Stargazer Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 2 hours ago, MiserereNobis said: Does this website count as social media? If so, it looks like we'll be having a bachelor party here for a week and a half (yes, I'm home alone on a Saturday night, waiting for my lady to get home, so ya'll have to put up with the Catholic responding on every thread for a little while longer ) I'd guess that we love your commentary. Feel free to go on at length! 1
Stargazer Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 1 hour ago, sheilauk said: Do you think there will be female speakers in the Priesthood session in April? Probably not, but I wouldn't mind!
halconero Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 1 minute ago, bluebell said: Its weird to think that an emphasis on importance of parenthood would ever be controversial for church members. The reaction seems to be mixed. I think parenthood will become one of those “sifting” policies. ”[Joseph Smith] said the time would come when none but the women of the Latter-day Saints would be willing to bear children.” - Lillie T. Freeze 3
bluebell Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 Just now, halconero said: The reaction seems to be mixed. I think parenthood will become one of those “sifting” policies. ”[Joseph Smith] said the time would come when none but the women of the Latter-day Saints would be willing to bear children.” - Lillie T. Freeze Did he foresee a time when even Latter-day Saint women would bristle at an emphasis on parenthood? 3
halconero Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 16 minutes ago, bluebell said: Did he foresee a time when even Latter-day Saint women would bristle at an emphasis on parenthood? Possibly. I suspect that in the long-term continued bristling would result in them not being Latter-day Saints anymore.
Rain Posted October 7, 2018 Author Posted October 7, 2018 17 minutes ago, bluebell said: Its weird to think that an emphasis on importance of parenthood would ever be controversial for church members. For me it wasn't an emphasis on parenthood, or rather motherhood in this session, it was just that I felt it was such a strong emphasis that the other roles we have as women was so slight. 2
Avatar4321 Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, bluebell said: Why? I honestly have no idea. A lot of complaining about insensitivity to women and motherhood but I don't know what he said and they weren't heavy on specifics Edited October 7, 2018 by Avatar4321
Storm Rider Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 2 hours ago, sheilauk said: Do you think there will be female speakers in the Priesthood session in April? Do you see a problem with the Prophet and his Apostles speaking to women? Do you think women should only hear from women and there is no need for the prophet to speak to them? Hmm, when you see the world in only gender, you miss out on almost everything of value and worth.
Storm Rider Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 2 hours ago, MiserereNobis said: I'm a man, so take this is as you will. I'd find it odd if there were a Catholic meeting for women during which the Pope spoke and then Catholic women complained about it because he was a man and it was a women's meeting. He is, after all, the Pope, and I'd assume that Catholic women would want to hear from him. Am I missing something here on the LDS side of things? I really do enjoy your comments. I will leave off on my criticism of the weakness of the feminist approach to listening to prophets and apostles.
Duncan Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 I don't know what they want when they emphasize parenthood, like do they think couples haven't thought about it before? Feeling guilty about not having children isn't a good reason to have children. 4
bluebell Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Rain said: For me it wasn't an emphasis on parenthood, or rather motherhood in this session, it was just that I felt it was such a strong emphasis that the other roles we have as women was so slight. I can understand that. I didn’t feel the same slightness of other roles listening to the talks so that could account for our differing reactions. Or (thinking about it more), maybe it’s more accurate to say that I already feel that all other roles are slight when compared to parenthood. When I think of Heavenly Father and how He views His role as a parent compared to all His other roles, it makes sense to me that other roles would be slight in comparison. 2
halconero Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Duncan said: I don't know what they want when they emphasize parenthood, like do they think couples haven't thought about it before? Feeling guilty about not having children isn't a good reason to have children. I think it’s more directed to the younger members. That might just be me. I know plenty of faithful young couples putting of parenthood that if commanded would likely follow through.
Storm Rider Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 1 hour ago, bluebell said: No, I think it’s odd too. I would be upset if the prophet didn’t speak at the women’s session. Bluebell, I am getting the impression that there is no chance in pleasing people. One is damned if they do and then damned if they don't. Ya just have to walk away and leave them to their own world and occupy yourself with your own. So much for that zion concept of being of one mind and one spirit.
bsjkki Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 Just now, Storm Rider said: Do you see a problem with the Prophet and his Apostles speaking to women? Do you think women should only hear from women and there is no need for the prophet to speak to them? Hmm, when you see the world in only gender, you miss out on almost everything of value and worth. She didn't say that. Why put words in her mouth? I think it would be nice to hear from more women speakers. Does that mean I only see the world in gender? I think a women speaking at Priesthood session should not be out of the realm of possibility. Do you think women should be banned from ever speaking at Priesthood session? Whose voice is not being heard? Who is missing? 3
Duncan Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, halconero said: I think it’s more directed to the younger members. That might just be me. I know plenty of faithful young couples putting of parenthood that if commanded would likely follow through. I hope so! I don't want my parents in their 70's and 80's having another child!
