Meridian Magazine: Can You Help Your Children Choose Heterosexuality? (Answer: Yes)

[cinepro]

It's been a while since Merdian surprised me.  Consider me surprised!

 

 

 

If we want our children to choose not to succumb to homosexual impulses, we must first teach them that they have a choice. Often we fear talking about such matters, because we fear they will make the wrong choice. We want them to think they have no choice but to go on a mission, or to marry in the temple. But they always have a choice. They also have a choice of whether or not they will give in to same-sex attraction.

 

http://ldsmag.com/helping-our-children-choose-heterosexuality/

 

 

I don't plan on teaching my children they "have a choice", but if any other parents do have this conversation with their children (especially their homosexual children), please let us know how it goes!

 

Of all the reasons to avoid pornography, and sexual abuse, (reasons numerous and profound) the chance that it could trigger a proclivity toward homosexuality would be among them.

 

I'm not entirely clear on her theory, so can someone explain if it would also be possible for pornography or sexual abuse to trigger someone away from homosexuality as well?

Edited September 29, 2015 by cinepro

[ALarson]

Ugh.  Reading the Meridian Magazine gives me a headache.  But this is awful even for them.

[The Nehor]

I thought that was self-evident. You have a choice. Basic agency. How is this controversial?

[HappyJackWagon]

There's a choice to act in a certain way but not a choice to feel a certain way.

[DJBrown]

It's been a while since Merdian surprised me.  Consider me surprised!

 

 

 

 

I don't plan on teaching my children they "have a choice", but if any other parents do have this conversation with their children (especially their homosexual children), please let us know how it goes!

 

 

 

 

I'm not entirely clear on her theory, so can someone explain if it would also be possible for pornography or sexual abuse to trigger someone away from homosexuality as well?

 

Interesting new survey in the UK.  Fifty percent of youths claim they are not fully heterosexual.  This certainly suggests cultural influence to me.  

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3201071/Half-young-Brits-say-not-exclusively-heterosexual-quarter-UK-adults-saying-gay-bisexual.html

[ttribe]

Meridian needs to stick to fluffy LDS cultural stuff.  Doctrinal commentary is really outside their wheelhouse.

[jkwilliams]

I thought that was self-evident. You have a choice. Basic agency. How is this controversial?

The choice is whether to act on your desires or not. I don't think anyone believes you can choose your sexual orientation, except this author, it seems.

[Russell C McGregor]

There's a choice to act in a certain way but not a choice to feel a certain way.

 

And the key phrase in the quote over which cinepro makes merry is "give in."

 

Not "feel."

[smac97]

It's been a while since Merdian surprised me.  Consider me surprised!

 

 

 

 

I don't plan on teaching my children they "have a choice", but if any other parents do have this conversation with their children (especially their homosexual children), please let us know how it goes!

 

 

 

 

I'm not entirely clear on her theory, so can someone explain if it would also be possible for pornography or sexual abuse to trigger someone away from homosexuality as well?

 

The title of this thread: "Meridian Magazine: Can You Help Your Children Choose Heterosexuality? (Answer: Yes)"

 

The actual quote from Meridian Magazine: "They also have a choice of whether or not they will give in to same-sex attraction."

 

Other quotes from the article:

 

"Those who believe that acting on same sex attraction is wrong and those who believe acting on same sex attraction is inevitable, can likely agree on one truth: It would be nice to have a choice."

 

"We can be kind to gays, and we can grant them legal privileges, but we can’t combine their genetics and create a human being. Therefore, an individual who finds themselves attracted to members of the same sex must make a choice. 'Will I choose this lifestyle that the world has made possible for me, the lifestyle that feels good, the lifestyle I feel I have a right to choose, even though I will be sacrificing an eternal family?'"

 

"You will note that I have differentiated between same sex attraction or homosexual inclinations, and acting on same-sex attraction, or living a homosexual lifestyle. Our youth need to recognize that there is a difference between the two."

 

"Parents who freak-out because their boys like to play with dolls or their girls like trucks may shame the child, simply for their toy preferences. Parents may fear because their son likes to do 'girl things,' or that their daughter likes to do 'boy things' that this means he or she is at risk of same-sex attraction. This leap of logic needs to leap right into the garbage bin."

 

"As stated, we don’t know how many individuals are homosexual because of a genetic anomaly, and how many are homosexual because of something that happened in their environment. Likewise, we don’t know what portion of sexual preference in any one individual is because of genetics and what portion is environmental. Although we can do little to affect a genetic anomaly, for those who have elected a homosexual lifestyle due to the influence of environmental factors, there is a lot we can do to help them choose heterosexuality."

