Spokesperson - I'M Not Feeling The Honesty

[maxrep12]

"At the LDS Church-owned Brigham Young University, caffeinated drinks are not sold. It is not because of a church or university edict, said spokeswoman Carri Jenkins, but customer demand.

“Dining Services has made the decision to not sell or serve caffeinated beverages on campus,” she told FOX 13. “Simply based on what our customers want or do not want.”

Jenkins said students would not violate BYU’s Honor Code by consuming caffeine, nor would people be forbidden from bringing it on campus."

http://bycommonconsent.com/2012/08/31/i ... at-costco/

The comments section seems to resemble reality far more than the spin from Jenkins.

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

"At the LDS Church-owned Brigham Young University, caffeinated drinks are not sold. It is not because of a church or university edict, said spokeswoman Carri Jenkins, but customer demand.

“Dining Services has made the decision to not sell or serve caffeinated beverages on campus,” she told FOX 13. “Simply based on what our customers want or do not want.”

Jenkins said students would not violate BYU’s Honor Code by consuming caffeine, nor would people be forbidden from bringing it on campus."

http://bycommonconsent.com/2012/08/31/i ... at-costco/

The comments section seems to resemble reality far more than the spin from Jenkins.

The WoW does not mention caffeine...that is what coffee and tea had in common. There is the letter of the law and the spirit of the law...I obey the spirit, but refuse to sit in judgement of others. In fact Bruce R McConkie called people who obsess over this as "cranks"...he pointed out that their is much more to the gospel. Edited September 2, 2012 by Bill “Papa” Lee

[Garden Girl]

I have avoided caffeine because it is a stimulant... and habit forming... when I was inactive and not adhering to the WoW, I used to have to have my strong black coffee before I could get started in the a.m. When I reactivated and had to give up coffee, I went through a "withdrawal" period. I actually got headaches, nerves, etc.

About 4 years prior to my reactivating, I quit smoking when my husband had a scare with his throat... we were both heavy smokers and we quit at the same time. That was fun... (he managed to dodge the bullet.) We both had smokers' cough... in the mornings you should have heard us... hack, hack, hack...

About a month after quitting smoking we both could tell the difference as the coughing subsided. About three months after quitting, we were cough-free... Amazing.

Even though there are some that say caffeine is not prohibited, I look at my own experience and don't want to get into that situation again... I remain caffeine free...

GG

Edited September 2, 2012 by Garden Girl

[KevinG]

This is something strange to be cynical and obsessive over. I suspect the food service people at Brigham Young University have better things to do than hide a secret policy to deny co-eds caffeine.

You would be better off to find out why there are no books on evolution in the BYU library.

[maxrep12]

"At the LDS Church-owned Brigham Young University, caffeinated drinks are not sold. It is not because of a church or university edict, said spokeswoman Carri Jenkins, but customer demand."

I don't think the OP has been addressed. Is the above sentence really honest or not?

[Calm]

I think the customer demand is a nice way of putting that there are enough customers (including parents of students) demanding they don't sell it and they got tired of the hassle....at least this is what I was told eons ago.

[maxrep12]

I think the customer demand is a nice way of putting that there are enough customers (including parents of students) demanding they don't sell it and they got tired of the hassle....at least this is what I was told eons ago.

How do you feel about, "Teach them correct principles and let them govern themselves"? How about the over used but under activated mantra of free agency? And lastly, why not touch on the level honesty offered by Jenkins?

Surely there is demand for caffienated drinks at BYU? Are we going to engage in a dance of semantics to offer a pass to Jenkins?

[maxrep12]

I think the customer demand is a nice way of putting that there are enough customers (including parents of students) demanding they don't sell it and they got tired of the hassle....at least this is what I was told eons ago.

So she should have said;

"Some students and parents prefer that no member of the student body have the ability to purchase any caffeinated beverage on campus, though these beverages would likely be popular if made available"

This would have been honest, yes?

[Buzzard]

The world has BYU to thank for the existence of caffeine-free Coke. When I was a student there, there were no colas at all in the vending machines. The local bottler went to Coca-Cola and asked them to make up a formula specifically to sell on campus. True story.

Funny that I've never seen caffeine free Mountain Dew.

[Calm]

Funny that I've never seen caffeine free Mountain Dew.

Just move to Canada. The government there believes people are too dense to be able to figure out that a noncola coloured drink just might contain caffeine. Mountain Dew up there has no buzz.*****newsflash apparently that has finally changed this year.

