Who is the One Mighty Among Them (2 Nephi 3:24)?

[Bernard Gui]

In 2 Nephi 2, Joseph, son of Lehi, is given this promise by his father:

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22 And now, behold, my son Joseph, after this manner did my father of old prophesy.

23 Wherefore, because of this covenant thou art blessed; for thy seed shall not be destroyed, for they shall hearken unto the words of the book.

24 And there shall rise up one mighty among them, who shall do much good, both in word and in deed, being an instrument in the hands of God, with exceeding faith, to work mighty wonders, and do that thing which is great in the sight of God, unto the bringing to pass much restoration unto the house of Israel, and unto the seed of thy brethren.

There is some question who this "one mighty among them" will be. It's not Joseph Smith, because the one will be a descendant of Lehi. Joseph Fielding Smith and Spencer Kimball suggested it would be a future prophet to come out of the remnants of Lehi (a "Lamanite" or "Indian" prophet).

Let me propose another candidate, one who we all know well but perhaps take for granted.

• He did much good in word and deed.
• He was an instrument in the hands of God.
• He had exceeding faith.
• He worked mighty wonders.
• He did that thing which is great in the sight of God in bringing restoration to the house of Israel and the seed of Lehi.  

1. He did much good in word and deed.

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I did speak unto my people, and did urge them with great energy, that they would stand boldly before the Lamanites and fight for their wives, and their children, and their houses, and their homes. And my words did arouse them somewhat to vigor, insomuch that they did not flee from before the Lamanites, but did stand with boldness against them. And it came to pass that the Lord did say unto me: Cry unto this people—Repent ye, and come unto me, and be ye baptized, and build up again my church, and ye shall be spared. And I did cry unto this people, but it was in vain; and they did not realize that it was the Lord that had spared them, and granted unto them a chance for repentance. And behold they did harden their hearts against the Lord their God.

Behold, I had led them, notwithstanding their wickedness I had led them many times to battle, and had loved them, according to the love of God which was in me, with all my heart; and my soul had been poured out in prayer unto my God all the day long for them; nevertheless, it was without faith, because of the hardness of their hearts. And thrice have I delivered them out of the hands of their enemies, and they have repented not of their sins. I did go forth among the Nephites, and did repent of the oath which I had made that I would no more assist them; and they gave me command again of their armies, for they looked upon me as though I could deliver them from their afflictions. But behold, I was without hope, for I knew the judgments of the Lord which should come upon them.

 

2. He was an instrument in the hands of God.

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And this is the commandment which I have received; and behold, they shall come forth according to the commandment of the Lord, when he shall see fit, in his wisdom. And I, being fifteen years of age and being somewhat of a sober mind, therefore I was visited of the Lord, and tasted and knew of the goodness of Jesus. And I did endeavor to preach unto this people, but my mouth was shut, and I was forbidden that I should preach unto them. And I do this for a wise purpose; for thus it whispereth me, according to the workings of the Spirit of the Lord which is in me. And now, I do not know all things; but the Lord knoweth all things which are to come; wherefore, he worketh in me to do according to his will.

 

3. He had exceeding faith.

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And the things which are upon these plates pleasing me, because of the prophecies of the coming of Christ; and my fathers knowing that many of them have been fulfilled; yea, and I also know that as many things as have been prophesied concerning us down to this day have been fulfilled, and as many as go beyond this day must surely come to pass. And it came to pass that when I, Mormon, saw their lamentation and their mourning and their sorrow before the Lord, my heart did begin to rejoice within me, knowing the mercies and the long-suffering of the Lord, therefore supposing that he would be merciful unto them that they would again become a righteous people. And wo is me because of their wickedness; for my heart has been filled with sorrow because of their wickedness, all my days; nevertheless, I know that I shall be lifted up at the last day. If it so be that ye believe in Christ, and are baptized, first with water, then with fire and with the Holy Ghost, following the example of our Savior, according to that which he hath commanded us, it shall be well with you in the day of judgment.

 

4. He worked mighty wonders.

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[Ammaron] came unto me, (I being about ten years of age, and I began to be learned somewhat after the manner of the learning of my people) and Ammaron said unto me: I perceive that thou art a sober child, and art quick to observe; Therefore, when ye are about twenty and four years old I would that ye should remember the things that ye have observed concerning this people; and when ye are of that age go to the land Antum, unto a hill which shall be called Shim; and there have I deposited unto the Lord all the sacred engravings concerning this people. Notwithstanding I being young, was large in stature; therefore the people of Nephi appointed me that I should be their leader, or the leader of their armies. Therefore it came to pass that in my sixteenth year I did go forth at the head of an army of the Nephites, against the Lamanites. And now, the Lamanites had a king, and his name was Aaron; and he came against us with an army of forty and four thousand. And behold, I withstood him with forty and two thousand. And it came to pass that I beat him with my army that he fled before me.

