Are Only Mormon Families Important?

[JAHS]

Sorry that I bring up something that was posted in the Tribune but the letter writer brings up an interesting point. In it the Rev. Dr. John E. Day says:

 

"Well-meaning friends who are members of the LDS Church tried to convert me. When I was a child and a young adult, they tried to convert me away from my church and my family's church with no thought of what it would do to our family.

 From the time she (his daughter) was 8 years old, her friends and their families tried to convert her away from her church and her family's church with no thought to what it would do to our family. Mormon friends told her their father was an "agent of Satan." I suppose now her friends are glad they did not convert her, for now she would no longer be welcome (daughter is in a gay marriage now).

The LDS Church is known for strong family values, yet it had no problem trying to split my family apart. "

 

http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/3191391-155/letter-are-only-mormon-families-important

 

I know what Jesus said about hating father and mother (Luke 14: 26) to follow him. But how can we say we support the family unit when we share the gospel with our friends, hoping they will leave the religion of their parents, thus causing contention within their family?

 

 

Edited to add: This NOT about the new church policy.

Edited November 20, 2015 by JAHS

[DJBrown]

Non-LDS families are just as important as LDS families.  It is no different than asking if non-LDS people are less important than LDS people.  There are no boundaries or lines between us in God's eyes- I believe.  

 

Edit- I make this statement about heterosexual marriages.  I do not believe God recognizes same-sex marriages and sees them as a very evil thing.

Edited November 19, 2015 by DJBrown

[Storm Rider]

I will follow the counsel and direction of the Brethren, but I do not do so blindly.  I remain convinced that there is a conflict created by the policy, which is unnecessary.  

 

Faith leads me to believe that given time God corrects and makes things work out for the best of the each soul, each of his children.  

 

God uses imperfect, very human individuals that are willing to accept his call and follow after him.  If I want to have an abundance of his mercy show toward me then let me show mercy and patience with all others.  

[Steve-o]

 

Sorry that I bring up something that was posted in the Tribune but the letter writer brings up an interesting point. In it the Rev. Dr. John E. Day says:

 

"Well-meaning friends who are members of the LDS Church tried to convert me. When I was a child and a young adult, they tried to convert me away from my church and my family's church with no thought of what it would do to our family.

 From the time she (his daughter) was 8 years old, her friends and their families tried to convert her away from her church and her family's church with no thought to what it would do to our family. Mormon friends told her their father was an "agent of Satan." I suppose now her friends are glad they did not convert her, for now she would no longer be welcome (daughter is in a gay marriage now).

The LDS Church is known for strong family values, yet it had no problem trying to split my family apart. "

 

http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/3191391-155/letter-are-only-mormon-families-important

 

I know what Jesus said about hating father and mother (Luke 14: 26) to follow him. But how can we say we support the family unit when we share the gospel with our friends, hoping they will leave the religion of their parents, thus causing contention within their family?

 

Are you suggesting that we should require all converts to be at least 18 years old so we don't contribute to a child's cognitive dissonance in believing differently than their family?

 

I don't think I'd go for that, but at least it would be consistent.

[bluebell]

 

 

I know what Jesus said about hating father and mother (Luke 14: 26) to follow him. But how can we say we support the family unit when we share the gospel with our friends, hoping they will leave the religion of their parents, thus causing contention within their family?

 

 

I think the key lies in the words of Christ that you alluded to but seemed to imply weren't really relevant.  Family is important, but it is not more important than following God (whatever a person feels following God entails).  Christ teaches us that.

 

And ultimately this is a decision for adults to wrestle with, not children.

[JAHS]

I think the key lies in the words of Christ that you alluded to but seemed to imply weren't really relevant.  Family is important, but it is not more important than following God (whatever a person feels following God entails).  Christ teaches us that.

 

And ultimately this is a decision for adults to wrestle with, not children.

 

I am wondering what we tell families that are torn apart by their kids joining the church or by our attempts to encourage them to join? Their family also believes they are following God within their religion. 

[Duncan]

I am wondering what we tell families that are torn apart by their kids joining the church or by our attempts to encourage them to join? Their family also believes they are following God within their religion. 

