grapevine Posted December 6, 2021 Posted December 6, 2021 Things he says are mostly political. Uncle Cleon wrote good books on Thousand year series but may have had out there ideas. Joel has many conspiracy thereos. There will be a war with Taiwan and China, Russia is just underground and Russia and China will attack us. World War three will start but we’re too busy fighting covid. wrote books on strategic location and survivalism. Used word Mormons in recent lecture. Need to walk t9 Zion. Conspiracy big time. People died with vaccine, Eisenhower killed man6 German pow,s. ideas of 911, Lockerbie bombing, Pearl Harbor Us either provoked those countries or didn’t do enough to stop them. Put things in wtc to cause the building to collapse and there are surviving terrorists. Okc bombing and waco cover ups too. YouTube deleted his lecture. we’re does he get all the information? Dallin H Oaks in speech about strength becoming weaknesses mentioned patriotism and people building up armies. 12th article of faith says to obey law. He said leaders were not inspired to tell people to take vaccine and some members persecuted for not getting vaccine. Won’t wear mask. Boyd K. Packer 1992 Oct mentioned people following the chicken lickens we know what’s going on 42:11 Doctrine and Covenants. Quentin L Cook beyond mark mentioned Oct 2016; and M Russell Ballard trek continues admonished people not to listen to those not called. I seen people fall away listening to self appointed leaders. What will happen when those wars he predicts don’t come to pass? He is a fear monger. In General Conference, Stale Conference, devotionals and other speeches how many times do,you hear fear mongering from those called and sent? Are to be prepared with savings and food storage, but that is for typical emergencies and disasters not some future event. and your not to share food storage and fuel you’ll go under if you do. Vaughan J Featherstone ten virgins explanation was spiritual what we can’t share not temporal. We get to share and not stand in judgement. who follows him and what does he know the brethren we know are called don’t? Russia and China I am sure will leave us alone for the most part. Be prepared but don’t go extreme like he’s advocating. 1
Calm Posted December 6, 2021 Posted December 6, 2021 1 hour ago, grapevine said: Uncle Cleon wrote good books on Thousand year series but may have had out there ideas. Easy to read and understand, but way too much speculation written as fact imo to call them good. I liked them as a young teen before I realized what he was doing. But lots were doing the same thing and still do. 3
Kenngo1969 Posted December 6, 2021 Posted December 6, 2021 Were you on your phone when you wrote the OP, grapevine? (Had to ask!) 3
Robert F. Smith Posted December 6, 2021 Posted December 6, 2021 The Southern Poverty Law Center, which deals with extremist groups, long ago listed Joel as head of a patriot and survivalist group based in Orem, Utah (SPLC Intelligence Report, Spring 2012, 57). See Joelskousen.com . Quote Joel Skousen is a world-renowned expert in home security and Constitutional law. Joel, who publishes a weekly comprehensive analysis of world affairs, is also the author of books on home security, law, and government. His latest two books, The Secure Home and Strategic Relocation--North American Guide to Safe Places, address the myriad economic, biological, and political threats that face families living in today's complex world. The books also serve as guides for families wishing to relocate to a more secure area and become self-sufficient. In addition, Joel is available to consult privately with individuals to design high security residences and retreats, or to develop contingency plans for emergency situations. Another doomsday cult. 2
strappinglad Posted December 6, 2021 Posted December 6, 2021 (edited) Is it true that he sells a line of merchandise made from tin foil? 🤑 Edited December 6, 2021 by strappinglad 1
Scott Lloyd Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 (edited) 14 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said: The Southern Poverty Law Center, which deals with extremist groups, long ago listed Joel as head of a patriot and survivalist group based in Orem, Utah (SPLC Intelligence Report, Spring 2012, 57). See Joelskousen.com . Another doomsday cult. I don’t know anything about this Skousen fellow, but the Southern Poverty Law Center has its own problems. Edited December 7, 2021 by Scott Lloyd 4
Hamba Tuhan Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: I don’t know anything about this Skousen fellow ... Having had a quick squizz at his website, I feel pretty certain he could have played Burt Gummer in the 1990 film Tremors ... Edited December 7, 2021 by Hamba Tuhan 2
Robert F. Smith Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 2 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said: I don’t know anything about this Skousen fellow, but the Southern Poverty Law Center has its own problems. Correct. However, they have had an obsessive-compulsive program to investigate and list right-wing terror groups for decades now, and their intel is pretty good. Before he fell on hard times, their leader successfully sued many such organizations and bankrupted many of them. In those days, Nazis and the KKK were his main targets, but he had plenty of time for anything similar. 1
grapevine Posted December 7, 2021 Author Posted December 7, 2021 He gave speech at High School auditorium then tells people not to go to Hospitals and stay out of schools with covid restrictions. So if you need life threatening surgery don’t go there?Last years lecture said his kids are better off for being home schooled despite missing out on some social aspects. And they will look you in the eye and have friends not just there age, whereas public school students don’t have those manners. stereotyping there. There are home school students with good and bad manners as well as public school students. I would say most kids even in public schools are for the most part good kids. Just his stereotypes. Gets a few people to follow him with some out thee ideas. 1
Scott Lloyd Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 10 hours ago, Hamba Tuhan said: Having had a quick squizz at his website, I feel pretty certain he could have played Burt Gummer in the 1990 film Tremors ... That may very well be. However, from what I’ve heard/read about the SPLC, their disapprobation does not comprise the strongest argument for denouncing him. Not for me, anyway.