 

So my thoughts are:

 

First, I think that the title of your post is substantively misleading, and that it mischaracterizes the content and spirit of the article.

 

Second, the article seems to be pretty reasonable and reasoned.  It does not deserve the scorn and condescension you have tossed at it.

 

Thanks,

 

-Smac

Edited September 29, 2015 by smac97

[HappyJackWagon]

Interesting new survey in the UK.  Fifty percent of youths claim they are not fully heterosexual.  This certainly suggests cultural influence to me.  

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3201071/Half-young-Brits-say-not-exclusively-heterosexual-quarter-UK-adults-saying-gay-bisexual.html

Sure, there may be instances of cultural influence because there is likely a spectrum of attraction. Like most things in life, I doubt there is a one size fits all answer to attraction.

[bluebell]

The quote seems to obviously be talking about choosing to *act* on homosexual impulses, not choosing whether or not you have them.

The idea that a person has a choice on whether or not to succumb to that temptation is a basic teaching of the LDS church and doesn't seem very surprising.

[HappyJackWagon]

And the key phrase in the quote over which cinepro makes merry is "give in."

 

Not "feel."

Or "succomb".

 

My point is, a person can't choose who they are or are not attracted to, but they can choose how they act on that attraction. Are you disagreeing?

[The Nehor]

The choice is whether to act on your desires or not. I don't think anyone believes you can choose your sexual orientation, except this author, it seems.

Not in the quoted portion. It says you can choose whether to succumb to homosexual impulses and you can choose whether to give in to same sex attraction. Is the quoted portion not representative of the article?

[jkwilliams]

The title of this thread: "Meridian Magazine: Can You Help Your Children Choose Heterosexuality? (Answer: Yes)"

The actual quote from Meridian Magazine: "They also have a choice of whether or not they will give in to same-sex attraction."

Other quotes from the article:

"Those who believe that acting on same sex attraction is wrong and those who believe acting on same sex attraction is inevitable, can likely agree on one truth: It would be nice to have a choice."

"We can be kind to gays, and we can grant them legal privileges, but we can’t combine their genetics and create a human being. Therefore, an individual who finds themselves attracted to members of the same sex must make a choice. 'Will I choose this lifestyle that the world has made possible for me, the lifestyle that feels good, the lifestyle I feel I have a right to choose, even though I will be sacrificing an eternal family?'"

"You will note that I have differentiated between same sex attraction or homosexual inclinations, and acting on same-sex attraction, or living a homosexual lifestyle. Our youth need to recognize that there is a difference between the two."

"Parents who freak-out because their boys like to play with dolls or their girls like trucks may shame the child, simply for their toy preferences. Parents may fear because their son likes to do 'girl things,' or that their daughter likes to do 'boy things' that this means he or she is at risk of same-sex attraction. This leap of logic needs to leap right into the garbage bin."

"As stated, we don’t know how many individuals are homosexual because of a genetic anomaly, and how many are homosexual because of something that happened in their environment. Likewise, we don’t know what portion of sexual preference in any one individual is because of genetics and what portion is environmental. Although we can do little to affect a genetic anomaly, for those who have elected a homosexual lifestyle due to the influence of environmental factors, there is a lot we can do to help them choose heterosexuality."

So my thoughts are:

First, I think that the title of your post is substantively misleading, and that it mischaracterizes the content and spirit of the article.

Second, the article seems to be pretty reasonable and reasoned. It does not deserve the scorn and condescension you have tossed at it.

Thanks,

-Smac

If anyone is misleading, it's the article's author. The title says kids can choose heterosexuality.

[Russell C McGregor]

Or "succomb".

 

My point is, a person can't choose who they are or are not attracted to, but they can choose how they act on that attraction. Are you disagreeing?

 

No.

 

And neither does the article under discussion.

 

The thread title asserts that it does.

 

But it doesn't.

[jkwilliams]

Not in the quoted portion. It says you can choose whether to succumb to homosexual impulses and you can choose whether to give in to same sex attraction. Is the quoted portion not representative of the article?

A better question is whether the title is representative. The article says that some kids who are not genetically predisposed to homosexuality choose to be gay for other reasons and can be taught to choose heterosexuality. This is BS and is dangerous.

[stemelbow]

Interesting new survey in the UK.  Fifty percent of youths claim they are not fully heterosexual.  This certainly suggests cultural influence to me.  