And behold, ye shall take the plates of Nephi unto yourself, and the remainder shall ye leave in the place where they are; and ye shall engrave on the plates of Nephi all the things that ye have observed concerning this people. And now I, Mormon, seeing that the Lamanites were about to overthrow the land, therefore I did go to the hill Shim, and did take up all the records which Ammaron had hid up unto the Lord. And it came to pass that when we had gathered in all our people in one to the land of Cumorah, behold I, Mormon, began to be old; and knowing it to be the last struggle of my people, and having been commanded of the Lord that I should not suffer the records which had been handed down by our fathers, which were sacred, to fall into the hands of the Lamanites, (for the Lamanites would destroy them) therefore I made this record out of the plates of Nephi, and hid up in the hill Cumorah all the records which had been entrusted to me by the hand of the Lord, save it were these few plates which I gave unto my son Moroni.

 

5. He did that thing which is great in the sight of God in bringing the restoration to the house of Israel and the seed of Lehi.

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Therefore I write unto you, Gentiles, and also unto you, house of Israel, when the work shall commence, that ye shall be about to prepare to return to the land of your inheritance; Yea, behold, I write unto all the ends of the earth; yea, unto you, twelve tribes of Israel, who shall be judged according to your works by the twelve whom Jesus chose to be his disciples in the land of Jerusalem. And I write also unto the remnant of this people, who shall also be judged by the twelve whom Jesus chose in this land; and they shall be judged by the other twelve whom Jesus chose in the land of Jerusalem. And these things doth the Spirit manifest unto me; therefore I write unto you all. And for this cause I write unto you, that ye may know that ye must all stand before the judgment-seat of Christ, yea, every soul who belongs to the whole human family of Adam; and ye must stand to be judged of your works, whether they be good or evil; And also that ye may believe the gospel of Jesus Christ, which ye shall have among you; and also that the Jews, the covenant people of the Lord, shall have other witness besides him whom they saw and heard, that Jesus, whom they slew, was the very Christ and the very God. And I would that I could persuade all ye ends of the earth to repent and prepare to stand before the judgment-seat of Christ. 

And also that a knowledge of these things must come unto the remnant of these people, and also unto the Gentiles, who the Lord hath said should scatter this people.... This I speak unto their seed, and also to the Gentiles who have care for the house of Israel, that realize and know from whence their blessings come. For I know that such will sorrow for the calamity of the house of Israel; yea, they will sorrow for the destruction of this people; they will sorrow that this people had not repented that they might have been clasped in the arms of Jesus. Now these things are written unto the remnant of the house of Jacob; and they are written after this manner, because it is known of God that wickedness will not bring them forth unto them; and they are to be hid up unto the Lord that they may come forth in his own due time. 

And behold, they shall go unto the unbelieving of the Jews; and for this intent shall they go—that they may be persuaded that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the living God; that the Father may bring about, through his most Beloved, his great and eternal purpose, in restoring the Jews, or all the house of Israel, to the land of their inheritance, which the Lord their God hath given them, unto the fulfilling of his covenant; And also that the seed of this people may more fully believe his gospel, which shall go forth unto them from the Gentiles; for this people shall be scattered, and shall become a dark, a filthy, and a loathsome people, beyond the description of that which ever hath been amongst us, yea, even that which hath been among the Lamanites, and this because of their unbelief and idolatry.

And ye will also know that ye are a remnant of the seed of Jacob; therefore ye are numbered among the people of the first covenant; and if it so be that ye believe in Christ, and are baptized, first with water, then with fire and with the Holy Ghost, following the example of our Savior, according to that which he hath commanded us, it shall be well with you in the day of judgment. And as surely as the Lord liveth, will he gather in from the four quarters of the earth all the remnant of the seed of Jacob, who are scattered abroad upon all the face of the earth. And as he hath covenanted with all the house of Jacob, even so shall the covenant wherewith he hath covenanted with the house of Jacob be fulfilled in his own due time, unto the restoring all the house of Jacob unto the knowledge of the covenant that he hath covenanted with them. And then shall they know their Redeemer, who is Jesus Christ, the Son of God; and then shall they be gathered in from the four quarters of the earth unto their own lands, from whence they have been dispersed; yea, as the Lord liveth so shall it be.