[maxrep12]

In the Trib Carri was quoted, "not a university or church decision, but made by dining services, based on what our customers want."

I don't think the conversation with Jenkins was an honest one regarding consumer demand. This is clearly an issue of control. Am I the only one willing to recognize the misleading tone of her commentary?

[Calm]

If there are customers who don't want the presence of a product, how is that different from customers that want the presence of a product. I am not saying it is right or wrong, it just seems to me it goes by the same label of "customer demand". A response to a boycott, for example, is an example of responding to "customer demand".

There is nothing stopping any student from putting soda in the backpack along with books and things and bring it on campus at a cheaper price than having to buy it there. Not much control there.

Edited September 2, 2012 by calmoriah

[Tacenda]

The world has BYU to thank for the existence of caffeine-free Coke. When I was a student there, there were no colas at all in the vending machines. The local bottler went to Coca-Cola and asked them to make up a formula specifically to sell on campus. True story.

Funny that I've never seen caffeine free Mountain Dew.

I kid you not here. I believe that the caffeine drinks would have the "appearance of evil" just as coffee and tea would. I was told this by a very faithful LDS once and I'm leaning towards that idea. OR the church knows the problem with caffeine addiction. So I kind of wish the church had kept the status quo and not said anything.

[maxrep12]

BYU has a long line of "customers" waiting to get in. Those whining would just deal with it if the church offered diet coke, no students would leave. Those same parents would still make the tuition payments. The church makes the call here, not the parents. Lets be clear. Do these same parents boycott grocery stores that sell pepsi? We are talking about college students here, not pre schoolers.

Lets drop the notion that the student body needs to "pack in" what could not realistically offend any reasonable human being. I thougth college was a place where young adults could grow up in preparation for the real world. A world with choices, even including the most trivial notions as dealing with diet coke...rolls eyes.

No, Calmorah, it all comes down to control.

[maxrep12]

If there are customers who don't want the presence of a product, how is that different from customers that want the presence of a product. I am not saying it is right or wrong, it just seems to me it goes by the same label of "customer demand". A response to a boycott, for example, is an example of responding to "customer demand".

Then Carri should have stated with clarity;

"Some students and parents prefer that no member of the student body have the ability to purchase any caffeinated beverage on campus, though these beverages would likely be popular if made available"

Carri, possibly at the request of those higher up the food chain, chose to mislead.

Her statement was not honest and clear, but an attempt to shift burden towards a ficticious student body who simply would not be interested in purchasing the product.

Does it get tiresome excusing bad behaviour?

[Bernard Gui]

I have avoided caffeine because it is a stimulant... and habit forming... when I was inactive and not adhering to the WoW, I used to have to have my strong black coffee before I could get started in the a.m. When I reactivated and had to give up coffee, I went through a "withdrawal" period. I actually got headaches, nerves, etc.

About 4 years prior to my reactivating, I quit smoking when my husband had a scare with his throat... we were both heavy smokers and we quit at the same time. That was fun... (he managed to dodge the bullet.) We both had smokers' cough... in the mornings you should have heard us... hack, hack, hack...

About a month after quitting smoking we both could tell the difference as the coughing subsided. About three months after quitting, we were cough-free... Amazing.

Even though there are some that say caffeine is not prohibited, I look at my own experience and don't want to get into that situation again... I remain caffeine free...

GG

When my dad joined the Church, he said it was much more difficult for him to stop drinking coffee than to stop smoking.

[Bernard Gui]

How do you feel about, "Teach them correct principles and let them govern themselves"? How about the over used but under activated mantra of free agency? And lastly, why not touch on the level honesty offered by Jenkins?

Surely there is demand for caffienated drinks at BYU? Are we going to engage in a dance of semantics to offer a pass to Jenkins?

Agreed. The CougarEat should also offer beer and wine, and the bookstore should sell cigarettes and weed. Surely someone

wants them, but if we teach correct principles, they will be able to govern themselves. I demand free agency!!!

[Bernard Gui]

In the Trib Carri was quoted, "not a university or church decision, but made by dining services, based on what our customers want."

I don't think the conversation with Jenkins was an honest one regarding consumer demand. This is clearly an issue of control. Am I the only one willing to recognize the misleading tone of her commentary?

If you think she was dishonest, you should have the facts to back up your accusation. Let's see them.

[Pahoran]

"At the LDS Church-owned Brigham Young University, caffeinated drinks are not sold. It is not because of a church or university edict, said spokeswoman Carri Jenkins, but customer demand."

I don't think the OP has been addressed. Is the above sentence really honest or not?

