Popular Post bsjkki Posted October 19, 2017 Popular Post Posted October 19, 2017 In 2018 changes will be made to the visiting teaching messages. https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865691373/Changes-to-Relief-Society-visiting-teaching-messages-Do-what-she-needs.html Beginning January 2018, changes to the monthly visiting teaching message will help sisters “minister” to each other in a more personal way. Rather than providing a specific message, each month a “Visiting Teaching Principle” will provide ideas to help sisters minister more effectively to each other. 6
CV75 Posted October 19, 2017 Posted October 19, 2017 40 minutes ago, bsjkki said: In 2018 changes will be made to the visiting teaching messages. https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865691373/Changes-to-Relief-Society-visiting-teaching-messages-Do-what-she-needs.html Beginning January 2018, changes to the monthly visiting teaching message will help sisters “minister” to each other in a more personal way. Rather than providing a specific message, each month a “Visiting Teaching Principle” will provide ideas to help sisters minister more effectively to each other. I think that's a great focus, but will they now call it Ministering Sisters?
Scott Lloyd Posted October 20, 2017 Posted October 20, 2017 (edited) It occurs to me that there was nothing to forbid or prevent visiting teachers to do this sort of thing before. It is not meet that ye be commanded in all things, don’t you know? But then, I’ve never been a Relief Society visiting teacher, so I could be wrong. Edited October 20, 2017 by Scott Lloyd
Garden Girl Posted October 20, 2017 Posted October 20, 2017 1 hour ago, Scott Lloyd said: It occurs to me that there was nothing to forbid or prevent visiting teachers to do this sort of thing before. It is not meet that ye be commanded in all things, don’t you know? Butthen, I’ve never been a Relief Society visiting teacher, so I could be wrong. Yes... I've been tailoring my monthly visiting teaching message for some time... I VT 4 inactive sisters, so when the monthly Ensign message was not really applicable I would go through the various articles and find a principle and write up a message to share that I hoped would be uplifting... I think it works well. For instance, instead of sending the October message on dealing with family members who "stray," I will be sending a message based on Pres Monson's "Help Someone Today" message from page 80. With all the suffering going on with fires, floods, hurricanes, etc., and just life in general, we have opportunities to serve others in numerous ways. GG 4
RevTestament Posted October 20, 2017 Posted October 20, 2017 2 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: It occurs to me that there was nothing to forbid or prevent visiting teachers to do this sort of thing before. It is not meet that ye be commanded in all things, don’t you know? Butthen, I’ve never been a Relief Society visiting teacher, so I could be wrong. I rarely follow a home teaching message these days. I'm not saying that makes me more effective tho. It's been awhile since I've felt particularly effective.
Rain Posted October 20, 2017 Posted October 20, 2017 10 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: It occurs to me that there was nothing to forbid or prevent visiting teachers to do this sort of thing before. It is not meet that ye be commanded in all things, don’t you know? Butthen, I’ve never been a Relief Society visiting teacher, so I could be wrong. No nothing prevented that. If I remember correctly, we have even been counseled to do that. I have done it many times. The difference that I see is that some do not know it is ok to do it. And like JAHS said the other day on my service thread - "Most of us are creatures of routine. Once we have a routine set up in our lives it's hard to divert from it to think about doing something out of the routine, like an act of service." This happens with the VT messages as well. Last year I was VT to a married member sister who was living with a nonmember married man not her husband. The missionaries were teaching them. At one point I discovered they didn't want to get divorces or stop living together and were getting anxious about being taught anymore. This sister needed the church in her life besides spiritual ways as well. So I suggested the missionaries teach the basics of the gospel for now - Christ. Well my companion was older and pretty formal about her lessons. We had talked about tailoring the lessons to her. So a lesson comes up about temple marriage and like with the rest of her lessons she went straight into it, but suddenly stopped. She had realized what she was doing, but wasn't sure what to do at that point. The next month she practically begged to give the lessen to make up for it, but unfortunately due to other things she never got the chance. So yes, we should by all means have been tailoring the lessons, but some, for whatever reason, are stuck as a creature of routine. This will help change that. 4
