Spokesperson - I'M Not Feeling The Honesty

[The Grimace]

That's why there is no one rule fits all with the WOW.

What?!?! Don't drink alcohol and tea and coffee seem like one-rule-fits-all to me...

[wenglund]

"At the LDS Church-owned Brigham Young University, caffeinated drinks are not sold. It is not because of a church or university edict, said spokeswoman Carri Jenkins, but customer demand."

I don't think the OP has been addressed. Is the above sentence really honest or not?

Since we aren't privy to the market research or the sales records, then reason and personal integrity suggests that it would be irresponsible at best for us to judge the accuracy, let alone the honesty, of the statement. But, then, not everyone is governed by reason and integrity. Some people may be driven to smear.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[Deborah]

What?!?! Don't drink alcohol and tea and coffee seem like one-rule-fits-all to me...

That as you well know is just a very small part of the WOW. The rest is certainly meant to be used wisely.

[Stargazer]

With my ADHD, it helps occasionally to drink a caffeinated drink to help me go to sleep, but, as you all know, I'm special.

Maybe that's why I had such a hard time getting to sleep earlier this week. I was cutting down on caffeine. I do not suffer from ADD, btw, I revel in it!

[Calm]

Body does get used to it. Sleep tends to be affected badly by any change at first, once the change has been adapted to, you are much better off. Caffeine takes on average 10 hours to clear the body enough not to affect the typical person. I have noticed it is around 23 hours for me...don't know if it is because of what it gets to combine with in my drugs or just oversensitivity due to sleep/neurological disorder.

To help with any form of withdrawal system, a good b complex to help the body cope with stress, tryptophan or tyrosine supplements can help with the anxiety and sleep issues (both cannot be eaten with protein and it has to be one or the other, not both, I prefer tyrosine these days). Magnesium and calcium can help with relaxation as well, I prefer to use them separately with mag for sleep, calcium for daytime...just works better for me for some reason.

Edited September 3, 2012 by calmoriah

[maxrep12]

Since we aren't privy to the market research or the sales records, then reason and personal integrity suggests that it would be irresponsible at best for us to judge the accuracy, let alone the honesty, of the statement. But, then, not everyone is governed by reason and integrity. Some people may be driven to smear.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Wade and others, please keep up with the thread. As previously noted, any approved vendor caught selling a caffeinated can of coke will lose their vendor status for a year.....there is an "edict" in place, contrary to what Jenkins alluded to. Vendor agreements can reviewed at the other board.

[MorningStar]

Wade and others, please keep up with the thread. As previously noted, any approved vendor caught selling a caffeinated can of coke will lose their vendor status for a year.....there is an "edict" in place, contrary to what Jenkins alluded to. Vendor agreements can reviewed at the other board.

You didn't give a reference.

[maxrep12]

You didn't give a reference.

Vendor agreements can be viewed at mormom discussions

[Stargazer]

Body does get used to it. Sleep tends to be affected badly by any change at first, once the change has been adapted to, you are much better off. Caffeine takes on average 10 hours to clear the body enough not to affect the typical person. I have noticed it is around 23 hours for me...don't know if it is because of what it gets to combine with in my drugs or just oversensitivity due to sleep/neurological disorder.

To help with any form of withdrawal system, a good b complex to help the body cope with stress, tryptophan or tyrosine supplements can help with the anxiety and sleep issues (both cannot be eaten with protein and it has to be one or the other, not both, I prefer tyrosine these days). Magnesium and calcium can help with relaxation as well, I prefer to use them separately with mag for sleep, calcium for daytime...just works better for me for some reason.

Sounds reasonable. Except Val and I spent 7 days on an Alaska cruise last month, and since we didn't buy a "drink package" that included any caffeinated drinks, and so for the entire week I was completely caffeine-free. I can tell you that I didn't notice it. I managed to snag a Pepsi in Juneau about mid-way through the trip, but I didn't notice anything one way or another. In fact, the caffeineless period was completely unremarkable. Which in fact surprised me. I must be special, too.

