Duncan Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 There I was on Family Search last night and trying to figure out family history and lo and behold I came across several family members that had their ordinances reserved, so I clicked on who it was that reserved them, i could care less if it was being done by someone else, I'm just curious. So, you have that option of emailing them and hey you could be related, or should be related if they are doing your/their lines-isn't their that rule only family? I got a response back from this lady and she isn't related and not even a member. I don't get why a non member would be reserving ordinances that they don't plan on doing? why would they even care about Temple work? I am excited that others are doing family history, especially mine but why would non members be doing this? To prevent them from being done?
Garden Girl Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 (edited) Duncan... Yes, I do see that it did occur to you that this is one way she can keep the ordinances from being done. Did you ask her why she reserved the names so the family can't do them, particularly since she is a non-member... how did she get into family search? She has to have a member ID number to request ordinances info, IIRC. GG Edited May 17, 2020 by Garden Girl 1
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, Duncan said: There I was on Family Search last night and trying to figure out family history and lo and behold I came across several family members that had their ordinances reserved, so I clicked on who it was that reserved them, i could care less if it was being done by someone else, I'm just curious. So, you have that option of emailing them and hey you could be related, or should be related if they are doing your/their lines-isn't their that rule only family? I got a response back from this lady and she isn't related and not even a member. I don't get why a non member would be reserving ordinances that they don't plan on doing? why would they even care about Temple work? I am excited that others are doing family history, especially mine but why would non members be doing this? To prevent them from being done? I think you should report this right away to the Church's Family History Department. I'm fairly certain that people are not allowed to submit names for temple work of persons to whom they are not related, much less reserving the names for ordinances they don't plan on doing. Methinks that mischief is afoot. The FamilySearch customer service phone number shown online is 1 (866) 406-1830 Edited May 17, 2020 by Scott Lloyd 4
Duncan Posted May 17, 2020 Author Posted May 17, 2020 18 minutes ago, Garden Girl said: Duncan... Yes, I do see that it did occur to you that this is one way she can keep the ordinances from being done. Did you ask her why she reserved the names so the family can't do them, particularly since she is a non-member... how did she get into family search? She has to have a member ID number to request ordinances info, IIRC. GG I asked but she didn't answer 1
Duncan Posted May 17, 2020 Author Posted May 17, 2020 Just now, Scott Lloyd said: I think you should report this right away to the Church's Family History Department. I'm fairly certain that people are not allowed to submit names for temple work of persons to whom they are not related, much less, reserving the names for ordinances they don't plan on doing. Methinks that mischief is afoot. The FamilySearch customer service phone number shown online is 1 (866) 406-1830 okay, I can see if someone is tangentially related but no relations whatsoever is a puzzler!
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Duncan said: okay, I can see if someone is tangentially related but no relations whatsoever is a puzzler! You can submit names from lateral lines (cousins), but as Garden Girl has pointed out, to reserve names for temple work, you need a Church identification and password. If you don't mind, please let us know how this turns out after you have contacted FamilySearch. Edited May 17, 2020 by Scott Lloyd 3
katherine the great Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 (edited) 56 minutes ago, Duncan said: There I was on Family Search last night and trying to figure out family history and lo and behold I came across several family members that had their ordinances reserved, so I clicked on who it was that reserved them, i could care less if it was being done by someone else, I'm just curious. So, you have that option of emailing them and hey you could be related, or should be related if they are doing your/their lines-isn't their that rule only family? I got a response back from this lady and she isn't related and not even a member. I don't get why a non member would be reserving ordinances that they don't plan on doing? why would they even care about Temple work? I am excited that others are doing family history, especially mine but why would non members be doing this? To prevent them from being done? It's all a ruse to get people outraged and inspire them to do their own temple work!! Or, there's a glitch in the system that sometimes allows anyone to reserve them. If so, I imagine that they are just clicking around and don't really even know what they're doing. The temple icon isn't exactly self explanatory. I do tons of genealogy and I've ended up in family search without logging in before and noticed that some things were visible that I thought were odd. Anyone can go into parts of family search. Just to clarify. If you go to the main family search page, you have to login. But if you are googling an ancestor's name and a family search hit comes up and you click on it--you go straight into the family search site without logging in. There may just be some remnants of an older system that haven't been patched. Edited May 17, 2020 by katherine the great 3
longview Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 (edited) My wife is expert in family history. I had her read your post. She thinks it is weird. We talked about the sign-in process. Members use the same user-id and password for the main Church web-site, Gospel Library app, Member Tools, FamilySearch (among others). The only way to be able to sign-in with update privileges (for church ordinances) is to have initially registered into the system with entry of membership I.D. number (which can only be obtained from the clerk's office). This person probably is a lapsed member. She may be just trolling you and causing havoc for the work of the Lord. Edited May 17, 2020 by longview 3
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 3 minutes ago, katherine the great said: It's all a ruse to get people outraged and inspire them to do their own temple work!! Or, there's a glitch in the system that sometimes allows anyone to reserve them. If so, I imagine that they are just clicking around and don't really even know what they're doing. The temple icon isn't exactly self explanatory. I do tons of genealogy and I've ended up in family search without logging in before and noticed that some things were visible that I thought were odd. Anyone can go into parts of family search. There's supposed to be a firewall, though, that prevents unauthorized persons from going in and mucking about with temple submissions.