Scott Lloyd Posted October 20, 2017 Posted October 20, 2017 2 hours ago, Rain said: So I suggested the missionaries teach the basics of the gospel for now - Christ. I wonder how missionaries could "teach the basics of the gospel" without teaching repentance. Seems pretty basic to me. 1
Duncan Posted October 20, 2017 Posted October 20, 2017 My Mum likes the new change she can't really read the small print in the Ensign anyways, so she says they just talk about whatever and see how they are doing and things of that nature 1
Jeanne Posted October 20, 2017 Posted October 20, 2017 (edited) Well...I think this is a better idea...each sister has different problems and it would help that they know they can receive and/or ask for personal help rather than receiving messages that have been given before. The key is to establish a relationship where they can feel secure, honest and open..with a promise of some confidenciality (sp) if necessary. Edited to add: This may make a big difference for sisters that don't like visiting teaching. It will make them feel more useful and service more relevant. I had such a hard time getting sisters to go...and harder still to find anything I wanted to discuss with my own visiting teachers. Edited October 20, 2017 by Jeanne 1
Rain Posted October 21, 2017 Posted October 21, 2017 7 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: I wonder how missionaries could "teach the basics of the gospel" without teaching repentance. Seems pretty basic to me. Teaching repentence is one thing. Encouraging them specifically for one of them to move out or for both of them to get divorced and marry, or both to go back to spouses is another thing, especially under the circumstances they had. My feeling was that as we help them build a testimony then they will start to understand the need for repentence and do that little by little on their own. Had the missionaries pushed for repentence over their marriages and living together at the moment they would have stopped seeing the missionaries. 2
Scott Lloyd Posted October 21, 2017 Posted October 21, 2017 3 hours ago, Rain said: Teaching repentence is one thing. Encouraging them specifically for one of them to move out or for both of them to get divorced and marry, or both to go back to spouses is another thing, especially under the circumstances they had. My feeling was that as we help them build a testimony then they will start to understand the need for repentence and do that little by little on their own. Had the missionaries pushed for repentence over their marriages and living together at the moment they would have stopped seeing the missionaries. Be that as it may, it is outside the purview of visiting teachers — or home teachers, for that matter — to try to control the content of missionaries’ teaching. That ought to come from or through the mission president. And yes, I recognize you used the word “suggested.” But for some 18- or 19-year-olds, even a suggestion from a seasoned and mature member can seem intimidating. 1
Rain Posted October 21, 2017 Posted October 21, 2017 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: Be that as it may, it is outside the purview of visiting teachers — or home teachers, for that matter — to try to control the content of missionaries’ teaching. That ought to come from or through the mission president. And yes, I recognize you used the word “suggested.” But for some 18- or 19-year-olds, even a suggestion from a seasoned and mature member can seem intimidating. I wasn't just a visiting teacher. I was a ward missionary and worked side by side with my ward mission leader husband whom I had talked to about this. I taught her with them as well as with my VT companion. There was no "controlling" involved. And they were not in anyway intimidated. I don't have a single concern about suggesting it. Edited October 21, 2017 by Rain 2
Scott Lloyd Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 On 10/20/2017 at 10:50 PM, Rain said: I wasn't just a visiting teacher. I was a ward missionary and worked side by side with my ward mission leader husband whom I had talked to about this. I taught her with them as well as with my VT companion. There was no "controlling" involved. And they were not in anyway intimidated. I don't have a single concern about suggesting it. I will accept the above as fact. But I still take issue with the thought that one can teach “the basics” of the gospel while separating it from the doctrine of repentance, which is integral to the Atonement, which in turn is central to the gospel.