halconero Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 2 minutes ago, Duncan said: I hope so! I don't want my parents in their 70's and 80's having another child! If Abraham and Sarah can......! 1
Calm Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 12 minutes ago, Storm Rider said: Do you see a problem with the Prophet and his Apostles speaking to women? Do you think women should only hear from women and there is no need for the prophet to speak to them? Hmm, when you see the world in only gender, you miss out on almost everything of value and worth. Even if there were only women speakers in the Women's Sessions, women would still be hearing many more men talk than women during conference. There has been no suggestion here by any woman that we aren't interested in hearing from men. It is so strange to see this claim that those who like hearing from their sisters are seeing the world only by gender when you act like those who would like to hear a few more talks by women don't want to listen to men at all. Your construction is putting it all into a binary men vs. women speakers, no one else is. 4
Storm Rider Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 4 minutes ago, bsjkki said: She didn't say that. Why put words in her mouth? I think it would be nice to hear from more women speakers. Does that mean I only see the world in gender? I think a women speaking at Priesthood session should not be out of the realm of possibility. Do you think women should be banned from ever speaking at Priesthood session? Whose voice is not being heard? Who is missing? What I am rejecting is the perspective that I will only evaluate a speaker based on their gender. I don't care if the prophet of God is a spotted green toad - I want to hear the toad speak. When we listen to the prophet we are not listening to a man - we are listening to the prophet. If someone's criticism is that not enough women spoke and the only individual that spoke happen to be the prophet and apostles - please tell me what is the problem with identifying the big elephant in the room. The prophet is reduced to his gender only and his role as God's messenger is ignored. That is not putting words in anyone's mouth. I don't have a dog in this race. I don't care if the prophet and apostles ever spoke to the women. Conversely, I don't care if they were the only ones that spoke. I would like women to just be happy - full stop. If they don't want any men to speak - great. Just announce that no men will ever speak again unless specifically invited by whoever is in charge of all the women. I don't care what needs to be done - I just want women to never feel the need to complain about it. 1
Popular Post Calm Posted October 7, 2018 Popular Post Posted October 7, 2018 (edited) These women are our leaders, appointed by the Prophet and the Apostles. What is wrong with hungering after their counsel? It is not about hearing random women off the street, imo. It is about hearing women called of God to teach us. Edited October 7, 2018 by Calm 6
Popular Post Rain Posted October 7, 2018 Author Popular Post Posted October 7, 2018 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Storm Rider said: Bluebell, I am getting the impression that there is no chance in pleasing people. One is damned if they do and then damned if they don't. Ya just have to walk away and leave them to their own world and occupy yourself with your own. So much for that zion concept of being of one mind and one spirit. I asked for people to be nurturing on this thread to those who struggled. If you are not going to be, please start your own thread. Edited October 7, 2018 by Rain 6
Popular Post bsjkki Posted October 7, 2018 Popular Post Posted October 7, 2018 (edited) 12 hours ago, Storm Rider said: What I am rejecting is the perspective that I will only evaluate a speaker based on their gender. No one is doing that. 12 hours ago, Storm Rider said: I would like women to just be happy Then don't take their comments and twist them into something that was never said. Edited October 7, 2018 by bsjkki 5
Calm Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 2 minutes ago, bsjkki said: Then don't take their comments and twist them into something that was never said. Amen. 2
carbon dioxide Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 26 minutes ago, Rain said: For me it wasn't an emphasis on parenthood, or rather motherhood in this session, it was just that I felt it was such a strong emphasis that the other roles we have as women was so slight. The highest role is that if father and motherhood. We refer to Heavenly Father and Heavenly Mother by those roles. Our heavenly parents may have other roles but nothing stand ahead of that role which is why we use those titles to refer to them. Whether a woman has children or not, at Pres Nelson said all women are called mothers as that is their eternal destiny if faithful.
Rain Posted October 7, 2018 Author Posted October 7, 2018 19 minutes ago, bluebell said: I can understand that. I didn’t feel the same slightness of other roles listening to the talks so that could account for our differing reactions. Or (thinking about it more), maybe it’s more accurate to say that I already feel that all other roles are slight when compared to parenthood. When I think of Heavenly Father and how He views His role as a parent compared to all His other roles, it makes sense to me that other roles would be slight in comparison. I wonder if some of it is also where we are in life right now. You still have young children. I'm soon to be an empty nester. 2
bluebell Posted October 7, 2018 Posted October 7, 2018 38 minutes ago, Avatar4321 said: I honestly have no idea. A lot of complaining about insensitivity to women and motherhood but I don't know what he said and they weren't heavy on specifics Do the men struggle with the priesthood session like this? Sincere question, I’m not trying to be judgmental or sarcastic.
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