Elder Nelson Set Apart Today As New President Of The 12

[Calm]

How many languages does President Nelson know?

Google is your friend:

 

Following his call to the Twelve, Elder Nelson's riveting biography reads much like the Acts of the Apostles, recounting as it does his remarkable labors and spiritual adventures in assisting to establish the Church of Jesus Christ in Finland, Norway, Denmark, Czechoslovakia, East Germany, Hungary, Yugoslavia, the former Soviet Union, Romania, Bulgaria, Turkey, Jordan, Africa, and Central and South America. During these missionary journeys, Elder Nelson—whose honed and disciplined memory seems almost photographic (on several occasions I watched him call each of the Western European mission presidents and their wives by their first names)—often addresses local Church members for a few minutes in their native language, including French (in which he is quite fluent), German, Danish, Mandarin Chinese, Czech, Portuguese, and Spanish.

 

http://magazine.byu.edu/?act=view&a=1412

 

That was in 2004, maybe he has added a few more to his list.

 

According to a comment here, he also speaks some Russian and she claims many of them fluently, but she does not give how she knows.

 

http://portugal.usbooks.press/1731531.Russell_M_Nelson.html

Edited July 17, 2015 by calmoriah

[Broker]

Where can this "proper order" be found in the Scriptures?  I've been looking all morning....

I would interpret this scripture as teaching the importance of order:

 

"8 Behold, mine house is a house of order, saith the Lord God, and not a house of confusion."

 

Also the many priesthood ordinances described in the Old Testament show the exacting detail that God expected in His Kingdom.

The principle is also clearly taught in priesthood ordinances outside, but especially inside the temple. Very exact or it has to be done over again.

 

What is most inspiring and motivational to me about Elder Nelson's life, is that he is such a clear example (from reading his biography) of the saying:

 

"Obedience brings success; exact obedience brings miracles." (Not sure who first came up with that phrase, but a lot of Church leaders have used it). I think that is what he is trying to teach us.

 

My favorite Elder Nelson talk was about prayer, when he wrote new words to "Our Mountain Home So Dear" and had the Choir sing as part of his talk. I think most Church members, including myself, never realized what a beautiful melody came from that hymn. Probably, because we never sang it. Looking forward to the next hymnal having updated words.

[Kenngo1969]

Interesting.

Thanks for that recollection.

On a related note, when I was stake Sunday School president, one of the ward Sunday School president's I advised is now my bishop.

This is, perhaps, off-topic, but your story reminded me of it.  I was called as Ward Sunday School Secretary to Brother V, a son.  Not too long after that, I was called as Stake Sunday School Secretary to Brother V., his dad.  I guess the elder Brother V. told the younger Brother V. that if he and his family wanted to maintain their invitation to the extended family dinners, the younger had to give me up so the elder could have me!

[sethpayne]

Scott -- you have got to stop making up stories, man.  Such lies and misrepresentation are unbecoming of one who enjoys lecturing others on what it means to be a Christian.

 

Do not call others liars or use their names without permission in sig lines.

 

 

 

Edited:  You know, I should repent.  Calling someone a liar is never right.  In this case it may be accurate, but it is still rude.  So I apologize to Scott for being rude.

 

I also forgive Scott for making up words and statements and then attributing them to me.  I don't like it.  I'm surprised Scott did it and won't retract or apologize.  But regardless, no hard feelings.  It's just a message board.  

Edited July 17, 2015 by sethpayne

[HappyJackWagon]

I've been fortunate enough to have a personal, private conversation with Elder Nelson where he was able to answer a couple of questions. During the conversation he discounted the need for miraculous revelation in the form of heavenly visitations in the modern church because the holy ghost is sufficient.

 

I applaud the choice of Pres. Nelson as the new quorum President and congratulate him on his new calling. I didn't see it coming. It was inspired.

[sethpayne]

I've been fortunate enough to have a personal, private conversation with Elder Nelson where he was able to answer a couple of questions. During the conversation he discounted the need for miraculous revelation in the form of heavenly visitations in the modern church because the holy ghost is sufficient.

 

I applaud the choice of Pres. Nelson as the new quorum President and congratulate him on his new calling. I didn't see it coming. It was inspired.

 

When I was a young man visiting SLC I was waiting out side the temple during a wedding.  Elder Nelson was coming out of the lobby and made a point to come up and say hello to the few of us who were there.  I always thought that was very kind and I think President Nelson will be a wonderful leader of the Quorum. His October 2002 GC address is one of my all-time favorites.

 

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/2002/10/blessed-are-the-peacemakers?lang=eng

 

Now, as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, what does the Lord expect of us? As a Church, we must “renounce war and proclaim peace.” 37 As individuals, we should “follow after the things which make for peace.” 38 We should be personal peacemakers. We should live peacefully—as couples, families, and neighbors. We should live by the Golden Rule.

 

 

This is certainly something I need to be reminded of more often than I'd like.