 

Yes, I'm talking about that giant of a Nephite, the Prophet Mormon. As a boy, he was a leader of men. As a man, he was one of the greatest prophets of God. As a prophet, he was fearless in his faith and secure in his knowledge. As a warrior, he gave his life in defense of his people. As a father, he inspired greatness in his son Moroni. As a historian, he was entrusted to make and preserve the record of his people that became the foundation of the Restoration. Truly, he was "one mighty among them."

Granted, some may point out that he claimed to be a descendant of Nephi, not Joseph, but it is reasonable to conclude that the descendants of the faithful Lehites (Nephi, Sam, Joseph, Jacob, and Zoram) intermarried and all could claim to be descended from Nephi. In fact, all the descendants of those Lehi sons became grouped under the head of Nephi. But is it not possible that this man was the one prophesied to come and bring restoration to Lehi's family?

Others may have come to this conclusion, but I'm not aware of any who have proposed Mormon. Feel free to burst that bubble of pride.

Your thoughts?

Edited November 21, 2016 by Bernard Gui

[Scott Lloyd]

2 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

In 2 Nephi 2 Joseph, son of Lehi, is given this promise by his father:

There is some question who this "one mighty among them" will be. It's not Joseph Smith, because the one will be a descendant of Lehi. Joseph Fielding Smith and Spencer Kimball suggested it would be a future prophet to come out of the remnants of Lehi (a "Lamanite" or "Indian" prophet).

Let me propose another candidate.

• He did much good in word and deed.
• He was an instrument in the hands of God.
• He had exceeding faith.
• He worked mighty wonders.
• He did that thing which is great in the sight of God in bringing restoration to the house of Israel and the seed of Lehi.  

1. He did much good in word and deed.

 

2. He was an instrument in the hands of God.

 

3. He had exceeding faith.

 

4. He worked mighty wonders.

 

5. He did that thing which is great in the sight of God in bringing the restoration to the house of Israel and the seed of Lehi.

 

Yes, I'm talking about that giant of a Nephite, the Prophet Mormon. As a boy, he was a leader of men. As a man, he was one of the greatest prophets of God. As a prophet, he was fearless in his faith and secure in his knowledge. As a warrior, he gave his life in defense of his people. As a father, he inspired greatness in his son Moroni. As a historian, he was entrusted to make and preserve the record of his people. Truly, he was "one mighty among them."

Granted, some may point out that he claimed to be a descendant of Nephi, not Joseph, but it is reasonable to conclude that the descendants of the faithful Lehites (Nephi, Sam, Joseph, Jacob, and Zoram) intermarried and all could claim to be descended from Nephi. In fact, all the descendants of those Lehi sons became grouped under the head of Nephi. But is it not possible that this man was the one prophesied to come and bring restoration to Lehi's family?

Others may have come to this conclusion, but I'm not aware of any who have proposed Mormon. Feel free to burst that bubble of pride.

Your thoughts?

A very thought-provoking and astute analysis.

At first glance, the prophecy seems to have a latter-days context, because it refers to "the bringing to pass much restoration unto the house of Israel," but in compiling the record and entrusting it into the hands of his son, who eventually delivered it to the Prophet of the Restoration, Mormon was indeed an instrument in this regard.

 

Edited November 21, 2016 by Scott Lloyd

[CV75]

9 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Your thoughts?

Like many prophecies that have multiple applications, I think you have shown that 2 Nephi Chapter 3 could refer to a number of people who are of the same mighty spirit for a shared role or mission, and so can apply to Mormon, Joseph Smith, or some other prophet.

I appreciate your thoughts on identifying Mormon. Where the seed of Joseph of old ended up among the nations of the Gentiles as well as among the descendants of Lehi, for the sake of discussion, the references I see as unique to Joseph Smith, who, as an Ephraimite was also a descendant of Joseph are:

-          The restoration (verse 7, “bringing of them to the knowledge of the covenants which I have made with thy fathers.”)

-          The post-Bible arrival of the Book of Mormon (verse 11, “the bringing forth my word …to the convincing them of my word, which shall have already gone forth among them.”)

-          The reference to the latter days (verse 13, “he shall be made strong, in that day when my work shall commence among all my people, unto the restoring thee, O house of Israel, saith the Lord.”)

