"spurious Materials.." And Julie Rowe

[toon]

Seems like a stream of consciousness.

 

Honestly, this lady reminds me of "Being There," where a simpleton is taken for a genius because people want his words to be profound, not that they are. 

 

Except that Being There is one of my favorite movies, with the final scene one of the best.

[Scott Lloyd]

It sounds like she's totally lost it. Does anyone know if she's married? If she is, I'd hope that he'd get her some help unless he's on board with all that she's saying.

I imagine it's hard for her to deal with going from being invited to speak in LDS chapels across the country and selling her book at Deseret Books to the leaders openly speaking out and warning people to stay away and not use her material to teach. I know that she didn't have official sanction from church leaders but I'd imagine she felt she did and same with her followers.

Did Deseret Book indeed sell her book? I would have hoped and expected they would be more discriminating.

 

(By the way, the correct name is Deseret Book, short for Deseret Book Company, not "Deseret Books".)

[jkwilliams]

Except that Being There is one of my favorite movies, with the final scene one of the best.

 

One of my favorites, too. Unfortunately, with Julie Rowe, the final scene seems to be a lot of people with less money in their bank accounts.

[ttribe]

We have these people in my area as well. As a TBM I viewed this as a counterfeit of the priesthood. Now I view it as hoakum. From personal experiences desrcibed to me from people in my ward who went to a member who was an energy/Emotion code healer-

 

The healer had a long list of questions. She would link her thumb and forfingers together like a chain and then she'd ask a question as she pulled her fingers against the chain. If the fingers broke through on a particular question it would mean that there was a physical weakness associated with the body part associated with that question. So, for example, if her chain broke on question 3 it would relate to an ailment in the person's shoulder. The ailments were always caused by demonic posession.

 

So after the healer went through her extensive list of questions, noting each question where her link was weak, she would write down all the areas of the body being physically pained due to separate demonic possessions. She would then give the list to a priesthood holder who would pray specifically for each area of the body and command that demon be removed. In some cases a priesthood blessing wasn't necessary. She would hold her hands over the ailing part of the body to draw the demon out with her positive energy. The healer is a temple worker and most of her "patients" are faithful members.

 

This woman is a variation on the energy healers like Reiki, and also the emotion coders. Some energy/emotion code healers use the energy from their hands but some use magnets, copper, oils. It's a strange subculture but many who buy into it are also the Julie Rowe preppers.

 

Now that I read this description, I realize we have a couple in our ward who are into this.  They are also the same couple who will tell you that your dead ancestors are in the room and desire to deliver a message, and tried to encourage a group of ward members to start a communist-style co-op sharing all their resources, etc.  Nuts.

 

It sounds like she's totally lost it. Does anyone know if she's married? If she is, I'd hope that he'd get her some help unless he's on board with all that she's saying.

I imagine it's hard for her to deal with going from being invited to speak in LDS chapels across the country and selling her book at Deseret Books to the leaders openly speaking out and warning people to stay away and not use her material to teach. I know that she didn't have official sanction from church leaders but I'd imagine she felt she did and same with her followers.

 

She's married.

[toon]

One of my favorites, too. Unfortunately, with Julie Rowe, the final scene seems to be a lot of people with less money in their bank accounts.

 

Yep.  Chauncey Gardner was truly innocent, which is what made the move work. 

 

I suspect there's a delusional aspect to Julie Rowe, but even with that, I can't eliminate a certain element of fraud.

[toon]

Did Deseret Book indeed sell her book? I would have hoped and expected they would be more discriminating.

 

(By the way, the correct name is Deseret Book, short for Deseret Book Company, not "Deseret Books".)

 

I don't believe they sold it.

[jkwilliams]

Yep.  Chauncey Gardner was truly innocent, which is what made the move work. 

 

I suspect there's a delusional aspect to Julie Rowe, but even with that, I can't eliminate a certain element of fraud.

 

The mindset or personality that is attracted to this kind of stuff is completely foreign to me.

[Scott Lloyd]

I don't believe they sold it.

I wouldn't have thought so. I just checked their website, and it's not there.

[ALarson]

I don't believe they sold it.

She stated that her book was sold at Deseret Book in one of her firesides.  I'll see if I can find the quote from her.   If they did, I'm sure they don't sell it anymore!! 

 

Edited to add:

I did a search and found where people have posted that they purchased her book at Deseret Book or have seen it for sell there.  I'm not going to link to them, but here's one quote (April, 2015):

 

If you have listened to ANYTHING Julie has said, she is presenting nothing new. She is not raking in tons of money off these books or "firesides." She testifies of the Savior. Why is that bad? Moreover, no General Authority has commanded her to stop AND her books are sold in Deseret Book (church-owned!) and Seagull Book. I've seen them at the BYU Bookstore (again, church-owned).

