Jump to content

David archuleta steps out of the closet as a member of lgbtq+


Recommended Posts

I've always loved this kid and his beautiful voice.  My heart is full of compassion for this former American idol.  I can't imagine the conflict he has had to endure giving his love for the church and his identity as a member of the LGBTQ+ community.  

Hopefully he can be a positive influence on the church for change.

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2021/06/12/david-archuleta-comes-out/

Edited by Fair Dinkum
Link to comment
32 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I've always loved this kid and his beautiful voice.  My heart is full of compassion for this former American idol.  I can't imagine the conflict he has had to endure giving his love for the church and his identity as a member of the LGBTQ+ community.  

Hopefully he can be a positive influence on the church for change.

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2021/06/12/david-archuleta-comes-out/

While it is natural for people who struggle to seek and ostensibly find a cosmic or divine reason/purpose for the way they are. I strongly believe, from experience, that sometimes -- and I think most often -- there is none. God placed us in a telestial condition where chaos and chance prevail. So you're born with x-y-z. But where there is no reason, there is still deliverance and redemption by virtue of the Atonement of Christ. Maybe that is all we need -- the terrible experience (D&C 122:7) -- to experience the ultimate deliverance and redemption.

Not every explanation for trial by fire has to be an influence for the Church to change.

Edited by CV75
Link to comment
29 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I've always loved this kid and his beautiful voice.  My heart is full of compassion for this former American idol.  I can't imagine the conflict he has had to endure giving his love for the church and his identity as a member of the LGBTQ+ community.  

Hopefully he can be a positive influence on the church for change.

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2021/06/12/david-archuleta-comes-out/

Again - my question is - what is the change?  What will be enough?  Is the ANY way the church can stand by heterosexual marriage being the only acceptable avenue for sexual relations (while still remaining temple worthy) and not have people be upset?  I've yet to hear anyone that is upset at the church for their stance on LGBTQ issues give me a hypothetical that would be acceptable to them that would not allow for SS relationships with active sex lives.

Link to comment
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, CV75 said:

While it is natural for people who struggle to seek and ostensibly find a cosmic or divine reason/purpose for the way they are. I strongly believe, from experience, that sometimes -- and I think most often -- there is none. God placed us in a telestial condition where chaos and chance prevail. So you're born with x-y-z. But where there is no reason, there is still deliverance and redemption by virtue of the Atonement of Christ. Maybe that is all we need -- the terrible experience (D&C 122:7) -- to experience the ultimate deliverance and redemption.

Not every explanation for trial by fire has to be an influence for the Church to change.

I'm of the opinion that the church will only change when enough societal pressure is applied coupled with a stiff enough hit to the finances of the church.  History has born this out.  When faced with the stark alternatives of a future with a change to its core doctrines or financial or societal destruction, the church will always choose  to change its hurtful doctrines and maintain its financial well being.

Pivotal to this pressure is a current law suite over BYU having access to federal dollars despite the schools discrimination of LGBTQ students.  it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  The next societal move will be a complete boycott of BYU sports by other schools.  But I'm sure that BYU will be happy scheduling games against Oral Roberts and Liberty University.  Oh wait they consider BYU part of a cult, never mind.

Edited by Fair Dinkum
Link to comment
2 hours ago, bluebell said:

This is already being discussed in the lgtbq thread, so that might be a good place to go if you want to talk about it but aren't getting a lot of traffic here.

Thanks but I believe that David deserves his own dedicated thread.

Link to comment
11 minutes ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I'm of the opinion that the church will only change when enough societal pressure is applied coupled with a stiff enough hit to the finances of the church.  History has born this out.  When faced with the stark alternatives of a future with a change to its core doctrines or financial or societal destruction, the church will always choose  to change its hurtful doctrines and maintain its financial well being.

Pivotal to this pressure is a current law suite over BYU having access to federal dollars despite the schools discrimination of LGBTQ students.  it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  The next societal move will be a complete boycott of BYU sports by other schools.  But I'm sure that BYU will be happy scheduling games against Oral Roberts and Liberty University.  Oh wait they consider BYU part of a cult, never mind.

What do you think is enough pressure, "the confiscation and loss of all the Temples, and the stopping of all the ordinances therein ...and the confiscation of personal property of the people," and do you see that coming?

Link to comment
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, CV75 said:

What do you think is enough pressure, "the confiscation and loss of all the Temples, and the stopping of all the ordinances therein ...and the confiscation of personal property of the people," and do you see that coming?

Honestly I don't know what it will take, I'm just of the opinion that it will happen.  At some point in the future the church will change its LGBTQ+ policy and treat all of god's children equally.  But as with other social changes, the church will be the last to change and only after doing everything in their power to prevent the inevitable from taking place.  I find it amazing that everyone except those called as Seers can actually see how this will end up.

Edited by Fair Dinkum
Link to comment
4 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I've always loved this kid and his beautiful voice.  My heart is full of compassion for this former American idol.  I can't imagine the conflict he has had to endure giving his love for the church and his identity as a member of the LGBTQ+ community.  

Hopefully he can be a positive influence on the church for change.

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2021/06/12/david-archuleta-comes-out/

Good, heartfelt comments.