Scott Lloyd Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said: Correct. However, they have had an obsessive-compulsive program to investigate and list right-wing terror groups for decades now, and their intel is pretty good. Before he fell on hard times, their leader successfully sued many such organizations and bankrupted many of them. In those days, Nazis and the KKK were his main targets, but he had plenty of time for anything similar. it’s about more than just the recent scandal involving their founder. I think in recent years, they have been guilty of overreach in that they have spewed their venom on conservative, family-advocacy sources whose only offense (if you want to call it that) has been to argue against some aspects of the gay-rights agenda. This has caused me to wonder whether and when their next target might be the Church of Jesus Christ for its doctrines on chastity and marriage. We’ve already seen the Human Rights Campaign going after at least one Church leader, an apostle. And in that regard, the SPLC has already gotten a bit too close for comfort, having attacked Cleon Skousen and Ezra Taft Benson, not over gay rights but over their conservative politics, a subject that scarcely bears any relationship to human rights and terrorism. Whatever your opinion of Cleon Skousen and the group he founded (I’m not a fan myself), they are hardly in the vein of neo-Nazis and the KKK. Again, overreach. But I don’t mean to turn this thread into a discussion about the SPLC. Edited December 7, 2021 by Scott Lloyd
Robert F. Smith Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Scott Lloyd said: it’s about more than just the recent scandal involving their founder. I think in recent years, they have been guilty of overreach in that they have spewed their venom on conservative, family-advocacy sources whose only offense (if you want to call it that) has been to argue against some aspects of the gay-rights agenda. This has caused me to wonder whether and when their next target might be the Church of Jesus Christ for its doctrines on chastity and marriage. We’ve already seen the Human Rights Campaign going after at least one Church leader, an apostle. And in that regard, the SPLC has already gotten a bit too close for comfort, having attacked Cleon Skousen and Ezra Taft Benson, not over gay rights but over their conservative politics, a subject that scarcely bears any relationship to human rights and terrorism. Whatever your opinion of Cleon Skousen and the group he founded (I’m not a fan myself), they are hardly in the vein of neo-Nazis and the KKK. Again, overreach. But I don’t mean to turn this thread into a discussion about the SPLC. Yes, and the SPLC has allowed corruption to seep into its ranks over the years, turning it into a monster of sorts. The same thing has happened to several other once promising and high-minded organizations, which shall remain nameless here.
MiserereNobis Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 On 12/5/2021 at 10:14 PM, grapevine said: Boyd K. Packer 1992 Oct mentioned people following the chicken lickens KFC? 1
mfbukowski Posted December 7, 2021 Posted December 7, 2021 On 12/5/2021 at 11:29 PM, Kenngo1969 said: Were you on your phone when you wrote the OP, grapevine? (Had to ask!) Yeah. ESL? Can't even make sense of a lot of it
The Nehor Posted December 8, 2021 Posted December 8, 2021 8 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said: Yes, and the SPLC has allowed corruption to seep into its ranks over the years, turning it into a monster of sorts. The same thing has happened to several other once promising and high-minded organizations, which shall remain nameless here. The NRA. I remember my grandpa talking about it mostly being a sport shooting organization that offered safety classes and set up shooting events back in the 60s and 70s. Then there was the Cincinnati leadership coup and it got weird fast. 2
The Nehor Posted December 8, 2021 Posted December 8, 2021 One of my mission companions was Cleon Skousen’s grandson. He kept the weirder parts of his beliefs out of his books. And yeah, they are weird. 2
JustAnAustralian Posted December 8, 2021 Posted December 8, 2021 Boy Joel certainly went in a different direction to his cousin Royal.
