Upcoming LDS seminary building on HS campus brings mixed reactions

[MorningStar]

On 3/30/2025 at 6:47 AM, california boy said:

No.  But is that necessary?  No religion had any release time in high school.  It seemed to work fine to just go to seminary before school every morning.

It doesn't work fine for kids who have zero hour classes. 

[JAHS]

4 hours ago, Amulek said:

They can opt to do it online now - at least, that's been an option in my stake since COVID.

 

I guess that's something that the stake decides on. It is mostly used if students would have to travel too far to attend physically. But if there are church buildings in town then they hold it there.

Edited March 31, 2025 by JAHS

[california boy]

4 hours ago, MorningStar said:

It doesn't work fine for kids who have zero hour classes. 

I don't know what zero class hour is.  Why doesn't it work.  

[california boy]

10 hours ago, Rain said:

The advantage of the released time for places in high density members are fewer teachers needed and less driving (even when church is closer). It also means that the teachers can have this as a full time job verses labor intensive callings in every ward/stake.  

One advantage for the school is slightly smaller class sizes. I saw this when I was in high school. I had early morning seminary and had driver's Ed scheduled for 4th hour.  When there were too many driver's Ed students they worked with the seminary - they had early morning driver's Ed and the early morning seminary students switched to driver's Ed and went to 4th hour seminary.  

It's not like the schools only release for religious things.  Some places also release students for work.  

I'm not saying there should be released time seminary. I'm just saying there are some advantages with released time for schools with a large population of members. 

Oh I can see the advantages of release time seminary.  But it is still just an option, not a necessity.  My bishop had no problem asking me to teach seminary for 6 years while I was raising a family and working a job. that required commuting every day.  I was happy to do what I was asked.  I am not special.  The majority of wards outside the Mormon bubble function this way.  

I guess I am just uncomfortable with the Church pushing to build buildings on public school lands when there are other options to consider that would not impose the Church on those that are not members even when that number is in the minority.  It just seems wrong.

[Rain]

11 minutes ago, california boy said:

Oh I can see the advantages of release time seminary.  But it is still just an option, not a necessity.  My bishop had no problem asking me to teach seminary for 6 years while I was raising a family and working a job. that required commuting every day.  I was happy to do what I was asked.  I am not special.  The majority of wards outside the Mormon bubble function this way.  

I guess I am just uncomfortable with the Church pushing to build buildings on public school lands when there are other options to consider that would not impose the Church on those that are not members even when that number is in the minority.  It just seems wrong.

I don't like it on public school land either.  This is the first time I've heard of one that was.  All of the seminaries I've known were church owned land right next to the high school or across the street. 

[Calm]

27 minutes ago, california boy said:

I don't know what zero class hour is.  Why doesn't it work.  

Zero hour is the hour before first period, I believe (if school starts at 8, zero hour is 7).  My son had band classes then.  This allows extra elective classes or additional credit for those who need it.

Edited April 1, 2025 by Calm

[webbles]

45 minutes ago, california boy said:

I guess I am just uncomfortable with the Church pushing to build buildings on public school lands when there are other options to consider that would not impose the Church on those that are not members even when that number is in the minority.  It just seems wrong.

Reading the AZ laws and Supreme Court cases, I can't see how this would be legal.  If the school sells the land to the church, then it is fine, but building a seminary on school land is not right.

[webbles]

That school district also rented out part of the high school to another Christian sect for worship services.  I found a blog post from the church talking about signing a contract with the high school - https://vailchurch.blogspot.com/2012/09/day-1-journey.html.  Is that a normal thing?  Is this town just odd in how it mixes school and religion?

[bluebell]

They have release time here in northern Wyoming in my town but as far as I know no other towns in the county or the one next to it have it.  They do early morning.  I'm assuming the difference is because there is an institute building across the street from the high school here, but no church buildings close to a high school anywhere else.

Release time is awesome.  I'm sad more kids don't get that as an option.

[Amulek]

16 hours ago, MorningStar said:

It doesn't work fine for kids who have zero hour classes. 

That's true. And in our stake, we have afternoon seminary for those students.

That wasn't an option when I was a kid though - we just started seminary earlier.

 

[Amulek]

10 hours ago, webbles said:

That school district also rented out part of the high school to another Christian sect for worship services.  I found a blog post from the church talking about signing a contract with the high school - https://vailchurch.blogspot.com/2012/09/day-1-journey.html.  Is that a normal thing?  Is this town just odd in how it mixes school and religion?