-          The name Joseph (verse 15, “And his name shall be called after me; and it shall be after the name of his father.”). And Joseph Smith, as an Ephraimite was a descendant of Joseph.

-          His status (verse 15, “And he shall be like unto me…” While the comparison may be arguable, it does sound like D&C 153:3, “Joseph Smith …has done more, save Jesus only, for the salvation of men in this world, than any other man that ever lived in it.”

-          Joseph Smith had a spokesman (verse 17-18, “I will make a spokesman for him” sounds like D&C 100:9-11), while Mormon, being alone, had no need for one in declaring “the writing of the fruit of [Joseph’s] loins, unto the fruit of [Joseph’s] loins.” …Unless Joseph Smith was Mormon’s spokesman in a manner of speaking/writing/translating…

-          Joseph Smith translated the unsealed portion that was to go forth in the latter days (verse 19, “the words which he shall write shall be the words which are expedient in my wisdom should go forth unto the fruit of thy loins”), leaving room for a future translator as well.

Edited November 21, 2016 by CV75

[JLHPROF]

11 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

In 2 Nephi 2, Joseph, son of Lehi, is given this promise by his father:

• 22 And now, behold, my son Joseph, after this manner did my father of old prophesy.

  23 Wherefore, because of this covenant thou art blessed; for thy seed shall not be destroyed, for they shall hearken unto the words of the book.

  24 And there shall rise up one mighty among them, who shall do much good, both in word and in deed, being an instrument in the hands of God, with exceeding faith, to work mighty wonders, and do that thing which is great in the sight of God, unto the bringing to pass much restoration unto the house of Israel, and unto the seed of thy brethren.

There is some question who this "one mighty among them" will be. It's not Joseph Smith, because the one will be a descendant of Lehi. Joseph Fielding Smith and Spencer Kimball suggested it would be a future prophet to come out of the remnants of Lehi (a "Lamanite" or "Indian" prophet).

You are misinterpreting these words out of context.

The entire chapter is Lehi quoting the Patriarch Joseph/Israel.

vs 6 - For Joseph truly testified, saying: A seer shall the Lord my God raise up, who shall be a choice seer unto the fruit of my loins.
vs 7 - Yea, Joseph truly said: Thus saith the Lord unto me: A choice seer will I raise up out of the fruit of thy loins;
vs 14 - And thus prophesied Joseph, saying: Behold, that seer will the Lord bless;
vs 15 - And his name shall be called after me; and it shall be after the name of his father.

and the pertinent verses you quoted:
vs 22 - And now, behold, my son Joseph, after this manner did my father of old prophesy.
vs 23 Wherefore, because of this covenant thou art blessed; for thy seed shall not be destroyed, for they shall hearken unto the words of the book.
vs 24 And there shall rise up one mighty among them, who shall do much good, both in word and in deed, being an instrument in the hands of God, with exceeding faith, to work mighty wonders, and do that thing which is great in the sight of God, unto the bringing to pass much restoration unto the house of Israel, and unto the seed of thy brethren.

The mighty one is a descendant of Joseph/Israel, not a descendant of Lehi.  Joseph/Israel is prophesying about Joseph Smith and the restoration.
It is his seed referred to in vs 23, not Lehi and his son Joseph's.
 

[Bernard Gui]

2 hours ago, CV75 said:

Like many prophecies that have multiple applications, I think you have shown that 2 Nephi Chapter 3 could refer to a number of people who are of the same mighty spirit for a shared role or mission, and so can apply to Mormon, Joseph Smith, or some other prophet. I appreciate your thoughts on identifying Mormon. Where the seed of Joseph of old ended up among the nations of the Gentiles as well as among the descendants of Lehi, for the sake of discussion, the references I see as unique to Joseph Smith, who, as an Ephraimite was also a descendant of Joseph are-        

-  Joseph Smith translated the unsealed portion that was to go forth in the latter days (verse 19, “the words which he shall write shall be the words which are expedient in my wisdom should go forth unto the fruit of thy loins”), leaving room for a future translator as well.

I understand the references to Joseph Smith, but this promise was about a descendant of Joseph, son of Lehi. Noting the period at the end of verse 22 and the pivot to his son in verse 23, it looks to me that Lehi has ended his quotation of the prophesy of Joseph of Egypt, and then moves on to promise that another prophet will be raised from the descendants of Lehi's son Joseph to bless his seed; Joseph Smith was not a Lehite.

Edited November 21, 2016 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

10 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

You are misinterpreting these words out of context.