Edited July 17, 2015 by sethpayne

[Gray]

OK, but I don't know that you can respond in sethpayne's behalf with that. His view seems to be that the content of the Standard Works (or his individual take on the content) trumps anything that living Church leaders should say or do, individually or collectively.

 

Well, the standard of using the scriptures as a yardstick for true doctrine is a perfectly legitimate approach within orthodox Mormonism. It's not the only way to approach it (I'd say your approach is equally legitimate), but it's one that was endorsed by Harold B. Lee, among others:

 

"If you want to measure truth, measure it by the four standard Church works. … If it is not in the standard works, you may well assume that it is speculation. It is man’s own personal opinion, to put it another way; and if it contradicts what is in the scriptures, you may know by that same token that it is not true. This is the standard by which you measure all truth. But if you do not know the standards, you have no adequate measure of truth." - HBL

[jkwilliams]

I wonder how the titles thing got started. Early in the church, members pretty uniformly called Joseph Smith "Brother Joseph." By the end of his life, however, it was almost always "President Smith." I wonder if anyone would be offended if we referred to Brother Russell or Brother Thomas.

[Kenngo1969]

I wonder how the titles thing got started. Early in the church, members pretty uniformly called Joseph Smith "Brother Joseph." By the end of his life, however, it was almost always "President Smith." I wonder if anyone would be offended if we referred to Brother Russell or Brother Thomas.

He decloaks!

 

Nice to cyber-see you, "Brother John."    Within the Quorum itself, I wouldn't be surprised if the Brethren called each other by their first names.

[jkwilliams]

He decloaks!

 

Nice to cyber-see you, "Brother John."    Within the Quorum itself, I wouldn't be surprised if the Brethren called each other by their first names.

 

I'm pretty sure that's right. When I was at the All-Church Coordinating Council meeting back in 1993, I heard Pres. Monson say to Elder Maxwell, "Can I borrow your glasses, Neal?"

[Mystery Meat]

I'm pretty sure that's right. When I was at the All-Church Coordinating Council meeting back in 1993, I heard Pres. Monson say to Elder Maxwell, "Can I borrow your glasses, Neal?"

 

President Eyring is mostly referred to as "Hal" by his quorum peers.

[jkwilliams]

President Eyring is mostly referred to as "Hal" by his quorum peers.

 

I think Seth may be right in that the emphasis on title is a result of the development of hierarchy in the church. When there were few structures and positions, there weren't many titles. Makes me wonder if the respect is more for the person or for the title. Dunno.

[Duncan]

I think Seth may be right in that the emphasis on title is a result of the development of hierarchy in the church. When there were few structures and positions, there weren't many titles. Makes me wonder if the respect is more for the person or for the title. Dunno.

 

I think if someone knows these people personally they'd call them yeah by their first names or whatever but for someone like me I don't know any of them personally and I don't want to call an older man or woman by their first name so I guess it's just a sign of respect and you do that for an Apostle, or not an Apostle, LDS or Not.

[Scott Lloyd]

Well, the standard of using the scriptures as a yardstick for true doctrine is a perfectly legitimate approach within orthodox Mormonism. It's not the only way to approach it (I'd say your approach is equally legitimate), but it's one that was endorsed by Harold B. Lee, among others:

 

"If you want to measure truth, measure it by the four standard Church works. … If it is not in the standard works, you may well assume that it is speculation. It is man’s own personal opinion, to put it another way; and if it contradicts what is in the scriptures, you may know by that same token that it is not true. This is the standard by which you measure all truth. But if you do not know the standards, you have no adequate measure of truth." - HBL

I have no quarrel with this post.

[Scott Lloyd]

I've been fortunate enough to have a personal, private conversation with Elder Nelson where he was able to answer a couple of questions. During the conversation he discounted the need for miraculous revelation in the form of heavenly visitations in the modern church because the holy ghost is sufficient.

 

I applaud the choice of Pres. Nelson as the new quorum President and congratulate him on his new calling. I didn't see it coming. It was inspired.

For future reference, the president of the quorum will always be the most senior member. So it is possible to see it coming.

[Avatar4321]

I was a bit surprised by that comment. Who else was going to be The president

[Scott Lloyd]

I was a bit surprised by that comment. Who else was going to be The president

In fairness to Happy Jack Wagon, I should point out that it may have been less than obvious in this instance due to the unexpected illness and quick death of Elder Perry, who otherwise would have been quorum president now.

[KevinG]

This is a good chance to make a mental note of his proper title. A lot of people had trouble remembering or grasping that President Packer was properly addressed or referred to as "President," not "Elder."

 

We do have to choose one. "Quorum of the 12 President Elder Apostle Prophet Seer Revelator Nelson" is just too long for a business card.

Edited July 17, 2015 by KevinG

[HappyJackWagon]

For future reference, the president of the quorum will always be the most senior member. So it is possible to see it coming.

Yeah, I know

 

I was poking a little fun at the many FB friends who have been bending over backwards talking about how inspired the calling was. Who else was it going to be? There's not much need for new revelation if we follow a defined pattern.

