Elder Holland Declares Earth's Existsnce is 6,000 Years

[Johnnie Cake]

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years I should have just stuck with 6,000

Poster has not supplied a reference for this claim. Thread closed.

[JLHPROF]

Glad to see someone understands that God knows better than man how old his creation is.

[JAHS]

23 minutes ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland emphatically stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years 

Sorry I don't believe it. No recent church prophet has been "emphatic" on this subject. Most accept the scientific evidence. Are you sure he didn't say that the earth is 6000 years old "in it's present temporal state? That I would believe.

 

[Duncan]

video or it didn't happen

[Sky]

Somebody should let the BYU Biology Department know this.

 

 

[TheSkepticChristian]

1 hour ago, JAHS said:

Most accept the scientific evidence. 

Not our next Prophet! 

"Yet some people erroneously think that these marvelous physical attributes happened by chance or resulted from a big bang somewhere. Ask yourself, “Could an explosion in a printing shop produce a dictionary?" - Elder Nelson

"But to think that man evolved from one species to another is, to me, incomprehensible.... Man has always been man. Dogs have always been dogs. Monkeys have always been monkeys. It’s just the way genetics works" - Elder Nelson 

"arguments swirl around that the earth is dangerously overpopulated and that couples should restrict the number of their children...if each man, woman, and child now living upon the earth were allotted a quarter of an acre of land, all 6.8 billion people would fit in the country of Brazil, with 20 percent of Brazil still left unoccupied. Does that sound like the earth is overcrowded? I checked that calculation. It is correct. I adjure you to believe the Lord, who said that “the earth is full, and there is enough and to spare.” Elder Nelson

Seriously, what is next? that Global Warming is not real because God controls the climate? 

 

Edited August 7, 2016 by TheSkepticChristian

[Storm Rider]

Hearsay is so much more vital to learning truth than actual reality or facts.  I am with Johnnie Cake, if I heard it from the National Enquirer or any other high quality publication or website then it must be the God's honest truth.  The rest of you ignorant, silly people may still go on in your fantasy world, but I prefer to live in the true world of honest talk from hearsay and rumor.  

I also heard that Joseph and Brigham had forked tails - if I heard once then it has to be true.  

I also heard that if you hit yourself up side the head as hard as you can with a hammer then you will see a vision of all kinds of wonderful things.  I have as many hammers as you want if you will try it and then come back and tell the group what you saw.  

Edited August 7, 2016 by Storm Rider

[Garden Girl]

I don't believe he said it either... 

GG

[Glenn101]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland emphatically stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years 

CFR

 

[JAHS]

24 minutes ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

Not our next Prophet! 

"Yet some people erroneously think that these marvelous physical attributes happened by chance or resulted from a big bang somewhere. Ask yourself, “Could an explosion in a printing shop produce a dictionary?" - Elder Nelson

"But to think that man evolved from one species to another is, to me, incomprehensible.... Man has always been man. Dogs have always been dogs. Monkeys have always been monkeys. It’s just the way genetics works" - Elder Nelson 

"arguments swirl around that the earth is dangerously overpopulated and that couples should restrict the number of their children...if each man, woman, and child now living upon the earth were allotted a quarter of an acre of land, all 6.8 billion people would fit in the country of Brazil, with 20 percent of Brazil still left unoccupied. Does that sound like the earth is overcrowded? I checked that calculation. It is correct. I adjure you to believe the Lord, who said that “the earth is full, and there is enough and to spare.” Elder Nelson

Seriously, what is next? that Global Warming is not real because God controls the climate? 

 

Has Elder Nelson ever said the the earth is only 6000 years old?   I don't think so.

"The physical Creation itself was staged through ordered periods of time. In Genesis and Moses, those periods are called days. But in the book of Abraham, each period is referred to as a time. Whether termed a day, a time, or an age, each phase was a period between two identifiable events—a division of eternity." (The Creation, Russell M. Nelson Ensign April 2000)

Edited August 7, 2016 by JAHS

[ERMD]

I see no reason to respond to the thread, even though I just did.