The entire chapter is Lehi quoting the Patriarch Joseph/Israel.

vs 6 - For Joseph truly testified, saying: A seer shall the Lord my God raise up, who shall be a choice seer unto the fruit of my loins.
vs 7 - Yea, Joseph truly said: Thus saith the Lord unto me: A choice seer will I raise up out of the fruit of thy loins;
vs 14 - And thus prophesied Joseph, saying: Behold, that seer will the Lord bless;
vs 15 - And his name shall be called after me; and it shall be after the name of his father.

and the pertinent verses you quoted:
vs 22 - And now, behold, my son Joseph, after this manner did my father of old prophesy.
vs 23 Wherefore, because of this covenant thou art blessed; for thy seed shall not be destroyed, for they shall hearken unto the words of the book.
vs 24 And there shall rise up one mighty among them, who shall do much good, both in word and in deed, being an instrument in the hands of God, with exceeding faith, to work mighty wonders, and do that thing which is great in the sight of God, unto the bringing to pass much restoration unto the house of Israel, and unto the seed of thy brethren.

The mighty one is a descendant of Joseph/Israel, not a descendant of Lehi.  Joseph/Israel is prophesying about Joseph Smith and the restoration.
It is his seed referred to in vs 23, not Lehi and his son Joseph's.
 

Actually, I came to this interpretation by carefully considering the context. I agree that Joseph Smith is the prophet foretold in the verses prior to 22. In previous verses, the words of Joseph of Egypt (JosephE) are set off by attribution phrases and colons. In my view, the period in verse 22 is a full stop; the quoting is over. Verse 21 is the end of JosephE's words.

Then in verses 23, 24, and 25 Lehi pivots back to his son Joseph (JosephL). He makes his own promise (similar to and patterned after that of their father JosephE) to his son JosephL. It is his final blessing to this faithful son.

Because of the covenant made with JosephE, JosephL will also be blessed. His seed shall not be destroyed because they will accept the message of the book. A mighty one will rise from "them" - the seed of JosephL in the verse 23 - who will participate in the restoration to the Jews and Lehites.

I think this was fulfilled in the prophet Mormon. The criteria fit him to a T. 

[Atheist Mormon]

1 hour ago, Bernard Gui said:

I understand the references to Joseph Smith, but this promise was about a descendant of Joseph, son of Lehi. Noting the period at the end of verse 22 and the pivot to his son in verse 23, it looks to me that Lehi has ended his quotation of the prophesy of Joseph of Egypt, and then moves on to promise that another prophet will be raised from the descendants of Lehi's son Joseph to bless his seed; Joseph Smith was not a Lehite.

Who is the One Mighty Among Them (2 Nephi 3:24)?

I could propose "Art Bulla", from the standpoint that He literally invested & dedicated his life to proclaim it....

[Michael Sanders]

1 hour ago, Bernard Gui said:

Actually, I came to this interpretation by carefully considering the context. I agree that Joseph Smith is the prophet foretold in the verses prior to 22. In previous verses, the words of Joseph of Egypt (JosephE) are set off by attribution phrases and colons. In my view, the period in verse 22 is a full stop; the quoting is over. Verse 21 is the end of JosephE's words.

Then in verses 23, 24, and 25 Lehi pivots back to his son Joseph (JosephL). He makes his own promise (similar to and patterned after that of their father JosephE) to his son JosephL. It is his final blessing to this faithful son.

Because of the covenant made with JosephE, JosephL will also be blessed. His seed shall not be destroyed because they will accept the message of the book. A mighty one will rise from "them" - the seed of JosephL in the verse 23 - who will participate in the restoration to the Jews and Lehites.

I think this was fulfilled in the prophet Mormon. The criteria fit him to a T. 

Only one problem - the one who rises from among them must be after the one who brings forth the book.  Joseph is the choice seer who brought forth the book, and that work will ultimately cause some of the descendants of JosephL to "hearken unto" those works (i.e. the book [of Mormon]).  The one mighty will rise from among this group.  So it must be after the work of Joseph Smith is complete - thus it cannot be Mormon.  What evidence do you have that his abridgement caused any great conversions among the seed of JosephL?  That they even had access to it?  Knew of its contents?  The prophecy clearly says that they one mighty will arise after the coming forth of the book [of Mormon]?  What book do you think is being referenced here, since you already have agreed that Joseph is the choice seer?

Mike Sanders

[HappyJackWagon]

Who is the one mighty and strong? This is an important question among fundamentalist sects but less so in the current LDS church. A quick view at the Wikipedia page shows a list of individuals who have been identified (by others or self) as the one, mighty and strong. This issue plays into the way fundamentalists view their role in the restoration by continuing polygamy and carrying priesthood keys. Interesting topic.

