longer, but they eventually will change.

Edited May 8, 2013 by ksfisher

[Bernard Gui]

But this is how things used to be. You either lived in one of the stakes of zion or you lived in the mission field. When elders left on missions they were sent into the mission field, which was outside of the Idaho, Utah, Arizona mormon corridor. Growing up in Salt Lake City I never saw a real life missionary elder until I entered the MTC. There just weren't any.

In recent years the demographic in Utah, especially Salt Lake City, has changed, and the church has responded by sending hundreds of missionaries to Utah. Ingrained speech patterns take longer, but they eventually will change.

This is an interesting perspective. I grew up in New Mexico, then "The Mission Field." At the time, the only wards were in Albuquerque.

We always thought and spoke of ourselves as pioneers.

The Guis lived in Illinois for 4 years. Our city was divided...one side was primarily Catholic, and the other Lutheran. All the quirkiness ascribed to

Utah Mormons would apply to that town and any other were there is a majority religion, ethnicity, political party, etc. IMO, it's just human nature.

[Bernard Gui]

What are your 5 favorite and least favorite Utah/Mormon quirks?

Edited May 8, 2013 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

A fair number of the young marrieds who are not from Utah, seem to be aware. They often refer to move ins as ULDS until they go through detox. It usually refers to uber materialistic, politically illiterate, very well groomed, and superficially spiritual people with no environmental ethic. In other words...

Utah transplants in our Washington ward are welcomed and usually provide solid leadership and adapt quickly to the wet way of things.

[Bernard Gui]

I see this as Church culture, a feeling of responsibility for others, a sense of expanded family:

http://www.sctimes.c...?nclick_check=1

I have felt that same sense in every place I have lived...New Mexico, Utah, Kansas, Illinois, Washington

Australia, Central America. My son Obstreppo is climbing fool's hill. He asked what reasons there would

be to stay in the church. I responded with this very thing: wherever you go in the world you will have

instant family.

Edited May 8, 2013 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

Utah culture...1950's White Bread.

Church culture.. More and more ethnic Tortilla

I would say Utah culture is more Whole Wheat Bread or maybe Cranberry Nut Bread.

[AddamS]

What are your 5 favorite and least favorite Utah/Mormon quirks?

I don't know if I can "rank" this but I do find that in Utah there are people that really love the church and people that really hate the church. Without much in the middle.

It seems that reaction to LDS folks elsewhere is more ambivilent.

[Tacenda]

Utah transplants in our Washington ward are welcomed and usually provide solid leadership and adapt quickly to the wet way of things.

Several years ago I sat on a plane next to a lady that was living in Washington. She said she grew up in Utah but would never go back, she hated Utah. I don't know why but she couldn't have been more clear. She wouldn't go into specifics. But she sure loved her Washington.

[thesometimesaint]

I would say Utah culture is more Whole Wheat Bread or maybe Cranberry Nut Bread.

That was a joke. But a joke with a small element of truth. In the mid 1970's at BYU it was, maybe still is, a saying that: Here at the base of the Wasatch Front where nothing gets out and nothing gets in.

[smac97]

So, what is Church culture, what is Utah culture, and where to they overlap?

I think "Utah culture" is getting harder to define. I was born in Hawai'i, but I grew up and am now raising my children in Utah. The place is changing, particularly along the Wasatch Front. It is no longer insular. It's not as "Mormon heavy" as I perceived it to be growing up.

If I was to attempt to define "Utah (Mormon) culture," I suppose I would identify a few if its more salient characteristics (in no particular order):

1. Utah is the headquarters of the Church, and everyplace else (except, perhaps, southern Idaho) is "the mission field." This drives my mother-in-law, who lives in Washington State, a little batty. So much so that it has become an ongoing joke between us. When she visits us at our home in Provo, I welcome her to "the bosom of Abraham" and ask her how things are going in "Babylon." At the end of our visits, I invite her and my FIL to come back any time, and I also absent-mindedly hum/sing a few bars of "Israel, Israel, God is Calling" (the part about "Come to Zion, Come to Zion") It's all good fun.

2. If a person is decently kempt, clothed and well-spoken (no cussin!), there is an assumption that he/she is probably a Mormon.

3. An assumption that a young black man on a college campus is probably there on an athletic scholarship.

4. Unexplained "in-house" cultural references to Mormonism are fine in public. Things like referring to President Monson as "the Prophet," or else using phrases like "Our FHE last night was a lot of fun" or "I was not able to make it to Institute last night" or "He just graduated from seminary" or "The stake dance last week was lame" and so on.

5. Minced oaths (flippin', fetchin', frickin' and the like). Having the appearance of swearing, but lacking the power thereof.

6. Sunday is for church and sleeping (and the Super Bowl, but not for football generally). It is also okay for extended family "get togethers" (which are not parties, because ... they're not), but get-togethers with friends would be more reserved, like dinner, but no more.