Well, of course it is.

I have long observed that those who suspect dishonesty in others when no actual dishonesty is in evidence are usually projecting their own failings onto others.

Which is a very polite way of saying that given that it is Maxrep making the accusation, nobody should take it seriously.

Regards,

Pahoran

[Storm Rider]

How do you feel about, "Teach them correct principles and let them govern themselves"? How about the over used but under activated mantra of free agency? And lastly, why not touch on the level honesty offered by Jenkins?

Surely there is demand for caffienated drinks at BYU? Are we going to engage in a dance of semantics to offer a pass to Jenkins?

I think you are confusing the intent of teaching correct principles. Your logic assumes that we teach correct principles and then add a bars, strip clubs, and any other vice to the environs of BYU. As long as we teach correct principles, do nothing to assist individuals in choosing a proper path. This is not the intent of the teaching. We have no need to bring all types of sinful practices into our areas of congregation just so that we give the freedom of choice to people.

Occasionally I like to drink diet Coke; I find it both refreshing and enjoyable. I also choose to drink, the majority of the time, either water or a fruit juice. Whether they sell caffinated beverages at BYU is irrelevant to me. If it was my choice, I would probably sell it. It seems strange not to sell it on campus, but I am not responsible and when I am in Provo and want to drink a Diet Coke, I easily find a place where it is sold and enjoy myself. Anyone who wants to drink a Diet Coke or other similar product can easily find it. The fact it is not sold at BYU is meaningless.

I would not have chosen to say what Jenkins said, but I also don't have the information Jenkins has and I don't know the demands of all customers. There are some zealots in the LDS Church who feel quite rabid about preventing people from breaking their interpretation of the WofW. Their voices might be a lot stronger than those who want to drink them.

[Hamba Tuhan]

Funny that I've never seen caffeine free Mountain Dew.

You just live in the wrong part of the world. I live in a country which, by law, disallows caffeine in any soft drink other than cola. Consequently, Coke here produces and sells caffeine-free Mountain Dew as the only variety.

[Storm Rider]

Then Carri should have stated with clarity;

"Some students and parents prefer that no member of the student body have the ability to purchase any caffeinated beverage on campus, though these beverages would likely be popular if made available"

Carri, possibly at the request of those higher up the food chain, chose to mislead.

Her statement was not honest and clear, but an attempt to shift burden towards a ficticious student body who simply would not be interested in purchasing the product.

Does it get tiresome excusing bad behaviour?

Tiresome? Not when we have perfectly honest people like you around to correct all the rest of us fools. I have learned that when you want to find something to complain about, you will find something everytime you search for it. I guess that I try to live my life looking for what is good, lovely, of good report and praisworthy. I seek after these things not because the opposite does not exist, but because I need as much light in my life as possible. I need the inspirational, I need that which will lead me on to do better. Keep looking for what you want and you will find it and have your reward. It appears that you are finding yours as well as I am finding mine. We create our own hell; isn't about time you start thinking about heaven instead?

[The Grimace]

In the Trib Carri was quoted, "not a university or church decision, but made by dining services, based on what our customers want."

I don't think the conversation with Jenkins was an honest one regarding consumer demand. This is clearly an issue of control. Am I the only one willing to recognize the misleading tone of her commentary?

University cafeteria's are businesses. If selling caffeinated beverages is a money-losing proposition because students and staff are not purchasing them, then the explanation given makes sense.

[maxrep12]

Agreed. The CougarEat should also offer beer and wine, and the bookstore should sell cigarettes and weed. Surely someone

wants them, but if we teach correct principles, they will be able to govern themselves. I demand free agency!!!

Grasping at straws are we(in an attempt to build the strawman)? In your absurd analogy to the offering of colas, you mention items that are under age restriction or are illegal. Of course, all your examples are in violation of the WoW to boot

Nothing shows the strength of your position like this sort of nonsense.

[MorningStar]

BYU has a long line of "customers" waiting to get in. Those whining would just deal with it if the church offered diet coke, no students would leave. Those same parents would still make the tuition payments. The church makes the call here, not the parents. Lets be clear. Do these same parents boycott grocery stores that sell pepsi? We are talking about college students here, not pre schoolers.

Lets drop the notion that the student body needs to "pack in" what could not realistically offend any reasonable human being. I thougth college was a place where young adults could grow up in preparation for the real world. A world with choices, even including the most trivial notions as dealing with diet coke...rolls eyes.

No, Calmorah, it all comes down to control.

Those kids can head over to Smiths to buy Coke.