 

[Bobbieaware]

2 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland emphatically stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years 

Why no quote? It would mess up your attempt at provocation?

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland emphatically stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years 

I think he means from Adam until now...the age of the earth is billions, Universe about 13 billion or more. 

[Johnnie Cake]

I did not personally hear Elder Holland make this statement but I did go back and  ask the witness. This is what he said:. Yes, he referred specifically to the six thousand years the earth has existed.

It's hearsay...accept or reject don't really care. Just thought some would like to know

[TheSkepticChristian]

1 hour ago, JAHS said:

Has Elder Nelson ever said the the earth is only 6000 years old?   I don't think so.

You said, "Most accept the scientific evidence."

I said, "Not out next prophet"

 I think it is worst to reject Evolution than an Old Earth 

[Johnnie Cake]

1 hour ago, Bobbieaware said:

Why no quote? It would mess up your attempt at provocation?

 

It's provocative to share this information? Ummm ok but remember, it wasn't me who made the statement, it was Elder Holland

Edited August 7, 2016 by Johnnie Cake

[JAHS]

12 minutes ago, TheSkepticChristian said:

You said, "Most accept the scientific evidence."

I said, "Not out next prophet"

 I think it is worst to reject Evolution than an Old Earth 

But the subject of the OP was about the age of the earth. I agree with Elder Nelson. I have been a scientist for 40 years and the more I study it the more convinced I am that there has to be a higher intelligence who brought about life as we have it today. However, I don't claim I know exactly how it was done.

 

[Robert F. Smith]

4 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland emphatically stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years 

I notice that, as usual, his actual words are not quoted, and you don't even bother to say which stake and whether you yourself were present.  Is that what we are reduced to here:  rumormongering?  That really takes the cake, Johnnie.  

[mfbukowski]

Quote

 

Elder Jeffery R. Holland notes that there was no human death on the earth prior to the Fall of Adam

Elder Jeffery R. Holland, at the April 2015 General Conference, stated,

[T]here was an actual Adam and Eve who fell from an actual Eden, with all the consequences that fall carried with it.

I do not know the details of what happened on this planet before that, but I do know these two were created under the divine hand of God, that for a time they lived alone in a paradisiacal setting where there was neither human death nor future family, and that through a sequence of choices they transgressed a commandment of God which required that they leave their garden setting but which allowed them to have children before facing physical death. [3]

 

http://en.fairmormon.org/Mormonism_and_science/Death_before_the_Fall

Whatever he said it has to be more nuanced than the quote implies.  Note bold- I added that to the quote

Adam and Eve, the story goes, caused the "Fall" and here Elder H says he does not "know the details of what happened before that"

Dating that event to exactly 6 thousand, not 7 thousand, not 5 thousand or 5 billion years certainly implies knowing "details of what happened before that"- namely the passage of the correct number of years

What he said here is compatible with the idea that perhaps "Adam" was the first of a particular tribe or family.  Note that no dates are mentioned here- from this quote "Adam" could have existed thousands or even millions of years ago.

Even the phrase "the existence of the earth" is a human concept- science does not define "existence".

How could the concept of "existence" itself exist before there was a person to give such an idea a name?  How could there be a concept of "earth" as the planet on which we live before it was possible to think that way due to linguistic development?

When life consists of living in a straw and mud hut hiding out from wolves and trying to eat one yourself, it is hard to imagine anyone worrying about "existence" of the "planet" called "earth"

I am certain that the person quoted is either lying or at least totally misunderstood the point, taking something out of context 

Edited August 7, 2016 by mfbukowski

[Atheist Mormon]

5 hours ago, JLHPROF said:

Glad to see someone understands that God knows better than man how old his creation is.

Yea, couldn't agree more with that.....Galileo made the same mistake and that blessed Cardinal put him in his place......

[Stargazer]

This sounds like someone misreporting what was actually said.  Putting quotes around it (  "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years." ) claims that those were the exact words he used.