katherine the great Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 5 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: There's supposed to be a firewall, though, that prevents unauthorized persons from going in and mucking about with temple submissions. No doubt. I do remember vaguely wondering why the icon was visible when I wasn't logged in. This was a while back- 6 months or more ago. It seems possible that in the transition, some safeguards were temporarily down. That's not to say that it couldn't be malicious, but I wouldn't jump to that conclusion without more information. I have friends on Facebook that I don't even know because I accidentally sent them friend requests in a clumsy moment online. 1
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 38 minutes ago, katherine the great said: No doubt. I do remember vaguely wondering why the icon was visible when I wasn't logged in. This was a while back- 6 months or more ago. It seems possible that in the transition, some safeguards were temporarily down. That's not to say that it couldn't be malicious, but I wouldn't jump to that conclusion without more information. I have friends on Facebook that I don't even know because I accidentally sent them friend requests in a clumsy moment online. Apparently, Duncan has tried corresponding directly with the person, but it seems she is being coy about saying what she is up to. Which makes me suspicious.
JAHS Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 2 hours ago, Duncan said: There I was on Family Search last night and trying to figure out family history and lo and behold I came across several family members that had their ordinances reserved, so I clicked on who it was that reserved them, i could care less if it was being done by someone else, I'm just curious. So, you have that option of emailing them and hey you could be related, or should be related if they are doing your/their lines-isn't their that rule only family? I got a response back from this lady and she isn't related and not even a member. I don't get why a non member would be reserving ordinances that they don't plan on doing? why would they even care about Temple work? I am excited that others are doing family history, especially mine but why would non members be doing this? To prevent them from being done? Yes. They might think if they keep them reserved in their name indefinitely they are protecting their ancestors from being made Mormons, which of course does not happen. 1
Duncan Posted May 17, 2020 Author Posted May 17, 2020 What I dunno, SUPER bothers me, is this person reserved my Dad's Uncle, and this Uncle had an incredibly difficult life, not always his fault and we've wanted to do his Temple but we needed more details about his life and finally, finally we found them, well, this lady has them on reserve😡 1
Popular Post bluebell Posted May 17, 2020 Popular Post Posted May 17, 2020 4 minutes ago, Duncan said: What I dunno, SUPER bothers me, is this person reserved my Dad's Uncle, and this Uncle had an incredibly difficult life, not always his fault and we've wanted to do his Temple but we needed more details about his life and finally, finally we found them, well, this lady has them on reserve😡 The nonmember, non-family, lady?? Oh heck yeah call the Family Search people. 6
Duncan Posted May 17, 2020 Author Posted May 17, 2020 Just now, bluebell said: The nonmember, non-family, lady?? Oh heck yeah call the Family Search people. I emailed her and politely, politely asking for more information and so when I hear back then i'll bring out the big guns as it were 2
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 4 hours ago, Duncan said: I emailed her and politely, politely asking for more information and so when I hear back then i'll bring out the big guns as it were Put a time limit on it, then. Don’t wait indefinitely to hear from her.