Rain Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: I will accept the above as fact. But I still take issue with the thought that one can teach “the basics” of the gospel while separating it from the doctrine of repentance, which is integral to the Atonement, which in turn is central to the gospel. Agreed. I'm glad you take issue over that. It's a good thing, as I stated above, that I felt we should help them build a testimony of repentance and the atonement. 1
Scott Lloyd Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Rain said: Agreed. I'm glad you take issue over that. It's a good thing, as I stated above, that I felt we should help them build a testimony of repentance and the atonement. Well, I’m getting more confused now. Are you saying you suggested the missionaries teach them repentance and the Atonement in the abstract while avoiding any implication they need to apply those teachings personally? Also, I’m having a hard time grasping how one gains a testimony of repentance without personally experiencing it. Edited October 23, 2017 by Scott Lloyd
Rain Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) Nope. I'm saying that they should teach repentance and atonement, but specifically not call attention to repentance about marriage and living together until they were at a point when they were ready to make such big changes in their lives. As they pray, read the scriptures, learn about Christ and his apostles, learn to repent over little things, etc they will build their confidence that making right choices about bigger things is a good thing even if it seems it will turn their lives upside down. Edited October 23, 2017 by Rain 3
Benjamin Seeker Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 On 10/20/2017 at 10:04 PM, Scott Lloyd said: Be that as it may, it is outside the purview of visiting teachers — or home teachers, for that matter — to try to control the content of missionaries’ teaching. That ought to come from or through the mission president. And yes, I recognize you used the word “suggested.” But for some 18- or 19-year-olds, even a suggestion from a seasoned and mature member can seem intimidating. Missionaries can be pretty thick. A suggestion isn't a bad idea. They can make a decision and live with it whether they are intimidated or not. This is the kind of stuff that often gets hashed out in coorelation meeting or ward council anyways. 4
Benjamin Seeker Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 54 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: Well, I’m getting more confused now. Are you saying you suggested the missionaries teach them repentance and the Atonement in the abstract while avoiding any implication they need to apply those teachings personally? Also, I’m having a hard time grasping how one gains a testimony of repentance without personally experiencing it. Baby steps. No need to bash them with a hammer every meeting. It wasn't going to help. Supporting those with spiritually feeble knees includes finding appropriate challenges and goals. Simply letting them know they couldn't be baptized until they remedied the situation would be plenty, as clearly, the church's expectations were obvious. The focus can move onto other areas of their life where they can build spirituality. 4
Rain Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) Bsjkki - I'm sorry. We took over your thread. I was surprised at how many knew about this change today. I haven't seen anything on facebook so I didn't think it was well known yet. Edited October 23, 2017 by Rain
Calm Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 It has been in the DeseretNews, LDSliving and Church website. Surprised not so much on FB.
Scott Lloyd Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 42 minutes ago, Benjamin Seeker said: Baby steps. No need to bash them with a hammer every meeting. It wasn't going to help. Supporting those with spiritually feeble knees includes finding appropriate challenges and goals. Simply letting them know they couldn't be baptized until they remedied the situation would be plenty, as clearly, the church's expectations were obvious. The focus can move onto other areas of their life where they can build spirituality. You speak as though you are personally acquainted with this situation. Is that a correct perception?
Scott Lloyd Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 23 minutes ago, Calm said: It has been in the DeseretNews, LDSliving and Church website. Surprised not so much on FB. Yeah, it has gotten plenty of press.
Benjamin Seeker Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 21 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: You speak as though you are personally acquainted with this situation. Is that a correct perception? I'm just taking Rain's word for it. The couple were considering stopping missionary lessons if the focus/push on their living situation continued. Clearly, they understood the exexpectations and weren't ready to meet it yet.
bluebell Posted October 23, 2017 Posted October 23, 2017 On 10/20/2017 at 10:50 PM, Rain said: I wasn't just a visiting teacher. I was a ward missionary and worked side by side with my ward mission leader husband whom I had talked to about this. I taught her with them as well as with my VT companion. There was no "controlling" involved. And they were not in anyway intimidated. I don't have a single concern about suggesting it. If the sister is a member, then you absolutely have the right to give suggestions on what the missionaries are teaching them. Missionaries are over nonmembers but the bishop of teach ward, who delegates to ward mission leaders and missionaries, is over members, active or not. Mission Presidents don't have stewardship over what members are taught. 2
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