[wenglund]

Wade and others, please keep up with the thread. As previously noted, any approved vendor caught selling a caffeinated can of coke will lose their vendor status for a year.....there is an "edict" in place, contrary to what Jenkins alluded to. Vendor agreements can reviewed at the other board.

People with even a modicum of experience in retail will understand the important and sizable difference between demand curves and vendor agreements.

Whereas, people looking to make others an offender for a word, won't care about that important and sizable difference any more than they would care about being in possession of necessary information (like market surveys and sales records) before presuming to judge the accuracy or honesty of a statement.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[Calm]

Sounds reasonable. Except Val and I spent 7 days on an Alaska cruise last month, and since we didn't buy a "drink package" that included any caffeinated drinks, and so for the entire week I was completely caffeine-free. I can tell you that I didn't notice it. I managed to snag a Pepsi in Juneau about mid-way through the trip, but I didn't notice anything one way or another. In fact, the caffeineless period was completely unremarkable. Which in fact surprised me. I must be special, too.

There is a wide range of responses to caffeine, as urroner pointed out for some it is even relaxing. And this can vary for the same person as well, what affects you at one time in your life may not have a noticeable affect at another time due to environmental or internal changes.

Not being in your normal environment might make any minor changes less noticeable.

Edited September 3, 2012 by calmoriah

[robuchan]

People with even a modicum of experience in retail will understand the important and sizable difference between demand curves and vendor agreements.

Whereas, people looking to make others an offender for a word, won't care about that important and sizable difference any more than they would care about being in possession of necessary information (like market surveys and sales records) before presuming to judge the accuracy or honesty of a statement.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

Wade, take a step back. This argument is not worth it. You are dead wrong and now you are starting to insult people.

[Calm]

now you are starting to insult people.

Of course there is no insult to anyone in the below quote:

The issue is lying.......I don't know why BYU's PR said what it did, but it's obviously not true. .....is it worth noting that BYU made a press release statement that is an obvious lie?

Edited September 3, 2012 by calmoriah

[Stargazer]

There is a wide range of responses to caffeine, as urroner pointed out for some it is even relaxing. And this can vary for the same person as well, what affects you at one time in your life may not have a noticeable affect at another time due to environmental or internal changes.

Not being in your normal environment might make any minor changes less noticeable.

I believe it. In fact that might explain my first few days back home -- couldn't sleep worth a darn for three nights. I don't think it was the caffeine, I think it was the gentle rocking of the ship that I was missing.

[Stargazer]

Wade, take a step back. This argument is not worth it. You are dead wrong and now you are starting to insult people.

Honestly, I don't think he's wrong. I think there are people out there who jump on innocous words and phrases to try to make people and things they oppose look evil, when in fact they are nothing of the kind. I think the current political campaign season is filled with instructive examples, too.

There's a lot of this going around, with people calling evil "good" and good "evil". I'd say it's quite scriptural.

[MorningStar]

Vendor agreements can be viewed at mormom discussions

Go look at another board is your reference?

[Calm]

I believe it. In fact that might explain my first few days back home -- couldn't sleep worth a darn for three nights. I don't think it was the caffeine, I think it was the gentle rocking of the ship that I was missing.

I have tried to figure out how to get the equivalent of a gigantic cradle, but the thing that came closest...a water bed....was too uncomfortable for my back (needed it very firm and once hubby got out of bed so much for that) plus there was an issue of my temperature comfort zone changing all night long and being either too hot or too cold. If I ever get a bedroom with a high enough ceiling, I may get a local carpenter to install a hanging bed for me....then train a dog or something to make gently rock it all night long. There must be some sort of wind up pendulum swinging type of mechanism that would work.

http://www.floatingbed.com/features-benefits/better-sleep/

I'd be afraid of falling out of one the beds in the link above, tossing and turning all night as I do, lol. Looks fun though.

http://www.laidbackhome.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/cama_mecedora_adultos.jpg

Like the look of this one better, but might have to build the house around it, lol.

