President Nelson: "Be careful who you follow"

[Scott Lloyd]

I didn't see tonight's Church-wide devotional for young single adults in which President Russell M. Nelson spoke. But my Twitter feed is exploding with short snippets from it. I hope to get the chance to read these in context in coming days (I know my colleague Marianne Holman Prescott will have written a report for the Deseret News and Church News).

Meanwhile, here are a couple of tweets I've received:

Quote

There are servants of Satan embedded throughout society, so be careful who you follow.

This, I think, is very important. It is particularly timely in the face of the recent chatter on one of my threads regarding whether or not Church leaders forbid us from reading content on the Internet. Notice the wording doesn't say to avoid reading, but it says "be careful who you follow." This is consistent with what Elder Ballard told the young single adults in the devotional I attended last Thursday and with the message President Uchtdorf gave in the last general conference. That is, become knowledgeable about Church History and doctrine so you can be forearmed as you encounter criticisms, but don't get swept up in rampant negativity about the Church, its doctrines or its leaders.

Another tweet:

Quote

A true millennial is a man or woman whom God trusted enough to send to earth during the most compelling dispensation.

This is remarkable when I think of some of what I've read on this board in the past few days, doomsday predictions about whether the "millennial generation" will be able to handle the onslaught of pervasive negative content about our faith. From this, I gather that President Nelson seems to be optimistic; so am I.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Scott Lloyd

[Scott Lloyd]

I just now noticed that smac97 started a thread that is getting a lot of traffic about President Nelson's talk, specifically about what he said regarding the handbook update having resulted from revelation. I'm now more eager than ever to read a verbatim transcript of the talk.

I think there is enough reason to allow this thread to stand, even as I note the existence of smac's thread. Perhaps my thread could be about things President Nelson said other than those that relate directly to his remarks about the handbook update resulting from revelation.

Edited January 11, 2016 by Scott Lloyd

[Hamba Tuhan]

44 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

This is remarkable when I think of some of what I've read on this board in the past few days, doomsday predictions about whether the "millennial generation" will be able to handle the onslaught of pervasive negative content about our faith. From this, I gather that President Nelson seems to be optimistic; so am I.

Almost exactly the thought I had. When I consider 'millennials' such as the missionaries that have served and are serving in our ward or the YSAs in our stake who just pulled off a five-day feast of spiritual goodness for about 250 other YSAs from outside of our territory, I'm beyond optimistic.

[The Nehor]

Yeah, I work a lot with the missionaries and have for the last decade and I can say that speaking generally this generation is better then mine was just like the generation of my parents said the same thing of mine. We are ready.

[Hamba Tuhan]

4 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Yeah, I work a lot with the missionaries and have for the last decade and I can say that speaking generally this generation is better then mine was just like the generation of my parents said the same thing of mine. We are ready.

That exactly mirrors my experiences too.

[halconero]

Honestly...and this is not pride or arrogance, but I feel as though the social, doctrinal, political, and historical pressures facing Latter-day Saint Youth (12-30ish) are forging a strong base for the Church for years to come. 

That base doesn't mean there won't be trials, doubts, worries, or torn loyalties. I would be lying if I said I didn't feel sympathy, and even agreement with many of the trends of the day. Yet...in the end the War in Heaven didn't have its results in honest doubt, worry, or sympathies, but in whether or not at the end of the day the sustaining hand could be raised in favour of the Father's Plan. 

So despite what I and many...possibly even the majority feel, I believe those hands will still be raised.

Edited January 11, 2016 by halconero

[Scott Lloyd]

38 minutes ago, halconero said:

Honestly...and this is not pride or arrogance, but I feel as though the social, doctrinal, political, and historical pressures facing Latter-day Saint Youth (12-30ish) are forging a strong base for the Church for years to come. 

That base doesn't mean there won't be trials, doubts, worries, or torn loyalties. I would be lying if I said I didn't feel sympathy, and even agreement with many of the trends of the day. Yet...in the end the War and Heaven didn't have its results in honest doubt, worry, or sympathies, but in whether or not at the end of the day the sustaining hand could be raised in favour of the Father's Plan. 

So despite what I and many...possibly even the majority feel, I believe those hands will still be raised.

Thanks, halconero. I hope and expect that this is indeed the case.

[Calm]

Just an FYI, the text to the devotional talks are both online now at

https://www.lds.org/broadcasts/archive/worldwide-devotionals/2016/01?lang=eng

[Ahab]

Great advice for all the YSA who heard it but the YSA who need to hear it the most are the ones who haven't heard it and don't even know who they should follow. 

YSA who are not members of the Church, mostly.  The ones we are still out there trying to help.

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

Great advice for all the YSA who heard it but the YSA who need to hear it the most are the ones who haven't heard it and don't even know who they should follow. 