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 It might eventually be a moot point anyway, since after a period of no action, the reservation on the name is automatically canceled. But I think it bears looking into if someone is going about making bogus reservations on names just to keep the ordinances from occurring. 2
Duncan Posted May 17, 2020 Author Posted May 17, 2020 20 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: Put a time limit on it, then. Don’t wait indefinitely to hear from her. that is a good idea, I have noticed that quite some time ago another person had reserved some people, but I emailed them, my older sister emailed them and nothing was heard back. I think? that FS kicked them of from reserving our names, but teh other day I found them reserving at least one name, I don't even know if it's a real person or who is behind it
Kenngo1969 Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 (edited) Could some enterprising (but also conniving, scheming, and designing) person create a bot that would go in and reserve names, I wonder? (Just thinking out loud here. Don't mind me.) Good luck with your family history and Temple work, Duncan. I think it's great that you're doing it. As for this woman (or anyone else) apparently trying to throw a wrench into the work, To quote Joseph Smith, "No unhallowed hand can stop this work from progressing." Edited May 17, 2020 by Kenngo1969 3
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 24 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said: Could some enterprising (but also conniving, scheming, and designing) person create a bot that would go in and reserve names, I wonder? (Just thinking out loud here. Don't mind me.) Good luck with your family history and Temple work, Duncan. I think it's great that you're doing it. As for this woman (or anyone else) apparently trying to throw a wrench into the work, To quote Joseph Smith, "No unhallowed hand can stop this work from progressing." Under normal circumstances, the bot would need a bona fide Church login and password and could not get one without a legitimate Membership Record Number, which is generated at baptism.
Scott Lloyd Posted May 17, 2020 Posted May 17, 2020 37 minutes ago, Duncan said: that is a good idea, I have noticed that quite some time ago another person had reserved some people, but I emailed them, my older sister emailed them and nothing was heard back. I think? that FS kicked them of from reserving our names, but teh other day I found them reserving at least one name, I don't even know if it's a real person or who is behind it This one sounds more like it could be a case of someone just having not gotten around to doing the work. That said, there’s no good reason for sitting on names if you’re too busy to take them to the temple. You can release them to the temple file, and other patrons can do the work. We still have plenty of folks who come to do ordinance work who have not brought names. There’s always a ready supply from which a name can be assigned to them, and these days, the names have all come from persons who have done their own family history work.
Duncan Posted May 17, 2020 Author Posted May 17, 2020 44 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: This one sounds more like it could be a case of someone just having not gotten around to doing the work. That said, there’s no good reason for sitting on names if you’re too busy to take them to the temple. You can release them to the temple file, and other patrons can do the work. We still have plenty of folks who come to do ordinance work who have not brought names. There’s always a ready supply from which a name can be assigned to them, and these days, the names have all come from persons who have done their own family history work. exactley, if someone reserved it and maybe forgot that's normal and understandable. If you can release them even better! I have a TON of names to do , or our family does and my 12 yr nephew is going to be baptized a million times but I am trying to get to the bottom of this. I discovered another lady who reserved a bunch of names also, I don' know if she is a member but she says she works in a archive in Germany, I dunno, we'll see if she is also a member. I didn't think my family was so popular!
rpn Posted May 18, 2020 Posted May 18, 2020 Quote rved my Dad's Uncle, and this Uncle had an incredibly difficult life, not always his fault and we've wanted to do his Temple but we needed more details about his life and finally, finally we found them, well, this lady has them on reserve😡 If your dad's uncle has closer kin than you are, and died within the last 100 years, you do need the next of kin permission. Please don't ignore that obligation because it causes bad feelings when people do not respect the closer links in a misguided effort to get the work done. 1
Duncan Posted May 18, 2020 Author Posted May 18, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, rpn said: If your dad's uncle has closer kin than you are, and died within the last 100 years, you do need the next of kin permission. Please don't ignore that obligation because it causes bad feelings when people do not respect the closer links in a misguided effort to get the work done. I know but this person isn't related at all and I wondering if she is working for someone or how she got his info. I have no problem a relative of his doing his work but I want to know they are a relative Edited May 18, 2020 by Duncan
mfbukowski Posted May 18, 2020 Posted May 18, 2020 13 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: I think you should report this right away to the Church's Family History Department. I'm fairly certain that people are not allowed to submit names for temple work of persons to whom they are not related, much less reserving the names for ordinances they don't plan on doing. Methinks that mischief is afoot. The FamilySearch customer service phone number shown online is 1 (866) 406-1830 Seconded. Deserved another repeat.
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