 

Edited September 28, 2015 by ALarson

[toon]

The mindset or personality that is attracted to this kind of stuff is completely foreign to me.

 

I don't get it either.

 

But I have some very sincere family members that got caught up in this.  Fortunately, the could afford it.  But they also tried to gather in others, mostly with the best of intentions.  My wife got a hard sell on it, but was able to politely brush it off.  (I would have been somewhat polite, but I'd also likely get in a little snark.)  Still, they were very concerned that we didn't have the least bit of interest in buying a tent, etc.

 

What I find interesting is the Church's latest statement on preparedness, which talks about "life's ups and downs" and becoming self-reliant for natural disasters and the "normal hardships that are part of life, including illness, injury, and unemployment."  That's all good advice.  But it doesn't match with the preparedness rhetoric that I remember (and I'll admit I could be misremembering it) when growing up, which seemed to focus more on the last days than on life's ups and downs.  Makes me wonder if the Church has changed its focus on the reasons for being prepared, or at a minimum, backed off the last days rhetoric.

[jkwilliams]

I don't get it either.

 

But I have some very sincere family members that got caught up in this.  Fortunately, the could afford it.  But they also tried to gather in others, mostly with the best of intentions.  My wife got a hard sell on it, but was able to politely brush it off.  (I would have been somewhat polite, but I'd also likely get in a little snark.)  Still, they were very concerned that we didn't have the least bit of interest in buying a tent, etc.

 

What I find interesting is the Church's latest statement on preparedness, which talks about "life's ups and downs" and becoming self-reliant for natural disasters and the "normal hardships that are part of life, including illness, injury, and unemployment."  That's all good advice.  But it doesn't match with the preparedness rhetoric that I remember (and I'll admit I could be misremembering it) when growing up, which seemed to focus more on the last days than on life's ups and downs.  Makes me wonder if the Church has changed its focus on the reasons for being prepared, or at a minimum, backed off the last days rhetoric.

 

I have a cousin who moved to Kansas or Missouri or somewhere to be closer to the "winding up scene," but other than him and his family, none of my friends and family are involved in this kind of stuff. There are probably some people in my ward who are into this, but I rarely attend more than sacrament meeting, so I wouldn't know.

[ALarson]

Her book is for sale at the BYU Bookstore, but a search at the Deseret Book website doesn't show it's for sell there (if it was).  So there are only statements posted by others that they purchased it at Deseret Book or saw it for sell there along with Julie stating that it was sold there.

 

Here it is on the BYU Bookstore website:

http://www.byubookstore.com/ePOS/form=robots/item.html&item_number=9780996097406&store=439&design=439

Edited September 28, 2015 by ALarson

[cinepro]

Her book is for sale at the BYU Bookstore, but a search at the Deseret Book website doesn't show it's for sell there (if it was).  So there are only statements posted by others that they purchased it at Deseret Book or saw it for sell there along with Julie stating that it was sold there.

 

Here it is on the BYU Bookstore website:

http://www.byubookstore.com/ePOS/form=robots/item.html&item_number=9780996097406&store=439&design=439

 

It's my understanding that it is only sold at the BYU bookstore as part of the course materials for PSYCH 342.

[ALarson]

It's my understanding that it is only sold at the BYU bookstore as part of the course materials for PSYCH 342.

[HappyJackWagon]

It's my understanding that it is only sold at the BYU bookstore as part of the course materials for PSYCH 342.

If so, perhaps that CES warning was intended for the purpose of stopping that. Or maybe they're just using it as a case study for abnormal psychology.

[Calm]

The phone sessions were 25 dollars for a group...since there was no talking save for the practitioner and questions were submitted through the internet, there would be no prsctical limit to how many were on. The questions were paraphrased to be so generic that even questions about relationships with family members could be used bysomeone with no family because close friends become family, etc.

Personal sessions were $100 per half an hour. Not a bad income for a twenty year old.

For the session that got recorded and posted online, Rowe spoke about five minutes on the group session then the kid took over (he is 20 I believe) and rambled for about an hour and a half.

[Tacenda]

The phone sessions were 25 dollars for a group...since there was no talking save for the practitioner and questions were submitted through the internet, there would be no prsctical limit to how many were on. The questions were paraphrased to be so generic that even questions about relationships with family members could be used bysomeone with no family because close friends become family, etc.

Personal sessions were $100 per half an hour. Not a bad income for a twenty year old.

For the session that got recorded and posted online, Rowe spoke about five minutes on the group session then the kid took over (he is 20 I believe) and rambled for about an hour and a half.

It was so lame, he goes on and on, not really saying anything new. Except for an off the wall personal experience.

Btw, have we discussed the children being affected by this? Listening to a podcast and one of them mentions one little 4 yr. old boy who had a dream of bombs going off and his mother telling him it was a sign of things to come. How messed up is that?