Edited September 3, 2012 by calmoriah

[wenglund]

Wade, take a step back. This argument is not worth it. You are dead wrong and now you are starting to insult people.

Rubuchan, step up, if you can, and substantiate your hypocritically insulting assertion that I am "dead wrong,"

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

[maxrep12]

People with even a modicum of experience in retail will understand the important and sizable difference between demand curves and vendor agreements.

Whereas, people looking to make others an offender for a word, won't care about that important and sizable difference any more than they would care about being in possession of necessary information (like market surveys and sales records) before presuming to judge the accuracy or honesty of a statement.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

The entire retail environment surrounding BYU, including UVU(high LDS demographic), sell caffeinated cola products and the like. Perhaps they would be interested in your nebulous speach about demand curves and vendor agreements. Tell them how carrying the "diet coke" is hurting their bottom line.

Your purposefully vague financial commentary hold no value with a University that can thumb its nose at coke sales, as it is has a financial safety net from tithes. They can afford to write their own ticket as to what can be marketed on campus.

And again,contrary to Jenkins, there is an edict. No caffeinated coke sold at the Y, exclamation point.

[robuchan]

Rubuchan, step up, if you can, and substantiate your hypocritically insulting assertion that I am "dead wrong,"

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

It's clear to anyone who has any understanding of BYU and Provo culture. Caffeinated beverages as a whole (Coke, Diet Coke, Pepsi, Mtn Dew, Dr Pepper) are by far preferred by BYU students and other LDS. They are sold in every single restaurant and store in the area. UVU's student body is essentially the same makeup as far as LDS mix. If you go out to lunch with LDS coworkers or friends, you will notice caffeine drinks are the most common orders. My wife, a TBM and BYU grad, saw this on facebook and laughed at the obvious lie, before she had a chance to be clouded by my apostate judgement. This is the wrong side of the issue to be on. BYU said something dumb. Don't compound it by defending it.

[MorningStar]

How often do you all see caffeinated drinks at ward parties? Do most members drink caffeinated beverages? Would they demand they be at ward parties? I know a lot of members who drink it, but they wouldn't demand there be caffeinated beverages at any church sponsored event. The members I know who drink it admit to being addicted. If BYU were to sell caffeinated beverages, it would be seen as an endorsement. I don't think there are many Mormons who would demand BYU endorse caffeine.

[robuchan]

How often do you all see caffeinated drinks at ward parties? Do most members drink caffeinated beverages? Would they demand they be at ward parties? I know a lot of members who drink it, but they wouldn't demand there be caffeinated beverages at any church sponsored event. The members I know who drink it admit to being addicted. If BYU were to sell caffeinated beverages, it would be seen as an endorsement. I don't think there are many Mormons who would demand BYU endorse caffeine.

You're misunderstanding the economic term "demand".

[maxrep12]

It's clear to anyone who has any understanding of BYU and Provo culture. Caffeinated beverages as a whole (Coke, Diet Coke, Pepsi, Mtn Dew, Dr Pepper) are by far preferred by BYU students and other LDS. They are sold in every single restaurant and store in the area. UVU's student body is essentially the same makeup as far as LDS mix. If you go out to lunch with LDS coworkers or friends, you will notice caffeine drinks are the most common orders. My wife, a TBM and BYU grad, saw this on facebook and laughed at the obvious lie, before she had a chance to be clouded by my apostate judgement. This is the wrong side of the issue to be on. BYU said something dumb. Don't compound it by defending it.

Well said, and probably a good note end on.

[MorningStar]

You're misunderstanding the economic term "demand".

The only "demand" there can be in this scenario is a request that it be sold in the first place.

[robuchan]

The only "demand" there can be in this scenario is a request that it be sold in the first place.

Incorrect