YSA who are not members of the Church, mostly.  The ones we are still out there trying to help.

This is true but it is true of virtually every open church meeting. I am curious why you think it is specifically applicable to this one.

[Duncan]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

Great advice for all the YSA who heard it but the YSA who need to hear it the most are the ones who haven't heard it and don't even know who they should follow. 

YSA who are not members of the Church, mostly.  The ones we are still out there trying to help.

 

true, the ones who need it the most weren't the ones who were listening. Case in point, dear friend of mine came home after 2 years on a mission in May of last year, now he is totally inactive, into the drug/drinking/party scene, claims to be an atheist,lives with his girlfriend-well fiancee now- and he isn't the only one I know who came off a mission and walked out of the church within a short while. I hope they come back around sooner than later

[Ahab]

11 hours ago, The Nehor said:

This is true but it is true of virtually every open church meeting. I am curious why you think it is specifically applicable to this one.

Huh? Isn't it obvious to you that those who don't know who they should follow or who follow some people they shouldn't follow are the ones who need to hear that message the most?

Those who listened to that talk from President Nelson showed that they know who to follow by either virtually or physically following him to that meeting and hearing what he said. He is among those that they are already following. So him telling them to be careful about who they follow is what I would call preaching to the choir. Or a good bumper sticker message.

Still a good message though and yes they also need to be careful about who they follow but the ones who really need to hear that message probably didn't hear him or don't even know who he is.

 

[Scott Lloyd]

18 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Huh? Isn't it obvious to you that those who don't know who they should follow or who follow some people they shouldn't follow are the ones who need to hear that message the most?

Those who listened to that talk from President Nelson showed that they know who to follow by either virtually or physically following him to that meeting and hearing what he said. He is among those that they are already following. So him telling them to be careful about who they follow is what I would call preaching to the choir. Or a good bumper sticker message.

Still a good message though and yes they also need to be careful about who they follow but the ones who really need to hear that message probably didn't hear him or don't even know who he is.

 

As I observe people who have slipped into a spirit of fault finding and evil speaking of God's anointed, preliminary to full-scale apostasy in all too many cases, I understand the need for a warning such as this to a congregation such as this. 

When Alma asked, "Have ye spiritually been born of God?" it wasn't addressed to a group of non-believers or neophytes, or even to those who had strayed very far from the path of righteousness.

 

[salgare]

13 hours ago, Duncan said:

 

true, the ones who need it the most weren't the ones who were listening. Case in point, dear friend of mine came home after 2 years on a mission in May of last year, now he is totally inactive, into the drug/drinking/party scene, claims to be an atheist,lives with his girlfriend-well fiancee now- and he isn't the only one I know who came off a mission and walked out of the church within a short while. I hope they come back around sooner than later

The rumor mill has it that a fairly high percentage of return missionaries leave the Church within 5 years of return

[salgare]

"You can learn to hear the voice of the Lord through the whisperings of the Holy Ghost.⁸ As helpful as Google, Twitter, and Facebook may seem, they simply do not provide answers to your most important questions!"

Please explain where they are going to find the answers.  Is this going to be via the burning in the bosom and the still small voice?  The essays and/or our Prophets?  At Sunday meetings?

Please explain.

[provoman]

2 hours ago, Ahab said:

Are Huh? Isn't it obvious to you that those who don't know who they should follow or who follow some people they shouldn't follow are the ones who need to hear that message the most?

Those who listened to that talk from President Nelson showed that they know who to follow by either virtually or physically following him to that meeting and hearing what he said. He is among those that they are already following. So him telling them to be careful about who they follow is what I would call preaching to the choir. Or a good bumper sticker message.

Still a good message though and yes they also need to be careful about who they follow but the ones who really need to hear that message probably didn't hear him or don't even know who he is.

 

Are you suggesting that meer presence in at meeting is some sign of listening/follow?

[The Nehor]

3 hours ago, Ahab said:

Huh? Isn't it obvious to you that those who don't know who they should follow or who follow some people they shouldn't follow are the ones who need to hear that message the most?

Those who listened to that talk from President Nelson showed that they know who to follow by either virtually or physically following him to that meeting and hearing what he said. He is among those that they are already following. So him telling them to be careful about who they follow is what I would call preaching to the choir. Or a good bumper sticker message.

Still a good message though and yes they also need to be careful about who they follow but the ones who really need to hear that message probably didn't hear him or don't even know who he is.

 

I disagree. Many who went to the meeting may have gone because their friends had gone or their SO wanted to go or because they had nothing better to do or they are trying to follow both the world and the gospel, and tons of other scenarios. Showing up at a meeting is not proof you are following the apostles. It is not a bumper sticker message.

[Ahab]

3 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

As I observe people who have slipped into a spirit of fault finding and evil speaking of God's anointed, preliminary to full-scale apostasy in all too many cases, I understand the need for a warning such as this to a congregation such as this. 