Teens and children are getting their lives stolen from them. That hope and dreaming of what they'll do or be when they grow up, or all is well in the world.

They also mention the pope saying that Americans are far better off than most in the world and they should never quit that hope.

Edited September 28, 2015 by Tacenda

[ALarson]

The phone sessions were 25 dollars for a group...since there was no talking save for the practitioner and questions were submitted through the internet, there would be no prsctical limit to how many were on. The questions were paraphrased to be so generic that even questions about relationships with family members could be used bysomeone with no family because close friends become family, etc.

Personal sessions were $100 per half an hour. Not a bad income for a twenty year old.

For the session that got recorded and posted online, Rowe spoke about five minutes on the group session then the kid took over (he is 20 I believe) and rambled for about an hour and a half.

Say what?  Wow.  Who was this 20 year old?

[bcuzbcuz]

Except that Being There is one of my favorite movies, with the final scene one of the best.

I always knew the film as "Chauncey Gardner". His best film.

[Calm]

It sounds like she's totally lost it. Does anyone know if she's married? If she is, I'd hope that he'd get her some help unless he's on board with all that she's saying.

I imagine it's hard for her to deal with going from being invited to speak in LDS chapels across the country and selling her book at Deseret Books to the leaders openly speaking out and warning people to stay away and not use her material to teach. I know that she didn't have official sanction from church leaders but I'd imagine she felt she did and same with her followers.

It was not a sudden break.

She was banned from speaking at LDS church buildings pretty quicly iirc ( there were some canceled events and then she was either in rented venues or private homes). I think her book may have been pulled about the same time from DB save by special order, but there were stillquite a few on sale through Seagull Books. Iirc this was around last February. Her first book or maybe it was Pontius' was advertised once by Seagull iirc between conference sessions, i think I did the old ,gag me' gesture to my husband when I saw it.

From what I've seen there were always some in the prepper community who didn't buy her stories, but she likely made a mint for the guy who runs one of the biggest forums (he is the one to push her to publish).

[ALarson]

It was not a sudden break.

She was banned from speaking at LDS church buildings pretty quicly iirc ( there were some canceled events and then she was either in rented venues or private homes). I think her book may have been pulled about the same time from DB save by special order, but there were stillquite a few on sale through Seagull Books. Iirc this was around last February. Her first book or maybe it was Pontius' was advertised once by Seagull iirc between conference sessions, i think I did the old ,gag me' gesture to my husband when I saw it.

From what I've seen there were always some in the prepper community who didn't buy her stories, but she likely made a mint for the guy who runs one of the biggest forums (he is the one to push her to publish).

I think from what I read, she didn't speak in chapels after February, 2015 (?).  

 

I'm trying to remember from when I was looking into her awhile ago.  There was a blog where someone was writing about each of her appearances that gave the locations.  I'll see if I can find it again.

 

Edited to add:

Here's one that I read (from Julie Rowe speaking in the chapel in Seattle on Jan. 10, 2015):

http://woodyoubelieveit.blogspot.com/2015/01/notes-on-julie-rowes-conference.html

 

I'm not sure when she began giving her presentations, do you know what year that was?  I didn't hear about her until last year, iirc.

Edited September 28, 2015 by ALarson

[Calm]

Did Deseret Book indeed sell her book? I would have hoped and expected they would be more discriminating.

(By the way, the correct name is Deseret Book, short for Deseret Book Company, not "Deseret Books".)

I get mixed up with Visions of Glory, but I am pretty sure at least Seagull Books (sp?) was promoting them. Didn't someone on the board relate they saw a huge stack of them at their local store and I am pretty sure I saw at least the first one in a DB catalog.

Hopefully they will be more cautious in the future.

Edited September 28, 2015 by Calm

[Tacenda]

Say what? Wow. Who was this 20 year old?

http://mormonstories.org/julie-rowe-and-spencer-energy-conference-call/ Edited September 28, 2015 by Tacenda

[Calm]

Say what?  Wow.  Who was this 20 year old?

Iirc his name is Spencer Watson. He had health issues of his own that got him sent home from a mission after two months, then he later moved to Utah to live with his aunt and uncle. If I followed the timeline correctly he has been involved in this stuff since then and maybe as a practitioner for a year or so.

Tacenda, how many cult leaders have you listened to?

He sounded to me like a really bad yoga teacher. I've listened to some of those. The few cult guys I've heard segments on are much more dramatic, shouting etc.

[Calm]

Her books were published in 2014...I think she got going in summer or fall that year. She was being promoted so heavily and I think she just stepped into the Pontius gap.

The earliest mention I've found so far is Mar 14. Looks like her books were published in Apr and Nov that year, then she was shutdown from church sites in Feb 2015.

Got a radio interview from beginning of June 14.

Edited September 28, 2015 by Calm