 

That has been going on since this all began. I think now at least if a kid wants to get baptized the folks have to sign something, if not then "but for a small moment" comes to mind

[Robert F. Smith]

 

Sorry that I bring up something that was posted in the Tribune but the letter writer brings up an interesting point. In it the Rev. Dr. John E. Day says:

 

"Well-meaning friends who are members of the LDS Church tried to convert me. When I was a child and a young adult, they tried to convert me away from my church and my family's church with no thought of what it would do to our family.

 From the time she (his daughter) was 8 years old, her friends and their families tried to convert her away from her church and her family's church with no thought to what it would do to our family. Mormon friends told her their father was an "agent of Satan." I suppose now her friends are glad they did not convert her, for now she would no longer be welcome (daughter is in a gay marriage now).

The LDS Church is known for strong family values, yet it had no problem trying to split my family apart. "

 

http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/3191391-155/letter-are-only-mormon-families-important

 

I know what Jesus said about hating father and mother (Luke 14: 26) to follow him. But how can we say we support the family unit when we share the gospel with our friends, hoping they will leave the religion of their parents, thus causing contention within their family?

 

All of what you say applies equally well to Evangelical and other religions' efforts to convert Mormons (young and old) away from the "Satanic cult" of which they are a part, without consideration for what that might do their families.  Jews are particularly upset with efforts by Christians to convert them away from the religion of their fathers -- a second Holocaust in their view, since assimilation threatens the very existence of Judaism and the Jewish people.

 

Western civilization affords us all a great deal of freedom in such matters, and we must take the problems which that freedom engenders in stride.

[bluebell]

I am wondering what we tell families that are torn apart by their kids joining the church or by our attempts to encourage them to join? Their family also believes they are following God within their religion. 

 

When adults are concerned, i really don't understand how a family CAN be torn a part just because the parents and children no longer agree on God's will for them.  If my kids grew up and left the church for another church that they felt was God's church, it would be very difficult, but it would not end my family.  It would take some real adjustment but mature and loving adults should be able to accomplish that.

 

Sometimes we just need to all grow up a little and learn how to still have love and harmony in a family that has different belief systems.

[Steve-o]

When adults are concerned, i really don't understand how a family CAN be torn a part just because the parents and children no longer agree on God's will for them.  If my kids grew up and left the church for another church that they felt was God's church, it would be very difficult, but it would not end my family.  It would take some real adjustment but mature and loving adults should be able to accomplish that.

 

Sometimes we just need to all grow up a little and learn how to still have love and harmony in a family that has different belief systems.

That is the hope but not always the realization.

[JAHS]

One of the differences between our church and most other religions is that we have active proselyting efforts with our missionaries and our edict from leaders that every member be a missionary. I am sure this must increase the fear that parents and leaders of other faiths have that we might be taking their children away from them.   I wonder if in our enthusiastic efforts to find people, we need to be more careful, that parents are aware of and approve of their kid's association with the LDS church. When LDS kids invite their friends to a church meeting or activity we make sure that the parents approve it.

[ERMD]

Minors cannot be baptized without parents' consent.  You didn't know that?

[Storm Rider]

One of the differences between our church and most other religions is that we have active proselyting efforts with our missionaries and our edict from leaders that every member be a missionary. I am sure this must increase the fear that parents and leaders of other faiths have that we might be taking their children away from them.   I wonder if in our enthusiastic efforts to find people, we need to be more careful, that parents are aware of and approve of their kid's association with the LDS church. When LDS kids invite their friends to a church meeting or activity we make sure that the parents approve it.

 

You are creating a boogeyman where none exist.  As ERMD stated, minors must have the permission of their guardians/parents before they are able to be baptized.  It might be more accurate to state that some may fear that their teenagers will be exposed to LDS teachings and become converted and then profess a DESIRE to be baptized.  That is all that can happen without their support and approval. 

Edited November 19, 2015 by Storm Rider

[JAHS]

Minors cannot be baptized without parents' consent.  You didn't know that?

Of course I know that, I am talking about efforts to try to convert kids before baptism when their parents might not approve of such efforts.

[JAHS]

You are creating a boogey men where none exist.  As ERMD stated, minors must have the permission of their guardians/parents before they are able to be baptized.  It might be more accurate to state that some may fear that their teenagers will be exposed to LDS teachings and become converted and then profess a DESIRE to be baptized.  That is all that can happen without their support and approval. 