7. Clothing styles are affected. Longer shorts for both men and women, less sleeveless and "revealing" stuff for women.

8. "Unconventional" expressions of style (unusual hairstyles, piercings, tattoos, etc.) are less common than in other places.

9. Social gatherings are less likely to center on, or even involve at all, alcohol. This is perhaps one of the most significant differentiators.

10. Businesses openly cater to Mormons. So you'll have Marie Osmond having a book signing as the Orem Costco. Or you'll have radio spots about Elder So-and-So's latest book. My mother-in-law marvels at all of the food storage options that are readily available in most grocery stores in Utah.

11. Larger-than-average number of kids per family, and social customs and pasttimes that tend to revolve more around children. Mini-vans. Soccer moms. Sold-out showings of Pixar movies. Lots of bedroom communities filled with young families.

12. The old-fashioned idea of family life (husband works, wife keeps the home fires burning) is more common than elsewhere.

13. More people get married earlier and have children sooner as compared to other places.

What else?

-Smac

Edited May 8, 2013 by smac97

[Stone holm]

Utah transplants in our Washington ward are welcomed and usually provide solid leadership and adapt quickly to the wet way of things.

Ours are welcome and frequently wind up in leadership positions. I don't think the older adults notice it as much as the young marrieds seem to -- especially the uber materialistic part. Although I do remember one newly moved in Utahn bearing her testimony at Fast and Testimony meeting shortly after arrival and the adult sitting next to me leaned over and said, "Don't worry she's from Utah, she'll get over it." My wife who tends to take the Molly Mormons under her wing as adopted daughters (the daughters who didn't turn out that way, but she wished they had) only occasionally gets frustrated normally about their environmental habits -- thinks they are special. The young marrieds tend to think they are living in their own little bubble planets and it takes awhile for them to hit reality. We have a lot of people who migrate from here to Utah to retire.

I think the ULDS are less noticeable in the Urban wards where often they are there with tons of graduate professional students all kind of living in a bubble world.

[Mola Ram Suda Ram]

What else?

-Smac

People find it odd that I like Ozzy and play electric guitar. After all everyone know's that really is Satan's music.

[thesometimesaint]

Ours are welcome and frequently wind up in leadership positions. I don't think the older adults notice it as much as the young marrieds seem to -- especially the uber materialistic part. Although I do remember one newly moved in Utahn bearing her testimony at Fast and Testimony meeting shortly after arrival and the adult sitting next to me leaned over and said, "Don't worry she's from Utah, she'll get over it." My wife who tends to take the Molly Mormons under her wing as adopted daughters (the daughters who didn't turn out that way, but she wished they had) only occasionally gets frustrated normally about their environmental habits -- thinks they are special. The young marrieds tend to think they are living in their own little bubble planets and it takes awhile for them to hit reality. We have a lot of people who migrate from here to Utah to retire.

I think the ULDS are less noticeable in the Urban wards where often they are there with tons of graduate professional students all kind of living in a bubble world.

We occasionally have an older couple move to a Wasatch Front community, they usually move back after one of their winters.

[guerreiro9]

environmental habits, uber materialistic

Could you explain? I am not sure what you are referring to.

-guerreiro9

[Stone holm]

We occasionally have an older couple move to a Wasatch Front community, they usually move back after one of their winters.

The ones from here tend to hit St. George, Provo, or a Salt Lake suburb, I think -- I know they had an Ascutney Ward reunion out there and posted a picture of a frigging room full of former Ward members now living out there. Most were people who had moved here from Out West and lived here for a couple decades and then moved back out there and were followed by their young married children. Trying to find an active Mormon spouse out here can be a challenge so lots of our kids who go to BYU wind up married to spouses from the Mormon corridor and tend to wind up back out there. If a young adult does not go to BYU or BYUI from out here the chances of marrying in the Church drop very substantially and if they marry outside the Church their chances of remaining active fall through the floor. We really, really need a marriage mill like BYU or BYUI out here on the East Coast it would change Mormon demographics considerably and substantially boost the likelihood of youth staying active after college -- about 100% more effective than preaching to them.

[Stone holm]

Could you explain? I am not sure what you are referring to.

-guerreiro9

Molly Mormons -- very focused on nice clothes, nice car, make-up, etc.

[guerreiro9]

Molly Mormons -- very focused on nice clothes, nice car, make-up, etc.

That's not the way I've heard the term "Molly Mormon" expressed in the past, it is usually referring to someone who is overly zealous in obeying the "letter of the law" if you will. I have never heard someone begin called a "Molly Mormon" for being materialistic.

You find then that members of the church from Utah are more materialistic than those outside of Utah? Also it appears that you find them politically illiterate, spiritually superficial, and having no "environmental ethic" (whatever that means).

These are not very flattering claims. Would you care to elaborate why you feel this way?

-guerreiro9