That's a fairly common(ish) thing here in Texas. The city is just renting out its facilities when not in use, and schools are generally not being used over the weekends - making them popular options for churches who have yet to acquire sufficient funds to construct their own buildings. It's no different than renting a pavilion at a public park and then holding your services there.

 

[Amulek]

17 hours ago, JAHS said:

I guess that's something that the stake decides on. It is mostly used if students would have to travel too far to attend physically. But if there are church buildings in town then they hold it there.

It's an option here for sure, and one that is heavily encouraged, but online is an option too.

 

Edited April 1, 2025 by Amulek

[MustardSeed]

My oldest had a zero hour band class at 7 so he chose to do 5:15 am seminary. Our church is walking distance to the high school.  
 

I wonder if 5 am seminary did anything good?  
 

 

[JAHS]

Here's another news video about this. They say it going to be a small building built by the church, with one classroom, a small office,
and bathroom and will be completed by January 2026.

LDS seminary plans at Vail's Cienega High spark debate

[california boy]

On 3/31/2025 at 8:40 PM, Calm said:

Zero hour is the hour before first period, I believe (if school starts at 8, zero hour is 7).  My son had band classes then.  This allows extra elective classes or additional credit for those who need it.

Got it.  We used to call it A period.  And we did have an earlier seminary class to accommodate that group.  I always taught the later group which started at 6:15. Still crazy early for me and the students.

[Doctor Steuss]

On 3/30/2025 at 6:55 AM, Calm said:

I think it is since kids should not be required to wake up so early.

https://www.uclahealth.org/medical-services/sleep-disorders/patient-resources/patient-education/sleep-and-teens

I ended up dropping seminary about half-way through senior year.  I had early bird Chem AP labs, which meant getting to seminary at 4:45am.  I'm surprised I made it for as long as I did.  Sucked not "graduating" seminary with everyone else, but there was just no way I could've have kept going like that.  Especially with Trig AP being an extra hour after school on top of that (and then theater, soccer, etc.).  Up at 4:00 am, and home around 5-6 pm was the pits.

[Doctor Steuss]

{dupe... sorry}

Edited April 2, 2025 by Doctor Steuss

[SeekingUnderstanding]

On 3/31/2025 at 11:40 PM, Calm said:

Zero hour is the hour before first period, I believe (if school starts at 8, zero hour is 7).  My son had band classes then.  This allows extra elective classes or additional credit for those who need it.

Isn’t the reason they need zero period because they are in release time seminary?

[JAHS]

39 minutes ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

Isn’t the reason they need zero period because they are in release time seminary?

Don't think so. It could be for any kind of extra class that the school has. For my kids In California it was a Jazz band class. They call it A period here.

[webbles]

40 minutes ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

Isn’t the reason they need zero period because they are in release time seminary?

No.  In my high school, zero hour was special classes that were not available during the day.  I also know of schools where kids in sports take a zero hour class as part of it (something like weight training or fitness).

[Rain]

2 hours ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

Isn’t the reason they need zero period because they are in release time seminary?

It is a way to get more classes in for whatever reason.  I did 0 hour seminary because I wanted more AP classes for college credit. Some may do it because they were sick one year so they can make up credits they missed. Some may want multiple music classes so 0 hour is a chance to fit in both required classes and more elective classes.

[Calm]

12 hours ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

Isn’t the reason they need zero period because they are in release time seminary?

My son did not have release time seminary.  It was a band or orchestra class, can’t remember which.  He played in two groups.

Canada

Edited April 3, 2025 by Calm

[Amulek]

Update: here or here.

Looks like the Church has opted to not go through with it.

 

[ZealouslyStriving]

So the Church is going to face fierce opposition in anything it does now. The next decade should be fun. What year do you all predict our 501 c3 will be revoked?😐

 

Edited April 23, 2025 by ZealouslyStriving

[Calm]

9 minutes ago, ZealouslyStriving said:

So the Church is going to face fierce opposition in anything it does now. The next decade should be fun. What year do you all predict our 501 c3 will be revoked?😐

 

This is a bit different though as this was building and exclusively renting a building on school/government/public property, not privately owned property.  I don’t think this is appropriate and I am all for released time seminary and making it as convenient as possible for students by having someplace right off of school property, but on school property is different.  If the building was open for use to other groups in the community, I think I would feel differently about it.  Exclusive use is privileged though even if paid for.

Edited April 23, 2025 by Calm