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3201071/Half-young-Brits-say-not-exclusively-heterosexual-quarter-UK-adults-saying-gay-bisexual.html

Indeed. Many years ago many dared not declare their sexual proclivities if they did not meet expectations. Now-a-days many see sexuality on a spectrum rather than directly one way or another. Let's face it, even twenty years ago it was considered worse to be gay than it is today. Twenty years ago the Church was harsher on the topic than it is today. NOw it's far more about reaching out, trying to love and understand, from a church perspective. We even had an apostle acknowledging not knowing much about transgendered issues.

[HappyJackWagon]

No.

 

And neither does the article under discussion.

 

The thread title asserts that it does.

 

But it doesn't.

The thread title is quoting the article title so if anyone is being misleading, it's the author of the article.

[rockpond]

 

The title of this thread: "Meridian Magazine: Can You Help Your Children Choose Heterosexuality? (Answer: Yes)"

 

The actual quote from Meridian Magazine: "They also have a choice of whether or not they will give in to same-sex attraction."

 

Other quotes from the article:

 

"Those who believe that acting on same sex attraction is wrong and those who believe acting on same sex attraction is inevitable, can likely agree on one truth: It would be nice to have a choice."

 

"We can be kind to gays, and we can grant them legal privileges, but we can’t combine their genetics and create a human being. Therefore, an individual who finds themselves attracted to members of the same sex must make a choice. 'Will I choose this lifestyle that the world has made possible for me, the lifestyle that feels good, the lifestyle I feel I have a right to choose, even though I will be sacrificing an eternal family?'"

 

"You will note that I have differentiated between same sex attraction or homosexual inclinations, and acting on same-sex attraction, or living a homosexual lifestyle. Our youth need to recognize that there is a difference between the two."

 

"Parents who freak-out because their boys like to play with dolls or their girls like trucks may shame the child, simply for their toy preferences. Parents may fear because their son likes to do 'girl things,' or that their daughter likes to do 'boy things' that this means he or she is at risk of same-sex attraction. This leap of logic needs to leap right into the garbage bin."

 

"As stated, we don’t know how many individuals are homosexual because of a genetic anomaly, and how many are homosexual because of something that happened in their environment. Likewise, we don’t know what portion of sexual preference in any one individual is because of genetics and what portion is environmental. Although we can do little to affect a genetic anomaly, for those who have elected a homosexual lifestyle due to the influence of environmental factors, there is a lot we can do to help them choose heterosexuality."

 

So my thoughts are:

 

First, I think that the title of your post is substantively misleading, and that it mischaracterizes the content and spirit of the article.

 

Second, the article seems to be pretty reasonable and reasoned.  It does not deserve the scorn and condescension you have tossed at it.

 

Thanks,

 

-Smac

 

 

The title of this thread matches the title of the article with the exception of the parenthetical note.  But that parenthetical note is the same answer that the Meridian author arrived at.

 

I didn't find the article to be reasonable or reasoned.  Many seem to agree... if you go to Meridian's facebook page and look at the post on this article you'll see many replies begging them to remove the article.

[rockpond]

The quote seems to obviously be talking about choosing to *act* on homosexual impulses, not choosing whether or not you have them.

The idea that a person has a choice on whether or not to succumb to that temptation is a basic teaching of the LDS church and doesn't seem very surprising.

 

That's not the message of the article.  The author tells parents that their children can choose heterosexuality including marriage and child-rearing.  This is a dangerous concept that the church used to promote but, thankfully, has stopped (see MormonsandGays.org for a reference).

[smac97]

If anyone is misleading, it's the article's author. The title says kids can choose heterosexuality.

 

The article's title is "Can You Help Your Children Choose Heterosexuality?"  

 

I think it's misleading to say "the title says kids can choose heterosexuality."  The article is considerably more nuanced in its treatment of this issue (emphases added):

 

We can be kind to gays, and we can grant them legal privileges, but we can’t combine their genetics and create a human being. Therefore, an individual who finds themselves attracted to members of the same sex must make a choice. “Will I choose this lifestyle that the world has made possible for me, the lifestyle that feels good, the lifestyle I feel I have a right to choose, even though I will be sacrificing an eternal family?”

 

When a young person understands (as well as is possible with their limited experience) the ramifications of choosing to live a homosexual lifestyle over a heterosexual lifestyle, one would imagine he would pause long and hard before choosing to give up an eternal family.

...

 

We, as a society, have made it far easier than it ever used to be for someone with homosexual inclinations to choose a gay lifestyle. We can, and must, make it easier for someone with homosexual inclinations to choose heterosexuality.

 

You will note that I have differentiated between same sex attraction or homosexual inclinations, and acting on same-sex attraction, or living a homosexual lifestyle. Our youth need to recognize that there is a difference between the two.

...