[Mystery Meat]

Yeah, I know

 

I was poking a little fun at the many FB friends who have been bending over backwards talking about how inspired the calling was. Who else was it going to be? There's not much need for new revelation if we follow a divine pattern.

 

Fixed it for you 

Edited July 17, 2015 by Mystery Meat

[KevinG]

Yeah, I know

 

I was poking a little fun at the many FB friends who have been bending over backwards talking about how inspired the calling was. Who else was it going to be? There's not much need for new revelation if we follow a defined pattern.

 

I would love to see one of these non-doctrinal practices broken due to revelation some time just to see the freaking out over tradition.  But then that's probably why I don't expect to be in general authority at any time in my life.

[Scott Lloyd]

Yeah, I know

 

I was poking a little fun at the many FB friends who have been bending over backwards talking about how inspired the calling was. Who else was it going to be? There's not much need for new revelation if we follow a defined pattern.

The revelation is in the calling of the member to the Quorum of the Twelve in the first place under revelation from God, Who knows the end from the beginning. And I have no doubt the Brethren feel the confirming witness when the man is ultimately named as president.

Established patterns don't preclude revelation.

[cinepro]

The revelation is in the calling of the member to the Quorum of the Twelve in the first place under revelation from God, Who knows the end from the beginning. And I have no doubt the Brethren feel the confirming witness when the man is ultimately named as president.

Established patterns don't preclude revelation.

Established patterns don't indicate revelation either.

I think as Church members, it's easy to go overboard with our esteem for the "succession" process, and sometimes we think the guidelines were handed down from on high with clarity and finality.

I certainly thought so, until reading about the different events that took place around the successions of John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff and Lorenzo Snow. For example, this is what happened when Lorenzo Snow was made Prophet:

 

By March of 1900, with Presidents Snow and Cannon noticeably aging and with Franklin D. Richards, President of the Twelve, having passed away, the issues of dates of ordination and setting apart to the Quorum of the Twelve regained significance and needed settling. Joseph F. recorded:

 

Presidents Snow, Cannon and I had a confidential talk together, introduced by President Cannon, relative to the choosing of a President of the Twelve. President Snow said: “It is President Cannon’s right to stand at the head of the Twelve, but if he did he would have to resign his counselorship in the Presidency,” and plainly intimated that he could do so if he chose. He then said to President Cannon: “If you and I were not here it would be the right of Brother Joseph F. Smith to stand where I am now, and if I were not here, it would be yours right now.” President Cannon expressed his desire to possess and enjoy every right that belonged to him but suggested that matters go along for the present as they are and that the Presidency meet with the Twelve and take the lead.

 

(As yet there was no provision established for an Acting President of the Twelve.) Joseph F. further wrote of this discussion: “Brigham’s (Brigham Young Jr.) position in the quorum was talked over and President Snow favored and practically decided that Brigham Young—ranked next to [after] me in the council of Apostles. This decided the question, as it was decided by President John Taylor.”

 

Although the First Presidency had decided among themselves that date of entrance into the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles determined apostolic seniority, their decision still needed the unified acceptance of the Quorum of the Twelve—including Elder Young himself. This ratification took place shortly thereafter, on April 5.

 

https://rsc.byu.edu/archived/joseph-f-smith-reflections-man-and-his-times/joseph-f-smith-s-succession-presidency

The process as we know it today was worked out over many decades, and there was lots of discussion, some disagreements, and certainly some compromises. Obviously we can say that in all this there was "revelation", but it certainly wasn't in the form of the Lord laying it out in 1844.

Edited July 17, 2015 by cinepro

[cinepro]

And then there is this headline from the September 26, 1896 edition of the New York Times regarding George Q. Cannon's place in the quorum during Wilford Woodruff's presidency:

 

 

CANNON'S EXPECTED COUP; WILL HE SEIZE THE MORMON CHURCH PRESIDENCY? He Has Controlled Church Affairs Since Brigham Young's Death -- Power Now Threatened by the Succession of Apostle Richards -- Moses Thatcher's Humiliation Is Probably in Preparation for the Overturning of All Mormon Precedents -- Effect on Politics. http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=9507E2DF133BEE33A25754C2A96F9C94679ED7CF

Edited July 17, 2015 by cinepro

[jkwilliams]

Established patterns don't indicate revelation either.

I think as Church members, it's easy to go overboard with our esteem for the "succession" process, and sometimes we think the guidelines were handed down from on high with clarity and finality.

I certainly thought so, until reading about the different events that took place around the successions of John Taylor, Wilford Woodruff and Lorenzo Snow. For example, this is what happened when Lorenzo Snow was made Prophet:

 

The process as we know it today was worked out over many decades, and there was lots of discussion, some disagreements, and certainly some compromises. Obviously we can say that in all this there was "revelation", but it certainly wasn't in the form of the Lord laying it out in 1844.

 

Thanks for that. We humans like to sort of backfill history with current notions of how things are supposed to be. So, what was once kind of messy is now the established, divine order of things. It doesn't preclude inspiration, but it does defy easy generalizations.