Link to comment
1 hour ago, Fair Dinkum said:

Honestly I don't know what it will take, I'm just of the opinion that it will happen.  At some point in the future the church will change its LGBTQ+ policy and treat all of god's children equally.  But as with other social changes, the church will be the last to change and only after doing everything in their power to prevent the inevitable from taking place.  I find it amazing that everyone except those called as Seers can actually see how this will end up.

Speak truth to God, Fair Dinkum.  He is sure to listen to you.  8)

Link to comment
4 hours ago, Maestrophil said:

Again - my question is - what is the change?  What will be enough?  Is the ANY way the church can stand by heterosexual marriage being the only acceptable avenue for sexual relations (while still remaining temple worthy) and not have people be upset?  I've yet to hear anyone that is upset at the church for their stance on LGBTQ issues give me a hypothetical that would be acceptable to them that would not allow for SS relationships with active sex lives.

The source of rampant denominationalism is the desire to make God in our own image, with rules that suit us.  Jordan Peterson tells us that it is the wishy washy churches which fail.

Link to comment
2 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

I'm of the opinion that the church will only change when enough societal pressure is applied coupled with a stiff enough hit to the finances of the church.  History has born this out.  When faced with the stark alternatives of a future with a change to its core doctrines or financial or societal destruction, the church will always choose  to change its hurtful doctrines and maintain its financial well being.

Pivotal to this pressure is a current law suite over BYU having access to federal dollars despite the schools discrimination of LGBTQ students.  it will be interesting to see how this plays out.  The next societal move will be a complete boycott of BYU sports by other schools.  But I'm sure that BYU will be happy scheduling games against Oral Roberts and Liberty University.  Oh wait they consider BYU part of a cult, never mind.

 

As to BYU, serious universities do not have sports teams anyhow.  'Would be nice to see the Y drop the folderol, along with the Federal money.

However, the problem with that last is that the lawsuits will fail.  Too many religious schools in the USA would have their doctrines interfered with, and that interferes with the First Amendment.  The Supreme Court won't allow it.

Your narrative refers to the stark change the LDS Church made in polygamy when faced with disestablishment of the Church.  What you didn't note is that that was based on a wrong Supreme Court decision -- which would have disallowed same sex marriage.  You need to think through the actual legal arguments.

Link to comment
2 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

Honestly I don't know what it will take, I'm just of the opinion that it will happen.  At some point in the future the church will change its LGBTQ+ policy and treat all of god's children equally.  But as with other social changes, the church will be the last to change and only after doing everything in their power to prevent the inevitable from taking place.  I find it amazing that everyone except those called as Seers can actually see how this will end up.

That's fine; I'm just not seeing a lot of specifics here. On the other hand, we've already seen Church policies change without changing the ordinances, especially the Atonement of Christ as the fundamental principle of the religion, and prepared from before the foundation of the world, before things were created spiritually, and these long before naturally, upon the earth.

Link to comment
1 hour ago, Robert F. Smith said:

The source of rampant denominationalism is the desire to make God in our own image, with rules that suit us.  Jordan Peterson tells us that it is the wishy washy churches which fail.

I agree - and add to that the fact that no concession will ever be enough, as people will always be clamoring for the cause du jour - My question was honest - I see any path towards trying to please the masses rather than hold to gospel principles as a losing and endless battle. If I believed the dissatisfied would be satisfied by honest expressions of love and acceptance from the church while still holding to the standard of worthiness for temple attendance and full fellowship, I would not feel so doubtful of the ability of the church to her do or be enough.

Link to comment
1 hour ago, Robert F. Smith said:

 

As to BYU, serious universities do not have sports teams anyhow.  'Would be nice to see the Y drop the folderol, along with the Federal money.

However, the problem with that last is that the lawsuits will fail.  Too many religious schools in the USA would have their doctrines interfered with, and that interferes with the First Amendment.  The Supreme Court won't allow it.

Your narrative refers to the stark change the LDS Church made in polygamy when faced with disestablishment of the Church.  What you didn't note is that that was based on a wrong Supreme Court decision -- which would have disallowed same sex marriage.  You need to think through the actual legal arguments.

Wait, Harvard, Duke and Stanford aren't "serious universities?"

Link to comment
2 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Speak truth to God, Fair Dinkum.  He is sure to listen to you.  8)

Seemed to work with the Priesthood prohibition...

2 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

The source of rampant denominationalism is the desire to make God in our own image, with rules that suit us.  Jordan Peterson tells us that it is the wishy washy churches which fail.

Why should anyone care what Jordan Peterson has to say?

Link to comment
4 minutes ago, ttribe said:

Seemed to work with the Priesthood prohibition...

False.  The true narrative is more interesting than the nonsense which wokesters constantly repeat.

4 minutes ago, ttribe said:

Why should anyone care what Jordan Peterson has to say?

Because he is one of the best clinicians out there.

Link to comment
Just now, Robert F. Smith said:

False.  The true narrative is more interesting than the nonsense which wokesters constantly repeat.

Because he is one of the best clinicians out there.

And a clinician’s opinion about religious organizations is worth what?

Link to comment
47 minutes ago, ttribe said:

Wait, Harvard, Duke and Stanford aren't "serious universities?"

 

39 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I smell a "no true Scotsman" argument coming and I am popping the popcorn.

A lot of colleges and universities have nice intramural sports programs (healthy mind in a healthy body, and all that), but the truly serious schools don't have any place for big time sports teams.

Link to comment
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...