Scott Lloyd Posted December 9, 2021 Posted December 9, 2021 On 12/7/2021 at 2:03 PM, mfbukowski said: Yeah. ESL? Can't even make sense of a lot of it It’s like trying to read somebody’s classroom notes. 1
grapevine Posted December 10, 2021 Author Posted December 10, 2021 Joseph Smith said it is contrary to the order of Heaven for someone to receive revelation for someone higher than themselves. Also said that someone that finds fault with others saying they are righteous while the church is out of order is on the road to apostasy. We’re does Joel get revelation the prophet is wrong or not inspired do to the stewardship principle? Is he apostatizing himself? Boyd K Packer used the word sky is falling, chicken lickens, of fables encouraging members to gather to colonies or cults. Won’t go astray following leaders. HTTPS://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/General-conference/1992/10/to-be-learned-is-good-if if link does not work go to church website and Boyd K Packers oct 1992 conference speech. And our fifth article of faith says people must be called of God by those in authoarity. 1
Calm Posted December 10, 2021 Posted December 10, 2021 On 12/7/2021 at 2:03 PM, mfbukowski said: Yeah. ESL? Can't even make sense of a lot of it More like free writing.
Calm Posted December 10, 2021 Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) 21 minutes ago, grapevine said: chicken lickens I was thinking you had erred and meant Chicken Littles, but apparently it also has the alternative name of Chicken Licken. I knew of Henny Penny though. Wonder if I forgot Chicken Licken rather than never read it that way as a kid https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henny_Penny Funny how I heard or read it as “little” in the conference talk all these years. Such is bias. Edited December 10, 2021 by Calm 1
Hamba Tuhan Posted December 10, 2021 Posted December 10, 2021 37 minutes ago, grapevine said: We’re does Joel get revelation the prophet is wrong or not inspired do to the stewardship principle? Is he apostatizing himself? We were warned that the world would be filled with false prophets in these days. I just never quite pictured it this way ...
Scott Lloyd Posted December 10, 2021 Posted December 10, 2021 5 hours ago, Calm said: More like free writing. I had to look up “free writing,” but the definition I found seems to describe making an initial rough draft. So I guess grapevine is giving us his rough drafts without bothering to refine them.
Calm Posted December 10, 2021 Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said: I had to look up “free writing,” but the definition I found seems to describe making an initial rough draft. So I guess grapevine is giving us his rough drafts without bothering to refine them. I have brain fog tonight and can’t catch the phrase I wanted which means free writing, but isn’t that phrase. “Free writing” may be more precise…if I could just remember the phrase, blast it, I could tell if I found a better label, lol. When I get thinking in overdrive, my writing needs about three edits before it is understandable to anyone else, so I am thinking maybe grapevine just doesn’t like to proof his writing or has too hard a time to do it on a phone. Both of which I relate to. It is actually kind of fun to decipher his posts. Edited December 10, 2021 by Calm
Scott Lloyd Posted December 10, 2021 Posted December 10, 2021 49 minutes ago, Calm said: I have brain fog tonight and can’t catch the phrase I wanted which means free writing, but isn’t that phrase. “Free writing” may be more precise…if I could just remember the phrase, blast it, I could tell if I found a better label, lol. When I get thinking in overdrive, my writing needs about three edits before it is understandable to anyone else, so I am thinking maybe grapevine just doesn’t like to proof his writing or has too hard a time to do it on a phone. Both of which I relate to. It is actually kind of fun to decipher his posts. “Free writing” makes sense to me as a descriptive term. From Wikipedia: ”Free writing has traditionally been seen as a prewriting technique in academic environments, in which a person writes continuously for a set period of time without worrying about rhetorical concerns or conventions and mechanics, sometimes working from a specific prompt provided by a teacher.[1] While free writing often produces raw, or even unusable material, it can help writers overcome writing blocks and build confidence by allowing them to practice text-production phases of the writing process without fear of censure.[2][3] Some writers even use the technique to collect initial thoughts and ideas on a topic, often as a preliminary to formal writing.” I can see how it might be a workable technique for some writers. As for me, since I was introduced to word processors in college back in the late ‘70s, I’ve never felt a need for such a thing. I always do almost all of my editing on the fly — which, of course, was not feasible in the days of typewriters. And, of course, in journalism, it would never work to do multiple drafts. There simply isn’t time.
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