 

Choosing Heterosexuality

 

The biggest obstacle to those with same-sex attraction who wish they were heterosexual is the belief that they can’t change. Once they become convinced they are “born this way” they accept their situation and try to persuade everybody else to accept it too.

 

There is continuing debate about whether sexual preference is indeed something you are born with, or is something that you learn. It is impossible to determine how much of who we are is due to nature and how much is due to nurture. But whether we are 80% nature and 20% nurture, or just the opposite, it doesn’t matter. We are still responsible for our choices.

 

Individuals who are born with a “hot temper” still must learn to treat their family members in harmony with the Church’s teachings. Missionaries who are painfully shy commit to open their mouths and bear testimony of the restored gospel, as hard as it may be. We are here on earth to overcome the natural man, even if the natural man came with us from Heaven.

 

If we want our children to choose not to succumb to homosexual impulses, we must first teach them that they have a choice. Often we fear talking about such matters, because we fear they will make the wrong choice. We want them to think they have no choice but to go on a mission, or to marry in the temple. But they always have a choice. They also have a choice of whether or not they will give in to same-sex attraction.

 

Diathesis-Stress Syndrome

 

As stated, we don’t know how many individuals are homosexual because of a genetic anomaly, and how many are homosexual because of something that happened in their environment. Likewise, we don’t know what portion of sexual preference in any one individual is because of genetics and what portion is environmental. Although we can do little to affect a genetic anomaly, for those who have elected a homosexual lifestyle due to the influence of environmental factors, there is a lot we can do to help them choose heterosexuality.

...

 

Simplifying the Choice

 

For youth who do not have a genetic predisposition to homosexuality, but choose homosexuality for other reasons, we can help them choose heterosexuality if we simply make heterosexuality more appealing to them.

 

When the only heterosexual relationships available for an adolescent to model are miserable, a child or an adolescent may decide they want “anything but” that type of relationship.

 

When the only heterosexual relationships available for an adolescent to model are miserable, a child or an adolescent may decide they want “anything but” that type of relationship. As homosexuality is currently in vogue, particularly among adolescents, he or she may decide to experiment with this type of relationship. If a child is to choose heterosexuality, it is very helpful for him to have happy, loving heterosexual role models.

...

Clearly, it is not our role to judge what influences a person’s choice to embrace a homosexual lifestyle, nor to assess the magnitude of those influences. It is, however, our obligation as parents, to educate our children, to teach them about agency and accountability.

 

We must be brave enough to contradict the world’s instance that homosexuals have no choice. For that matter, we need to contradict anybody’s refusal to take responsibility for their choices. The notion that we cannot help ourselves is contrary to our essence as children of our Heavenly Father. Our agency is what makes us human, not robots, and not animals. We must not let anybody convince us, or our children that agency is a myth. Our choices are something over which we have complete control.

 

I don't really see anything significantly problematic with the article, either from an LDS perspective or from a secular, sociopolitical one.

 

Thanks,

 

-Smac

Edited September 29, 2015 by smac97

[Zakuska]

How is it "dangerous"? Any behavior can me learned an mimiced.

[Senator]

 The author tells parents that their children can choose heterosexuality including marriage and child-rearing. 

 

Are you telling us this is an impossibility?

[smac97]

The title of this thread matches the title of the article with the exception of the parenthetical note.  But that parenthetical note is the same answer that the Meridian author arrived at.

 

I didn't find the article to be reasonable or reasoned.  Many seem to agree... if you go to Meridian's facebook page and look at the post on this article you'll see many replies begging them to remove the article.

 

Hence, perhaps, the need the article's author probably felt to include the following: "Clearly, it is not our role to judge what influences a person’s choice to embrace a homosexual lifestyle, nor to assess the magnitude of those influences. It is, however, our obligation as parents, to educate our children, to teach them about agency and accountability."  And this: "We must be brave enough to contradict the world’s instance that homosexuals have no choice. For that matter, we need to contradict anybody’s refusal to take responsibility for their choices."

 

Thanks,

 

-Smac

[stemelbow]

Additionally, I would argue we don't know the eternal outcome for people, even people who choose a "homosexual lifestyle" (Whatever that means).

When a young person understands (as well as is possible with their limited experience) the ramifications of choosing to live a homosexual lifestyle over a heterosexual lifestyle, one would imagine he would pause long and hard before choosing to give up an eternal family.

Surely there is room for exceptions. How does she know any such person will give up an eternal family?

she also says:

A husband and wife can celebrate posterity that will last through the eternities. Their union, sanctioned not just by the government, but by God Almighty, can last forever.

But, there are heterosexual couples who also can't enjoy these things, but can enjoy raising children anyway. I'm an adoptive parent. I resent this notion of exclusion.