Quote

Interpretation by the LDS Church

In a 1905 statement, the First Presidency of the LDS Church—composed of Joseph F. Smith, John R. Winder, and Anthon H. Lund—offered two possible interpretations of the prophecy.

Possibility #1: Closed prophecy

First, the Presidency stated that Smith's words may have been a prophecy of what would happen if the presiding bishop of the church, Edward Partridge, failed to repent and fulfill his calling in the church:

It is to be observed first of all that the subject of this whole letter, as also the part of it subsequently accepted as a revelation, relates to the affairs of the Church in Missouri, the gathering of the Saints to that land and obtaining their inheritances under the law of consecration and stewardship; and the Prophet [Joseph Smith] deals especially with the matter of what is to become of those who fail to receive their inheritances by order or deed from the bishop. ...

It was while these conditions of rebellion, jealousy, pride, unbelief and hardness of heart prevailed among the brethren in Zion—Jackson county, Missouri—in all of which Bishop Partridge participated, that the words of the revelation taken from the letter to William W. Phelps, of the 27th of November, 1832, were written. The "man who was called and appointed of God" to "divide unto the Saints their inheritance"—Edward Partridge—was at that time out of order, neglecting his own duty, and putting "forth his hand to steady the ark"; hence, he was warned of the judgment of God impending, and the prediction was made that another, "one mighty and strong," would be sent of God to take his place, to have his bishopric—one having the spirit and power of that high office resting upon him, by which he would have power to "set in order the house of God, and arrange by lot the inheritance of the Saints"; in other words, one who would do the work that Bishop Edward Partridge had been appointed to do, but had failed to accomplish. ...

And inasmuch as through his repentance and sacrifices and suffering, Bishop Edward Partridge undoubtedly obtained a mitigation of the threatened judgment against him of falling "by the shaft of death, like as a tree that is smitten by the vivid shaft of lightning," so the occasion for sending another to fill his station—"one mighty and strong to set in order the house of God, and to arrange by lot the inheritances of the Saints"—may also be considered as having passed away and the whole incident of the prophecy closed.^[5]

Possibility #2: Prophecy of a future presiding bishop

However, the First Presidency also offered the possibility that the prophecy was not closed, and that the One Mighty and Strong would be a future presiding bishop of the church when the Latter-day Saints return to Jackson County, Missouri. Concerning this possibility, the First Presidency stated:

If, however, there are those who will still insist that the prophecy concerning the coming of "one mighty and strong" is still to be regarded as relating to the future, let the Latter-day Saints know that he will be a future bishop of the Church who will be with the Saints in Zion, Jackson county, Missouri, when the Lord shall establish them in that land; and he will be so blessed with the spirit and power of his calling that he will be able to set in order the house of God, pertaining to the department of the work under his jurisdiction; and in righteousness and justice will "arrange by lot the inheritances of the Saints." He will hold the same high and exalted station that Edward Partridge held; for the latter was called to do just this kind of work—that is, to set in order the house of God pertaining to settling the Saints upon their inheritances.^[5]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Mighty_and_Strong

Edited November 21, 2016 by HappyJackWagon

[bluebell]

This is supposedly a SW Kimball quote that deals with the prophecy.  It's referenced in a GC talk (and parts quoted) that was given in the 1970s but i've only found the entire quote on a separate site that's not very pro-mormon so take it for what it's worth.  

“The Lamanites must rise in majesty and power.” (Conference Reports, Oct. 1947) “The Lamanites must rise in majesty and power. We must look forward to the day when they will be “white and delightsome” (2 Ne. 5:21; 2 Ne. 30:6), sharing the freedoms and blessings which we enjoy; when they shall have economic security, culture, refinement, and education; when they shall be operating farms and businesses and industries and shall be occupied in the professions and in teaching; when they shall be organized into wards and stakes of Zion, furnishing much of their own leadership; when they shall build and occupy and fill the temples, and serve in them as the natives are now serving in the Hawaiian Temple where I found last year the entire service conducted by them and done perfectly. And in the day when their prophet shall come, one shall rise. . . mighty among them . . . being an instrument in the hands of God, with exceeding faith, to work mighty wonders (2 Ne. 3:24).”