But let me take it at face value for a moment.  Elder Nelson surely understands what the age of the earth is.  But how old is the earth for purposes of man's present existence?  6,000 years, assuming Archbishop Ussher's estimate holds any water at all.  If Elder Nelson actually said that, then this is how I understand him.

It's a pointless exercise making hay out of it, however.

[Bobbieaware]

13 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years I should have just stuck with 6,000

Whatever the actual nuances and details concerning the creation of the earth actually turn out to be, it's obvious the general authorities are taking their cue from the scriptures:

 6 Q. What are we to understand by the book which John saw, which was sealed on the back with seven seals?A. We are to understand that it contains the revealed will, mysteries, and the work of God; the hidden things of his economy concerning this earth during the seven thousand years of its continuance, or its temporal existence. (D&C 77)

So what if it turns out the most important period of the earth's history (the part that most pertains to our salvation) turns out to be the 7,000 year period that began with the earthly sojourn of the patriarch Adam and ends with the creation of the new celestialized earth? The scriptures testify there was a first man who is the progenitor of the human race, who, under Christ, holds all the priesthood keys of our salvation.

When it comes to our salvation, whatever happened prior to Adam's earthly ministry might be interesting to think about, but precisely how all earthly things came to be is of secondary importance to the seven thousand year period of Gospel dispensations spoken of in the scriptures. Excessively troubling oneself with the things that exist outside of that seven thousand year period is part and parcel of that spiritually debilitating hobby the apostle Paul calls "looking beyond the mark." And just look at the fruits of those who insist on looking beyond the mark: lost faith, lost testimonies, inactivity, forsaken covenants, constant nitpicking about and quarreling with the inspired teachings of the apostles and prophets, atheism and hopelessness.

 

 

 

 

Edited August 7, 2016 by Bobbieaware

[smac97]

15 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

CFR.

Thanks,

-Smac

Edited August 7, 2016 by smac97

[Gray]

15 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

At a recent Stake Conference, Elder Holland stated that the "Earth's Existence is 6,000 years."

i feel like a fool now for ever letting science deceive me into changing my belief from 6,000 to 4.5 billion years I should have just stuck with 6,000

Isn't a little irresponsible to quote an anonymous stranger's second-hand account from an internet forum as if it definitely happened?

[Robert F. Smith]

2 hours ago, Bobbieaware said:

Whatever the actual nuances and details concerning the creation of the earth actually turn out to be, it's obvious the general authorities are taking their cue from the scriptures:

 6 Q. What are we to understand by the book which John saw, which was sealed on the back with seven seals?A. We are to understand that it contains the revealed will, mysteries, and the work of God; the hidden things of his economy concerning this earth during the seven thousand years of its continuance, or its temporal existence. (D&C 77)

So what if it turns out the most important period of the earth's history (the part that most pertains to our salvation) turns out to be the 7,000 year period that began with the earthly sojourn of the patriarch Adam and ends with the creation of the new celestialized earth? The scriptures testify there was a first man who is the progenitor of the human race, who, under Christ, holds all the priesthood keys of our salvation.

When it comes to our salvation, whatever happened prior to Adam's earthly ministry might be interesting to think about, but precisely how all earthly things came to be is of secondary importance to the seven thousand year period of Gospel dispensations spoken of in the scriptures. Excessively troubling oneself with the things that exist outside of that seven thousand year period is part and parcel of that spiritually debilitating hobby the apostle Paul calls "looking beyond the mark." And just look at the fruits of those who insist on looking beyond the mark: lost faith, lost testimonies, inactivity, forsaken covenants, constant nitpicking about and quarreling with the inspired teachings of the apostles and prophets, atheism and hopelessness.

"I would like to know just what it is that a man must be required to believe to be a member of this Church. Or, what it is that he is not permitted to believe, and remain a member of this Church. I would like to know just what that is. Is it evolution? I hope not, because I believe in evolution." (David O. McKay, David O. McKay and the Rise of Modern Mormonism, p. 46)