When Alma asked, "Have ye spiritually been born of God?" it wasn't addressed to a group of non-believers or neophytes, or even to those who had strayed very far from the path of righteousness.

 

I agree that it is a message that is good for everybody to hear or be aware of, and seeing

"Be careful who you follow"

on anyone's bumper sticker would be a good thing to see.

All I meant was that it's too bad more people weren't there to hear his mesaage and that the people who needed to hear his message "the most" were the people who were not there or don't even know who he is.

But, yeah,  sure, it was a good message for those who heard it.

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, provoman said:

Are you suggesting that meer presence in at meeting is some sign of listening/follow?

Uh, yeah. Unless they were off in la-la land while he was giving his message they would have followed him while there and listening to his message.

The term "follow" now being used these days to refer to people listening to or seeing someone's messages like on Twitter or Facebook as well as sometimes actually being in the same physical location while paying attention.

Do you follow me or what I mean now?

 

[salgare]

 

"You are an elect son or daughter of God."

If I accused Mormonism as being elitist, would I not get an argument?  Is this really a good thing to indoctrinate the youth with?

 

[Kate]

I loved this talk and have listened to it a couple of times. I have 3 single young adult children and one of them went to the devotional. She was so impressed by the talk that she has convinced her siblings to take undistracted time out of their evening tonight to watch it as a family. 

Salgare, elect is often thought of as choice, special, etc...but I believe and have taught my children since the time they were young that the truest meaning of the word elect meant that in the preexistence they progressed far enough that they were selected and given greater responsibility to help their brothers and sisters find the Gospel here on earth. That they carry a great responsibility to help everyone return to Heavenly Father.  Why is it some people always look for ways to show that those who are trying to follow Christ are being elitist?

I especially loved the blessing he pronounced upon all the young adults:  

"Now, as an Apostle of the Lord Jesus Christ, I bless each one of you, as though I had my hands upon your heads, with the ability to become the True Millennial you were born to be. I bless you to have the desire and ability to learn your true identity and purpose, that you will expect and prepare to do “impossible” things, that you will be undaunted in your efforts to learn how to access the powers of heaven to help you solve your problems and answer your questions. And I bless you to follow the prophets with exactness, to feel peace in your heart as you do so. I bless you to know and feel how much the Lord loves you and how much confidence He has in you."

I see this as a huge reason this talk was important.  

[The Nehor]

1 hour ago, salgare said:

 

"You are an elect son or daughter of God."

If I accused Mormonism as being elitist, would I not get an argument?  Is this really a good thing to indoctrinate the youth with?

 

You would get no argument here. We are the elite.

However as with so many things the gospel turns elitism on its head and subverts the secular paradigm. Whoever is greatest will be the servant. Do not desire the high seats. And we are the salt of earth to save the whole world through Christ but if the salt loses its savour it must be cast out and destroyed. And we are told not to imagine that we are better and that all people are equal in the eyes of God. We are tools in his hand chosen because we are capable of doing a job. There is no room for pride in that work.

[readstoomuch]

8 hours ago, salgare said:

The rumor mill has it that a fairly high percentage of return missionaries leave the Church within 5 years of return

The only one I know of is my son and we usually have 5-7 missionaries out at any one time.  He came back the first part of 2011.  Otherwise, there have not been any others from my ward (as much as you can know).  There have been more of them coming back early with health problems.  I am mostly impressed with the missionaries we have had the last two years that I was a ward missionary.  Even one who was sent home I really loved .  His seemed to be a problem telling tall tales (outright lying at times).  The youth that I see leaving do seem to lose their faith in any type of deity.

[The Nehor]

8 hours ago, salgare said:

The rumor mill has it that a fairly high percentage of return missionaries leave the Church within 5 years of return

It is a disappointing percentage but what do you mean by "high"?

I can really only speak anecdotally and I have seen missionaries come home and fall away but that rate is nothing compared to those who did not serve who fall away in greater numbers. The 20s seem to be a turbulent time as it is the age at which we have the highest rate of falling away. Fortunately we also have the highest rate at that age of people returning.

[Glenn101]

1 hour ago, The Nehor said:

It is a disappointing percentage but what do you mean by "high"?

I can really only speak anecdotally and I have seen missionaries come home and fall away but that rate is nothing compared to those who did not serve who fall away in greater numbers. The 20s seem to be a turbulent time as it is the age at which we have the highest rate of falling away. Fortunately we also have the highest rate at that age of people returning.

Of the returned missionaries I have known personally, a couple have transgressed pretty heavily, but after an enforced hiatus are back into full fellowship. Most of the others are still active and some especially so. Salgare's comments were from "the rumor mill". Would need some hard numbers to give it any credence.

 

Glenn