 

[bluebell]

8 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Who is the one mighty and strong? This is an important question among fundamentalist sects but less so in the current LDS church. A quick view at the Wikipedia page shows a list of individuals who have been identified (by others or self) as the one, mighty and strong. This issue plays into the way fundamentalists view their role in the restoration by continuing polygamy and carrying priesthood keys. Interesting topic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Mighty_and_Strong

From what i've read, the 'one mighty and strong' prophecy is separate from the 'one mighty among them' prophecy.  I had them confused at first as well.

[HappyJackWagon]

2 minutes ago, bluebell said:

From what i've read, the 'one mighty and strong' prophecy is separate from the 'one mighty among them' prophecy.  I had them confused at first as well.

Thanks. I read "one mighty and" and in my mind went directly to "strong".

[CV75]

2 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

I understand the references to Joseph Smith, but this promise was about a descendant of Joseph, son of Lehi. Noting the period at the end of verse 22 and the pivot to his son in verse 23, it looks to me that Lehi has ended his quotation of the prophesy of Joseph of Egypt, and then moves on to promise that another prophet will be raised from the descendants of Lehi's son Joseph to bless his seed; Joseph Smith was not a Lehite.

Cool--you might be onto something!

It seems that Joseph (son of Lehi)’s remnant descendants would not have had “the words of the book” (verse 23) until after they came out of the dust and were translated in the last days, pointing to Joseph Smith as the "one mighty"… although it seems he was described in the D&C as "weak" more often than not. But then again (verses 19, 20), coming out of the dust would signify they would have the words of the book long after Mormon and Moroni had gone.

Considering that the remnant lived in the Americas, and Joseph Smith rose up among them (not from among them), verse 24 might be speaking of him since this prophet needn't be a Lehite.

But I like the thought that several servants of God were “no less serviceable” in bringing about this marvelous work and wonder.

And for all I know, you’re onto something!

[Bernard Gui]

11 hours ago, Atheist Mormon said:

Who is the One Mighty Among Them (2 Nephi 3:24)?

I could propose "Art Bulla", from the standpoint that He literally invested & dedicated his life to proclaim it....

Bzzzztttt. Thank you for playing. Art is mighty but not strong. Or is it the other way around? Either way, he cannot be the mighty "one."

Edited November 22, 2016 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

6 hours ago, Michael Sanders said:

Only one problem - the one who rises from among them must be after the one who brings forth the book.  Joseph is the choice seer who brought forth the book, and that work will ultimately cause some of the descendants of JosephL to "hearken unto" those works (i.e. the book [of Mormon]).  The one mighty will rise from among this group.  So it must be after the work of Joseph Smith is complete - thus it cannot be Mormon.  What evidence do you have that his abridgement caused any great conversions among the seed of JosephL?  That they even had access to it?  Knew of its contents?  The prophecy clearly says that they one mighty will arise after the coming forth of the book [of Mormon]?  What book do you think is being referenced here, since you already have agreed that Joseph is the choice seer?

Mike Sanders

Since it is a prophecy, it is fulfilled as the book is introduced to the Lehites (JosephL and his brethren). Here is the "one" in verses 22-24....the descendant of JosephL....

Quote

 

21 And now, behold, my son Joseph, after this manner did my father of old prophesy. 23 Wherefore, because of this covenant thou art blessed; for thy seed shall not be destroyed, for they shall hearken unto the words of the book. 24 And there shall rise up one mighty among them, who shall do much good, both in word and in deed, being an instrument in the hands of God, with exceeding faith, to work mighty wonders, and do that thing which is great in the sight of God, unto the bringing to pass much restoration unto the house of Israel, and unto the seed of thy brethren.

 

 

I'm not seeing where he must come after the book, but that his seed will "hearken to the book," which is the Book of Mormon. I don't see 23 and 24 being a chronological order, but perhaps you can see it that way. One could interpret "And" at the beginning of 24 as "then," or just as another part of the prophecy. Would you agree that it is not Joseph Smith? Is this one yet to come from among the Lehites?

 

Edited November 22, 2016 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

6 hours ago, bluebell said:

This is supposedly a SW Kimball quote that deals with the prophecy.  It's referenced in a GC talk (and parts quoted) that was given in the 1970s but i've only found the entire quote on a separate site that's not very pro-mormon so take it for what it's worth.  