I said nothing about them getting baptized. I meant what you just said. 

[bluebell]

That is the hope but not always the realization.

 

Very true.

 

When it's not the realization though, i don't think we can blame any church (unless the belief system is actively teaching such).   It's the adults who fail in those situations.

[bluebell]

One of the differences between our church and most other religions is that we have active proselyting efforts with our missionaries and our edict from leaders that every member be a missionary. I am sure this must increase the fear that parents and leaders of other faiths have that we might be taking their children away from them.   I wonder if in our enthusiastic efforts to find people, we need to be more careful, that parents are aware of and approve of their kid's association with the LDS church. When LDS kids invite their friends to a church meeting or activity we make sure that the parents approve it.

 

I think most people assume that if the parents don't approve, they won't let the kids go to the activity.  That's how it always worked when i was growing up.

[JAHS]

I think most people assume that if the parents don't approve, they won't let the kids go to the activity.  That's how it always worked when i was growing up.

Some kids can get involved without letting their parents know.  Is the Reverend's complaint in the article not valid? 

[Scott Lloyd]

I said nothing about them getting baptized. I meant what you just said. 

When I was on my mission, we were forbidden to teach minor children without the express consent of their parents.

 

I'm fairly certain that policy is in place Church-wide.

[Scott Lloyd]

Some kids can get involved without letting their parents know.  Is the Reverend's complaint in the article not valid? 

I would need to know more about it and explore other sides to the story if possible before forming a value judgment.

 

Does talking about what you did last night for a Mutual activity constitute trying to convert someone away from his/her faith? Is the reverend advocating walking on eggshells to the point that we don't dare mention our religious faith in a secular setting? I, for one, would find that intolerable.

[JAHS]

When I was on my mission, we were forbidden to teach minor children without the express consent of their parents.

 

I'm fairly certain that policy is in place Church-wide.

Yes. I am mostly talking about non-full time missionary efforts by the members.

[bluebell]

Is the Reverend's complaint in the article not valid? 

 

I really don't know. 

 

Would he feel the same way if it was a Muslim, Hindi, pagan, or Jewish father talking about members of the Reverend's church trying to interest his kids in Jesus Christ?  Or would the Reverend feel that a little disharmony in a family is an ok price to pay for helping the kids gain a testimony that will have eternal significance in their lives?

 

I don't know how the Reverend would answer those questions, but his answers directly impact whether or not his personal complaint is valid.

[KevinG]

Being a convert from Protestantism to Mormonism my experience is that the evangelicals and Non-Denominational were calling me an agent of Satan, not the other way around.  Yet I managed not to stereotype and generalize the zealots who said my family was going to hell, and apply that hatred to all Protestants and Non-Denominational Christians.

 

If this was said by a Mormon it was wrong.  It is certainly not indicative of what we teach and how we teach it.  Even those who parody us find it hard to get around the fact that we are so nice.  (South Park).

[Scott Lloyd]

Being a convert from Protestantism to Mormonism my experience is that the evangelicals and Non-Denominational were calling me an agent of Satan, not the other way around.  Yet I managed not to stereotype and generalize the zealots who said my family was going to hell, and apply that hatred to all Protestants and Non-Denominational Christians.

 

If this was said by a Mormon it was wrong.  It is certainly not indicative of what we teach and how we teach it.  Even those who parody us find it hard to get around the fact that we are so nice.  (South Park).

And the Book of Mormon musical on Broadway.

 

Maybe that's what bothers them. We're too nice. Or in the words of someone here the other day, we "love bomb" everyone.

[JAHS]

Being a convert from Protestantism to Mormonism my experience is that the evangelicals and Non-Denominational were calling me an agent of Satan, not the other way around.  Yet I managed not to stereotype and generalize the zealots who said my family was going to hell, and apply that hatred to all Protestants and Non-Denominational Christians.

 

If this was said by a Mormon it was wrong.  It is certainly not indicative of what we teach and how we teach it.  Even those who parody us find it hard to get around the fact that we are so nice.  (South Park).

 

Where LDS kids are in the majority they can sometimes be a little insensitive and cruel to their non-LDS friends. My own wife was a convert at 19. She grew up in Utah and when younger remembers hearing fellow classmates tell her that she was going to hell if she didn't join the church.