“The Lamanites must rise in majesty and power.” (Conference Reports, Oct. 1947) “The Lamanites must rise in majesty and power. We must look forward to the day when they will be “white and delightsome” (2 Ne. 5:21; 2 Ne. 30:6), sharing the freedoms and blessings which we enjoy; when they shall have economic security, culture, refinement, and education; when they shall be operating farms and businesses and industries and shall be occupied in the professions and in teaching; when they shall be organized into wards and stakes of Zion, furnishing much of their own leadership; when they shall build and occupy and fill the temples, and serve in them as the natives are now serving in the Hawaiian Temple where I found last year the entire service conducted by them and done perfectly. And in the day when their prophet shall come, one shall rise. . . mighty among them . . . being an instrument in the hands of God, with exceeding faith, to work mighty wonders (2 Ne. 3:24).”

 

I mentioned Pres Kimball's interepretion in the OP. Thanks for posting it. Because I have a different interpretation, I didn't think it was necessary.

[Bernard Gui]

6 hours ago, bluebell said:

From what i've read, the 'one mighty and strong' prophecy is separate from the 'one mighty among them' prophecy.  I had them confused at first as well.

Indeed, there are two mighty ones. But only one is might and strong. I'm thinking Mormon probably was strong, though.

Edited November 22, 2016 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

6 hours ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Thanks. I read "one mighty and" and in my mind went directly to "strong".

An easy error to make. 

[Bernard Gui]

6 hours ago, CV75 said:

Cool--you might be onto something!

It seems that Joseph (son of Lehi)’s remnant descendants would not have had “the words of the book” (verse 23) until after they came out of the dust and were translated in the last days, pointing to Joseph Smith as the "one mighty"… although it seems he was described in the D&C as "weak" more often than not. But then again (verses 19, 20), coming out of the dust would signify they would have the words of the book long after Mormon and Moroni had gone.

 

Considering that the remnant lived in the Americas, and Joseph Smith rose up among them (not from among them), verse 24 might be speaking of him since this prophet needn't be a Lehite.

 

But I like the thought that several servants of God were “no less serviceable” in bringing about this marvelous work and wonder.

 

And for all I know, you’re onto something!

 

Well, I'm not staking my testimony and activity on it being right. It's something I noted a while back and decided to put it into writing and float it here to see if it can be sunk. I would be very happy if Mormon got his due as one of the great prophets of all time.

[CV75]

11 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Well, I'm not staking my testimony and activity on it being right. It's something I noted a while back and decided to put it into writing and float it here to see if it can be sunk. I would be very happy if Mormon got his due as one of the great prophets of all time.

At least he got a whole church nicknamed after him. Even better than "Moonies" in my opinion...

[Five Solas]

19 hours ago, bluebell said:

From what i've read, the 'one mighty and strong' prophecy is separate from the 'one mighty among them' prophecy.  I had them confused at first as well.

The Multiple Mighties Theory (MMT) holds that 2 Nephi 3:24 and D&C 85:7 refer to separate individuals, each one mighty and at least one strong.  I haven't seen much support around here for SMT.

;0)

--Erik

[JLHPROF]

20 hours ago, bluebell said:

From what i've read, the 'one mighty and strong' prophecy is separate from the 'one mighty among them' prophecy.  I had them confused at first as well.

They are separate.

But oddly enough they are both Joseph Smith.

[bluebell]

43 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

They are separate.

But oddly enough they are both Joseph Smith.

It seems like a lot of knowledgable people, who are close to the spirit, believe differently.  I personally have no opinion.

[CV75]

2 hours ago, Five Solas said:

The Multiple Mighties Theory (MMT) holds that 2 Nephi 3:24 and D&C 85:7 refer to separate individuals, each one mighty and at least one strong.  I haven't seen much support around here for SMT.

;0)

--Erik

I think it holds that 2 Nephi 3:24 and D&C 85:7 can refer to several individuals at the same time (including Joseph Smith, Mormon, and others). I don't see anyone specifically excluding them and saying their understanding is the only one!

[Vance]

On 11/21/2016 at 11:34 AM, Bernard Gui said:

I understand the references to Joseph Smith, but this promise was about a descendant of Joseph, son of Lehi. Noting the period at the end of verse 22 and the pivot to his son in verse 23, it looks to me that Lehi has ended his quotation of the prophesy of Joseph of Egypt, and then moves on to promise that another prophet will be raised from the descendants of Lehi's son Joseph to bless his seed; Joseph Smith was not a Lehite.

The punctuation and therefore sentences were put in by the printer.  The original text had no periods, comma, semi-colons, etc.

Verses 23 and 24 are quoting a prophesy of Joseph of old (Son of Jacob) and therefore do NOT of necessity refer to a descendant of Joseph, son of Lehi.